@Alpha_Pulse I think what I'm trying to get at is that I see the current protesting, petitions, polls etc as somewhat pointless.
As I said in a previous post, those saying they are going to abandon PS when PS6 releases are, in the most part, just 'kicking the can down the road'. The actual number who do this will likely be overall fairly small - my main reasoning being that the alternatives will be Digital.
Surely the best thing to do for those upset by Sony's decision, which some believe is far more than the 1 in 5 users that the data would suggest, is to take action now. The only real action people CAN take is refusal to purchase.
You do have a point that these (in the eyes of many) 'fake' physical games may add into basic physical sales data. However, it would surprise me immensely if Sony don't do deeper analysis than that. In fact, it would very much surprise me if Sony didn't know what % of users who regularly buy Physical, will also buy Digital.
@For-Kier I do think a boycott (Now) of all digital, or incomplete games on discs, stands more of a chance.
Sony will likely be watching at the moment.
We keep being told that there are more than just 1 in 5 people upset with this, for various reasons.
It is a like for like boycott, which in my opinion are always more likely to work.
The problem is, people need to miss out - exception making will just be seen as as confirmation that people will accept and buy digital.
Threats to not buy PS6 in 2028 (probably), and move to PC - Yeah, we agree. I don't see this being a significant number, particularly given the time, and the fact the alternatives are all / mostly digital. It feels like 'kicking the can down the road' to me.
@Oram77 Your not wrong - we all make mistakes! Though I did catch up with a few that have been remastered since.
The exclusives situation was one of the major reasons why I moved back to PlayStation for PS4, along with not trusting Xbox and their 'vision' of consoles future (the XBone announcement), and the quality of their hardware.
@Anthony_Daniels Actually, I'm completely for that stance (not buying).
I'm on the fence about Sony's plans to stop supporting Physical. However, for people who are in any way upset with Sony's decision, by far the best way to send a message to them is to (without exception) not buy a single game that is not complete on the disc (including those that are digital only).
Threats about not buying PS6, 2 years away are fairly meaningless at this point.
@Oram77 Having had a 360 in the PS3 gen, I never played 1 or 2, but really enjoyed Second Son and its DLC / standalone expansion (I can't remember which it was) on PS4.
To me, either would be just as good. Either a full remaster of 1 and 2, or a new entry would be excellent.
@ButteredCrumpet @LogicStrikesAgain I can see both good and bad points about Sony stopping support for Physical, and I think I must have added a like against nearly every comment you both have added here, because I agree with nearly all of what you have said. NB I think you are quite correct in what you say regarding the legal position of ownership of Physical.
I'm on the fence, wanting to hear what Sony has planned for improvements to Digital, but I don't think they will talk until people are ready to listen.
I have bigger issues now with how this is all playing out however, and first let me say this isn't directed at all physical supporters, only a few.
1) For the benefit of Mr/Ms Crumpet (because your account is new) game framerates are very important to me. Anything less than a stable 60fps is literally unplayable to me. I am also very strongly of the belief that a stable 60fps can be achieved on any game - devs just need to keep their ambitions in check. How is this relevant? On odd articles here, some people have given a pass to certain devs, purely on the basis of 'the majority don't care about framerates' (something that I do not believe, and even if partially true, peoples expectations are clearly increasing in this area). Yet here we are with Physical - with a clearly minority and downtrending support, and yet you see the reactions you do. And sometimes, I seem to think from some of the same people who didn't care that a proportion of gamers CAN'T play at less than 60fps, and maybe from some that were advocating a majority rules then, but not not now. I don't think I am being bitter, but it does irk me.
2) We are seeing more and more of the type of comment of 'you must be a shill (/ whatever else they come up with)' not to be up in arms about losing discs, when there are clear arguments in this case.
3) Going back to an earlier point, if a game isn't stable 60fps I do not buy it - simple. How many physical supporters have made 'exceptions' for games like GTA6 for example, and how many have/haven't cancelled pre-orders. People are threatening to boycott PS6 - maybe 2 years away - yet you see very few calls to boycott far more appropriate and much sooner released digital only games.
4) This may be a personal one, and it is rare, but those who demand a disc drive as standard. I do support the option of a disc drive, but not everyone should have to pay for it.
5) Why should I feel sorry for retailers who have been selling all digital consoles? (With the Pro they could have only sold bundles of console+drive). This was easily foreseeable in the short term.
Sony are clearly banking on a significant chunk of people, who normally buy Physical, buying digital if that is the only option - whether this is via their store, or via digital codes.
I suspect they already have proof of this with the unit sales of digital only games, and that people are already making 'exceptions'.
@Dogbreath Now you mention it, I remember that old PS1 disc swap being reported - never tried it myself because all my games were legit.
But (before your original post) I had never considered the deterrent link between digital and permanent bans / loss of library if Sony detect modded consoles.
Should the devs be held responsible for the apparent ease at which hacking is being committed? - again, in my opinion, yes.
But, does that give people the right to hack this game? - No, absolutely not.
This is not something that should be applauded - quoting yourself: "Fantastic work, pirates! Keep it up!" , and certainly not because a different company wants to remove a long downtrending physical media, whether that decision upsets you or not.
To give an analogy: If a car owner makes it easier to steal a car, say by leaving the doors unlocked, that doesn't mean someone is allowed to steal it (or should be cheered on for doing so).
@IllusiveMan Thats the way I read it - ie Digital codes available for all publishers that want them, in order to sell in shops etc. They have until 2028 to detail all this (I don't think we will see PS6 before), so I expect thar they will wait until they can announce their plans without the discourse turning into 'we want discs'.
@IllusiveMan Part of their announcement included a small part about other sellers being able to sell codes or something - I forget the exact wording. I remember thinking at the time that this sounded similar to the GTA6 code in a box, or maybe just a card with a code on it like a wallet top up.
As far as I understand it, this would be perfectly sufficient for legal purposes as long as the retailer is able to undercut Sony by reducing their own profit margin.
It is like for like - Sony and Retailers both have access to sell a digital licence for the game.
"This could be a crucial detail that will get it off the hook with regulators."
It would be incredibly surprising if Sony doesn't have plans / robust defence in place for all of this. Just look at how 'on the ball' they were regarding the UK social media ban for children- as I remember it they were already stsrted age verification before it was announced!
@WolfyTn "The initial p!ssed offness may have ‘died down’ a little bit but just like a ### who cheats on you - it’s gonna be heavily on everyone’s mind and it’ll never be the same again"
It hasn't made a bit of difference to how I or a lot of others view Sony.
It was clear this was coming - Physical has been downtrending for years, the Pro not having a Disc drive version, etc. On the other side, I knew their marketing / communication was crap before this announcement - the not answering foreseeable issues was bad, but expected.
How Sony proceed from here in terms of their digital policies is what is important to me.
@zebric21 I agree that would be a good gesture, but if the headlines and loud minority just respond with "this isn't what we want, we want discs", what is the point for them at this time.
@ShadowRJ "Now this situation isn’t really like the physical games issue for a variety of reasons, but it’s stories like these which help fuel the protestors into believing they can make a difference"
I more or less agree with you. I will say now that I think there is very little chance of reversing Sony's decision on physical, but that changes to Sony's digital store / rules etc are very possible (and may even already be planned by Sony).
Going back to what you said, personally I think there is a very big difference here though.
In this case (and I am only going on the article above), the backlash against this game - as we have seen in the past - appears to have scared EA. The games release is imminent too. This is a targeted boycott, aimed at the very thing that has caused the anger, and missing 1 game is easy to do for users.
Online petitions / social media anger does not concern Sony - they know it will fade, and people saying they will jump ship next gen is a far distance away (and makes little real sense as the alternatives are digital only). Moving platform, given the 'alternatives' is not going to suit many either.
In my opinion, the only thing that could be boycotted to make Sony take notice, that is close enough in time and (targeted enough) in subject matter is digital-only AAA games. If, for instance, Sony saw that their announcement had lead to a significant downturn in pre-orders, or worse, significant cancellations of pre-orders for GTA6, then they would take serious notice. I use the example of GTA6 because of the hype and reported pre-order numbers, and because its digital only nature has been very well reported (ie it is the most high profile). If they don't see a difference here, it will send the message to Sony that if there is no physical alternative, people will buy digital instead.
@Bizzy
I can assure you, very little is 'too complicated' for me, and if you knew me you would know that to be true (I don't know if you were intending to be rude, but thats the way it appears) - the only question is, do I want that sort of unnecessary hassle, nonsense, and time wasting, in pursuit of a hobby.
(Edit: reply to a comment (to me) I now see has been deleted)
I have considered PC in the past for higher framerates - something it most certainly can give, if I spend enough.
But, if I wanted physical discs of new releases, then that is something it doesn't give, and moving to PC for this reason would make me very unhappy.
A number of people I know, have moved from PC to PS5 (Pro) recently, due to the amount of time they were wasting on compatibility / driver / update issues (1 had to do a FULL wipe and reinstall of his PC from scratch twice, and still had issues!) ; and also what they saw as prolific online cheating.
None of them note that they are spending more on PS5 - its more or less the same according to them, just MUCH less hassle.
I have also been warned off PC by well meaning PC gamers on this site, for exactly the same reasons.
@Vertere The odd thing here is that I believe Sony will very likely have decent plans in place. They certainly appear (from how fast they reacted to the UK social media ban for children, before it was announced) to have a very proactive legal department who will be well on top of potential issues.
It is, in my opinion, just a case of bad communication / marketing (I agree they should have offered something like a FAQ with the announcement).
Unfortunately, the behaviour of some now means that Sony need to wait before revealing more - they should have predicted this, but what would be the point in announcing even sweeping and positive changes to their digital system at the moment.
@CheesyOatcake You make a lot of good points. The trouble is that there are 3 issues here that need separating:
1) Some are highly upset about not having the option to buy Physical discs, but I very much doubt Sony will change their mind. Physical purchases have been downtrending for years, and they know that a certain % of gamers who buy Physical will buy digital if that is the only option.
We do not know that a optional disc drive for PS6 is off the table - its all speculation. I would prefer Sony to clarify this, and arrangements for Physical back catalogues.
What we do know is that Sony's main competition is either all digital, or most likely to be by next gen. All the 'I will move to PC' sounds like a protest, not a plan, given its all digital status.
2) Digital 'ownership' and PS store. This is the area that people and Sony should now be focusing on. I want to know if they intend to upgrade their policies around things like refunds etc in light of physical not being supported.
3) PS6 Price. Somehow this has got mixed in. Nobody in their right mind should have expected the PS6 to ship with a disc drive - (before their announcement I would have expected an optional drive similar to PS5 Pro) - so I don't know how Sony stopping physical has any bearing on the price of PS6. I also think that PS6 will sell just fine given the expected price - Sony are never going to expect PS5 type pick up, and devs are going to have to support PS5 for a long time. As long as technically it is a massive upgrade, I will still be there day 1.
The big problem here is that the conversation keeps revolving back to point 1 (Physical), which to my mind has already been resolved, with the exception of whether PS6 will have an optional drive. Sony really need to talk about about point 2 (Digital), but a loud minority are hostile. Sony have been generally very bad at communication / marketing this generation in my opinion (eg Pro announcement with no real specs!) , but is this the right environment for them to be talking, and will people listen.
@LogicStrikesAgain Good point - your right, I remember reading something like Doom was one of the games series they were going to focus on after their (Xbox's) implosion. It was probably some leaker with a bad source again.
At this rate there is going to be very little left of Xbox game studios outside of COD.
I wasn't the greatest fan of what they did with the series after Doom 2016 (which I thought was fantastic btw), but this was a talented team. Now it seems that they have fallen victim to Xbox's hubris and mismanagement.
The sad thing is that a lot of people predicted this when Xbox went on its ridiculous buying sprees.
Hopefully these devs all find good work elsewhere, and Xbox are prevented from making any more purchases.
(And yes, I know others, not Xbox, have seen downsizing / closing, but this is on a whole different scale).
@get2sammyb "I interpret this as people are angry."
Completely agree. Sadly, this just looks like 'lashing out' to me.
If I were Sony, the only thing I would be paying attention to at the moment is pre-order / purchase numbers of digital only games, and whether these have been affected in any noticeable way.
In the last year or so a few of my friends/ family who were PC gamers moved over to PlayStation - PS5 Pro in all cases I think.
They had just got so fed up with compatibility issues and wasting time messing about with getting things working properly, and also sick of all the cheating in online games.
Not making light of the current Xbox implosion at the moment, but at this rate Bethesda itself will be scaled down or spun off before this game is ready.
Even IF it does see the light of day, I have zero faith it won't be a bug ridden, performance nightmare.
@twitchtvpat I would agree with you. The thing is, that if I was upset about Sony's decision, I would 100% cancel my pre-order of GTA6, and any other all digital game (no exceptions).
We are being told time and time again how many people are outraged by Sony's decision, and how this won't just go away, and how serious this is for Sony. But when you actually consider real tangible action (ie aside from words), it doesn't seem like there is any.
The high pre-orders for GTA6 are total confirmation that people will accept all digital if discs aren't printed.
@Vaako007 I think where I'm at is I just don't have a clue. It seems that you won't be under a real time time limit (which is my biggest dislike), but beyond that I really don't know. Hopefully the reviews clarify this mechanic in detail, and the length of the game (it could well be a short game with many paths for example which might not be so bad if handled well).
@Fishmasterflex96 I play quite a few games classed as action RPG's (not turn based) and a lot these days don't have branches that make you miss large sections of game. I generally find it quite easy to avoid the sort I don't like, but thank you for your concern.
@CaptainWow Was it Domino's pizza by any chance? Sorry, I just couldn't resist! Lol
But, yes, I quite agree. In all likelihood, only a significant reduction in pre-orders/purchases of Digital only games will convince Sony that they may have made the wrong choice. Whereas, continuing high pre-orders of games like the aforementioned GTA6, will only confirm to Sony that they have not made a mistake.
@Oram77 You know, it's funny - at times like this I am reminded that my appetite for joining social media is approximately the same as my appetite for ordering Domino's pizza... practically non existent. Lol.
@Oram77 I think its just a personal thing. I just hate feeling rushed in games, and hate feeling I'm missing out part of the content.
I never played Majoras mask. I tried one of the dead rising games, bully, and the 1st Kingdom Come game (which has hidden time limits on a number of missions), and the time limit mechanics all put me off. Anything beyond the normal short 'self destruct sequences' , and even then they are not my favourites.
I'm hoping this game has found a better way to do it.
I just don't like time limit systems. I hate not being able to take my time (which doesn't appear to be the major concern here), and not being able to see / do everything in a single playthrough. Choices are fine, as long as they don't branch and make you miss large sections.
@Ctrl_Alt_Delete How do you know they don't have plans for an optional disc drive for PS6 - the numerous articles have been pure speculation at this point.
There definitely won't be one included, but digital users don't want to pay for it, so the PS5 Pro model is the best option. However, until Sony actually come out with their plans, we have no idea if an optional drive is planned or not.
@For-Kier I had an Xbox360, before moving to PS4 and never looking back.
Not considering the link between Outlook and Xbox, I thought that my Xbox account would have been closed years ago - I have certainly never used it for gaming since PS4 launched - but about a year or so ago found it was still open and active. When I looked into it, it was only because I use Outlook for emails.
So, its not silly at all what you suggest, as my Outlook email address is keeping my Xbox account active!
@cainhurst94 Oh good grief, neither am I - Xbox are the complete opposite extreme! Yeah, they just need to come with a FAQ ready, with proper answers. Its not like the questions weren't foreseeable.
@cainhurst94 Hopefully, some of the silliness can die down soon, and things can get 'back on track'. I also hope though that Sony have learned a lesson here about communication.
@AdamNovice Someone else may have already answered, but I suspect a big part is that if they offload they won't have redundancy payments, and any agreements they have made to pay others for future work won't need to be paid by them / won't incur cancellation fees.
@cainhurst94 A very good point, and maybe I was being a bit overly simplistic by just saying 'anger'.
Whilst I haven't read / heard everything you mention (I dont have any mainstream Social media accounts, though I did read the article here about account deletion after 3 years), you are quite correct - no sensible information can be put across or discussed in the current situation.
I do think the 'announcement' Sony made was poor - it was very corporate, and they should have combined it with answers to foreseeable questions about their plans for this 'all digital' future. Sadly, Sony's communication has not been very good recently in my opinion.
They should stay silent until the anger dies down, then come back with answers (eg will there be an optional drive for PS6, if not what arrangements will be made for Physical back catalogues, and what updates will be made for the store).
They may also decide to wait until after the Xbox implosion we are expecting this week.
I'm sorry, I just don't see anything to be gained in them entering into dialogue at the moment, given how much anger is around.
To be fair, with how good PSSR is now, it should be included for the Pro version of every game.
Unlike the original PSSR and UE5, we haven't heard of any incompatibility issues with PSSR2, and it makes a night and day difference.
It really should be 'first on the list' before enhancing further with the additional GPU power (minus that used to negate the small frame time cost of PSSR) / RT capability available.
Comments 4,111
Re: Halo's Physical PS5 Disc Won't Play without a Download
@Alpha_Pulse
I think what I'm trying to get at is that I see the current protesting, petitions, polls etc as somewhat pointless.
As I said in a previous post, those saying they are going to abandon PS when PS6 releases are, in the most part, just 'kicking the can down the road'. The actual number who do this will likely be overall fairly small - my main reasoning being that the alternatives will be Digital.
Surely the best thing to do for those upset by Sony's decision, which some believe is far more than the 1 in 5 users that the data would suggest, is to take action now. The only real action people CAN take is refusal to purchase.
You do have a point that these (in the eyes of many) 'fake' physical games may add into basic physical sales data. However, it would surprise me immensely if Sony don't do deeper analysis than that. In fact, it would very much surprise me if Sony didn't know what % of users who regularly buy Physical, will also buy Digital.
Re: Halo's Physical PS5 Disc Won't Play without a Download
@For-Kier
I do think a boycott (Now) of all digital, or incomplete games on discs, stands more of a chance.
The problem is, people need to miss out - exception making will just be seen as as confirmation that people will accept and buy digital.
Threats to not buy PS6 in 2028 (probably), and move to PC - Yeah, we agree. I don't see this being a significant number, particularly given the time, and the fact the alternatives are all / mostly digital.
It feels like 'kicking the can down the road' to me.
Re: PS3's inFAMOUS 2 Sees an Explosion of New Players with Platinum About to Become Unobtainable
@Oram77
Your not wrong - we all make mistakes! Though I did catch up with a few that have been remastered since.
The exclusives situation was one of the major reasons why I moved back to PlayStation for PS4, along with not trusting Xbox and their 'vision' of consoles future (the XBone announcement), and the quality of their hardware.
Re: Halo's Physical PS5 Disc Won't Play without a Download
@Anthony_Daniels
Actually, I'm completely for that stance (not buying).
I'm on the fence about Sony's plans to stop supporting Physical.
However, for people who are in any way upset with Sony's decision, by far the best way to send a message to them is to (without exception) not buy a single game that is not complete on the disc (including those that are digital only).
Threats about not buying PS6, 2 years away are fairly meaningless at this point.
Re: PS3's inFAMOUS 2 Sees an Explosion of New Players with Platinum About to Become Unobtainable
@Oram77
Having had a 360 in the PS3 gen, I never played 1 or 2, but really enjoyed Second Son and its DLC / standalone expansion (I can't remember which it was) on PS4.
To me, either would be just as good. Either a full remaster of 1 and 2, or a new entry would be excellent.
Re: 'Millions of Gamers Value True Ownership': PS5, PS4 Represented Half of All UK Physical Game Revenue in 2025
@ButteredCrumpet @LogicStrikesAgain
I can see both good and bad points about Sony stopping support for Physical, and I think I must have added a like against nearly every comment you both have added here, because I agree with nearly all of what you have said. NB I think you are quite correct in what you say regarding the legal position of ownership of Physical.
I'm on the fence, wanting to hear what Sony has planned for improvements to Digital, but I don't think they will talk until people are ready to listen.
I have bigger issues now with how this is all playing out however, and first let me say this isn't directed at all physical supporters, only a few.
1) For the benefit of Mr/Ms Crumpet (because your account is new) game framerates are very important to me. Anything less than a stable 60fps is literally unplayable to me. I am also very strongly of the belief that a stable 60fps can be achieved on any game - devs just need to keep their ambitions in check.
How is this relevant? On odd articles here, some people have given a pass to certain devs, purely on the basis of 'the majority don't care about framerates' (something that I do not believe, and even if partially true, peoples expectations are clearly increasing in this area).
Yet here we are with Physical - with a clearly minority and downtrending support, and yet you see the reactions you do. And sometimes, I seem to think from some of the same people who didn't care that a proportion of gamers CAN'T play at less than 60fps, and maybe from some that were advocating a majority rules then, but not not now.
I don't think I am being bitter, but it does irk me.
2) We are seeing more and more of the type of comment of 'you must be a shill (/ whatever else they come up with)' not to be up in arms about losing discs, when there are clear arguments in this case.
3) Going back to an earlier point, if a game isn't stable 60fps I do not buy it - simple. How many physical supporters have made 'exceptions' for games like GTA6 for example, and how many have/haven't cancelled pre-orders. People are threatening to boycott PS6 - maybe 2 years away - yet you see very few calls to boycott far more appropriate and much sooner released digital only games.
4) This may be a personal one, and it is rare, but those who demand a disc drive as standard. I do support the option of a disc drive, but not everyone should have to pay for it.
5) Why should I feel sorry for retailers who have been selling all digital consoles? (With the Pro they could have only sold bundles of console+drive). This was easily foreseeable in the short term.
6) I have droned on long enough lol
Re: 'Millions of Gamers Value True Ownership': PS5, PS4 Represented Half of All UK Physical Game Revenue in 2025
Sony are clearly banking on a significant chunk of people, who normally buy Physical, buying digital if that is the only option - whether this is via their store, or via digital codes.
I suspect they already have proof of this with the unit sales of digital only games, and that people are already making 'exceptions'.
Re: Sony's Social Media Still Toxic Two Weeks After PS5 Discs Debacle
All further making me pleased I don't have mainstream social media accounts.
Re: PS5's Call of Duty: Black Ops Port Reportedly Riddled with Hackers
@Dogbreath
Now you mention it, I remember that old PS1 disc swap being reported - never tried it myself because all my games were legit.
But (before your original post) I had never considered the deterrent link between digital and permanent bans / loss of library if Sony detect modded consoles.
Re: PS5's Call of Duty: Black Ops Port Reportedly Riddled with Hackers
@Dogbreath
Good point "Discs are a hackers dream ..."
In a related area, and it may well be I'm wrong (I'm no expert), but don't most jailbreaks of PS5 consoles rely on the disc drive too?
Edit: just googled, and the answer is not most, but some can be committed via the use of the disc drive.
Re: PS5's Call of Duty: Black Ops Port Reportedly Riddled with Hackers
@NoPhysicalNoBuy123
Is this game too expensive? - in my opinion, yes.
Should the devs be held responsible for the apparent ease at which hacking is being committed? - again, in my opinion, yes.
But, does that give people the right to hack this game? - No, absolutely not.
This is not something that should be applauded - quoting yourself: "Fantastic work, pirates! Keep it up!" , and certainly not because a different company wants to remove a long downtrending physical media, whether that decision upsets you or not.
To give an analogy: If a car owner makes it easier to steal a car, say by leaving the doors unlocked, that doesn't mean someone is allowed to steal it (or should be cheered on for doing so).
Re: Here Come the Lawsuits! Sony's Physical Disc Debacle Likely to Keep Its Lawyers Busy
@IllusiveMan
Thats the way I read it - ie Digital codes available for all publishers that want them, in order to sell in shops etc.
They have until 2028 to detail all this (I don't think we will see PS6 before), so I expect thar they will wait until they can announce their plans without the discourse turning into 'we want discs'.
Re: Here Come the Lawsuits! Sony's Physical Disc Debacle Likely to Keep Its Lawyers Busy
@IllusiveMan
Part of their announcement included a small part about other sellers being able to sell codes or something - I forget the exact wording.
I remember thinking at the time that this sounded similar to the GTA6 code in a box, or maybe just a card with a code on it like a wallet top up.
As far as I understand it, this would be perfectly sufficient for legal purposes as long as the retailer is able to undercut Sony by reducing their own profit margin.
It is like for like - Sony and Retailers both have access to sell a digital licence for the game.
Re: Here Come the Lawsuits! Sony's Physical Disc Debacle Likely to Keep Its Lawyers Busy
"This could be a crucial detail that will get it off the hook with regulators."
It would be incredibly surprising if Sony doesn't have plans / robust defence in place for all of this.
Just look at how 'on the ball' they were regarding the UK social media ban for children- as I remember it they were already stsrted age verification before it was announced!
Re: PS5's Physical Disc Debacle Will Attract More Anger if This Xbox Rumour Is True
@WolfyTn
"The initial p!ssed offness may have ‘died down’ a little bit but just like a ### who cheats on you - it’s gonna be heavily on everyone’s mind and it’ll never be the same again"
It hasn't made a bit of difference to how I or a lot of others view Sony.
It was clear this was coming - Physical has been downtrending for years, the Pro not having a Disc drive version, etc. On the other side, I knew their marketing / communication was crap before this announcement - the not answering foreseeable issues was bad, but expected.
How Sony proceed from here in terms of their digital policies is what is important to me.
@zebric21
I agree that would be a good gesture, but if the headlines and loud minority just respond with "this isn't what we want, we want discs", what is the point for them at this time.
Re: College Football 27 to Remove Single Player Microtransactions After Fans Threatened Boycott
@CheesyOatcake
Thank you. I appreciate that.
Re: College Football 27 to Remove Single Player Microtransactions After Fans Threatened Boycott
@ShadowRJ
"Now this situation isn’t really like the physical games issue for a variety of reasons, but it’s stories like these which help fuel the protestors into believing they can make a difference"
I more or less agree with you.
I will say now that I think there is very little chance of reversing Sony's decision on physical, but that changes to Sony's digital store / rules etc are very possible (and may even already be planned by Sony).
Going back to what you said, personally I think there is a very big difference here though.
In this case (and I am only going on the article above), the backlash against this game - as we have seen in the past - appears to have scared EA. The games release is imminent too.
This is a targeted boycott, aimed at the very thing that has caused the anger, and missing 1 game is easy to do for users.
Online petitions / social media anger does not concern Sony - they know it will fade, and people saying they will jump ship next gen is a far distance away (and makes little real sense as the alternatives are digital only). Moving platform, given the 'alternatives' is not going to suit many either.
In my opinion, the only thing that could be boycotted to make Sony take notice, that is close enough in time and (targeted enough) in subject matter is digital-only AAA games.
If, for instance, Sony saw that their announcement had lead to a significant downturn in pre-orders, or worse, significant cancellations of pre-orders for GTA6, then they would take serious notice. I use the example of GTA6 because of the hype and reported pre-order numbers, and because its digital only nature has been very well reported (ie it is the most high profile).
If they don't see a difference here, it will send the message to Sony that if there is no physical alternative, people will buy digital instead.
Re: 'PS5 Has Put a Dampener on Gaming': 45% of Enthusiasts 'Seriously Considering' Leaving Sony for PC
@Bizzy
I can assure you, very little is 'too complicated' for me, and if you knew me you would know that to be true (I don't know if you were intending to be rude, but thats the way it appears) - the only question is, do I want that sort of unnecessary hassle, nonsense, and time wasting, in pursuit of a hobby.
(Edit: reply to a comment (to me) I now see has been deleted)
Re: 'PS5 Has Put a Dampener on Gaming': 45% of Enthusiasts 'Seriously Considering' Leaving Sony for PC
I have considered PC in the past for higher framerates - something it most certainly can give, if I spend enough.
But, if I wanted physical discs of new releases, then that is something it doesn't give, and moving to PC for this reason would make me very unhappy.
A number of people I know, have moved from PC to PS5 (Pro) recently, due to the amount of time they were wasting on compatibility / driver / update issues (1 had to do a FULL wipe and reinstall of his PC from scratch twice, and still had issues!) ; and also what they saw as prolific online cheating.
None of them note that they are spending more on PS5 - its more or less the same according to them, just MUCH less hassle.
I have also been warned off PC by well meaning PC gamers on this site, for exactly the same reasons.
Re: 'Sony Knows a $1,000 PS6 Won't Sell as Much': Analyst on Manufacturer's Plan to Maximise Revenue
@Vertere
The odd thing here is that I believe Sony will very likely have decent plans in place. They certainly appear (from how fast they reacted to the UK social media ban for children, before it was announced) to have a very proactive legal department who will be well on top of potential issues.
It is, in my opinion, just a case of bad communication / marketing (I agree they should have offered something like a FAQ with the announcement).
Unfortunately, the behaviour of some now means that Sony need to wait before revealing more - they should have predicted this, but what would be the point in announcing even sweeping and positive changes to their digital system at the moment.
Re: 'Sony Knows a $1,000 PS6 Won't Sell as Much': Analyst on Manufacturer's Plan to Maximise Revenue
@CheesyOatcake
You make a lot of good points.
The trouble is that there are 3 issues here that need separating:
1) Some are highly upset about not having the option to buy Physical discs, but I very much doubt Sony will change their mind.
Physical purchases have been downtrending for years, and they know that a certain % of gamers who buy Physical will buy digital if that is the only option.
We do not know that a optional disc drive for PS6 is off the table - its all speculation. I would prefer Sony to clarify this, and arrangements for Physical back catalogues.
What we do know is that Sony's main competition is either all digital, or most likely to be by next gen. All the 'I will move to PC' sounds like a protest, not a plan, given its all digital status.
2) Digital 'ownership' and PS store. This is the area that people and Sony should now be focusing on. I want to know if they intend to upgrade their policies around things like refunds etc in light of physical not being supported.
3) PS6 Price. Somehow this has got mixed in.
Nobody in their right mind should have expected the PS6 to ship with a disc drive - (before their announcement I would have expected an optional drive similar to PS5 Pro) - so I don't know how Sony stopping physical has any bearing on the price of PS6.
I also think that PS6 will sell just fine given the expected price - Sony are never going to expect PS5 type pick up, and devs are going to have to support PS5 for a long time.
As long as technically it is a massive upgrade, I will still be there day 1.
The big problem here is that the conversation keeps revolving back to point 1 (Physical), which to my mind has already been resolved, with the exception of whether PS6 will have an optional drive.
Sony really need to talk about about point 2 (Digital), but a loud minority are hostile.
Sony have been generally very bad at communication / marketing this generation in my opinion (eg Pro announcement with no real specs!) , but is this the right environment for them to be talking, and will people listen.
Re: 'PS5 Has Put a Dampener on Gaming': 45% of Enthusiasts 'Seriously Considering' Leaving Sony for PC
I suggest everyone go and watch Sir Humphrey Appleby from Yes Prime Minister (old sitcom)) explain Surveys.
(The example he used is about National Service and there are clips on YouTube).
Re: 'I'm Not Convinced There's a Viable Way Forward': DOOM Dev Relegated to 'Support Studio' Size
@LogicStrikesAgain
Good point - your right, I remember reading something like Doom was one of the games series they were going to focus on after their (Xbox's) implosion.
It was probably some leaker with a bad source again.
At this rate there is going to be very little left of Xbox game studios outside of COD.
Re: 'I'm Not Convinced There's a Viable Way Forward': DOOM Dev Relegated to 'Support Studio' Size
I wasn't the greatest fan of what they did with the series after Doom 2016 (which I thought was fantastic btw), but this was a talented team.
Now it seems that they have fallen victim to Xbox's hubris and mismanagement.
The sad thing is that a lot of people predicted this when Xbox went on its ridiculous buying sprees.
Hopefully these devs all find good work elsewhere, and Xbox are prevented from making any more purchases.
(And yes, I know others, not Xbox, have seen downsizing / closing, but this is on a whole different scale).
Re: Poll: Are You Considering Leaving PlayStation for PC?
@get2sammyb
"I interpret this as people are angry."
Completely agree. Sadly, this just looks like 'lashing out' to me.
If I were Sony, the only thing I would be paying attention to at the moment is pre-order / purchase numbers of digital only games, and whether these have been affected in any noticeable way.
Re: Poll: Are You Considering Leaving PlayStation for PC?
In the last year or so a few of my friends/ family who were PC gamers moved over to PlayStation - PS5 Pro in all cases I think.
They had just got so fed up with compatibility issues and wasting time messing about with getting things working properly, and also sick of all the cheating in online games.
Re: The Elder Scrolls 6 Is Reportedly Still Years Away from Release
@Mr-Cage
Skyrim launched only 5 and a half years (approx) after Oblivion.
Re: The Elder Scrolls 6 Is Reportedly Still Years Away from Release
Not making light of the current Xbox implosion at the moment, but at this rate Bethesda itself will be scaled down or spun off before this game is ready.
Even IF it does see the light of day, I have zero faith it won't be a bug ridden, performance nightmare.
Re: PlayStation's First Post Since Physical Games Debacle Draws Over 65k Replies
@twitchtvpat
I would agree with you.
The thing is, that if I was upset about Sony's decision, I would 100% cancel my pre-order of GTA6, and any other all digital game (no exceptions).
We are being told time and time again how many people are outraged by Sony's decision, and how this won't just go away, and how serious this is for Sony.
But when you actually consider real tangible action (ie aside from words), it doesn't seem like there is any.
The high pre-orders for GTA6 are total confirmation that people will accept all digital if discs aren't printed.
Re: Round Up: Ridiculously Positive Dawnwalker Previews Claim It's a Game of the Year Candidate
@Vaako007
I think where I'm at is I just don't have a clue.
It seems that you won't be under a real time time limit (which is my biggest dislike), but beyond that I really don't know.
Hopefully the reviews clarify this mechanic in detail, and the length of the game (it could well be a short game with many paths for example which might not be so bad if handled well).
Re: Round Up: Ridiculously Positive Dawnwalker Previews Claim It's a Game of the Year Candidate
@Fishmasterflex96
I play quite a few games classed as action RPG's (not turn based) and a lot these days don't have branches that make you miss large sections of game. I generally find it quite easy to avoid the sort I don't like, but thank you for your concern.
Re: Round Up: Ridiculously Positive Dawnwalker Previews Claim It's a Game of the Year Candidate
@Fishmasterflex96
Most RPG's don't have similar mechanics.
Re: PlayStation's First Post Since Physical Games Debacle Draws 57k Replies
@CaptainWow
Was it Domino's pizza by any chance? Sorry, I just couldn't resist! Lol
But, yes, I quite agree. In all likelihood, only a significant reduction in pre-orders/purchases of Digital only games will convince Sony that they may have made the wrong choice.
Whereas, continuing high pre-orders of games like the aforementioned GTA6, will only confirm to Sony that they have not made a mistake.
Re: PlayStation's First Post Since Physical Games Debacle Draws 57k Replies
@Oram77
You know, it's funny - at times like this I am reminded that my appetite for joining social media is approximately the same as my appetite for ordering Domino's pizza... practically non existent. Lol.
Re: PlayStation's First Post Since Physical Games Debacle Draws 57k Replies
But have we/Sony seen mass cancellations of pre orders of / mass refusal to pre-order/purchase digital only games like GTA6??
Re: Round Up: Ridiculously Positive Dawnwalker Previews Claim It's a Game of the Year Candidate
@Oram77
I think its just a personal thing. I just hate feeling rushed in games, and hate feeling I'm missing out part of the content.
I never played Majoras mask.
I tried one of the dead rising games, bully, and the 1st Kingdom Come game (which has hidden time limits on a number of missions), and the time limit mechanics all put me off. Anything beyond the normal short 'self destruct sequences' , and even then they are not my favourites.
I'm hoping this game has found a better way to do it.
Re: Round Up: Ridiculously Positive Dawnwalker Previews Claim It's a Game of the Year Candidate
I just don't like time limit systems. I hate not being able to take my time (which doesn't appear to be the major concern here), and not being able to see / do everything in a single playthrough. Choices are fine, as long as they don't branch and make you miss large sections.
Re: Practically Every Comment on PlayStation's YouTube Is Now About Physical Discs
@Ctrl_Alt_Delete
How do you know they don't have plans for an optional disc drive for PS6 - the numerous articles have been pure speculation at this point.
There definitely won't be one included, but digital users don't want to pay for it, so the PS5 Pro model is the best option.
However, until Sony actually come out with their plans, we have no idea if an optional drive is planned or not.
Re: Practically Every Comment on PlayStation's YouTube Is Now About Physical Discs
I wonder if everyone commenting on these YouTube videos has cancelled their pre-orders or refused to pre-order the all-digital GTA6 ?..
Re: Reaction: Sony Needs to Start Speaking to Us Again
Sony's mistake was not accompanying their announcement with a set of (proper, non corporate speak) answers to foreseeable questions:
Having made that mistake though, they are doing the right thing keeping quiet until all the silliness dies down a bit.
Re: Despite Eliminating 15% of Its Workforce, Xbox Wants a Billion Players Per Day
@For-Kier
I had an Xbox360, before moving to PS4 and never looking back.
Not considering the link between Outlook and Xbox, I thought that my Xbox account would have been closed years ago - I have certainly never used it for gaming since PS4 launched - but about a year or so ago found it was still open and active. When I looked into it, it was only because I use Outlook for emails.
So, its not silly at all what you suggest, as my Outlook email address is keeping my Xbox account active!
Re: Despite Eliminating 15% of Its Workforce, Xbox Wants a Billion Players Per Day
"Exactly how she intends to achieve this goal is not outlined in her memo"
Creative numbers or fairy dust, are 2 options. Lol.
Re: 5 Xbox Studios Impacted in Microsoft Layoffs, But No Games Cancelled
It's good that the 4 (maybe 5) studios have a reprieve, but the 3200 other jobs going completely, is not good at all.
Re: Sony Quits Social Media for 5 Days After Killing Physical Games, Earns Multiple Community Notes
@cainhurst94
Oh good grief, neither am I - Xbox are the complete opposite extreme!
Yeah, they just need to come with a FAQ ready, with proper answers. Its not like the questions weren't foreseeable.
Re: 'I Know This Is Painful': Xbox Confirms 3,200 Job Losses in Industry Bloodbath
@LogicStrikesAgain
Sadly thats 3200, not including the 4 studios, according to Pushsquare.
Quoting from the article:
"The layoffs are calculated separately to the studios being spun off."
Re: Sony Quits Social Media for 5 Days After Killing Physical Games, Earns Multiple Community Notes
@cainhurst94
Hopefully, some of the silliness can die down soon, and things can get 'back on track'. I also hope though that Sony have learned a lesson here about communication.
Re: 'I Know This Is Painful': Xbox Confirms 3,200 Job Losses in Industry Bloodbath
@AdamNovice
Someone else may have already answered, but I suspect a big part is that if they offload they won't have redundancy payments, and any agreements they have made to pay others for future work won't need to be paid by them / won't incur cancellation fees.
Re: Sony Quits Social Media for 5 Days After Killing Physical Games, Earns Multiple Community Notes
@cainhurst94
A very good point, and maybe I was being a bit overly simplistic by just saying 'anger'.
Whilst I haven't read / heard everything you mention (I dont have any mainstream Social media accounts, though I did read the article here about account deletion after 3 years), you are quite correct - no sensible information can be put across or discussed in the current situation.
I do think the 'announcement' Sony made was poor - it was very corporate, and they should have combined it with answers to foreseeable questions about their plans for this 'all digital' future. Sadly, Sony's communication has not been very good recently in my opinion.
Re: Sony Quits Social Media for 5 Days After Killing Physical Games, Earns Multiple Community Notes
They should stay silent until the anger dies down, then come back with answers (eg will there be an optional drive for PS6, if not what arrangements will be made for Physical back catalogues, and what updates will be made for the store).
They may also decide to wait until after the Xbox implosion we are expecting this week.
I'm sorry, I just don't see anything to be gained in them entering into dialogue at the moment, given how much anger is around.
Re: Stunning Single Player Game Blood Message Exploring PS5 Pro Upscaling, Ray Tracing
To be fair, with how good PSSR is now, it should be included for the Pro version of every game.
Unlike the original PSSR and UE5, we haven't heard of any incompatibility issues with PSSR2, and it makes a night and day difference.
It really should be 'first on the list' before enhancing further with the additional GPU power (minus that used to negate the small frame time cost of PSSR) / RT capability available.