@CJD87 one you beat it, the difficulty come from; A: your brain tries to make sense of the story; & B; trying to find the last ciphers before you give up. If you can beat the game, you can get the platinum, all it takes is patience.
Good luck on b4, the boss is my favorite!
“I’m a really good lawyer.”
———
“One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them, One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them; In the Land of Mordor where the shadows lie.”
“I’m a really good lawyer.”
———
“One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them, One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them; In the Land of Mordor where the shadows lie.”
@velio84 - Yes I remember another post of yours regarding beating Sekiro... sounds like you had a very similar Isshin experience to me ha! (2-3 weeks of masochistic hardship with a side-helping of circa ~1000 deaths!)
I'd be curious to hear more about your DeS experience, particularly with you playing it off the back of Sekiro.
I appreciate BluePoint did an excellent job in graphically bringing the game 'up-to-date' but do the mechanics feel slightly archaic in present day? Or does it still hold up? I am definitely going to have an easier 'rest game' between Returnal and DeS, but am fairly certain DeS will be my next game.
The idea of playing around with builds seems fun, and much deeper than Returnal (highly dependant on RNG) and Sekiro (basically non-existent).
I'm OK and comfortable with a difficulty threshold, with Guardian Ape being a good example of something that is very hard to overcome but 'do-able'. But another Isshin fight is where I draw the line mate!
Again - v glad to hear you finally beat Isshin. I wouldn't wish my experience on anyone...!
Oh wow... just beat B5 last night. In my opinion, B5 has definitely been the most challenging of all the biomes so far - it is basically relentless!
After failing numerous times I tried a new tact of basically clearing all of B4, and securing as much health/integrity as possible - alongside a decent weapon.
Went into B5 with an astronaut and 2 large health vials + 'Adrenaline Leech' fabrication. I left B5 with 0 items and a sliver of health!
Decided to save the yellow/challenge room until last, and this was remarkably brutal - I actually think it was 'Adrenaline Leech' fabrication that got me through this, being able to recover integrity taking out the smaller enemies.
What a rush though, and now straight into B6. I understand B6 is generally easier than B5? What are people's thoughts on this? I feel the end is in sight, and what a remarkable game.
So excited for what Housemarque will do next, especially with the Sony acquisition etc. Is there anything in their back catalogue worth trying?
Returnal is my personal GOTY (so far) - really hope it gets some recognition at the awards
@CJD87 The thing about B6 is that is has some of the spikiest difficulty spikes in the game but some of the hardest rooms you’ll only have to do once because they contain a permanent upgrade or the vault key (the vault stays open). So unlike B5 you don’t have to do it all in one go.
@CJD87 Well done! B5 is a tough one. I guess I felt it wasn’t quite as hard as B3 though since there is no boss fight. And B3 has that awful climb up the tower toward the boss fight which is just brutal and weakens you before you go into the boss. Still, B5 is tough because of those multiple enemy rooms you have to go through. By the way, if you didn’t go into the locked room at the hub of B5, be sure to do that. I skipped that room since it was not essential to clearing the biome and there’s actually something important in there you’ll want for future runs. (I hope I’m not spoiling it but it took me a while to figure it out)
As for B6 — it’s hard to say. I think it’s probably about as tough as B5. It’s just totally different. I’m sure you’ve seen it by now and how even movement is changed. I did a lot of falling into the abyss during my early runs, because it’s easy to dash right off the edge when you’re surrounded.
B6 is a great place to level up weapons and learn their traits. There are a lot of spots with those kamikaze enemies flying er… swimming toward you and they die with just one shot. You can sit there and pick off dozens of them almost endless less and grind up to learn a weapon trait, then run over to a chest, get a new weapon, rinse and repeat.
Nevertheless, B6 has a couple really hard brute / mini-boss types. And honestly, it’s the only part of the game where I actually had to run past enemies rather than kill them all, as there is a couple spots where that just made more sense to me in order to save my integrity.
I think most people think of B6 as not being as hard because by now in the game, you are a seasoned veteran and can handle the really tough things it throws at you. You’ve “got gud” by now. 😄
I would say that strategy is more important in B6 than other biomes. I found it better to go slow, clear as much of an area from a distance before moving fully into an area. And like I said, one or two spots are just tough and there’s not many lock-down rooms so you can bolt for the exit. But be careful, sometimes enemies will follow you out.
The choice of weapon is also key in B6 (as with most of the biomes). The longer distance makes the Dreadbound, usually my favorite weapon, is useless in B6. Using it is an easy way to get killed. Carbine and Hollowseeker work well, as does the Pylon Driver. It’s great to fire into an area and then just duck around a corner and wait for it to kill all the enemies.
@CJD87 Well done on getting through B5. That was the only biome that I managed to do in one go but it's definitely quite tough in general compared to the others.
B6 can also have a few places that can be brutally tough so don't let your guard down. I found that the Hollowseeker (esp with Portal Beam), the Pylon Driver, or the Rotgland Lobber are all pretty good weapons there. If you've been playing fairly aggressively with lots of melee then you might find that you need to change tack for B6 but that really depends on your skill level.
Also really excited for what comes next from Housemarque. This beta patch that's been mentioned might be something or nothing, but even so there's a lot of promise for their next game what with having Sony's full backing.
@Voltan That's a relief, and thanks for letting me know - dying is definitely less traumatic when you perceive you've attained at least some form of carry-over progression! Right now I'm still riding a high that I won't need to endure the B5 golden challenge room again
@Th3solution It's really interesting to hear different people's takes on biomes... B3 for me was nearly a 'non-entity' as I was riding a really OP build from farming the hell out of B1&2, so I actually did B3 and boss quite easily on first shot. B4 was a stumbling block for me, but nothing compared to B5 - insanely challenging/brutal but great fun!
Your advice on weapons has come literally 2 hours too late ha! I was onto a good thing with a Hollowseeker (nice traits including portal) but decided to trade in for a higher levelled Dreadbound. Big mistake, as I then got my ass handed to me by a mini boss who didnt even seem that difficult... moreso he had the upper hand due to my poor choice of weapon.
I'm still loving the game, and honestly appreciate it more & more with each biome. I am actually more sympathetic to Housemarque regarding the lack of save option, and can appreciate why they chose for people to play the game 'their way'. Whilst I think a save function would definitely lend itself to encouraging a wider player-base, in some ways I believe that this option would then remove the constant feeling of 'high stakes'! Every good run always has an extra element of stress/pressure due to the knowledge you could lose it all in a given second lol
What are you currently playing out of interest? I've got Kena lined up next, alongside Dread (when travelling), and am in the mood for a couple of shorter games.
Thanks again for the tips, honestly very helpful to know that other people have actually beat this game - gives me (naive) hope!
@CJD87 B6 I got lucky with and completed on my first run. But like most biomes, one slip up can completely ruin your run and the one enemy that fires projectiles that causes immediate malfunctions is just pure evil!
Luckily the boss isn't too bad and keep an eye out during the fight as it does actually drop health items at times.
@CJD87 Haha, yeah — it becomes pretty clear that the Dreadbound isn’t your friend when you’re stuck there like a sitting duck for what seems an eternity waiting for a shard to come back. 😅 The coilspine shredder and the Spitmaw are also of limited value, by virtue of poor rate of fire, poor long distance accuracy, etc.
I forgot to mention that it is probably worth a look back at Housemarque’s back catalogue if you’re enjoying this. But don’t expect anything nearly on the breadth and overall quality of Returnal, but their previous games still have that fun factor or tight controls and arcadey shooting and colorful bright visuals. Most of their games are twin stick shooters. Of course I can only speak for Resogun and Super Stardust; I have yet to play Dead Nation, Alienation, Nex Machina, Matterfall, etc. If you want to try one I’d recommend Resogun. It’s more like a modern Space Invaders, but it just feels fun to play and it’s really cool to see the DNA of Returnal in its arcade style gameplay and visuals (…or rather, to see Resogun’s DNA in Returnal). It’s a short game with little to no story, easy to drop in and out of. Probably can be cleared in a weekend, but can be replayed endlessly to score-chase. I recently went back to play Resogun after finishing Returnal (I cleared Resogun several years ago) and it holds up. Still, it feels a bit empty compared to Returnal in that there isn’t the narrative, 3D exploration, or depth that Returnal has. Nevertheless, it’s worth it to experience some of their early development. Same for Super Stardust which is a similar game. I own Dead Nation and need to try it one day, and I’ve always wanted to try Nex Machina.
As for what I’m playing, I’m in Ch 12 of Final Fantasy 7 Remake, and also playing Rime with the Game Club. I have a couple other games I’ve started and fell off but those are my main ones now. I believe after finishing Rime (which is supposed to be fairly short) we’re going to play Resident Evil 3 Remake. And after I finish FF7R, I’m thinking of going to Rift Apart, but I’ll see how my mood is. Having cleared Retunal several weeks ago, might be up for an intense and difficult game again and so Demon’s Souls is on the radar, as is Dark Souls 3. But I couldn’t justify going from one super hard game to another. 😅. I don’t have the intestinal fortitude of @render who did the Retunal/Demon’s Souls back-to-back gauntlet. 😛
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Th3solution@CJD87 Yeah you can definitely say it was a gauntlet. I really enjoyed both but the gear change between the two was insane 😆
I still have DeS to go back to to finish my NG+ play through but I've been distracted lately by Death Standing then Alan Wake and I'm also 4 trophies away from hitting the platinum on Hades, which I've been dipping in and out of. Alan Wake is just as the review suggested gameplay wise so not finding the combat particularly enjoyable, but the story is excellent. Hades though I can definitely recommend gameplay wise, it's great fun for a quick fix and the way the weapons and modifiers work it kind of forces you into different ways to play.
Since Returnal though I definitely feel I'm more up for ramping up the challenge. Games that I previously might not have considered are now on my radar so I might even find myself going back to Nioh at some point - but don't hold me to that 😅
@Th3solution Hope you're enjoying FF7R! I kicked this off after finishing Sekiro (Which nearly broke me) and it was just what the doctor ordered, very enjoyable game.... bonkers in parts, but in the best possible way. @render must be the ultimate masochist going straight from Returnal - - > DeS lol!
I agree fully on Hades, been playing this on my Switch whilst travelling with work - ploughed in about 60 hours effortlessly. Fantastic example of a more 'mainstream' rogue game I guess, and amazing how much variation you get per play through! Also like you I am hoping to jump on the Nioh train, but I still have Kena/DeS (as well as Dread and SMTV on Switch) - wanting to clear all before Elden Ring in Jan
“I’m a really good lawyer.”
———
“One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them, One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them; In the Land of Mordor where the shadows lie.”
@MatthewJP No, I don’t think I’d go for that. I don’t think I ever tried that specific trade-off, I regretting taking anything that impaired silphium pick-ups.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
I really struggled with Biome 6, perhaps even moreso than B5, but mainly due to the approach I was employing.
Previously, and leading up to my many B6 deaths, I was playing extremely 'conservative' runs in farming B4 completely - but avoiding anything/everything where potential malignancies or malfunctions could spoil progress.
What I learnt is that conservative play is fine, but you need to accept that the potential for obolites is greatly reduced unless you're willing to take some risk...
So my most recent 'winning' run I employed a totally different, and almost reckless (!), approach to the game - wanting to see if mixing up my playstyle would bear fruit.
I gambled on a lot of health upgrades, often taking on malignancies, and likewise with obolite stacks (the ones you have to break) and also a few chests/containers. I farmed pretty much 100% B4, and then also dabbled in B5, and by the time I was ready to leap down into B6 I had the Astraunaut, extra max health upgrade, 2 x large health vials, 1 x small health vial and also the 'Adrenaline Leech' extra.
(Albeit I had a couple of irritating malfunctions I was struggling to shift, particularly one that dealt damage upon using keys, but this was offset by a parasite that allowed for key retention...)
I took a fairly measured approach through B6, largely ignoring blue/side doors and focussing on honing in on the boss fight. Got screwed by a few of the larger enemies, but managed to retain 1 of my large health vials and also dropped on a levelled-up Hollowseeker with Portal Beam II.
The boss was still a challenge, and managed to beat him with about 15-20% of my health left (spaceman obviously used ha!!) and it was an absolute rush.
Shamelessly, and mainly due to design of family/work commitments, I'm a filthy 'casual' gamer - so I rarely aim to go full completionist/platinum as there are so many other games I want to experience. So I technically consider Returnal 'completed' now that Act2 is done, and credits have rolled. I might dabble with Act3, as I love the gameplay, but otherwise I will move on to Kena and Metroid Dread (probably play both simultaneously).
Would like to sincerely thank all of those on this forum who have given me guidance on this game in the last couple of weeks, which is really testament to the friendly and collaborative environment on this site - thanks guys!
My final thoughts:
Incredible game, and HM have truly developed something special.
Lack of 'save' function actually not so much of an issue, with my max runs lasting <2hrs. You just need to be willing to put PS5 in rest, and/or not wanting to play other games during this time.
HOWEVER, I would like to see HM patch in some kind of suspend/save, as I believe this is probably putting off a lot of gamers from even attempting Returnal (it nearly did this for me). I'd like as many to experience this as possible, and think addition of this function would yield much more play from those currently on the fence.
Difficulty curve was perfect, albeit punishing at times. I would say this game is probably not as challenging as Sekiro (at least not for me) but maybe this is mindset. There were times in Sekiro (last boss especially) where I thought I would never overcome the challenge at hand. But with Returnal I always felt that it was 'beatable' and that eventually my skill + RNG would combine for a winning run.
I appreciate that the GOTY awards are hugely subjective, and not necessarily a reflection of true quality, but I would love Returnal to win. It blew me away, a great next-gen experience and wonderful game.
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