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Topic: Nier: Automata

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KratosMD

@kyleforrester87 That would explain why you didn't find the side quests that great. I'm glad that I decided to study philosophy during upper secondary school because I found those quests to be really unique. Having learned about certain philosophers will also help you piece together which real life individuals some of the characters are based on. When I realised that a certain boss in the game was actually based on the lover of a philosopher in real life, a lot of things started making more sense to me.

So yeah, having knowledge in philosophy is a big plus if you want to enjoy the game even more.

KratosMD

Octane

@kyleforrester87 @crimsontadpoles I can't remember whether I unlocked fast travel or not, but I do recall having trouble figuring out how it works. Maybe because the game gives you fast travel points before it actually allows you to fast travel. Just going for the story seems to be my best option.

Octane

Ralizah

I'll re-evaluate once I actually play the entire game, but at the moment I'm inclined to call the "philosophy" in this game window-dressing. Which isn't a bad thing: I just get the impression that the creator is more interested in using themes and ideas to evoke certain emotions in the player than actually exploring them in a meaningful fashion. And it's the easiest thing in the world to invoke a few famous philosophical phrases and names in your work to achieve an appearance of depth that's not present in the actual text.

With that said, there are some games that you still gain additional appreciation of if you're even mildly well-read in philosophy and/or world literature. For example, Persona 4 as it relates to Nietzsche (there's a lot of pseudo-Jungian blathering in this game, but it's 99% window dressing, whereas you can actually do a very surface-level Nietzschean reading of the game itself), or Persona 5's true ending as it relates to Dostoevsky's famous "Grand Inquisitor" fable in his Brothers Karamazov.

Oh, and on a side-note, I officially hate the joke endings in this game. Started route B. Played some tedious 2 minute segment where you're a robot. That's cool. Lowered a crane after starting as 9S and ran down it, only for the game to give me another 2 lines of text and the RESTART ME BEFORE THE ROBOT SEQUENCE.

Okay, fine. I do the robot thing again. Kind of sucks this time. I figure: "OK, the crane had a place in the middle to drop down, and I was supposed to go there." I do that. Joke ending again.

Robot sequence again. I'm actively getting irritated now. I see another crane altogether. You can guess what happens.

Finally, on the fourth go, I figure out that I can just drop down to the flight unit below me. Which I didn't try before because most of the time when I try to jump off a platform like that, I'm greeted with an invisible wall. The game usually doesn't let you just skirt the middle man and go directly to your goal like that. Not this time.

This game has no respect for the player's time, and I hate it. Also not a fan of re-running the same story events, and 9s' focus on hacking over melee makes combat a lot less fun.

@KratosMD I don't know that I've encountered that boss yet, but would the "lover" you mentioned happen to be Simone de Beauvoir?

@Octane I'd do the side-quests. They add to the flavor of the total experience in a meaningful way.

I've done the vast majority of the available side-quests so far, and I think it was a good call.

Edited on by Ralizah

Ralizah

PSN: Ralizah

KratosMD

@Ralizah Yes exactly. The reason why you feel like you haven't encountered that boss yet is because they develop more on this in the second playthrough. In the first playthrough you're pretty much clueless, so I won't talk more about it until you've reached that point in the second one.

Edited on by KratosMD

KratosMD

Octane

@Ralizah Hmm. I didn't really like them. Lack of voice acting makes it difficult to enjoy story when I have to read a wall of text.

Octane

Thrillho

@Ralizah I found the second play through quite tedious at times but the game starts to give you bigger clues as to what else is going on.

The third time through is the winner though

Thrillho

Th3solution

@Ralizah Oh yes, I remember that sequence and I did the exact same thing with having to play the same robot sequence over and over about 4 times until I dropped down to the “correct” place. Fortunately, I don’t think I recall any more similar “cheap” endings that bad where you have to go back over and over until you figure it out or get to the right path by happenstance.
But I would prepare you a little for probably the most laborious part of the game to get through — route B. You probably are far enough in to be feeling this and your comment about the re-running of events and respecting he gamers time is a legitimate criticism at this point. However, I’m sure the other fans of the game would echo this when I say that it will be worth it to push through. 9S has some pretty unique things coming up and eventually you will make it to some awesome story points. Try to hang in there! You’ve made it this far so I feel confident that you won’t give up. Because to your point, the relative shallowness of the philosophical narrative will also hopefully crystallize into something more with what’s coming up. Such things are often hard to predict how another person will feel about them because we all interpret things on different levels, but I honestly feel that, although some of the philosophy is relatively shallow filler to evoke a targeted response, when taken in context of the overarching narrative it has more impact. I don’t know, I’m not really well-versed in philosophy, at least academically, but I do like to ponder things. And it’s rare to have a video game even attempt to ask the difficult questions and do so in a entertaining and engaging way. And the fact that I’m thinking about this game and enjoying the discussion about it 10 months after platinuming it is a testament to Nier’s quality in this regard.

By the way, all this NieR discussion had me put the soundtrack on in the background today and I just adore the emotions and memories of the game scenes that come back to me as I listen. I almost never listen to video game music (when I’m not actually playing the game) but it has been a joy to listen to today while I work.

Edited on by Th3solution

The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

Ralizah

A few things that came to mind:

  • Framerate issues don't usually bug me too much, but this game seems to have some really unfortunate performance issues. It's definitely getting pretty chunky during multiple sections of the game, and is at its worst near the end of Route A (so far) when fighting numerous enemies in the really open city environment. Also, I don't think there's any AA here, because there be jaggies all over the place, which is more noticeable for a game like this that opts for a more realistic visual style. I thought about getting it on PC, but apparently it's really poorly optimized for that platform.
  • I'm a bit tickled that the game really did record me messing around with the settings in Route A. Another really creative touch.

@Th3solution Oh, no worries, I'm totally pushing through to the end. I'll probably even do the majority of the Route B sidequests if they're as painless as the ones in Route A.

One of my favorite games from 2017 (that's becoming an increasingly long list) was Xenoblade Chronicles 2, and I complained pretty incessantly about it on NL at the time. The important thing is if the entire experience transcends the sum of its flawed parts, and I'm guessing that's not going to be an issue here.

Edited on by Ralizah

Ralizah

PSN: Ralizah

Th3solution

@Ralizah Haha, oh yeah, I hear ya. My first several posts on the Bloodborne thread were pretty negative when I played that for the first time a few months ago. Unfair combat, poor hit detection, lack of tutorials and maps, horrible save system, repetitive gameplay, ... the complaints went on and on. And after making it over the hump, and with the help and encouragement of the PS community, it became one of my very favorites games of this entire generation. I think it sits at #5 in my top 5 list that I posted on the respective thread on here (Incidentally NieR Automata sits at #3). So there is something to be said for a game with a little bit of a slow burn or a nice crescendo with building rewards toward the end.

The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

Ralizah

So, I'm a little over halfway through Route B, I'm around level 48 (a little overleveled for the point I'm at in the game, probably, but oh well), and have completed 52% of the quests.

I'm finding that 9S' hacking ability is quite OP. It literally trivializes any fight you use it in. With that said, his lack of melee proficiency when compared to 2B makes using it feel necessary to avoid tedium.

The cryptic cutscenes they keep stuffing into the familiar flow of the campaign now are quite interesting. I liked finding out more about the inhabitants of the forest kingdom, although it makes me feel even worse about what ends up happening to them.

Speaking of which, a lot of the sidequests are quite dark. I almost kind of regret helping the people in The Wandering Couple sidequest now. Learning what I learned about the woman, I imagine she left her male companion because she was just trying to save her own hide.. I want my 50,000G back!

There seem to be sidequests that aren't officially listed, but still come with narrative elements. The wise men robots I keep finding (does it end with the one that commits suicide?), those tough gold robots that apparently know eachother, etc.

Oh, and Emil can go take a dive off a cliff somewhere. I was finishing that quest with the robot who keeps getting stronger and challenging you, and the conclusion to that could have felt meaningful, but Emil's lousy song kept playing in the background and distracting me.

Still enjoying the game. If this is the low point of the experience, I think I'll be just fine.

Edited on by Ralizah

Ralizah

PSN: Ralizah

Thrillho

@Ralizah Remember, with 9S you can hack and control an enemy if you do so without them spotting you. Each has a fairly unique set of moves and (if you're so inclined) I seem to remember there being a trophy tied to killing enemies with a hacked unit too.

Thrillho

crimsontadpoles

I finally got the platinum trophy for this game. It wasn't something that I was originally planning on doing since some of the trophies are a bit tedious, but by the time I upgraded all the weapons to max to unlock a secret boss fight, I was already pretty close to that trophy. Plus I used the secret trophy shop hidden in the game to skip past the fishing and archives trophies.

Now that I did everything that I was interested in doing with this game, I played through the ending again and made the choice to help someone.

ellsworth004

I always read what people have to say about this game because its one of my favorites. I'm really thinking about doing another play through. Then try the dlc again.

ellsworth004

PSN: ellsworth004

Ralizah

@Thrillho Oh, is them not spotting you what triggers the ability to hijack them? I wasn't sure what was triggering that. I generally find the explosions to be more useful, though, especially if enemies are grouped together.

Ralizah

PSN: Ralizah

Ralizah

So, I finished Route B tonight. Some thoughts.

  • The story structure was clearly designed around Route A. Route B doesn't have a great sense of pacing in its later half. It feels anticlimactic.
  • I wonder if "Type-E" androids will be featuring in the main plot to any significant degree. That one quest felt like foreshadowing.
  • I wish there was more variety to the hacking. I'm getting tired of destroying cores with my little ship constantly.
  • There seems to be a decent amount of new story content here, but the cutscenes interspersed throughout are often so cryptic that I have no ideas what conclusions I'm supposed to be drawing.
  • Besides developing the context around certain characters (the opera robot, the forest king, etc.), the BIG revelation in this route is that humans have been dead the entire time, and the Android leaders are keeping the illusion of human survival alive to keep the struggle against the robots on Earth going. Not particularly shocking, but maybe we'll get some decent plot twists that build off of this.
  • There also seems to be the implication that YoRHa is some connected to the death cult featured at the end of Route A.
  • Something I've wondered since the beginning of the game: why do androids seem so baffled by the notion of intelligent machines when they, themselves, are evidence that non-organic lifeforms can be intelligent and feel emotion? They talk and act like they're humans, but it's pretty clear that they're machines themselves.
  • Maybe the androids are intelligent because the brain patterns of humans were digitized and transferred into their network before going extinct?
  • The 'preview' of the next few routes was interesting. Hopefully this means the game will be adding actual new content instead of running me through the same set of events from a slightly different perspective.
  • Overall, while I still enjoyed my time with it, I feel like Route B didn't add enough substantive new content that really required me to play as 9S to appreciate. It feels like padding.

I've completed 55% of the sidequests and am currently sitting at level 50.

Edited on by Ralizah

Ralizah

PSN: Ralizah

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