Topic: PlayStation 5 --OT--

@Thrillho Your story has convinced me to keep my PS4 hooked up when I get a PS5. I had thought about the redundancy of having a PS4 when the PS5 can do all the things a 4 can do, only better. I think I’m going to also like being able to have two TVs/two rooms as gaming options.

Wow! I'd be gutted and annoyed if I got a 'broken' PS5 - hopefully they sort it out as soon as possible for you.

I tend to keep hold of consoles. I still have my PS3 Phat 60GB, PS3 Slim, PS4 and PS4 Pro too. I still have my OG Xbox, Xbox 360 Slim, Xbox One, XB1S Gears 4 edition and XB1X Project Scorpio edition too. Currently the PS5 and Series X are connected to my main TV with my Pro and X connected to my Bedroom TV.

I got rid of mine but mainly because a friend was looking to buy one. Kept the PS3 around for the longest time though - mostly because it could play audio CDs 😂

@Arugula The reliability of my 4 is quite remarkable. At this point in the last two generations I’d had to replace my PS3 and PS2 due to technical failure. My launch PS4 hasn’t failed me yet.

@Th3solution I had to replace the PSU and the fan in my PS4 Pro after 2 years. Technically they both still worked but they started making weird noises, even in rest mode. It's possible that the failure of one of them caused the failure of the other somehow, as they happened pretty much at the same time.

@Th3solution Well, the PS4 was still set up from doing the data transfer so there was no need to get rid of it so quickly. As an aside, I'd highly recommend getting an ethernet cable to do the data transfer if you don't have one; it only took about 10 mins to get the profile and console data moved across and another 10-15 mins to get the few games I wanted to move across too.

Spoken to customer services and it's just a case of sending it back (for free), they'll look at it and either repair or send a refurbished one out. Apparently, they'll even include a note of what went wrong. Maximum of three weeks which isn't the end of the world but annoying as I have next week off!

Its funny, because technically, the new generation is a much larger difference than ever before. Back in 2013, the PS4 was the most powerful console but the PS5 is several PS4's more powerful so it must be the biggest jump.

The issue though is that technology has already reached milestones that transformed the way we view, hear and type of games we play. Going from 2 colours (like Black and White) to 8 colours, to 32 colours etc was quite transformative. However, going from 16m to 1bn, a massive jump up and bigger than any jump before, has much less impact. Going from Sprites to Polygons was a big transformation, going from simple beeps, to digitised sound/speech, to full CD quality audio was a big step, going from 2D to 3D was a big step...

Everything now is more about refinement - even RT is a graphical refinement to create more realistic lighting that doesn't have the issues of current lighting methods. It can also help devs too as they don't have to try and 'bake in' lighting. As for ultra realistic visuals, we see numerous games now utilising incredibly realistic visuals.

In terms of Gaming milestones, I can't think of any major area now that we are waiting for the technology to catch up to enable it. If you look at Audio for example, where is there left to go? I know PS5 now has 3D audio but that's been around a few years now and its a bit more refined than full surround sound but we have Movie quality audio. We already have 1bn colours, High Dynamic Range, high res 'realistic' visuals. As far as game-play is concerned, we have 3D worlds, every style of movement, every type of vehicle etc.

Of course there are things that can be improved, like Open World density, more physics, better AI, more Dynamic worlds etc but really, these are iterations on what came before. Improvements can still have an impact but even if an Open World RPG for example makes all these improvements, there is still a feeling of iteration rather than something that is transformative as we have been playing 3D open world RPG's for years.

Mixed Media (AR/VR) of course can still offer something entirely new and has the potential to see the biggest leap - mostly because its still in its infancy and the hardware was quite limiting in numerous ways so that is one area where technology can be more transformative than iterative.

Another thing though is what one person may consider transformative, another could see as more iterative. For example, playing a game at say 900p that only hits 30fps when looking at the sky and minute+ loads every time you die or 'fast travel' can be 'transformed' with much higher quality visuals (not just res), locked 60fps with significantly better input response and almost instantaneous loads - transforms a game that was frustrating to play into an enjoyable experience - although its still more 'iterative' because the story, the characters, the objectives, the basic game-play loop, the audio etc are the same.

The difference between 900p vs 1080p and 1800p vs 2160p is the same as a Percentage. Both 900p and 1800p are less than 70% of 1080p and 2160p respectively. However, in Pixel counts, the number of pixels 'lost' by dropping from 2160p to 1800p is more than the number of pixels in a 1080p image. 1080p has 2,073,600 pixels but the difference between 1800p and 2160p is 2,534,400. However, those are a lot smaller pixels so on a 4k screen, any upscale 'blur' is also much smaller so doesn't have as much impact. You also have much more information to sample from as well.

Its similar to 'sprites' and Polygon counts too. If you have a Sprite made of 8pixels high by 5 pixels wide, and 'each' pixel has to be 1 of 8 colours, you are limited to what you can do. If you 'double' the resolution, you have 16x10 (4x the number of pixels) and increase the colour count to 32, you can add more detail and more 'shape' to that sprite. Add some 'shading' too to create more of a '3D' look. Double the Resolution again and increase the colour count to 256, and your Sprite now has 32x20 pixels to add detail, more shading etc. Even movement can be refined too because you have 'more' pixels to refine movement. If the sprite 'Jumps', it can only move up in pixels so the movement is more jerky. If it takes a second to jump up and come back down, the height is '2' pixels (for the 8x5) and the game is running at 60fps, every 15 frames, the character moves. It can't move every frame because each pixel cannot be multiple colours. The 32x20 would move up 8 pixels as each pixel in the 8x5 sprite is equivalent to 4x4 pixels at 32x20 so jumping up the same height would be 2 x 4 = 8, so every 3.75frames, the character has moved 'enough' to be able to render the movement. Just moving a Sprite up and back a 'quarter' of its overall height in a second, you can see how many more unique frames. In the 8x5 sprite, there are just a few positions it can be - at 0 height, at 1 pixel height and at full (2 pixel) height. With the 32x20 Sprite, it can be a ), at 1pixel, at 2, at 3 etc up to 8 and then back down. Therefore, the movement is improved.

However, you can reach a point where the resolution doesn't impact the motion. If that sprite has 30 pixels (or more) to move in height, it can move up a pixel every single frame. If you double the resolution, it still moves up every frame and the 'same' distance too but each frame is now two pixels higher. The extra pixels won't improve the motion.

Polygons too - you reach a point where the number of polygons are more a refinement. You can make a circle from say 10 triangles to create a Decagon but its not as 'round' as a circle with 20 triangles. Much like a 'ball' made of 9 pixels (3x3) is not as round as the same sized ball made of 6x6 pixels. However, you will reach a point where an increase in pixel/triangle count isn't going to make something look more round. Nothing shows this off more than Racing games and cars - lots of round and curved shapes here. I really can't see how even quadrupling the Polygon counts on cars in GT7 would be transformative over the Cars from GTSport - yes there are refinements to maybe some of the finer details and improvements to materials and lighting too but it can still be very difficult to tell an in game photo from a real life one in GTSport.

The TL:DR is that we are at a point now where all the major milestones are possible now and that is why things feel more iterative than transformative. When technology allowed Devs to build 3D worlds, that was a major milestone and transformed gaming. Internet connectivity transformed gaming - how we play with others and the type of experiences too. Audio has transformed gaming - being able to hear where Enemies are in a 3D world, immersing you in with cut-scenes and dialogue.

I cannot think of anything myself that we are waiting on technology to catch up and enable. Yes you could argue that we aren't quite there yet with ultra-realism with fully path traced lighting - the kind of CGi and lighting that movies can offer but I'd argue that's iteration on what we have now. Its not like I can think of something though that no game can offer because the technology hasn't reached a stage where its now possible. Whether you are controlling a Character or vehicle, I can't think of anything we haven't been able to do before so I think its always going to be iterative now - unless we add in Mixed Media.

I would love to hear an idea that is entirely new and only made possible by the new hardware. I don't mean things like R&C's Rifts and the fact that the SSD made that possible because that is possible now - even if that would mean being stuck in the rift for 30s instead of just 1 or 2s. What it has done is enabled that to be a more frequent feature and jump around more in a level without it breaking up the momentum. It would be really frustrating to be waiting in a rift for 30s to drop into a world for a 30s on rails section before falling into a rift for another 30s etc. It would be a lot less frustrating if you had 30min+ sections before jumping into a 'rift'. Turok on the N64 had rifts/portals and the general game-playy of R&C looks basically the same as other R&C games - not a criticism. There are games too that allow you to 'teleport' - look at Dishonoured for example - the principal is the same.

These maybe more refined, more prolific, more a feature etc etc but they are not entirely 'new'. Like I said, I cannot think of something I can't do in a video game that technology will suddenly allow. No new mechanic we haven't yet been able to do but I'd love to hear of 'something'...

@BAMozzy Maybe the next transformative aspect of gaming will be something seen possible now through PSVR2. That also haptic feedback, which I feel is still in its infancy.

@Th3solution As I said, Mixed Media is the only area of gaming that I can see having any major milestone in gaming. I don't have a VR (or mixed media) headset to know exactly what experiences are impossible now but could be possible in the future. Obviously, there are a lot of areas that can be improved by better technology - like visuals, not being tethered by cables etc but as its still very much in its infancy, I can see the possibility that some milestones specific to that format to target.

Haptic Feedback isn't really that new. Its more refined now and Sony has certainly taking it to a new level, but I feel its more iterative. Its come a long way from the basic 'rumble' packs but the DS5 is an iteration of that. Xbox had Rumble triggers that give you haptic feedback - like the right trigger rumbling when your right wheels go off the track in Forza, increasing in intensity the further off you are. Granted, its not as clever as Sony's which seems an iteration on Switches Haptic feedback. Also Sony adds more feedback to the adaptive triggers too so its certainly the most advanced controller in that respect.

I can understand why it may seem transformative for Sony more so because the DS4 didn't offer anything more than the basic 'rumble' but to me it seems like the next logical step up from 'rumble triggers'. I don't know if it can transform gaming though. Whether you have more resistance pulling a heavy bow string back over a light bow, you are still running around shooting a Bow. Its an iterative 'enhancement' to the overall experience of shooting a bow in a game but I don't know that its enabling something impossible before - ie firing bows in games.

@BAMozzy Smell-O-Vision is next. I want to smell my games!

@nessisonett Lol, can you imagine smelling the sewer levels of Resident Evil 2, the dusty plains and animal dung in RDR2, or when you body up defensively in the paint in NBA2K with 9 other sweaty guys all around you. 😂

I wonder what Bloodborne would smell like. Or Helheim in Hellblade.

@Th3solution To be fair, that would be seriously cool. It’s the last frontier of gaming innovations!

@Th3solution "I wonder what Bloodborne would smell like"
I definitely don't wanna know

@Arugula @Th3solution The only fault I had with my PS4 is the eject disk fault, it was quite loud at time too. I gave mine to my niece with a caveat of that fault. But I the only time I used my ps4 since I got my ps5 was to submit screenshots for the forum competition. PS5 is so much quicker and quieter, I couldn't bear to use my PS4.

@JohnnyShoulder I actually haven't figured out how to find which of your friends are playing or have played a certain game. That's the one feature I really miss from the PS4.

@Kidfried There are quite a few things that used to be on the front dash for the PS4 which are now hidden away behind a menu (such as trophies). If you tap the PS button on your controller (not hold it as that will take you to the home screen), and then go to Gamebase, that is what used to the Friends tab on PS4.

@Kidfried look on your friends profile and then the games tab...shows you all their games and time played too...

I beat The Pedestrian there. It really was fantastic. Definitely hit me the same way The Witness did. It won’t spoil anyone but there’s one moment where everything clicks into place that’s one of the smartest twists I’ve seen in a while. For the price, it was worth every penny. Just brilliant.

@nessisonett You've peaked my interest!