Topic: The Push Square Football (Soccer) Thread

@BAMozzy That's what I think - we need much more squad depth to ensure that injuries don't affect us as badly as they did last season. Solanke for £3 million doesn't seem bad at all, it's relatively low risk.

Now that City have bid for Van Dijk, us nabbing him seems unlikely but apparently we're in with a chance of getting Mohamed Salah from Roma who's a pretty good winger. By the sounds of it Klopp wants to get all his signings done before pre-season starts.

@Anchorsam_9 Depth is certainly needed. No disrespect to the kids that often had to be called upon to give us a matchday squad but most match days we were heavily reliant on the starting 11 to do the job and to be able to bring the kids on to rest players and see out a victory. You never looked at the bench and thought we had someone who could chase a game, give us something tactically different or be a match winner.

As for Van Dijk, Man City may have offered more but Van Dijk is said to want to work with Klopp. A number of players want to make themselves 'heroes', be put on a pedestal and adored by the fans - not just another player. Salah has done well at Roma and we missed out on him first time when Chelsea signed him - didn't make an impact there (wouldn't be the first to struggle at Chelsea though and Mourinho does make it clear who his 'favourites' are).

Of course its early days and the window isn't officially open yet. Solanke isn't officially a Liverpool player until the 1st July but its clear City will be strong next year and no doubt Chelsea, Utd and maybe Arsenal will strengthen their squads. Spurs at least have a good, young squad so maybe may not need to many 'new' players considering the others all have ageing teams and a number of big name departures.

Anyway, time will tell - September 1st and the end of the Window is still quite a way off. It would be great to have all our business done - or at least the key areas dealt with before the pre-season begins but speculation will no doubt run and run right up until the end of the window and then start looking forward to January (have teams done enough, which areas did they miss out on, where are the weaknesses they need to address in January etc etc)

Any chance the Neymar to PSG talk is legit? It'll certainly spice the summer up a little if so! I just really can't see Neymar dawning the PSG colors, but if he wants to be the focal point of a team, there are plenty of worse ones out there. It would just about wrap up the Ligue 1 Title before the season even starts though, haha.

@CThrash13 It definitely seems like there's something in it, but I just can't imagine it happening. Seems too crazy.

So far this summer transfer window has been a bit slow. I would love to see a major or a shock signing.

I'm a bit sad to see Lucas leave Liverpool. He wasn't the most gifted brazilian but he was one of those players who just loves playing footy and I believe he genuinely loved the club. I wish him all the best at Lazio.

@ApostateMage Yeah but I understand his decision. It looks like Klopp is also allowing Kev Stewart to leave and that means two of the more defensive/holding midfielders will be gone. Keita deal looks unlikely - RB Leipzig would rather keep him a year and possibly lose him for £48m (buyout clause) than take £66m now...

Good to see Salah and Solanke looking settled and playing well. The kids still look a bit lightweight but progressing well - not sure I would feel comfortable with seeing them starting in a CL match or even an EPL/domestic Cup match against top opposition or if we needed to get a result. 1 or 2 on the bench because we haven't got cover in that area. It would be great if we could get another 'Kante' as that could help defensively. If you got someone that can break up play in the midfield, stop the opposition from building up attacks, then that obviously helps the defence. They won't be called upon so much - just deal with long balls that bypass the midfield...

We still have a lot of midfielders but most seem more 'attack minded'. Hendo has been playing a bit deeper in pre-season. Can is due back soon after his extended break for the confederations cup, Mane should be back from injury for the German tour and its looking like we will be signing Robertson for LB. I know Milner did 'OK' there, but he was caught out of position quite a bit and very predictable when assisting attack. Robertson looks more suited as he is Left footed - still think Moreno could do a job for us but snatched at the limited chances he had - just needs to calm down a bit and not give silly and avoidable free kicks away but has shown he can be a good option getting up and down the left wing quickly. I do feel he has been made a scapegoat to a degree because of that Final - a lot of time he has been caught out of position is because of another player giving the ball away cheaply and he is a bit far up the field. Most opposition are strong on the right wing (more right footed players) so that's invariably the side they look for.

Still think we need a few more players. Not sure about VVD but he is a good player. I think we could get a decent CB for quite a bit less but would still be happy if he joined. I would have liked to see Lacazette or Aubameyang signed - maybe even the next big Striker as Klopp has found 'young' talent that becomes a world class player. Maybe Solanke could be that player but I do think we need a clinical finisher as well as someone with pace (like Owen) or that unpredictability to create their own chances (like Suarez) that can make the difference in those tight games. I know Coutinho can often create something, Mane and Salah too on the other wing but you want a player that plays off the last man, has the skill and pace to beat their marker. Not just on the wings but in the centre too...

Still a long way to go yet but it seems we are losing more than we are getting in - Ok so Stewart was unlikely to get much of a look in - even after Lucas left. Ojo did well at the u20 WC and thought he may of been part of the squad but a Loan deal could be good to get more experience. I still think we should have a 'B' Team like they do in Spain and have them playing against 'league' opposition. They should be able to play in the League Cup and maybe even the FA Cup too - just not allowed to be drawn against their A team in a similar way to Europa or CL draws. Maybe then these youngsters get a real chance of competing in a 'real' season instead of playing in youth leagues against their 'peers' which often seems 'ridiculous' as players on the 'comeback from injury' can play in u23's and the u20's have u18 players fast tracked. It would be better if we had two teams and an under18's league. As soon as they are two old, join the 'B' team. Maybe some rule that only in transfer windows (ie summer and January) can players be swapped - ie be promoted to the A or relegated to the B team and only 3 players over 23 can play in the B team. I think that would be more beneficial than a loan to a team that may have different ideas. The A and B teams can train together etc so when the B team players are promoted, they are league ready and fit into the system straight away.

1. Man City
2. Chelsea
3. Arsenal
4. Spurs
5. Man United
6. Liverpool

I'm a Spurs fan, and I can honestly see us finishing anywhere from 2-6 depending on how things go. I love what Man City has done so far though, and Gabriel Jesus will be even better than he was last season. Chelsea won't go away and will contend for sure, but the back-to-back thing doesn't happen as often these days. It should be a really interesting title race as it's hard to set one team apart from the rest when it comes to the cream of the crop.

And who knows what the transfer window will still bring?!? It gets even crazier even after the season starts. If Liverpool can get VVD, that could boost them a little for sure.

My prediction

1) Arsenal
2) Man Utd
3) Chelsea
4) Everton
5) Spurs
6) Man City
7) Liverpool
8) Leicester
9) West Ham
10) Newcastle

@themcnoisy As an Arsenal supporter, I have to ask you why?

Only Sanchez can be relied upon to deliver when it matters, and he's got one foot out the door.

@CThrash13 it's on. There's nothing about it that doesn't make sense. Jesse Lingard as his replacement, however...

So..... can PSG win the Champions League now that they've got Neymar?

@WanderingBullet Nope but it's a hell of a signing for both in regards to money. Chi ching.

@WanderingBullet Nah and he won't win the Ballon d'or either. French league isn't considered a top league so his goals will also count less (x1.5 instead of x2).

To me Madrid, Barca & Bayern are head & shoulders above the rest.

EDIT: The transfer market was already bad, but this will change it forever. Liverpool are already demanding €120mil for Courinho. Mbappe asking price has been raised to €200mil. It's crazy.

The La Liga Chief did block the move at first, citing that not even Barca & Madrid could afford to pay that sum without offloading players & still clear FFP. Makes me think PSG are almost certainly going to get hit with a ban, but I don't think they care. They can build their team around Neymar for a decade.

Yea, the money PSG payed to get him was ridiculous. Clubs are gonna demand more money for their players now.

The thing about PSG is that they're favourites to win their domestic league anyways even before they got Neymar. I'm pretty sure they'll be prioritising the Champions League now.

@Fight_Teza_Fight Its not surprising that teams like Liverpool can say Coutinho is worth €120m (if not more considering he still has 4.5yrs left on his contract) when Man U paid £90m for Pogba and M'Bappe had a better 'goal per minute' (either assisting or scoring) than ANY player - inc Neymar, Messi and Ronaldo so why isn't he worth €200m with that potential at his age? Especially if you look at what level Ronaldo, Neymar and Messi were at when they were that age too. He 'could' eclipse these so if Neymar is worth £200m then M'Bappe at 25 'could' be worth how much if he continues to progress at the same rate.

Of course its difficult to justify player costs. No Player is worth these fees BUT you are not paying for them as such, you are paying the club a compensation for their 'loss' - not just in terms of the 'player' but also a loss in potential earnings from things like Shirt sales over the 4yrs or so they had left on their contract. Its also a 'cost' to replace that player that the 'team' expected to have for the remainder of their contract - the cost they may have to spend to buy someone else out of their contract. If you look at most sites - like transfrmarket.com, very few players actually cost what they are valued at. Often its more because you are compensating the club for losing a player with 'x' years left. Players with 1yr left often cost around 'value' because the club would get nothing in a year. If Neymar, Messi etc refuse to sign a contract and let them run down, these players 'could' cost 'nothing' so the Fee is purely based on buying a player out of their contract and compensating the Club for their 'loss' - not necessarily the 'players' worth in terms of 'football' and ability. These players only have 'value' because of their contract with a club.

@WanderingBullet With Monaco, PSG may not have guaranteed the league. Monaco though have lost 'some' talent which propelled them to the top last season and it will be interesting to see if they can hold on to those remaining (like M'bappe) or recruit well with the money they get.

Neymar wasn't really suited to la liga in my opinion. The Spanish never appreciated his skill or flair. They took it as an offence if Neymar would make a defender look stupid with a flick, trick etc. This often led to outrage from the opposition, the fans etc. I haven't watched enough of the French Ligue 1 to know if he would be better appreciated but I think he will.

The money involved in football is really putting me off the sport. Fairplay is now irrelvant. You have Neymar personally paying his tranfser fee which makes a mockery of everything.

@BAMozzy That's very true. It's a security blanket for the selling club, but the knock on effects these record breaking deals have are undeniable. It trickles down to the smaller clubs.

£80million for Cristiano is going to go down as the bargain of the century the way these prices are going!

@Fight_Teza_Fight It would cost a lot more than £200m to buy Ronaldo out of his contract. I believe the Buyout clause, like Benzema's, is €1000m (yes €1bn) - Messi's by comparison is €300m. ALL Spanish club players must have a buyout clause in their contract. Of course it doesn't mean a club can't sell for a lot less if they want but if they want to be 'difficult' they can also state that the buyout clause must be met in full. Barca were not keen to lose Neymar but were powerless to stop it because the buyout clause was met in full.

Other leagues though don't have clauses - we don't have to have those here - so LFC can turn down ANY offer for Coutinho if they wanted as he doesn't have a buyout clause at all. Barca could offer €1bn and LFC could refuse if they wanted. Some players have clauses in their contract based on criteria. Kieta (at Leipzig) has a £48m clause that only comes into affect from next season - I think its after 2yrs. Some may have a buyout clause if the team fails to get into the CL for example or different figures based on CL qualification - a low figure if they fail but much higher if they qualify so a 'star' player can get out of a club to join a team in the CL if their current club fails.

If VVD had a buyout clause, he wouldn't be training on his own, if Kieta had a Buyout clause in effect now, he wouldn't be playing in Germany. Arguably, whoever signs Ibrahimovic, who can be acquired for 'free' wuld get a 'bargain' because he is out of contract. Of course it still costs a club because free agents can state a signing on fee and command a big wage too.

The FFP though is based on the overall cost over the period of contract so if Neymar's overall cost is €500m (fee and wages for 5yrs), that equates to €100m a year that PSG would have to balance - not the full €222m this year.

Contracts are complicated. To sign Ronaldo or Benzema now would cost €1bn - unless Real Madrid are willing or need to offload a player for whatever reason. In some cases, Buyout clauses can be a way for clubs to 'dictate' where a player moves too as well to a degree. If Barca, for example, wanted to replace Neymar with Ronaldo, RM would probably state that the buyout clause would need to be met in full but may accept a lower bid from any team outside of Spain and an even 'lower' bid from a team they would be unlikely to meet in the CL - like Chinese or MLS clubs. It can be a way to ensure their rivals don't buy their star players that could come back and bite them. Higuain for example could have been sold for less but because he was joining a Rival team in Italy, they insisted that the 'high' Buyout clause was met.

Essentially a buyout clause can be used to dictate where a player is sold and the point at which the owning club is unable to stop the sale regardless. Like I said though, the fee is only based on the 'contract' and length remaining rather than the 'true' value of a player. As soon as a 'contract' is in its final year, a players 'value' can be significantly lower as clubs cash in rather than risk losing everything. The only time a club can get a fee for a player - at least in England - is for a player under a certain age to protect clubs from investing time and money in their education and development to see them leave for nothing. Case in point - Solanke and Ings - both signed by LFC when out of contract but both also cost (or will do when a fee is agreed by tribunal) LFC a fee too.