@FullbringIchigo I completely agree that MS should have drawn a line under this gen and made the X a 'next gen' 4k system. In virtually all ways, it is that in all but name - assuming of course that the XB1 games would still be Backwards compatible along with the Xbox 360 and OG games. Instead of releasing 'next gen' versions separately - like we expect to see with the PS5 - they are essentially releasing the game as 'one'. By that I mean releasing a PS4 and PS5 version of the same game. As far as 'losing' the generation, I disagree. They may have lost as far as sales figures go and certainly don't think they will catch up but its not a race or competition as such. MS will still be in business, still making consoles/games etc. You could argue Sony lost too as they haven't beaten the PS3 sales figures which didn't beat the PS2 either. Has Sony lost the TV market too? They can't compete with Samsung or LG in terms of sales figures. Have they lost the Mobile market - again can't come close to Apple and Samsung?
I doubt very much that a 'truly' next gen console would have radically different specs from the X anyway. At most, the only change would be in the choice of.CPU. It wouldn't need more RAM than the X as that appears to be enough to handle all the 4k assets. I doubt a next gen system would target a 'higher than' 4k resolution with HDR. so the only 'area' that, spec wise at least, would be different from the current specs is most likely to have been with the CPU. They could have kept Forza 7 and PUBG as 'launch' titles for the 'next gen' system - releasing these just as 4k games with State of Decay 2, maybe Crackdown 3 and Sea of Thieves as 'next gen only' games to force people into buying it but I bet games like Shadow of War, Wolfenstein 2, Assassin's Creed Origins, CoD:WW2, Fifa 18, SWBF2 etc would still have released on XB1 and the 'next' gen Xbox with the upgraded 4k visuals - much like we saw in 2013 with CoD: Ghosts, Fifa 14, BF4, AC4: Black Flag etc. There is no reason why Forza 5 and probably Ryse too for that matter couldn't have scaled down for XB360. The only difference with the XB1 launch compared to the 'X' launch is that instead of having to rebuy the games (like CoD, Fifa etc) to get the 'enhanced' version, these will now work and be enhanced by the new console.
Like I said though, I would much prefer the Console to have been 'unlocked' to this generation. Not necessarily a iterative upgrade but not necessarily a straight 'next' gen system either. A mix of both in essence. All the XB1 games running on it and many of them being 'enhanced' to 4k but also free to have its own content rather than be limited by the much weaker system. Not be named as an 'Xbox one' but Xbox Scorpio for example and in 3-4yrs time, maybe get another similarly placed console. Essentially following the PC model where you can replace your GPU every 3-4yrs and its a 'new' generation that plays your existing library at enhanced levels. Like the PC model though, the weakest GPU's eventually get phased out because the 'big AAA' games are too complex for it. You don't get devs holding back PC games because they must also run to some degree on a Radeon 7780. It gets to a point where you have to upgrade or go without. I think MS should have followed this pattern. If games scale down well to the XB1 - great, if not then the XB1 misses out but Xbox Scorpio gets it. Instead of releasing XB1 and Scorpio games, its just released as an Xbox game and plays at the lower level on XB1 and next gen level on Scorpio.
Anyway, enough of that. As for the 4k and sales of 4k capable consoles, at the moment, I really can't see the X selling more than the HD consoles. Its true that 4k TV's are not the most 'common' in peoples homes BUT I bet the percentage is a lot higher in the 20-40 age range. I can't see the 65+ or the under18's having access to 4k TV's and the over 65's are not likely to replace their TV until the old one breaks down. But amongst techies and gamers, I can see the 4k TV saturation increasing rapidly. The sales of both Pro and X will overtake their base models as more and more move to 4k. The only thing that may stop the rise of Pro/X sales compared to base models is 'next gen' console release. If Sony do bring out a PS5 in a year or two, people will more likely buy that than a Pro (or X). I bet any money that the PS5 won't be targeting HD at all.
I know the PS4 has the best library of Exclusives and I bet the PS5 will too. However most people buy multi-platform games in a year. Its whether or not they are willing to sacrifice on the majority of games to play the extra 'few' games that Sony has orr whether they would rather have the majority of their games running and looking the best but miss out on those few. They could of course keep their PS4/Pro for those Exclusives only but buy the X because its going to benefit more of their game purchases.
I buy on average 15-20 games a year and at least 10-15 are multi-platform games. At most I buy 4-5 exclusives a year and of those, generally the split between PS4 and Xbox is quite even but lets say 3 out of 5 exclusives are PS4 and I buy 15 multi-platform games a year. Of those 20 games, 3 will be bought for Pro and 17 for X because that's where they look, run and play best on console. I could keep my XB1s and use it for the 2 MS exclusives I want and use my Pro for the 'enhanced' games and those 3 exclusives I want. Others may be willing to play the 'Pro' enhanced games and access to the best Exclusives but they could be tempted just to keep their PS4 for those - it's still going to play those Exclusives at 'decent' visual settings and offer HDR but the majority of games + access to the 'few' MS exclusives they may have wanted (like Sunset Overdrive, Cuphead etc) as well as a 4k HDR Bluray player would be better.
I can't predict what everyone will do or even the majority. Of course on a PS website, the majority here will be more interested in PS exclusives and think that will be enough for Sony. I don't doubt that Sony will continue to sell consoles by the bucket load. Maybe at the 'end' of the generation, MS could outsell the Pro (especially if Sony do bring the PS5 sooner rather than later) despite the Pro being on the market a year longer, will that mean MS was the 'king' of the iterative hardware? More people bought CoD:IW than BF1 so does that make CoD the winner, the better game? Destiny 2 is the years 'biggest' seller to date so is that the best game of the year, the winner? better than Horizon:Zero Dawn? Better than Zelda?
Anyway - I really don't think that Sony did enough to dent sales of the X - the point of the article. Those who were sat on the fence and pondering whether to buy an X or Pro, would still be sat on the fence after Paris. The majority of the 'system sellers' were the same 'system sellers' we have been seeing for a year or more. The one 'new' game, as great as it looks and the fascinating concept of it, I doubt would have pushed people more to the Pro. Maybe if we had been given more insight into the game with a 'game-play' video, it may have helped a bit more but IF you had a PS4 already and wondering whether to buy a Pro or X, I think a big price cut would have been more effective. You could reason that those 'exclusives' will still look great on your PS4 without a 'minor' upgrade on Pro but the X would be more beneficial in more games. I don't think MS would be worried by Sony's Paris showing - not as much as if they had shown a lot more AAA games that we hadn't seen (at least not in a long while) and with 'close' release dates and a big price drop too. The fact it was 'similar' to E3 and I did feel they were pushing VR - especially as the X won't (at launch) support VR at all, I don't think it would have changed peoples minds or have MS concerned - at least not more concerned than they were beforehand.
As the point of the article was about whether or not Sony did enough to dent any potential hype for the X, I think not. As others have pointed out, those that were interested in the X will still be buying the X. They won't be cancelling and considering a Pro instead because of 'Paris' so therefore, it didn't do enough to affect MS in my opinion.
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@BAMozzy i don't think it's going to affect the market at all, after all the only people who want it are both fans of the brand and own 4K equipment and lets be honest they have probably already pre-ordered it
my point was it's not that big of a market, at least not yet so i don't think it's going to make a difference to anybody in the grand scheme of things but perhaps IF MS had touted it as a brand new system perhaps some of those who already own a XB1 and are thinking of upgrading to 4K might have taken the plunge a bit earlier but by making it part if the XB1 family they may have cut off a part of their potential market
if for example the PS5 was announced today as being a 4K machine with exclusive games as it's a next gen system i would get a 4K TV for it, same as when the PS3 was announced as HD, i got a HD TV and i think others holding off would do the same but with it just being a more powerful XB1 (no matter how powerful it is that is what it is) i and many others feel no need to get it, same as PS4 Pro as we already have systems that will play the games they can play, that fact the XB1X version of a game looks better is of no importance, if it was we would game on P.Cs as they are able to do everything the XB1X can do and do it better, hell P.Cs are capable of doing 6K now a days
the tech doesn't matter, it's power doesn't matter all we want are fun games, it's why the PS4 Pro doesn't out sell the PS4
and like i said earlier price is also important and some one just looking to play games wont care about 4K the will see a price £100 more expensive than it's competitor and $200 more than it's sister, a system that plays the exact same games
it's a niche market right now for console gamers and in the long run i don't think it's going to help MS that much
games are more important than power and that is where exclusives come in, those are the draw, you can say XB has the multiplats but that's the key word, Multiplat as in on other systems as well and with a strong 1st party line up and more on the way, the same multiplat games AND a cheaper price point the PS4 in my opinion looks the better option even if the XB1X is more powerful
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@Kidfried You stated that you wanted people to name any exciting games that were announced by Microsoft and I gave you a list of games that excited people. I was here when PushSquare showed MS's conference and there was quite a bit of excitement for Anthem, PUBG, Last Night etc so not only did they announce projects that excited MS fanboys but also games that excited PS gamers too - even if that means they have to wait longer to get their hands on it. Some of those even thought PUBG would be a System Seller for MS because of its popularity.
MS may not have announced anything at Paris this week but they have been in the media - releasing TV ads for the X, announcing more games that will be enhanced and endeavouring to get 70 games enhanced for the release week. The difference between an 'enhanced' game on X is more significant than the 'enhanced' XB1/PS4 versions of games like CoD Ghosts, AC4: Black Flag, Fifa 14 etc that also had a 'delayed' release because the 'next gen' console wasn't out. If you didn't buy the XB1/PS4, you could still buy/play these games on your PS3/XB360 at a more 'basic' visual level.
The point I was making though, is that MS has announced a lot of exciting games - all of which will look and/or run best on the Xbox One X. Not all of those games are exclusives - although a few are and some will release first on their platform. Just because some are not 'exclusives', it doesn't mean that MS hasn't announced ANY exciting and interesting games. You challenged people to name any so I named quite a few. I know quite a few PS gamers that would love to have been able to play Cuphead or Sunset Overdrive, Maybe both Ori games too, would love to play PUBG and wished GT Sport had a full career mode like Forza. As I said, I know a lot of MS's exclusives are 'good' at best where as Sony has more 'must haves' and a larger portfolio but MS has Backwards Compatibility to add to their library of games available. Not saying that makes up for the lack of new and exciting AAA exclusives of course but as I hear a lot of 'Sony fanboys' state now, visuals aren't as important as 'game-play' and considering games like KotoR, RDR, Fallout 3, Ninja Gaiden etc are superb games - albeit with 'dated' but still improved above their original level visuals, they add up to increase the massive amount of games available on XB1.
I honestly couldn't pick between Xbox and Playstation. I have owned every PS and Xbox generation console and had immense enjoyment from each. I may come across more on the side of Xbox but that's mainly because this site is so heavily weighted towards PS (unsurprisingly) but on an Xbox site, I used to be accused of being a Sony fanboy as I would stick up for Sony amongst the Xbox fanboys. I think both have strengths and weaknesses but at the end of the day, I will play the games on the system that plays them the best. If that means that most of my games from here end up being more on Xbox so be it, the last few years its mostly been PS4 - especially since the Pro launched. It may well be that way until the PS5 launches but either way, I have both a Pro and X and will get to play ALL the exclusives at their best as well as all the multi-platform games. No way would I get rid of my Pro and miss playing Days Gone, Spider-Man etc. I strongly believe that both need to exist and in 'direct' competition - each to push each other - each to learn from each other. Even this gen, Sony has improved the PS4 experience to bring it more in-line with the Xbox - things like External HDD support, custom backdrops etc. Its not one-sided of course but I was there at the beginning of the PS4 - when people were making similar comments about that and its 'most power but no games'. Sony's investment has paid off in the long run but it took a while for their studio's to start dropping games. And before anyone starts, the first year or two were a bit 'barren' of big AAA games that people really wanted to play but that doesn't mean that Sony had 'nothing' - much like MS has 'nothing' for the year ahead. Still at the end of the day, I like both equally and for different reasons. I may be more inclined to buy certain games on one system over another at different times - like buying CoD on Pro last year and for Xbox this year but I don't have a particular allegiance to one plastic box of electronics over another - these are just the necessity to play the games I want at a standard I can tolerate. If I wanted 'better' I would invest the money I spend on 2 consoles (and more) on a Gaming Rig but I would still need to buy at least 1 console to play ALL the games I want. In a perfect world, I would be able to buy just one box and have access to ALL games at their best - no exclusives etc. If that day ever came - like buying a Bluray player and able to play ALL blurays, DVD's CD's etc regardless of make, I wouldn't necessarily buy Sony or MS as Samsung, HP, Apple, LG etc would no-doubt come up with competitive gaming boxes too. Point is, I couldn't care less about 'Sony' or 'MS' and have to own both to access all the games I want to play.
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I don't really understand the appeal of the Xbox One X, to be honest. If all you care about is playing the latest Call of Duty, Madden, whatever on a 4K TV, then the PS4 Pro is going to be a much more affordable option. If you're a tech fetishist who gets turned on by more powerful hardware, then you've probably already built a PC that can run circles around the Xbox One X. Microsoft has almost nothing in the way of big exclusive games to push alongside the system.
I expect this system's sales will go down drastically after a couple of months. Sony and Nintendo are each offering me something that I can't get anywhere else, whereas, in comparison, Microsoft is offering me next to nothing.
@Ralizah If visuals aren't important, why bother going with the Pro? Why not just settle with the PS4 as it plays all the same games anyway? The Pro only boost resolution OR frame rates and doesn't go the whole way into 4k so if you do own a 4k TV, you have to put up with HD quality textures and an 'average 1440p resolution - like playing a 720p version on a HD TV with 540p quality textures. BUT as visuals are not important then playing at 720p shouldn't matter. I bet it will matter when Sony bring out its PS5 though which will target 4k with 4k quality textures etc. Why bother bringing out a PS5 at all if ganes could run on a PS4 - even if that means sub HD level visuals and 'lots' of upscaling for all those that will own a 4k TV
The point of the X is no different from the point of the Pro. As more and more 4k TV's are in peoples homes, 1080p upscaled looks softer than 1080p on a 1080p TV because 75% of the image is interpolated from the 25% that is rendered. Its far better to map pixels 1:1 with the display rather than having to upscale to fit. The point of the X is exactly the same as the Pro is - to play games at higher resolutions to match the display, offer better frame rates as the base models are not exactly 'strong' enough, to give gamers a 'premium' experience that comes closer to the PC experience. Why should people be forced to pick the Pro as the 'only' UHD console option? MS are offering their solution to this in the form of the X. It just so happens that MS have built the console to be better equipped at delivering the 4k experience - albeit a year later and at a 'higher' cost - although that £100 is nothing considering the difference it offers. That difference is far more significant than the XB1 vs PS4.
Not everyone wants a PC to game on and prefer the simplicity of a console, I know PC's can be connected to TV's but that kind of defeats a lot of the benefits of a PC but not everyone has the space for desk type set-up either.
Would you be critical of MS if they released a next gen console to rival the PS5? Would you say what is the point? Would you be critical of Sony fir bringing out a PS5 that targets 4k and doing it better than MS's X or would you say whats the point when MS's is cheaper? There are a number of areas that MS beat Sony on - maybe not exclusives and certainly not on Multi-platform performance for the past 4years but now MS are bringing something 'substantial' to the market, you are critical. Its not just CoD, Fifa, Madden etc but 'every' multi-platform game. Its not just higher 'resolution's' but higher quality visual settings and/or smoother game-play with better quality audio - all things I expect Sony will look to bring with its PS5 but why bother with a PS5? Why not make do with a PS4 after all 'visuals' don't matter!! Funny how they mattered for the past 40yrs and how incredible ND games 'look', arguably the best 'visuals' on any console for the past 10yrs have all come from Naughty Dog. Games have always had a 'visual' contingent to them - maybe not always the 'most' important but enough to be significant. Why bother remastering any game - why not just port the games forward with NO improvements to the visuals. Why bother making any 'Pro' enhancements or even why bother with Pro if visuals don't matter at all. I know Horizon:ZD looked fantastic on PS4 but on Pro with HDR it was breath-taking. That's not being superficial, but it really enhances the experience. Games are made in 4k with 4k assets so why should we settle for major visual sacrifices - lower quality visual settings and a quarter of the image size?
The Point of the X is to bring the high-end PC visuals to the console market. To give devs the opportunity to bring their games as close to their vision to the console market. The point of the X is to give gamers a 'premium' console experience in the majority of games they want to play. I bet its no different to the ambition that Sony set out to deliver with the Pro and will try to deliver with the PS5 too...
Your argument is like saying who is the nVidia GTX1080ti for? might as well settle for the AMD RX480 as that's cheaper.
Hmm interesting debate. I would agree that multi-plat games sell more year on year But at some stage, everyone has to decide which console to get to play them. How do people decide? Well price but also what can I get I can't get elsewhere. I switched back to Playstation after XB360 because I wanted to play a lot of exclusive games I missed out on. I will judge the next gen on the same thing.
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@Rudy_Manchego I think the debate has gotten off topic and turned more into a 'lets bash MS'.
The question was, did Sony do enough to take away the 'hype' of the upcoming new console? It wasn't about whether the X will sell at its price point, whether there was any 'need' for an X or whether MS would have been better to release it as a next gen system.
The answer, in my opinion, is that Sony didn't do enough to take any hype away from the X. The reason I think that is because I don't think many will suddenly cancel their Pre-order and rush out and buy a Pro instead just because of their showing at Paris. I think those that may have been sat on the fence, unsure of whether to buy an X or Pro will still be left on the fence. The only big new game, Ghosts of Tsushima, may have shifted the balance 'very slightly' but without game-play etc, its just an interesting concept but I think Digital Foundry video comparisons of current games like CoD, SWBF2, AC Origins etc will do more to tip the balance in favour of MS.
Had Sony come out with more 'new' AAA games instead of showing games we knew about and then finished their briefing with a $50/£50 price drop - bringing the Pro down to under £300/$300, maybe announced a few new 'bundles' too - I know they have CoD and SWBF2 bundles so maybe not necessary to have 'new' bundles. I think that would have taken the hype away. Those that were sat on the fence would be more inclined to forego the extra 'power' and visual enhancements to save £150 - that's nearly enough to buy a 4k HDR Bluray if they wanted too or put towards VR (if that also had a price drop). If Sony had announced a more powerful PS5 due out in Q4 2018, that would also have taken the hype away from MS but not the show they put out.
Point I am making is that I don't think Sony's Paris briefing would have any impact on MS and the 'hype' for its new console - to those that are 'hyped' for it. I don't think it made enough of a difference to those that may not have been 'especially' hyped for the X and sat on the fence. That doesn't mean that I think the X will suddenly sell enough consoles in the next couple of years to significantly eat into Sony's sales lead. That doesn't mean I think Sony's show and games were 'poor' either, just that they didn't do enough to affect the hype and/or sales of the X next week.
I have never worried about which console has the 'best' line-up when they release or which has the most 'power' myself as I have ended up owning both. Sometimes Price may come into deciding which I buy first - incidentally it worked out cheaper for me to upgrade to XB1 first despite the higher initial cost - which after moving was a bigger factor than playing the games at their best at that time.
What annoys me though, is for the past 4yrs, Sony fanboys have spent a lot of time ridiculing the XB1's lack of power and the fact that most games didn't run at full HD. Now the X is coming out, the only thing that matters is the number of Exclusives and 'resolution' and graphical quality doesn't matter at all. The power mattered more at PS4's launch and a lot were saying that they bought many more multi-plat releases and 'exclusives' were 'bonus' games so it was 'more important' to play games that ran and looked the best than go with the weaker system that couldn't even do 1080p and no amount of exclusives like Forza, Dead Rising, Ryse, Titanfall etc would make up for that lack of power. Its that 'hypocrisy' that really gets to me more than anything else. On the one hand they are saying visuals don't matter then commenting on how much better SotC looks compared to its PS3 HD remaster and the original. Saying visuals don't matter and then saying 'x' game 'looks' amazing. Saying visuals don't matter then criticizing devs when the games get a small downgrade from their E3 trailer...
I will remember this when the PS5 launches and improves the visuals above what the X can deliver - higher native resolutions and/or higher quality visual settings! I bet when Sony do show it off, and the games, all these people will suddenly be commenting on how great the visual are, how much better they look compared to the X etc etc...
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Isn’t one of Xbox’s big problems is a complete lack of presence in Asia? In Japan, Sony and Nintendo have a huge home field advantage. I think I saw the number for Xbox there are dismal.
In the States, MS has the local advantage but has squandered their lead they had last gen. Sony and Nintendo have done admirably in penetrating the Western market. Sony utilizes western developers and studios. They have been more globally minded I think. I’m not an expert on these things though ... but just an observation that hasn’t been mentioned.
@Kidfried Here in the US it seems like 50-50 on the advertising. Last gen it was more like 70-30 with more Xbox ads, but now it seems about even. That’s just my estimate.
@Kidfried I tend not to watch TV ads and FF through them. That being said, the few I do see tend to be primarily associated with games - so you get Shadow of War and AC: origins with Xbox and CoD/Destiny with PS4. Sony have been advertising VR on TV and of course Xbox has its advert for the 'X' specifically. I can't recall Sony doing a 'Pro' specific ad. As I said, I don't tend to see many ads but it seems that I have seen more Xbox ads of late - maybe because SoW and ACO are out and next week it will be more PS4 ads as CoD and then SW:BF2 are out.
I wasn't disagreeing that Sony have a big an exciting rosta of AAA games to release in the coming years. Its just that this year, with the few shows they have attended, Detroit, God of War, Spider-Man, Days Gone (or Last of Us in the case of Paris), SotC and Horizon:ZD DLC have been shown over and over again. All of those (apart from SotC of course) were also shown at E3 2016 too - well H:ZD the game not the DLC but H:ZD was at E3 (and E3 2015 too). Its unfair to compare what we know of MS's Exclusive with Sony's because for all we know, MS may have some 'big' games coming late 2018, early 2019 whilst we could still be waiting for Days Gone, Last of us 2, Ghost etc - I wonder how many of these will be shown again at E3 2018. If MS had shown ALL their hand for the next 2-3 yrs or Sony kept to giving you a snapshot of the year ahead, it would probably seem a lot closer in number - obviously Sony will still have the edge (maybe 1-2 more) due to many more studio's but a snapshot of a year as MS give us is obviously going to look a lot more barren than the next 2-3yrs that Sony are showing. How many MS announced exclusives could you name expected after next years E3 and compare that to how many Sony exclusives you can name.
In an average year, looking at my 'games', I buy roughly the same number of PS exclusives as I do Xbox exclusives. I buy more multi-platform games a year than I have bought 'exclusives' combined and I still don't have enough money to buy ALL the games I want. I don't have the space for or interest in PC gaming - not at the moment and I want to play the majority of games I buy at their best on my 4k HDR TV. If that happens to be Sony great, if it happens to be MS, great - I still get the best console experience regardless of who happens to be the best and have the other to take advantage of any exclusives, deals and free games. I bet if you or others here had an X or PC as well as a Pro, the majority of the games they buy that are on both would be the one that looks and/or runs best in most cases. Exceptions may be online games where more friends are playing or some 'special' deal of course.
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@BAMozzy Funny thing I completely disagree with you on how would i buy my games the thing where they look the best is 0 concern to me if i had all three i would buy the games where i can make my collection the best In PC i would never buy because of only digital I'm not interested in that now Consoles.
Xbox doesn't have Asia they aren't getting support there so there is that then exclusives Ps4 wins in that department too.
Third Party is vastly bigger on PS4 as there will be more players to play with...bigger install base.
I know i'm xox will not have more 60fps options than pro they are basically the same cpu processors graphics will just be a little bit more and that is in Texture department and Resolution bump nothing else.
Many people are talking about Sony's conference and the games announced like Ghost of Tsushima, can't forget about the impressive trailers for The Last of Us 2, God of War, Detroit and Spider-Man. Can't forget the great support that PSVR is receiving. Also, there is the fact about Super Mario Odyssey on Switch, these are the hot topics on gaming right now, nothing about Xbone X...
@PS_Nation
Xbox One X hype is going to start picking up steam over the next few days as we get closer to launch, but as powerful as the hardware is and as much as I've been entrenched in that ecosystem of the years I'm surprised by how uninterested I am. If all I owned was a PS4 and I was in the market for a One X or Switch this holiday the choice would be simple. The latter has two instant classics in just over 7 months on the market, the Xbox One X has PUBG and a bunch of third party games that can be played perfectly fine (minus some textures and other graphical details) on PS4. That said, I have a feeling quite a few enthusiasts will jump on the Xbox One X bandwagon, this time of year it's especially easy to do that with the right marketing.
As someone who's still somewhat on the fence, i have to agree with statement that PGW did not really affect the decision in any way. Just feel that Sony might just be getting abit complacent... With xb1x currently on special for pre-order, only about 30 usd difference here in SA, its just looking.... so expensive to get the pro.
Plus comparing MS store game prices with Sony, Sony is just more expensive. Battle chasers, for example is almost double on Sony store. But with ps4 doing so well, they almost don't need to drop the price. Maybe some more competition in the xb1x will be good for the price sensitive. But quality is also important, and in terms of games, one feels that Sony is ahead, with more compelling exclusives... I guess thats the price for more quality exclusives.
@PS_Nation Nobody is criticising the games that Sony showed and I for one am very excited to play most of them. The point is that before Paris though, we already knew that Spider-Man, Detroit, God of War and the Last of Us 2 were coming. Ghosts was more a CGi trailer or cut-scene - like the Last of Us 2, God of War kind of disappointed by the boy's vocal, Detroit was 'uncomfortable' to watch and Spider-Man seemed to be trying too much to take away some of that 'negativity' it received from its E3 game-play and QTE criticism. As for VR, Its great to see it supported, but it still only aimed at the extreme minority of gamers. Did it do enough to sell an expensive peripheral to its own fanbase, let alone attract those considering an Xbox X with 4k enhanced visuals to something that struggles to run at the same visuals as a base PS4 - even with a Pro. Yes they maybe 1080p but they are also a lot of sacrifices needed too.
The point of the thread wasn't whether Sony did well/poorly etc, but whether they did enough to derail the hype of the X. If you were NOT interested in the X before, then the question doesn't really matter. Sony could of not bothered with Paris at all and it wouldn't have made any difference to you - you are a Sony fanboy and regardless, you would not be leaving their clutches.
To affect the Hype of the X, as the question asked, you would have to look at those who had an interest in the X before Paris, Not just those with pre-orders but everyone with an interest - inc those who were on the fence. If Sony had 'affected' the hype, its these people that would feel it - not someone who had NO interest in the X. If Sony had 'done enough' to affect the hype, these people would be pulled away from the X and towards Sony - assuming Sony's show was 'spectacular' or even pushed more towards the X if it Sony's show flopped. Point is, it was kind of neutral - in other words not a disaster that pushes those on the fence to MS but not spectacular that it pulls them towards Sony.
Again that doesn't mean the show itself was 'bad' especially not for Sony fanboys but it wasn't 'good' enough to affect those people who are 'hyped' for Xbox X or good enough to pull those people who are sat on the fence away from MS either. That was the point of the thread - at least as far as I understand the question posed. If E3 didn't take the hype away with the majority of those games then why would they take it away at Paris? I still think if Sony had shown a completely different line-up to E3 - as a part 2 would have, and then ended with a sizeable price drop on hardware, that would have had more of an impact on the Xbox hype. Those that were sat on the fence, may well of been pulled to Sony, bought a Pro and been reminded of the 'games they haven't shown for a while. Probably made their AAA blockbusters appear to have more 'variety' than yet another 'dark' and/or violent game.
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@JoeBlogs I agree that if you are looking for 'different' games, the Xbox doesn't offer too much. 3x Forza Motorsport games (personally I prefer Motorsport to GT and much prefer to play offline career modes so F7 is my racing sim of choice) but you could get Project Cars 2 to get F7-ish on PS4. 2x Forza Horizon - Best Arcade Racers in my opinion - open world and fun - nothing else really like it. Halo 5 (not the best campaign but some really like the MP), Gears 4 - A decent 3rd person cover shooter, Halo Wars 2 - A RTS game - not that common on console + games like Quantum Break, Recore, Screamride, Sunset Overdrive, Titanfall, Ryse, Dead Rising 3/4 (although 4 is coming to PS4), Sea of Thieves, State of Decay 1/2, Crackdown 3, PUBG, Cuphead, Ori, Rare Replay, Super Luckys Tale etc. Also you do get Backwards Compatibility so a lot of 'Old' games you may have missed out on or just miss playing are available too. Games like KoToR - probably the greatest Star Wars game ever, RDR, Fallout 3 etc. Its still got quite a lot of 'unique' software and a lot more if you don't own a PS3/XB360 anymore,
Both the S and X offer 4k HDR Bluray player, Dolby Atmos quality audio, Obviously HDR gaming (in supported titles - inc some BC games believe it or not). The S is cheaper than most dedicated 4k HDR bluray players and the Switch. At the end of the day though, a lot of the games releasing will also be on the PS4. If you have a PS4, the S isn't going to be the better place to play games and the X is 'expensive' if you don't have a 4k HDR TV - its still cheaper than some dedicated 4k HDR Bluray players and even downsampled to 1080p (if you have a 1080p TV) will look better than 'native 1080p' on the PS4. High res 'quality' modes, whilst not necessarily native 4k or even CB4k (SoW) will look far superior when downsampled as these have much higher visual settings, draw distances etc. Things like aliasing and anisotropic filtering are significantly improved so you don't get the shimmer etc and edges are much sharper (far fewer jaggies) when Super sampling. I know the Pro offers some supersampling too and even 1440p supersampled down to 1080p is better than native 1080p with the same visual settings.
The cost/value of any console though is dependent on how much use you will get from it. If the Switch is going to see more use because of its more flexible design, the fact you can use it anywhere and not tied to a TV, then that will be better value than an XB1s even though the S is cheaper and more powerful with more media support too. Obviously the games will determine how much 'use' your console gets. Despite the versatility of the Switch, if you don't have the 'games' you want to play, it could end up being a dust collector after a few months - once you have played the 'few games' you wanted. Same goes for the S or X too although, if you do buy or own a 4k HDR TV, these could get more use as a media box than a games console. You could of course still get 4 games a month and access to over a hundred games with Game Pass and Gold - Around £10-12 a month - so never actually need to 'buy' games. Its not like the BC games and older XB1 games you may have missed out on are expensive now anyway but like you say, a lot of them you may already own or played on the previous generation(s) and PS4. I certainly wouldn't recommend any console specific as I don't really know what your situation is, what you are looking for, what your tastes are etc. In my situation, the Xbox One X makes the most sense. I have a 'big' library of Xbox games - going right back to the OG Xbox (just have to dig out my box of games from Storage if I want to play these via BC) and a 4k HDR TV - so it will improve all of these in some way - some more than others but even those 'non-enhanced' games will benefit from the extra power, built in anisotropic filtering (improves textures - especially at angles), faster loading, massive Cache etc etc. I also own a Pro so I know exactly what each offers in terms of unique games. However, I also know that they both offer different deals so often a game is cheaper on one than the other - also you get different free games too so you may end up with some of those multi-plats on different systems rather than keeping one for 'exclusives'. It maybe better for you to buy the Switch in your situation, maybe you want the flexibility, want to game on the go, have more interest in the types of game Nintendo make etc etc.
Either way, enjoy your gaming...
A pessimist is just an optimist with experience!
Why can't life be like gaming? Why can't I restart from an earlier checkpoint??
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All these games are also available on PC as well, there is no need for a Xbox at all...
i feel this is probably the biggest hurdle the XB1X has to clear, when you can get all the XBOX exclusive games on P.C and they will look even better on P.C what need is there for the console really especially when you could just upgrade your P.C to even better specs than the XB1X
the play anywhere feature sounds great on paper but it could also make the XB1 obsolete, especially as you can connect your P.C to your TV too
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@JoeBlogs I know that feeling. I admit that since the beginning of October, I will have bought 5 games, with a 6th coming soon after the release of the Xbox One X - all of which I have purchased with that console in mind and therefore haven't touched any of these yet - they are still in the sealed Cellophane packaging. I also purchase the Witcher 3 Season Pass on Xbox with the thought of playing these again on the 'X' - I bought and played all of these on the PS4. I am also considering getting Doom and TF2 - both of which I have on the PS4.
I am also looking forward to the Frozen Wilds which launches on the 7th Nov - the same day my X arrives. I do understand how difficult it can be to keep up with 'everything' you want to play with just 1 console let alone 2 or more. The good thing though, is that in times of 'lulls' there is usually something to play. If I am bored or want something 'different' from my PS4 collection, I have the Xbox and its library - inc any 'free' games that I may have added but not got round to.
Because I knew the X was coming, I had been very conservative with my 'free cash' this year. In fact until August, I had only bought two games and the Witcher 3 Season Pass in a sale. I also got a third but that was paid off last year. I made do with the games in my collection on both systems - although 90% of the time, it was on PS4 Pro. I hardly touched my XB1s (bought new a year ago - Gears 4 custom edition) and now that is being replaced. I tend to go in long phases - alternating between the two rather than swapping back and forth regularly but I like the option of having both - 6 free games a month (not that I always take advantage and download all) - never missing out on a 'deal' or Exclusive. This set-up has suited me for 20+ years - before the Xbox came along - even before Sony too - but since the N64/PS1 era, its been mostly consoles where as before, A 'computer/PC' was my 'main' gaming device with maybe a Gameboy as the 'other' but then when I passed my Driving Test, and mobile phones had a few games on them, I found handhelds lost their appeal. I had no need to pass time on a bus/train etc and if I wasn't sat playing games in front of a TV/Monitor, I was doing household jobs, raising kids etc. Now all my gaming is in front of a TV - a 4k HDR TV and like I said, I still have a 'big' catalogue of Xbox and Playstation games. I would still have my PS1/2 era games too if my PS3 Phat hadn't YLOD and therefore lost BC with older games. My son had my old PS2 after his broke so I gave him all my PS games consoles, my youngest had my N64 and games etc but still have my PS3 and games, all my Xbox, Xbox 360 games and consoles - even have a Gameboy Color somewhere...
A pessimist is just an optimist with experience!
Why can't life be like gaming? Why can't I restart from an earlier checkpoint??
Feel free to add me but please send a message so I know where you know me from...
@FullbringIchigo What people are missing is that those 'Exclusives' are only available to Windows 10 PC owners, Only available to those that sign-up (like creating an Xbox Profile) and can only be purchased via the Microsoft Store. Its like buying an Xbox but only able to buy MS games to play on it via their Xbox store.
Essentially, what MS are doing with their games is making you play on a 'virtual' Xbox. You can either buy a ready built console that you have to create a 'profile' or buy Windows 10 and have a 'virtual' Xbox. Its still an 'Xbox' exclusive essentially but whether you play on the 'physical' Xbox that MS built for you or you play on a 'virtual Xbox' with your own specs but must buy Windows 10 (if you haven't got it), Sign up to Microsoft and create your own 'Xbox Profile' and your own 'Xbox gamertag' and then buy their Exclusives - either from the Microsoft store on your PC or the Microsoft store on your Xbox. You can't just go to Steam or Game and buy these. MS get maximum profit from them with no 'middlemen'. People need to remember that whilst MS may not have built the PC you are gaming on, you are still required to own the Microsoft operating system and a Xbox profile to play. If I were to buy a Win10 gaming PC, Sign in with my Xbox profile, I could instantly play any game that I bought on my Xbox in a 'virtual' Xbox on that Microsoft running PC. Regardless of the 'Hardware' its still Microsoft and its still 'Xbox'. I really don't get why people cannot grasp that its still Microsoft and the Console, right from the outset going back to the first - was built to be a PC gaming device in console form - stripping away all the unnecessary PC functionality to be more 'gaming' focused. The Xbox was built around the PC API and the name came about because the 'original' idea was to make a DirectX Box. The console was intended to be the first game system built like a PC and to bring all of the flexibility and power of a gaming rig to the console market. The system would run on Windows 2000, making it easy for traditional PC software developers to work within the console’s architecture. Its also why it was the first with an built in HDD too. The initial response at launch was quite skeptical of what they saw as nothing more than a fancy PC dressed up like a gaming console
I think its ridiculous for MS to create/publish games for its Microsoft powered 'console' but not for their Microsoft powered PC gamers. I am sure if Sony had its own PC OS, they too would support that with 'games' as well - extending both their user-base and sales/profits.
As to why someone may want the X - not everyone wants to game on a PC, be in the PC gaming environment or have the space/room for a PC set-up. I know you can connect a PC to a TV but that seems counter-intuitive as most TV's only accept a 60hz signal at best. Even if a game is running at 120hz, every other frame is never displayed. Also if a TV can run at 120hz or 240hz even, The TV often interpolates those 'extra frames' rather than displaying 'accurately' these. You still only get 60hz actual images/frames - the rest are artificially created. Another aspect is Lag and response times. I know the Best OLEDs have incredible response times - beating monitors but their input lag - even at 20ms is double that of a monitor. OLEDs are not necessarily the 'best' for non-gaming use either - thanks to ABL (Automatic Brightness Limiter) which means that 'reading' a page of black text on a white background looks very dim by comparison to a monitor and 'colours' change too depending on how 'bright' the whole screen is. If you have a 'bright' red (say 500nits) in the top corner on a solid black background. As you 'enlarge' that red, the colour drops and becomes dimmer dropping down to 100-150nits - so not good for image correction or photoshop/illustrator applications. Of course, if its just games you want, then that may not matter but its something to consider otherwise.
I know Consoles are not 'plug and play' so much anymore and with HDR added in, its more important to set them up correctly - make sure their RGB output matches the Display properly etc. But they are more simple than PC in a lot of ways. You don't have to 'optimise' them yourself, don't have to make sure the correct and updated drivers are their, know that the other people in the MP lobbies are on similar hardware - you won't get such a vast difference in frame rates, visual quality etc. I know its a bit different now with these more powerful consoles but you know the MP frame rate caps are the same.
As to why someone with a 'decent' PC may consider an X, it maybe because they don't always want to be sat at a desk playing games. They may want to be able to sit on the Sofa in front of the TV and carry on from where they left off on the PC - on those cross-play games anyway. May want the 'free' games that come from console subscriptions. May want the 4k HDR Bluray player and Dolby Atmos audio and want the same 'visual' quality that their PC delivers for gaming - after all the cost isn't that much more than buying a dedicated 4k HDR player - some are even more expensive too. It maybe that they don't have a 4k Monitor and a decent GPU to deliver 4k visuals at playable frame rates, but the X is cheaper than buying a GTX1080 and they have a 4k HDR TV as that has 'more' use than buying a decent 4k HDR monitor. Therefore they can pick to play in 4k HDR on the console or 1080/1440 SDR on their PC but with 'higher frame rates'. In fact there are a lot of reasons why they may want to go with an X to compliment their PC set up. I can also see why a PC gamer may opt for a PS4/Pro or Switch instead but its not necessarily as B&W as some make out. Owning a 'gaming' PC does not necessarily mean the X is 'pointless' as it can offer flexibility on where you play, a better match in quality visuals between the two and the added advantage of doubling up as a 4k HDR Bluray player. Most HDR monitors are also NOT HDR10 standard - topping out at around 500nits. For an LCD panel (as these are), that's short of the 1000nits that HDR10 standard LCD's display. Therefore, HDR will look more impressive on a TV and, like I said, it probably makes more sense for most people to upgrade their TV first as a TV is often Larger, more useful (for bluray, streaming, STB's, Freeview/freesat, on-demand etc). You are more likely to have a better audio set-up for TV's too
A pessimist is just an optimist with experience!
Why can't life be like gaming? Why can't I restart from an earlier checkpoint??
Feel free to add me but please send a message so I know where you know me from...
@BAMozzy I hope I didn't come across as MS bashing, I think the X looks great, they do have some good games and backward compatibility is an awesome Idea. For me as a consumer who isn't really loyal to one brand over another, as a PS4 owner, I personally don't feel the need to get an XB1 because there is nothing that makes me feel I should invest all the cash into another console.
At Paris games week, I think Sony played a strong hand in appealing to their faithful and they are reaping the rewards of some major investment in content. It has become a major contributing factor in this gens sales lead.
I am still interested in Microsofts long term plan, especially if they do away with generations. I don't get people who say the XB1 isn't a success. It has still sold a ton and got good titles.
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Topic: Did Sony just take away the hype surrounding Microsoft xbox one x launch
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