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Topic: Ten Forward - The Star Trek Topic

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RogerRoger

@FullbringIchigo The comment on torture was also pretty brave back when "Chain of Command, Part II" was aired; nowadays, thanks to Jack Bauer and our post-9/11 world, shows bring the reality of torture into our living rooms on a daily basis but back then, it was rare.

And I agree with @LN78 in both praising David Warner (he's always excellent) and suggesting "Family" and "Tapestry" as excellent overview shows on Picard's character (whilst "The Inner Light" is a wonderful piece of science fiction, you can't include it without including "Lessons" and at that point, the £40 price tag for the collection goes out the window... particularly since, at that broader level, I'd also argue strongly for "Time Squared" and "Darmok" as important insights on Picard's character).

If we're dealing purely with providing a catch-up for the new show, then it should be "I, Borg" and "Descent, Parts I and II" taking their place.

And a whole bunch of Voyager episodes, too.

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FullbringIchigo

@LN78 Kelvinverse wasn't bad, the issue is that not only are they recasting beloved characters BUT they also had to compete in a time where big budget action films were taking all the headlines such as Iron Man so i can see why they wanted to go for a more action route but it's not like Trek has to always be mindful or philosophical, there is room for a good action romp and some silliness too, some of the best episodes are the ones that were just fun

also unlike what most people believe the Kelvinverse films did have a message to tell even under all the action, it's about family and bonds which i think are also as important as acceptance and diversity because even as connected as we are thanks to things like the internet we still seem to be pushing each other apart

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LN78

@FullbringIchigo I liked the Kelvin movies (two of them,anyway) well enough for what they were, which is exactly as you suggested. I can't help but feel a little (perhaps a bit more than that) resentful towards them,however, as they certainly appear to have set the template for what Trek has become and will continue to be moving forwards which is not a vision I can find myself getting on board with and that makes me immeasurably sad.
PS Steady on @RogerRoger. We nearly agreed on something!!

Edited on by LN78

LN78

FullbringIchigo

@LN78 well when the guy in charge of the shows was also heavily involved in those films then it's to be expected

not to mention that CBS even said that to start with the series was originally intended to be part of the Kelvin Time Line you can see why

and of course they are still trying to recover from the cock up Bryan Fuller and his cronies did it was his idea to make all the changes such as the Klingons and ships and by the time CBS realised what was going on it was too late, too much time and money and been put into it so they couldn't back out and not to mention that Netflix was pushing them

to be honest i don't think Trek will ever recover from the absolute mess Discovery's production was

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RogerRoger

@LN78

If it helps, my full reply was nearly "...David Warner (he's always excellent, particularly in Star Trek V: The Final Frontier which I watched the other night, and will be returning to later in the week with a glowing review)..." so never fear, Hell hasn't frozen over.

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Making It So Since 1987

LN78

@FullbringIchigo As far as I was aware Fuller's intention was to make a Trek anthology show in the vein of " American Horror Story" where each season might have taken place in a different timeline with varying ships,crews and even styles. At what point that mutated into the horror story we now know as "Discovery" is probably something you know far more about than I but one need only look at the huge number of producers (both creative and executive) credited at the start of the show to know that the old adage regarding too many cooks in the kitchen certainly rings true.

LN78

FullbringIchigo

@LN78 to be honestly it would have been better as an anthology series and i really wish they had kept to that but i guess they realised just how much that would have cost and decided against it, just picture it each season you would have to hire a new cast, build new sets create new uniforms and props, that's expensive unless you go with an animated series then that cuts the cost significantly

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KALofKRYPTON

@FullbringIchigo Ronnie Cox makes Chain of Command for me!

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Twitter: @KALofKRYPTON (at your own risk, I don't care if you're offended)

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LN78

@KALofKRYPTON @Fullbringlchigo I loved that the episode (Rian Johnson take note) subverted the audience's expectations by making Jelico a competent and resourceful captain, albeit one with a different command style, that handled the situation as well as, if not better than Picard might have done. Cox is a great actor but he'll always be Dick Jones to me.

Edited on by LN78

LN78

RogerRoger

@KALofKRYPTON You could tell how good a captain Jellico was; he had his own catchphrase ("Get it done!") straight out of the box. Only the best captains have catchphrases!

Best thing he achieved? He got Deanna out of those damned outfits and into a proper uniform.

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FullbringIchigo

@RogerRoger remember what Marina Sirtis said about that

"It covered up my cleavage and, consequently, I got all my brains back, because when you have a cleavage you can't have brains in Hollywood. So I got all my brains back and I was allowed to do things that I hadn't been allowed to do for five or six years. I went on away teams, I was in charge of staff, I had my pips back, I had phasers, I had all the equipment again, and it was fabulous. I was absolutely thrilled."

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RogerRoger

@FullbringIchigo ...and the fact it took so long, on a show that was supposedly at the forefront of being "woke" on such issues, is more than a bit shameful. I really adore Deanna Troi as a character in the last two seasons of TNG, the movies, in Voyager and in "These Are The Voyages..." (ENT). She had personality, she had purpose, she was three-dimensional, and it's astounding that she wasn't allowed to be those things until she got back in her uniform. She had her moments before, don't get me wrong, but she wasn't consistently a favourite until she got dressed properly.

I'm so pleased she's back for Picard. It'd be lovely to see everybody, of course, but if we could have only picked two then I'd definitely have picked Will and Deanna as personal favourites.

Would quite like to see Beverly again, too, if only because Gates McFadden is a great actor who was criminally underused in the show itself, and the films. Of everybody who perhaps deserves a much, much better final note to their character, she moves to the top of the list.

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FullbringIchigo

@RogerRoger personally i would love to see what Geordi is up too, he and Data were my favourite characters in TNG

i would love to know if he eventually got married and had a family like he wanted and if he got a command of his own like the alternate future seen in the Voyager episode Timeless

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RogerRoger

@FullbringIchigo If somebody mentions Captain LaForge of the Starship Challenger, even as background dialogue over a Starfleet Command tannoy or something, I'll be a happy fan.

It suited me for Pulaski, so it'll suit me for Geordi.

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FullbringIchigo

@RogerRoger yeah that would be enough for now

on a side note didn't they do that in Rouge One with Hera and the Ghost?

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RogerRoger

@FullbringIchigo Yep, and then some.

Not only is there a call for General Syndulla, you can also see Chopper rolling across the background of a Yavin IV hangar shot. The Ghost is seen three times; once parked outside the Yavin IV hangar, then twice during the climactic space battle.

Also, the Hammerhead corvettes used in said space battle were taken directly from Rebels, when the producers realised they needed an imaginative way to take down a Star Destroyer.

There was also supposed to be a nod to Sabine, but it got cut (likely at the request of Dave Filoni).

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FullbringIchigo

@RogerRoger oh by the way i have changed my avatar but don't worry it's just for Halloween and i'll change back after

on the plus side it's still Tuvok

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RogerRoger

@FullbringIchigo I noticed. Poor Neelix!

Funnily enough, I've been wanting to change mine for the past couple days, and was thinking of something from Star Wars: Rebels to build hype for Jedi: Fallen Order... then you asked me about Hera and the Ghost yesterday, and now have changed your avatar today.

It's a conspiracy!

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Making It So Since 1987

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