You still don't get it. Try replacing Mormonism with other religions; like this:
"Black and white console? Who are they trying to appeal to? Hasidic Jews?" "Not sure about the blue LEDs. They should have gone with orange; might shift a few more consoles to the Protestants in Northern Ireland!"
Either you accept that they're all ok, or you admit that there's something different about Mormonism which makes your comment ok but the ones above unacceptable.
I accept that some religions have associations or affinities with particular colours. It doesn't mean that an individual's buying preference for a video game console is going to align to the broader religious grouping; that is a generalisation.
You could have replied to tell me that I'm being overly concerned about this and that could have been a valid discussion, but that's not the approach you took: It was you who wrote "Informed and educated no?" and made it personal.
How informed and educated are you? Do these quotes seem familiar? "The amount of yellowing in white plastics is insane, everybody walkways wants dark coloured consoles." Walkways? What are you on about? Do you read the stuff you write?
"well you’re reaffirming that you a one that a deviation from the general so thanks for helping to reinforce my point." What? Any resemblance to written English is purely coincidental, right?
I got it 4 or 5 years ago. It's the one with the separate hub, so the handset uses RF rather then IR, which avoids any line-of-sight issues. I've found it reliable; sometimes the 'power on' activity macros can take a while to execute, but overall it's been fine.
One of the things I do like about it is that it's compatible with 'smart home' devices. I tinker a lot with electronics and have found that the Harmony can control anything that you can expose via an Alexa skill, so I can use it to toggle different security cameras on a Pi touchscreen display, for example.
Certainly a lot better than using separate remote controls and fielding constant queries from my wife and kids about which amp/TV input is which!
@JohnnyBastos It's not a crusade, just calling them out for being a berk. I got the reference, but didn't find it funny. As you say, each to their own.
Your words: "the timing religion had a strong predilection for all things coloured white"
Double down on your generalisation. Not sure if you're trying to say that I'm uniformed and ill-educated, but I think your posts in this comments section are not reflecting very well on you.
I use a Logitech Harmony remote for controlling TV, Amp, BTTV, UHD, etc. It's got Bluetooth, so controls the PS4 as well, but I rarely use the PS4 for anything other than gaming, so it's not that useful.
One thing missing from the PS4 Bluetooth remote profile is the ability to power the console on, so I've got a convoluted workaround triggered by the Harmony activity which boots the console.
I've got no intention of getting a separate media remote from PS5, but I hope that the existing PS4 integration carries on working.
It'll be on its side in the glass equipment stand I've been using for the last 20-odd years, sized for hifi and home cinema separates, so size isn't an issue.
I'm interested to know if it vents heat out of the top (right-hand side when horizontal).
Unless they allow you to move PS5 games onto an external USB HDD, then back to the SSD if you wanted to play them. I'd need to check, but was this mentioned or alluded to in Cerny's tech talk?
I was surprised. I already have a UHD player and buy most games from PSN, but have several PS4 games on disc. It depends on the price difference, but I do prefer the design of the digital-only one.
It's quite bold, I like it but don't have anywhere I could put it vertically (other than on top of the subwoofer, but that doesn't seem like a great idea!), So I'll have to go with it horizontal which isn't quite as imposing.
Interesting that they didn't show the back, so we don't know what ports we're getting. I'm hoping that the USB C and A ports on the front panel can accept a cable adaptor to drive a PSVR without needing the breakout box. Could do with a couple of USBs on the back so I can have a permanent external hard drive attached for my PS4 games.
The all-digital option is interesting. Most of my PS4 library is digital and I've got a UHD BD player, so I might be tempted if the price difference makes sense.
I assume 1080p/30 is easier for assembling a unified video to stream. I hope that the individual trailers will be on YouTube in 4k (or whatever) soon after the stream finishes.
Interesting the comment about using headphones if possible: are they going to try to push the Tempest audio stuff somehow?
Will Cerny be whispering ASMR tech goodness directly into our ears? (using a generic approximate HRTF model, until we can mail Sony plaster casts of our inner ears)
I wasn't sure whether they would show the box or not, but now I'm thinking they have to: if they're starting to ramp up production then it's only a matter of time before the design leaks. They don't want another PS4 Slim 'pre-reveal'...
I don't really understand the backlash. Perhaps I've missed something. I don't see how they could have gone ahead with their planned promotion with the current situation, it would have seemed a bit tone-deaf.
I guess that not causing offence makes good business sense, but it doesn't necessarily follow that this is somehow a cynical move.
@Syttorak Thanks for the reply, always good to have a discussion with reasonable folks on here!
I think it's fair to say that Sony could provide backwards compatibility for gens earlier than PS4. I'm certainly not an expert, but it feels like the PS5 would have enough grunt to be able to emulate the Cell for PS3 and the Emotion Engine and Reality Synthesiser (those CPU and GPU names aren't ageing that well) for PS2. If the hardware is capable it's just a matter of investing the time and money.
It's interesting the way Sony's approach has changed over the years. The PS2 included the PS1 CPU as an extra chip, so could run previous gen games natively. The original Asian PS3s had the PS2 chips included for full back-compat. When PS3 launched here they'd ditched the hardware solution for a software emulator, which I recall was not great. Later iterations of the PS3 dropped BC altogether. PS4 didn't even attempt any BC, opting for separately priced remasters and PS Now.
I guess they're just taking a calculated risk on how many people will change their purchasing decision based on BC alone. Time will tell if they've judged it right or not. BC is not a big deal for me, but I appreciate that it is significant for a lot of people.
My understanding is that PS4 does not play CDs. I think it lacks the necessary laser assembly (happy to be corrected).
My old launch-day 60gb PS3 plays SACDs, too! Works really well with the one hybrid SACD I've got. I think it's got a Compact Flash and Memory Stick reader as well. Nice bit of kit
@Syttorak It's a completely valid expectation for PS4 games to be playable on PS5, both for physical and digital titles. Thankfully, Cerny confirmed that the PS5 APU natively supports PS4 and PS4 Pro modes, so I think we're fine for PS4.
PS1, PS2 and PS3 are more problematic. Sure, in an ideal world PS5 would play everything, but that's not realistic:
Getting the PS5 APU to play PS4 games isn't a huge technical challenge, as the two consoles have much in common.
But getting the PS4 or PS5 to play PS3 games has always been hard, due to the unusual architecture of the PS3. Either you increase the base cost of the console by including the actual PS3 chipset (Cerny referred to this approach in his tech presentation), or you build a Cell VM that you can run on the Zen2 chipset. When you look at how the Cell PPU and SPUs were designed it becomes clear that it isn't as simple as just 'run the PS3 games in an emulator'.
If Sony dedicated some of its resources to creating an emulator that let you run PS3 games on PS5, then it would divert resources away from developing next-gen games. I'd rather have the latter than the former.
They've confirmed that the APU has built in support for 'legacy' PS4 and PS4 Pro modes. Whether current gen titles get any benefit from using the extra grunt of PS5 varies on a case by case basis.
PS4 backwards compatibility is confirmed. Some games may need patching. Don't panic.
Assume that PS1, PS2 and PS3 compatibility isn't happening. It's expensive to implement and gives low ROI. If you want to play these on current or next gen hardware, that's what PS Now is for.
I normally start to use fast travel towards the end of a game, when I'm sweeping up the last few bits and pieces and I've already traveled those paths over and over.
I liked the GoW and HZD systems where fast travel only becomes available/viable later in the game.
Astro Bot was fantastic, and wouldn't have been anywhere near as good without VR. I can just see them trying to leverage the IP outside VR, maybe a compendium like Playroom?
I think they have to drop some serious info in June. The UE5 reveal went down well, but after a while saying nothing is going to cause damage.
I reckon they'll do a few minutes on a couple of launch games, maybe Demon's Souls and Godfall, and a sizzle reel of in-development titles. Just a split second reveal of GoW2 and Horizon 2 would cause a meltdown.
Wouldn't bet against a non-VR Astro Bot. How about a brand-new Wipeout?
That's amazing. Just watched it in 4k (or what YouTube claim is 4k!) and it's really impressive. Only negative was the water animation didn't look great, lighting is incredible though.
Maybe this is part of Sony's strategy: show not say?
One thing about selling below cost price is how long it takes for the cost of production to drop below the chosen retail price. The thing is with these consoles is that they're all made from the same components: if the price of the chips used in SSDs or the fabrication costs of the APUs falls, then it falls for your competitor, too. Maybe you can make a loss for 6 months or a year while you wait for the BOM to drop, but your competitors costs drop as well.
Can't see a company selling at below cost these days, tough sell with the shareholders, I would have thought.
I'm struggling to see MS selling the XSX at a loss to undercut PS5, while also launching the Lockhart XSS to, hmm, undercut PS5?
The XSX has a bigger APU, bigger SSD, so you'd think that the BOM would be higher, right? Or are they going to dig into their Office and Azure profits to secure bragging rights?
Could be that Sony have messed up their marketing and are on the back foot.
Could be that they're biding their time waiting for the XSX hardware reveal hype and today's announcement to die down before they go in hard with their reveals.
Time will tell. PS5 hardware reveal with Demon's Souls and HZD2 optimised for next gen in early June would be a killer strategic move.
There have been multiple SKU launches before (e.g. PS3), but Microsoft have a problem this time:
Take Cyberpunk 2077 as an example, as it's confirmed cross-gen. Best experience available on an MS console will be the XSX, which is simple enough. Compare the X1X and XSS, though: X1X is 4K, XSS is 1080P. Maybe XSS has a framerate advantage, and faster loading, but a lot of people get hung up on resolution (maybe not as many as FLOPS!). How do you message this if you've decided not to have next-gen exclusives straight away, and have either 3 or 4 SKUs on the shelf? What if you've got a 4K TV, but don't want to pay for the premium XSX?
I'm fine with it being a purely next-gen title. Make full use of the new machine's capabilities without having to worry about how it would run on a Jaguar with a HDD.
If they were aiming for PS4, maybe development is further along than we think? Is there any chance of this being a launch window game? Please?
@Nightcrawler71 Maybe, but I don't know if the distribution of physical media is a big enough deal to delay it again. What's the digital/physical split across all platforms, when you include Steam and the other PC storefronts? If the game is good to go and the only thing holding release back is pressing and moving physical discs, how long are they going to be prepared to wait? Would they happily miss Black Friday, Cyber Monday and Christmas just so they could do a simultaneous digital and physical release? Surely they want to realise some ROI this year?
If the original planned release date was September, then I think it would be at risk. However, the September date is a slip from April for bug fixes and polishing, remote working shouldn't have the same kind of impact during this phase as it would have during the main part of development. Another slip from September would slide the game into the release slot for next-gen consoles, or even into next calendar (or financial?) year, with some potentially severe financial impacts. I'd expect it to release in September, even if they have to compromise on quality to do so.
Today's PS5 announcement wasn't a PR triumph. The new PlayStation is at a raw GPU spec disadvantage, and I get that some people are disappointed.
However: "This does, however, prove that Xbox is confident it can still hit its projected Holiday 2020 release window."
So MS accidentally put the real release date out early, or the wrong release date out, and then have to hastily retract it? And your takeaway from that is that they're confident?
Yup, and also: "We can look at the available NAND flash parts and construct something with optimal price performance. Someone constructing an M.2 drive presumably does not have that freedom, it would be difficult to market and sell if it were not one of those standard sizes," Mark Cerny says.
To choose 825 over 1Tb there must be a pretty compelling price reason.
It's interesting the way that MS and Sony seem to have gone. Looks like MS have gone for full-fat performance with a bigger APU while Sony have been looking for cost-savings with fewer CUs and smaller SSD.
My guess is that MS now have a decision to make:
Go with a single more powerful more expensive SKU and really push the power angle, or move forward with Lockhart to undercut the PS5.
I found most of it interesting. Maybe not the smartest marketing move, though.
My big takeaways: PS4 games can be played from a USB HDD, and don't need to be installed on the SSD. Weird size SSD makes me think they're being very price-conscious. The only rationale for 825Gb over 1Tb must be pricing. No proprietary plug-in SSDs (so far), just testing/certification for off-the-shelf drives.
I'm not doing damage control, I'm just trying to be realistic. At the moment it's going to be hard to commit to a release window: even if there's capacity to manufacture enough units then the impact on distribution isn't going to be certain at the moment. Even launch software availability could be impacted. My guess (and it is just a guess) is that they've taken a calculated risk and decided to say nothing for the moment while they wait to see whether things get worse or better. I can't see them basing their comms on 'stuff the fans'.
I think that the reason is that they don't know what the impact of COVID-19 is on the Chinese manufacturing process yet. This is going to impact Xbox production as well, and also smartphones, etc. I guess that at the moment they're hoping that the worst is over and that China gets back up to full capacity soon, but that's not certain yet. They may have decided it's best to hold off for a while longer until they've got more info. At the moment I'd be surprised if either next-gen console launches this year.
Good idea. Anyone picking up a PS5 would have a massive game library alongside whichever launch titles they get.
Due to the niche nature of Dreams and the difficulty marketing it, a bundling deal might be a better bet for Mm. Maybe a slow and steady income instead of the money tailing off a while after launch.
I liked the original. It had the steampunk Difference Engine setting, Tesla as gunsmith, people shouting 'son of a whore' and Ygraine. Works for me.
Sadly, reading the later posts from OsirisBlack it sounds more like a Resistance game than The Order. Four arms and four yellow eyes? Sounds more alien than werewolf
@Neolit It will be interesting if MS launch two SKUs in November 2020, say a Series S close to the rumoured PS5 specs and a Series X with a beefier GPU. As you say, how do you market them both effectively? What happens if Sony repeat their mid-gen refresh approach with a PS5 Pro 3 years later, possibly leapfrogging the Series X? Hopefully we'll get some solid info in Feb/March.
Comments 113
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
"non-exultant argument"
Try harder.
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
@Shinobi1Kenoby
You still don't get it. Try replacing Mormonism with other religions; like this:
"Black and white console? Who are they trying to appeal to? Hasidic Jews?"
"Not sure about the blue LEDs. They should have gone with orange; might shift a few more consoles to the Protestants in Northern Ireland!"
Either you accept that they're all ok, or you admit that there's something different about Mormonism which makes your comment ok but the ones above unacceptable.
I accept that some religions have associations or affinities with particular colours. It doesn't mean that an individual's buying preference for a video game console is going to align to the broader religious grouping; that is a generalisation.
You could have replied to tell me that I'm being overly concerned about this and that could have been a valid discussion, but that's not the approach you took: It was you who wrote "Informed and educated no?" and made it personal.
How informed and educated are you? Do these quotes seem familiar?
"The amount of yellowing in white plastics is insane, everybody walkways wants dark coloured consoles." Walkways? What are you on about? Do you read the stuff you write?
"well you’re reaffirming that you a one that a deviation from the general so thanks for helping to reinforce my point." What? Any resemblance to written English is purely coincidental, right?
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
@JohnnyBastos
I got it 4 or 5 years ago. It's the one with the separate hub, so the handset uses RF rather then IR, which avoids any line-of-sight issues. I've found it reliable; sometimes the 'power on' activity macros can take a while to execute, but overall it's been fine.
One of the things I do like about it is that it's compatible with 'smart home' devices. I tinker a lot with electronics and have found that the Harmony can control anything that you can expose via an Alexa skill, so I can use it to toggle different security cameras on a Pi touchscreen display, for example.
Certainly a lot better than using separate remote controls and fielding constant queries from my wife and kids about which amp/TV input is which!
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
@JohnnyBastos
It's not a crusade, just calling them out for being a berk. I got the reference, but didn't find it funny. As you say, each to their own.
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
@Shinobi1Kenoby
Your words:
"the timing religion had a strong predilection for all things coloured white"
Double down on your generalisation. Not sure if you're trying to say that I'm uniformed and ill-educated, but I think your posts in this comments section are not reflecting very well on you.
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
@Shinobi1Kenoby
You're generalising based on religion. Your assertion is that black and white console design will appeal more to Mormons.
I was asking you to consider how your post would have read if you'd used Islam or Hinduism instead.
Am I being sufficiently clear for your now?
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
@Shinobi1Kenoby
Mormons?
What? I'm not religious, but try replacing that word in your post with some other large religions and reread it. Still sound ok?
Re: PS5's Media Remote Is Super Slick, Includes a Microphone
I use a Logitech Harmony remote for controlling TV, Amp, BTTV, UHD, etc. It's got Bluetooth, so controls the PS4 as well, but I rarely use the PS4 for anything other than gaming, so it's not that useful.
One thing missing from the PS4 Bluetooth remote profile is the ability to power the console on, so I've got a convoluted workaround triggered by the Harmony activity which boots the console.
I've got no intention of getting a separate media remote from PS5, but I hope that the existing PS4 integration carries on working.
Re: PS5 Size Appears to Be Huge As the Internet Estimates Dimensions
It'll be on its side in the glass equipment stand I've been using for the last 20-odd years, sized for hifi and home cinema separates, so size isn't an issue.
I'm interested to know if it vents heat out of the top (right-hand side when horizontal).
Re: PS5 Digital Edition Exists for Consumers Who 'Purchase Solely Digitally'
@Sb2020
Unless they allow you to move PS5 games onto an external USB HDD, then back to the SSD if you wanted to play them. I'd need to check, but was this mentioned or alluded to in Cerny's tech talk?
Re: PS5 Digital Edition Exists for Consumers Who 'Purchase Solely Digitally'
I was surprised. I already have a UHD player and buy most games from PSN, but have several PS4 games on disc. It depends on the price difference, but I do prefer the design of the digital-only one.
Re: Gallery: PS5's Design Is Unorthodox But Unforgettable
It's quite bold, I like it but don't have anywhere I could put it vertically (other than on top of the subwoofer, but that doesn't seem like a great idea!), So I'll have to go with it horizontal which isn't quite as imposing.
Interesting that they didn't show the back, so we don't know what ports we're getting. I'm hoping that the USB C and A ports on the front panel can accept a cable adaptor to drive a PSVR without needing the breakout box. Could do with a couple of USBs on the back so I can have a permanent external hard drive attached for my PS4 games.
The all-digital option is interesting. Most of my PS4 library is digital and I've got a UHD BD player, so I might be tempted if the price difference makes sense.
Re: PS5 Reveal Event Confirmed for This Week
I assume 1080p/30 is easier for assembling a unified video to stream. I hope that the individual trailers will be on YouTube in 4k (or whatever) soon after the stream finishes.
Re: PS5 Reveal Event Confirmed for This Week
Interesting the comment about using headphones if possible: are they going to try to push the Tempest audio stuff somehow?
Will Cerny be whispering ASMR tech goodness directly into our ears? (using a generic approximate HRTF model, until we can mail Sony plaster casts of our inner ears)
Re: PS5 Reveal Event Confirmed for This Week
@TooBarFoo
Agree. I like the Horizon 2 New Day name, neat!
My money is still on Horizon 2: Far Zenith, but I know how dumb it sounds. Hopefully we'll find out on Thursday!
Re: PS5 Reveal Event Confirmed for This Week
I wasn't sure whether they would show the box or not, but now I'm thinking they have to: if they're starting to ramp up production then it's only a matter of time before the design leaks. They don't want another PS4 Slim 'pre-reveal'...
Re: Cyberpunk 2077 Night City Wire Livestream Postponed to 25th June
I don't really understand the backlash. Perhaps I've missed something. I don't see how they could have gone ahead with their planned promotion with the current situation, it would have seemed a bit tone-deaf.
I guess that not causing offence makes good business sense, but it doesn't necessarily follow that this is somehow a cynical move.
Re: PS5 Fans Are Panicking Over Backwards Compatibility
@Bistna444
7 consecutive posts. You ok?
Re: PS5 Fans Are Panicking Over Backwards Compatibility
@Syttorak
Thanks for the reply, always good to have a discussion with reasonable folks on here!
I think it's fair to say that Sony could provide backwards compatibility for gens earlier than PS4. I'm certainly not an expert, but it feels like the PS5 would have enough grunt to be able to emulate the Cell for PS3 and the Emotion Engine and Reality Synthesiser (those CPU and GPU names aren't ageing that well) for PS2. If the hardware is capable it's just a matter of investing the time and money.
It's interesting the way Sony's approach has changed over the years. The PS2 included the PS1 CPU as an extra chip, so could run previous gen games natively. The original Asian PS3s had the PS2 chips included for full back-compat. When PS3 launched here they'd ditched the hardware solution for a software emulator, which I recall was not great. Later iterations of the PS3 dropped BC altogether. PS4 didn't even attempt any BC, opting for separately priced remasters and PS Now.
I guess they're just taking a calculated risk on how many people will change their purchasing decision based on BC alone. Time will tell if they've judged it right or not. BC is not a big deal for me, but I appreciate that it is significant for a lot of people.
Re: PS5 Fans Are Panicking Over Backwards Compatibility
@Tharsman
My understanding is that PS4 does not play CDs. I think it lacks the necessary laser assembly (happy to be corrected).
My old launch-day 60gb PS3 plays SACDs, too! Works really well with the one hybrid SACD I've got. I think it's got a Compact Flash and Memory Stick reader as well. Nice bit of kit
Re: PS5 Fans Are Panicking Over Backwards Compatibility
@Syttorak
It's a completely valid expectation for PS4 games to be playable on PS5, both for physical and digital titles. Thankfully, Cerny confirmed that the PS5 APU natively supports PS4 and PS4 Pro modes, so I think we're fine for PS4.
PS1, PS2 and PS3 are more problematic. Sure, in an ideal world PS5 would play everything, but that's not realistic:
Getting the PS5 APU to play PS4 games isn't a huge technical challenge, as the two consoles have much in common.
But getting the PS4 or PS5 to play PS3 games has always been hard, due to the unusual architecture of the PS3. Either you increase the base cost of the console by including the actual PS3 chipset (Cerny referred to this approach in his tech presentation), or you build a Cell VM that you can run on the Zen2 chipset. When you look at how the Cell PPU and SPUs were designed it becomes clear that it isn't as simple as just 'run the PS3 games in an emulator'.
If Sony dedicated some of its resources to creating an emulator that let you run PS3 games on PS5, then it would divert resources away from developing next-gen games. I'd rather have the latter than the former.
Re: PS5 Fans Are Panicking Over Backwards Compatibility
They've confirmed that the APU has built in support for 'legacy' PS4 and PS4 Pro modes. Whether current gen titles get any benefit from using the extra grunt of PS5 varies on a case by case basis.
PS4 backwards compatibility is confirmed. Some games may need patching. Don't panic.
Assume that PS1, PS2 and PS3 compatibility isn't happening. It's expensive to implement and gives low ROI. If you want to play these on current or next gen hardware, that's what PS Now is for.
Re: Soapbox: Cyberpunk 2077 and the Question of Fast Travel
I normally start to use fast travel towards the end of a game, when I'm sweeping up the last few bits and pieces and I've already traveled those paths over and over.
I liked the GoW and HZD systems where fast travel only becomes available/viable later in the game.
Re: Sony: We Are Planning to Introduce a Compelling Line-Up for PS5 Soon
Colony Wars and G-Police remakes, with support for PSVR and PSVR2.
Never going to happen, but I can dream...
Re: Sony: We Are Planning to Introduce a Compelling Line-Up for PS5 Soon
@nookie_egg
Astro Bot was fantastic, and wouldn't have been anywhere near as good without VR. I can just see them trying to leverage the IP outside VR, maybe a compendium like Playroom?
Re: Sony: 'We Are Planning to Introduce a Compelling Line-Up for PS5 Soon'
I think they have to drop some serious info in June. The UE5 reveal went down well, but after a while saying nothing is going to cause damage.
I reckon they'll do a few minutes on a couple of launch games, maybe Demon's Souls and Godfall, and a sizzle reel of in-development titles. Just a split second reveal of GoW2 and Horizon 2 would cause a meltdown.
Wouldn't bet against a non-VR Astro Bot.
How about a brand-new Wipeout?
Re: PS5 Unreal Engine 5 Gameplay Demo Finally Shows Us What Next-Gen Games Look Like
That's amazing. Just watched it in 4k (or what YouTube claim is 4k!) and it's really impressive. Only negative was the water animation didn't look great, lighting is incredible though.
Maybe this is part of Sony's strategy: show not say?
Re: PS5 Release Date of Holiday 2020 Unaffected by COVID-19, Claims Sony
Good news. I need something to look forward to. Guess I can earmark some of the refund from the family summer holiday...
Re: PS5's Price Could Be Undercut by Xbox Series X, Analysts Suggest
One thing about selling below cost price is how long it takes for the cost of production to drop below the chosen retail price. The thing is with these consoles is that they're all made from the same components: if the price of the chips used in SSDs or the fabrication costs of the APUs falls, then it falls for your competitor, too. Maybe you can make a loss for 6 months or a year while you wait for the BOM to drop, but your competitors costs drop as well.
Can't see a company selling at below cost these days, tough sell with the shareholders, I would have thought.
Re: PS5's Price Could Be Undercut by Xbox Series X, Analysts Suggest
I'm struggling to see MS selling the XSX at a loss to undercut PS5, while also launching the Lockhart XSS to, hmm, undercut PS5?
The XSX has a bigger APU, bigger SSD, so you'd think that the BOM would be higher, right? Or are they going to dig into their Office and Azure profits to secure bragging rights?
Re: Reaction: Sony Needs to Show Us a True, Next-Gen PS5 Exclusive After Lukewarm Inside Xbox
Hmm, interesting.
Could be that Sony have messed up their marketing and are on the back foot.
Could be that they're biding their time waiting for the XSX hardware reveal hype and today's announcement to die down before they go in hard with their reveals.
Time will tell. PS5 hardware reveal with Demon's Souls and HZD2 optimised for next gen in early June would be a killer strategic move.
Re: Talking Point: Could PS5's Price Be a Problem Against Xbox's Rumoured Lockhart?
There have been multiple SKU launches before (e.g. PS3), but Microsoft have a problem this time:
Take Cyberpunk 2077 as an example, as it's confirmed cross-gen. Best experience available on an MS console will be the XSX, which is simple enough.
Compare the X1X and XSS, though: X1X is 4K, XSS is 1080P. Maybe XSS has a framerate advantage, and faster loading, but a lot of people get hung up on resolution (maybe not as many as FLOPS!). How do you message this if you've decided not to have next-gen exclusives straight away, and have either 3 or 4 SKUs on the shelf? What if you've got a 4K TV, but don't want to pay for the premium XSX?
Re: Rumour: Horizon Zero Dawn 2 Initially Planned for PS4 Before Moving to PS5
I'm fine with it being a purely next-gen title. Make full use of the new machine's capabilities without having to worry about how it would run on a Jaguar with a HDD.
If they were aiming for PS4, maybe development is further along than we think? Is there any chance of this being a launch window game? Please?
Re: Cyberpunk 2077 Still Set for September 2020 Release Date, CD Projekt Red Confirms
@Nightcrawler71
Maybe, but I don't know if the distribution of physical media is a big enough deal to delay it again. What's the digital/physical split across all platforms, when you include Steam and the other PC storefronts? If the game is good to go and the only thing holding release back is pressing and moving physical discs, how long are they going to be prepared to wait? Would they happily miss Black Friday, Cyber Monday and Christmas just so they could do a simultaneous digital and physical release? Surely they want to realise some ROI this year?
Re: Cyberpunk 2077 Still Set for September 2020 Release Date, CD Projekt Red Confirms
If the original planned release date was September, then I think it would be at risk.
However, the September date is a slip from April for bug fixes and polishing, remote working shouldn't have the same kind of impact during this phase as it would have during the main part of development.
Another slip from September would slide the game into the release slot for next-gen consoles, or even into next calendar (or financial?) year, with some potentially severe financial impacts.
I'd expect it to release in September, even if they have to compromise on quality to do so.
Re: Microsoft Responds to PS5 Deep Dive with Confidence in 2020 Launch for Xbox Series X
Today's PS5 announcement wasn't a PR triumph. The new PlayStation is at a raw GPU spec disadvantage, and I get that some people are disappointed.
However:
"This does, however, prove that Xbox is confident it can still hit its projected Holiday 2020 release window."
So MS accidentally put the real release date out early, or the wrong release date out, and then have to hastily retract it? And your takeaway from that is that they're confident?
Re: Reaction: PS5 Deep Dive Was As Expected, But Was Shockingly Misjudged
@wiiware
As far as the presentation and the DF article, the total SSD size is 825. Is Twitter saying it's 1Tb with 825 usable?
Re: Reaction: PS5 Deep Dive Was As Expected, But Was Shockingly Misjudged
@wiiware
Source for SSD size?
Re: Reaction: PS5 Deep Dive Was As Expected, But Was Shockingly Misjudged
@arnoldlayne83
Yup, and also:
"We can look at the available NAND flash parts and construct something with optimal price performance. Someone constructing an M.2 drive presumably does not have that freedom, it would be difficult to market and sell if it were not one of those standard sizes," Mark Cerny says.
Courtesy DF
Re: Reaction: PS5 Deep Dive Was As Expected, But Was Shockingly Misjudged
@wiiware
To choose 825 over 1Tb there must be a pretty compelling price reason.
It's interesting the way that MS and Sony seem to have gone. Looks like MS have gone for full-fat performance with a bigger APU while Sony have been looking for cost-savings with fewer CUs and smaller SSD.
My guess is that MS now have a decision to make:
Go with a single more powerful more expensive SKU and really push the power angle, or move forward with Lockhart to undercut the PS5.
Re: Reaction: PS5 Deep Dive Was As Expected, But Was Shockingly Misjudged
I found most of it interesting. Maybe not the smartest marketing move, though.
My big takeaways:
PS4 games can be played from a USB HDD, and don't need to be installed on the SSD.
Weird size SSD makes me think they're being very price-conscious. The only rationale for 825Gb over 1Tb must be pricing.
No proprietary plug-in SSDs (so far), just testing/certification for off-the-shelf drives.
Re: Rumour: PS5 Deep Dive Video Is 52 Minutes Long
YouTube title is "The Road to PS5".
Odd that it doesn't seem to be mentioned on the EU PS blog...
Re: Rumour: PS5 Deep Dive Video Is 52 Minutes Long
I am excited.
What are the chances of hints of new games? Glimpse of Kratos or Aloy?
Re: Talking Point: Why Isn't Sony Saying More About PS5?
@RustyBullet
I'm not doing damage control, I'm just trying to be realistic. At the moment it's going to be hard to commit to a release window: even if there's capacity to manufacture enough units then the impact on distribution isn't going to be certain at the moment. Even launch software availability could be impacted. My guess (and it is just a guess) is that they've taken a calculated risk and decided to say nothing for the moment while they wait to see whether things get worse or better.
I can't see them basing their comms on 'stuff the fans'.
Re: Talking Point: Why Isn't Sony Saying More About PS5?
I think that the reason is that they don't know what the impact of COVID-19 is on the Chinese manufacturing process yet. This is going to impact Xbox production as well, and also smartphones, etc.
I guess that at the moment they're hoping that the worst is over and that China gets back up to full capacity soon, but that's not certain yet.
They may have decided it's best to hold off for a while longer until they've got more info.
At the moment I'd be surprised if either next-gen console launches this year.
Re: CD Projekt RED Unveils New Look for Female V in Cyberpunk 2077
I prefer the new look. Liked old V, but like new V more. Once I saw the old 45 minute demo with female V it was inevitable I'd play thru as her.
Just don't change the voice actors:
"Don't spend it all on scotch"
"Got me confused with someone else, Jackie. I'm cleaner than a c*** in a convent"
Re: Soapbox: Why Dreams Needs to Come Pre-Installed on Every PS5
Good idea. Anyone picking up a PS5 would have a massive game library alongside whichever launch titles they get.
Due to the niche nature of Dreams and the difficulty marketing it, a bundling deal might be a better bet for Mm. Maybe a slow and steady income instead of the money tailing off a while after launch.
Re: Rumour: Resident Evil 8 Has Zombies and Werewolves, First-Person, Chris Redfield Returns
PSVR support again, please.
RE7 in VR was awesome.
Re: Rumour: The Order: 1886 Will Make a Triumphant Comeback with PS5 Sequel
I liked the original. It had the steampunk Difference Engine setting, Tesla as gunsmith, people shouting 'son of a whore' and Ygraine. Works for me.
Sadly, reading the later posts from OsirisBlack it sounds more like a Resistance game than The Order. Four arms and four yellow eyes? Sounds more alien than werewolf
Re: PS5 Specs Leak Sends the Web into a Frenzy
@Neolit
It will be interesting if MS launch two SKUs in November 2020, say a Series S close to the rumoured PS5 specs and a Series X with a beefier GPU. As you say, how do you market them both effectively? What happens if Sony repeat their mid-gen refresh approach with a PS5 Pro 3 years later, possibly leapfrogging the Series X?
Hopefully we'll get some solid info in Feb/March.