PS Store Games of a Generation Sale Discounts Some of the Best PS4 Titles

This is why I don’t do digital. Even the supposedly staggering sale on Ghost of Tsushima is less than £2 cheaper than physical which is £45, yet trade in for physical is £31. So effectively for these single player single playthrough games I can pay £43.44, or or £14...not a tough choice, that’s more than 3x as much for digital!!!

Now I’m aware various parties are cut out of my money there, so I’d be willing to pay maybe £24 digital, but the discrepancy between digital and physical is too large currently. Sony need to allow trade back on digital.

Edit: I may have misread the tone of the quotation marks, but the point stands lol. Digital is fine for the smaller Indy games that are hard to find physical and can go down to a few quid.

It's incredibly good value to purchase The Witcher 3. Granted, it's always on sale for around this price, but with the free upgrade for PS5, the price could be so much higher to capitalise on it. 😁

EDIT: Also, for people buying the PS5DE, it's not a lot to replace a physical version you may already own.

@thefourfoldroot
Trade back digital? I believe its more possible that steam buys playstation franchise 😉

@thefourfoldroot this is why I will never go digital it’s a joke but at the same time they don’t really want us buying them out right the future will be subscriptions as you can see with Xbox having pushed it very hard this upcoming gen because once your signed up not matter what is released that year your tied in to paying.

Borderlands 3 is under £10 on Amazon.

I honestly don't know how you can justify going for the digital only PS5. Unless you plan to buy less than 3 games in its lifetime, you're sure to lose money in the long run.

Witcher 3 complete edition is 15 pounds on base.com

Makes me glad I bought a disc version, the DE is just a giant money pit.. "BuT i BuY DiScOuNTeD cReDiT" still doesn't make up for the fact discs will always be cheaper, Digital is great for Indie and AAs but anything else and they are just taking people for granted

Blasphemous is such a good deel for 8 quid. A really good and beautifully looking and sounding metroidvania. Highly recommended.

So many people policing on why Digital is so bad and they don't get DE customers.

Okay? Just let people enjoy what they want lol, they know the pros and cons of going that route, some people just prefer Digital, me being one of them.

Do I lose money? Yeah. Do I care? Not really no. (Ask me the same question when we go balls deep into a recession and my answer might be different however aha!)

@Hulk88 its a horrifying future that people are walking blindly into (just to clarify i dont mean people choosing to buy digital, despite my consternation over the pricing structure, but those signing up en masse to Game Pass)

Gamepass seems amazing, astonishing value for money. But when sub models are the only option prices will go up, and there wont be any individual ownership of games. You will be at the behest of platform holders and publishers who could withdraw access at any time.

That's not to mention the reduced investment in AAA quality games, particularly those one and done single player games that Sony excels at. The future is persistently online, service based gaming. And i am very concerned about it.

Sony have made serious communication errors going into this gen, but in time people will treasure the continued commitment to ownership of games (once the prices come down, considerably!!).

@DonJorginho whilst i am largely physical, i am looking forward to switching on my PS5 and finding all of that digital content i've purchased over the years just waiting for me if i need it. Its certainly super convenient!

I've nothing but respect for those who choose to go fully digital. Its a choice that works for them.

With that said i am concerned about what will happen for the generation after PS5/Series X which will most likely follow a digital only model - prices are likely to hold higher, for much longer than they currently do. We'll have to see what happens.

Now that Sony have forgotten about the PS Vita, there are some obscenely priced games on the store that i just cant justify paying, and i dont see the prices dropping any time soon. Amd i am someone whose vita library is approx 75% digital

@Hulk88
Indeed that’s the case and, after this period of MS subsidising the subscription model is over, the strategy will only support so many quality games per month/year before prices have to rise substantially, investment per game drops, or games are riddled with micro transactions...sad times.

@Rob_230 Exactly my reasoning, that ease of access and the ability to play games the exact second they come out just makes my life easier.

Especially considering in my area we have had so many dodgy couriers and our only local game shop is a small woeful GAME which is a nightmare to deal with, especially around work hours.

Digital is what I have used for most of the second half of this gen, and I am looking forward to continuing it!

@DonJorginho
I don’t think we are hating on people who are OK with being ripped off (although they are somewhat complicit), we are more criticising digital pricing policies.

@Rhaoulos Because they prefer Digital, there's your justification lol.

People just like different things, regardless of the evident pros and cons.

Like others are saying if they are sale prices it’s a big enough clue to not buy digital only. You’ll save the difference in first year. All those have been cheaper physical for a while

@thefourfoldroot I never said hating, policing is the term I would use, making it seem wrong that in 2020 where the gaming market is dominated by digital sales that more people are willing to take the plunge.

I would have got a disc version if I didn't have a great 4K UHD Player for my films, but as I already have one there was literally no point to get one, as my whole library is digital.

@Rhaoulos Not really. If you wait long enough, digital is cheaper than physical. People think it's the opposite because of their confirmation bias. If you pay attention to everything that is offered, you can easily see there are some truly amazing deals, provided, like I said, you're willing to wait long enough (in some cases years).

Plus, there are others who simply prefer digital versions and don't mind paying a bit more at launch.

@naruball You are wise Mon Ami.

@DonJorginho you mean GAME's sales pitch - do you want to preorder anything while you are here? How about disc insurance? What about this comedy hat? - is off putting? 😉

I wasn't sad to see our local Game go (apart from obviously being sad for the staff that lost jobs because of it); although i must admit when CEX is now the only shop selling video games, choice is rather limited these days! I can certainly see why people would choose to go digital

@DonJorginho
Then I guess you are one of the people who will benefit most from the rest of us disc players insisting we will not go digital unless prices are reduced!

I have no issue with an all digital future as long as it doesn’t cost me substantially more, which shamefully it would under current pricing structures.

It’s not even that I can’t afford it, I just refuse to throw money down the drain.

@gmxs Demons Soul's (RRP £70)

Digital you can get a £50 and a £20 voucher for £60, that is already a £10 saving, let alone if we factor in delivery costs, and that guarantees you your game the second it comes out, and allows you to preload so you can jump right in, who is to say your delivery won't arrive on time due to unforeseen circumstances?

Of course some retailers will sell for £65 and if you like to trade in games you will lose money in the long run going digital, but the customer base for Digital know that and evidently don't care seeing as Digital Sales dominate the current marketspace.

@gmxs " still doesn't make up for the fact discs will always be cheaper"

The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt on psn: £7.49
The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt on amazon: £16.97
The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt on Shopto: £29.85
https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=the+witcher+wild+hunt&ref=nb_sb_noss
https://www.shopto.net/en/ps4wi22-witcher-3-wild-hunt-game-of-the-year-edition-p62029/?currency=GBP

Nice fact.

@DonJorginho mille mercis

@thefourfoldroot My advice is to just do whatever is easier and makes you happy, I have no qualms against people using Discs, hell I do it for older consoles!

@Rob_230 Exactly that, never forget when they tried to charge me £5 every purchase for that disk protection stuff!

But yeah Digital is my preferred choice atm, and getting cheap credit makes it even easier than before so I will keep going down that route.

@DonJorginho
I wouldn’t use a dodgy gray market credit selling site, nor should I have to. But the main point is that demon souls might be £70 now, but the price drops quickly, physical and it doesn’t digital. Plus it very rarely costs more than £20 max net when accounting for trade back, do significantly more than digital.

Again, digital and the people buying it is all fine, but the companies ripping people off with digital pricing and non ownership (no resale) are not snd should be criticised.

@thefourfoldroot I would hardly say that ShopTo falls under that category, and all you are saying is true about price cuts being quicker for physical, but if you are like me, buying Discs ends up costing more anyway!

The amount of times I repurchased discs would rack up over time, so it would even out either way. For me you just can't beat that ease of access that Digital brings, it isn't for everyone though and I accept that!

@Rob_230 yeah I feel like this is the probably the last gen il buy in to even tho iv cancelled my pre order il wait a year or 2 before I pick up a 5 I’m not enjoying the direction gaming is heading and it’s more worrying people don’t see it, the fact these companies now think that £70 is an acceptable amount of money for a game is crazy and people actually defend it. I think gaming as iv known it will be over by the end of this systems life cycle and il have to just be content playing what I’ve collected over the years.

I love SteamWorld Dig but this would be the 3rd platform I've bought it on, so no. Metal Gear Solid 5 Definitive was on the last sale for like 6 or 7 quid, surprised to see it go even cheaper

@DonJorginho
Fair enough if you are willing to pay for the questionable convenience of digital that’s up to you of course. Again, not criticising anyone but the companies involved snd their horrendously insulting digital pricing.

Out of interest though, why would you ever need to repurchase discs?

@Hulk88 "it’s more worrying people don’t see it, the fact these companies now think that £70 is an acceptable amount of money for a game is crazy and people actually defend it"

Ironic considering how pretty much everything is more expensive than it used to be, but we expect video games to cost the same or less than they did 30 years ago, despite development costing much more now.

Best deal (that hasn't been previously available multiple times) I've seen today is £9.49 for Huntdown.

@thefourfoldroot I would sell a game due to not enjoying it, then want to retry it another time, or if I sold a game like No Mans Sky only for a great update to come out for example

@thefourfoldroot being digital, I can share with my friend or siblings. There will be multiplayer update coming soon for GoT. So for me I always buy digital. So I open game, and it only costs half. It is totally fair price if you think you can share your games with one other person officially. (Unofficially more but tidious)

@DonJorginho
Ok, I can see that. I think I’ve actually done it myself with persona 5. Bought it for £30, got £20 back bought it again for £18 sold it for £10. Still only cost me £18 overall though, if I had got it digitally the first time would have cost me around £50 I think.

Anyway, I’m not trying to convince people of anything, just think it’s pretty self evidence that cost wise, digital is a rip off. Of course there are other benefits for people that might make them willing to be ripped off as the alternative is bad too, but I just wish Sony and MS would be less predatory

I wouldn't ever buy a digital only console, but I have been mostly digital for nearly a decade.

I buy digital because I collect and don't sell on games anyway, and I like the convenience of having instant access to all my games (which is why I'm concerned about the storage solutions on next gen. It's literally removing one of the advantages of digital games), and it saves physical space.

I get games like Spider-man with DLC for £20, Rage with DLC for £14, and three Far Cry games, again with DLC for £24. I'm OK with those prices.

I've bought way too many games lately, i'm gonna sit this one out.

@mrbone
Yes, I’m aware you can game the system by swapping primary designation with another or sharing account details with someone you trust. If it’s a friend you can get them to give you half back (which you can also do physically, although then you couldn’t play simultaneously).
This is an edge case, but I would still say that, as games overall are more than double the price digitally, it would still work out better to both go physical. Unless it’s a multiplayer game you would play fir years and never trade (which is why publishers are pushing more and more for games as a service)

@naruball this is what I mean. So development costs go up so the prices need to go up but games don’t cost £40-£50 right now as they are all riddled with micro transactions, season passes, dlcs, collectors editions, special editions and now when you see the profits the likes of EA and Activision are reporting and then you say that it costs to much to develop I can’t believe it for a second. Some have said the price hike will put an end to all that add on rubbish but it’s already been confirmed in new games ( dark souls on Psn £20 for a few add ons) so what it comes down to is blind greed and don’t forget people’s wages don’t go up at the same rate if at all

I'm willing to pay more for digital overall. No shelf space taken and no changing dics is heaven.(priceless for VR)
For ps5 load times are fast and switching games is quick. You would lose that if you had all games on disc.
Some people enjoy having disc collection I get that. I enjoy having a minimal setup that I can switch between quick.

Anyone here talking about how they're going to buy Goat of Tsushima now that it's on sale don't deserve it, pay up in full you cowards.

How will swift resume and multiple games suspended at the same time work with physical media?
I have a de and disc ps5 and will probably stick with the de. I'm game sharing next gen and despite baulking at the high prices, buying cheaper credit and sharing will soften the blow until sales come. Hzd full version was £11.50 and gow was £9.50 or a fiver on the US site. Only digital regret was pga 2k21 which is a big bug fest and no was of getting a refund. Strangely enough it was the most expensive purchase on psn for me at £48 after cheaper credit.
I know the pros and cons and I'm getting tired of the same people coming out with the 'I play a game then sell it a week later' mentality. Bully for you mate, I'm not rushing through games in what very little time I have just so it costs me ten to fifteen quid for the pleasure.

@DonJorginho your points are all very much in line with what I think. I've gone back to plenty of games after updates and dlc and just having stuff in your library is very convenient.
Also discs can be noisy, and something else to go wrong.
I was all out for getting a 4k player but the pro should've had one, nowadays with decent quality streams and £25 for one film, I've decided that it's not something I'm bothered about.

@thefourfoldroot for day one buyers of games (which I am for major releases) and for game sharing (which I do with a friend of mine [ps5 is also seemingly going to allow game sharing]), in Canada at least, it is cheaper to buy digital as physical has tax on top of the price and digital Sony seems to be picking up the tab on that as there is no tax on top. 14.50 savings on every new release not to mention only having to buy every second game.

Digital is by far the better option in my opinion.

Also, your assertion that you can’t play at the same time is actually false. You can and me and my friend do all the time. It’s not tricking or “gaming” the system. It’s a feature of the system which they’re also implementing in ps5.

@Rhaoulos sales happen all the time - been pretty much all digital for last 3 years just got deluxe code vein and deluxe nioh 2 both for $25 bucks each and those are fairly new games, I can’t trade them in, but to get the best trade in you would need to buy the game and beat it before the value goes down - personally i think that takes enjoyment out of the game. I’d rather wait till a sale at the right price for a game.

Also game sharing with a trusted friend or family Member , split each game 50/50 and wait for sales , I have gotten death stranding, spider man and other top games for under $15 buck each when split with my cousin

Also its just a preference thing physical media may be phased out eventually but I think companies realize a choice is important for now , who cares if people buy digital or physical just do what makes sense to you

@Hulk88 You're right about Microtransactions. Those games could either cost much less (e.g. 30 euro) or have much more content for free to justify them (Marvel's Avengers comes to mind).

But it's important to keep in mind that many games don't have any MTX. Does Demon's Souls have any? If not, then maybe the price is justified?

@Dan_ozzzy189 I agree with all your points too mate, was a bit frustrating when the PS4 Pro didn't launch with a 4K drive but I have made great use of my 4K player seeing as I have spent easily a few grand in the last 12 months on UHD Films, but games wise I have went the other way, adoring that ease of access of being able to load any game any time.

With COVID still very much a thing I can see that affecting physical games for a while, from shipment troubles to stores closing/restricting customers, it will likely be more stressful, where as us Digital Users can simply download the games free of hassle (as you can if you buy Digital on a disc too).

@KathyQ Don't pay attention to it my friend, just think of all the great games you can enjoy with no hassles via Digital, no chances of missing delivery dates, no chances of faulty disks, and actually the ability to buy games cheaper on launch in most cases.

People who berate other's spending decisions are quite sad, and for them to keep bringing up losing money as their main point, makes me feel lucky that I am not in such a financial hardship that I have to sell my games to feel good about my purchases.

@KathyQ nah, that's nothing out of the ordinary. Many gamers are extremely close minded and... angry, unfortunately. It's been proven over and over again. Normal people express their opinion (or don't) and move on. What happened with TLoUII is a perfect example of what's wrong with a significant part of the gaming community.

@MarcG420
You misread, I said if you share physically you can’t play at the same time.

And yes, if you platform or account share you can split the cost (just like you can on physical, just without playing at the same time).

I am aware of these fringe cases, especially in other countries with very high taxation on physical products. They are fringe cases however, and not the case for most players in the world.

If you want to assume a proviso on all of my comments to the effect of “may not be the case for you depending on country of origin and how many friends you game with and should you always buy games on day of release” then that is fine.

@naruball NeVeR fOrGiVe NeiL cUcKmAnN fOr PuTtInG sTrOnG wOmAn In MuH gAmE!

@KathyQ Where do you get your store credit btw if you don't mind me asking? I go with ShopTo atm but am looking for alternatives!

@naruball this is also true for the games that don’t have any add on/micro transactions like you say with the likes of demon souls and cyberpunk comes to mind but don’t get it twisted demon souls in a remake so the production of that game shouldn’t be anywhere near that of the likes of cyberpunk due to the fact the story and gameplay is already there as a template and like I said early they have a special edition for this £90!! For a few in game item and I know you don’t have to buy it but it all falls under these company not having any connection to it’s really player base, I used to work in a big name grocery shop and that would’ve been over 2 days wages( minus tax I pay) it just seem very poorly timed to bring this massive price hike in

@KathyQ No problem, it is a great site, just sometimes with things like this you can see the slightly narrow viewed gamers come to life.

@DonJorginho CD keys are usually the cheapest

In addition to all the great points above. Being able to Pre-load a game a few days before launch and then being able to play at 12 midnight is best for me, without waiting for Amazon delivery driver and all sorts of delay. Also the quick resume feature will be key this coming generation.

@thefourfoldroot well, as for the physical sharing it’s possible but not very convenient if , as is the case with my buddy and I, you live in a different city.

This is not a fringe, very high taxation situation as you would put it. This is in Canada and all things have the same sales tax, on the psn store they’re simply covering it for you.

There is no need to assume a provision on your posts, I was simply pointing out that your experience and preference is not EVERYONE’S.

@SoSolidSnake also a great perk being able to play it the moment it’s available.

I am an avid collector of physical discs and prefer physical. The cases, the artwork (even in the absence of instruction booklets)... You just can't beat holding something tangible in your hands. I am the purist the digital crowd scoffs at, the same way we sometimes scoff at buying digital only.

Why physical? I used to argue about the re-sell value and being able to trade with friends. Truth is, I haven't traded a game in 10 years. Being a collector, I don't re-sell either. So it's not about money necessarily.

It's more the principle of the thing. I belong to an outdated school of thought that when you pay money for something, you own it in perpetuity. Not a "license" or whatever the the Terms of Service agreements call it. When you go for the convenience of digital, you are essentially agreeing to a long-term rental. And that's alright if it works for you. But as someone who has watched consumer rights in the sphere of gaming erode on a consistent basis during my time in the hobby, the new acceptance of digital disturbs me. I don't think people understand or have reflected on the long-term implications of it. Or don't care.

The "convenience fee" of digital isn't the markup on the PSN store, its your ownership rights.

@MarcG420
Well, yes, that’s a given, obviously. It is however the case for the majority.

@UnlimitedSevens
As a physical only gamer with generations of games stacked up from C64 onwards, I do now trade back every game once finished.partially a cost thing but also that is the principle. I could afford all games digital if I wanted, I just don’t see why I should line the pockets of those with predatory pricing methods.

As to ownership - well, technically everything is an effective rental given I’ll lose it when I die in 30-50 years. And digital code is actually far longer lasting than physical games even when looked after well, especially discs. So as long as Sony is around longer than I’m gaming (almost a certainty, and even more so with MS) I’m good with just having the license. Especially with basically mandatory patches off disc these days.

@Hulk88 Yup. Good point about Demon's Souls. It's not a new game and it could cost less for that very reason. But many other games will be new and without MTX. I also doubt enough people buy special editions to help offset the costs.

Maybe those high prices will teach some people the beautiful virtue of patience?

Digital is useful when you have two consoles, allowing two people to play at the same time because of the "primary PS4" feature. On the other hand, I also buy a lot of physical copies because with some games this is unnecessary and sometimes I just want to own an actual object (because materialism). Or other times I just let price decide. So I've got no problem with either.

Now having established my ambivalence and impartiality on the matter, I did want to point out that I don't really see anyone being attacked for buying digital. The complaint seems to simply be "digital could be cheaper." Not sure I disagree.

@DonJorginho

Digital is a worse deal in more ways than one. But yeah, you do get some convenience for all you give up, for sure. Doesn't cut the mustard for me personally, not by a very very long shot. I'm lucky enough to have to be to afford this expensive hobby too, but it's about so much more than money for me. Ownership of my purchases is what I care about. I like having that personal agency, to say I have something tangible and "real" for my money.

That's me, and you are you. Put it this way if it makes you feel better about your Digital PS5 purchase: I think going all digital is pretty silly, BUT I'm the exception here. Your philosophy is taking over and soon we all won't have a choice but digital. Take comfort in that and just enjoy your purchases with confidence.

Here's my dillemma. I've been waiting for a sale on Tsushima. Had Sony been clear on the details of their BC, free patches and "remaster upgrade" policies, I'd buy this before even typing this message.

But there's a problem. Is there any reason to buy this PS4 game right now that we don't know if it is getting an update on PS5? If this were XBox, the answer would be "yes." If there's an upgrade patch, then it'll just be upgraded, or not, by the time I play the game. Easy win.

But right now, if I buy this game now, does that mean they're going to "remaster" it instead of giving an update patch in a year or so for PS5 and this is a wasted purchase if I want to to play it at its best? Does it mean they will give it a PS5 patch for free, but the saves don't carry over so there's still no point playing it yet?

I can't buy it or play it until I know these things, and have to skip it. And if I skip it for more months I may as well wait until the price is way less than this.

This is an unfortunate situation where Sony's current lack of clarity is causing me to make the decision to NOT give them money right now despite them offering a product at a price I was otherwise eager to pay.

@thefourfoldroot It's a complicated dillemma. I was hardcore physical only for a long long time as well, though it was partially a limitation due to internet that just couldn't handle digital. I was militantly resistant to digital as well, and in fact, the mix of cost, hassle, and the clear migration to digital and away from physical is the set of reasons that caused me to leave PC and go back to console generations ago!

But this past gen, I've migrated to digital after getting better internet, and I don't see myself going back. One big factor is that "game sharing" factor others mentioned, where if you have 2 people playing in the same home, swapping consoles and buying a game once rather than twice makes it cheaper, even at Sony's new pricing. As you say, that's an edge case and doesn't work for too many people (and I'm hoping that's while they'll continue allowing it to work that way - that and even Nintendo works that way now... though the nature of a portable console makes it less desirable so I end up buying 2 there.)

But in some ways, digital customers are getting the shaft versus potential pricing specifically because of physical customers. I don't know how to fix that. The PC world fixed that by eliminating physical media entirely - it no longer exists. Their prices start lower and fall faster as a result. Used game sales simply don't exist, so that isn't a market factor in digital pricing.

I fully embrace all the importance of physically owning the product, and even having a case to display. I still have all my PS4 cases of the first half of the gen on display even though I've re-bought 100% of them digitally on sales. And I still buy new physical Switch games for a variety of reason and enjoy owning and displaying them. Yet with the way modern games are made, patches, add-ons, drip-feed content, I'm under no illusion that those discs/cartridges have any value at all whenever the digital stores are closed on each console either. It's not PSX. You aren't going to just dump a CD in and play from it like the old days, 30 years from now.

But it's a problem. ESPECIALLY for Sony. What do do with physical games. XBox gamers are more digital than physical for the mostpart because so many advantages of their environment reovolve around digital, the "endless library" of the digital BC versus Sony's "generations" model....digital is a clear PC-style purchase there. Nintendo games have started embracing drip-fed content. Even Animal Crossing will be worthless from the cartridge 20 years from now. Most of the game is being drip-fed in patches over a year or more. And because of that, used game sales are low too. Their strategy, stated by Reggie years ago was to make games people don't want to sell at all. It seems extending the game's release over a year is part of that.

(continued due to length limit)
Sony OTOH delivers a 10-30 hour experience in a game, story driven, that it seems all too common to play it fast, sell it at max value, and move on. From there, sales drop lower and lower due to the recirculating physical used copies. They're milking digital customers as whales to fund that, but that's also no doubt a big part of the new price increase.... Something needs to happen to shake up pricing. We can't have the "all digital future" where they lock us to $70 forever and ever until they say with no competition. But we also can't have people buying and dumping used games and recirculating them so that despite the first buyer paying $70, the real "per-sale" value is as though they charged $30 all along. And they can't drop digital prices outright because then they're undercutting their own retail partners. It's a tough challenge.

I think one of the easiest solutions would be something Nintendo did, but in a cheap "why even bother" kind of way. They give you 5% kick-back in gold coins (PSN wallet money) for digital purchases. 5% isn't enough. But I think PSN (and MSFT) could have some sort of digital loyalty/rewards program, hopefully better than that, that encourages cost savings for digital buyers without ticking off retail companys for undercutting them, while still enabling the benefits of physical games. Turning a blind eye to "game sharing" is probably part of that, but they should have tangible rewards/loyalty points system to offset digital costs and encourage more direct sales.

@thefourfoldroot

Absolutely solid points. It's true, I could die tomorrow, and all my points about long-term ownership would come to nothing. I also understand even blu-rays have a shelf life even if taken care of properly.

i guess... it's a principle I hold that we should jealously protect what rights as consumers we still have, and digital is certainly a step away from ownership in a strict sense. But you bring up a good point that physical can actually be more restrictive at times as far as your ownership.

I'll be the first to admit arguments based purely on principle can be counterproductive (and usually are). I suppose it's a combination of an old-fashioned idea about ownership, fear of change, or maybe I just really enjoy the collecting aspect of it more than I care to admit.

I'll say this though, I'm very suspicious of digital in general because we've never really been here before as an industry. I know Sony will probably be around longer than I am, but not as sure about PSN or the games. They've permanently delisted a surprisingly large amount of PS3 games on the PSN store and the list grows monthly. Well over 100 PS3 games delisted I believe, and only 7 years out from that generation.

@naruball ah yeah the old waiting game will be my play but everyone has there own opinions and minds but maybe a little dip in says due to people being more patient could help the gamers cause, well here’s hoping.

£3 for MGSV??? If you lot haven't played it then grab this masterpiece. In terms of story it leaves a lot to be desired, I didn't dislike it like many did. But gameplay wise, it's a masterpiece.

@NEStalgia
I’m not going to be able to give that essay as much attention as it deserves at the moment but, just on the larger point of physical resale keeping digital pricing up (and even physical) to compensate.
1) I wouldn’t trust companies to drop digital pricing even if physical disappeared, in face I think lower physical options can keep digital in check. And
2) It’s not quite so easy as every resale is a lost sale. Many who buy a secondhand game wouldn’t just buy it at full price in the absence of the resale market. They just wouldn’t buy it full stop. As such they may not grow to love the franchise, buying DLC and sequels in the future, etc. We see with subscription services; companies willing to basically give away games cheaply because people then might be a first day purchaser of DLC, sequels day 1, or spend on micro transactions.

I like the switch money back thing, but it’s very poor value and so I see it as quite cynical, pretending people are getting a cheap deal when they aren’t compared to physical. We absolutely need the ability to sell digital game keys within the Sony/MS/Ninty ecosystems to make digital competitive in my view.

@UnlimitedSevens
Good point about delisted games, but that only applies to games one didn’t care to buy right? If you’ve bought it you can always download it I think.

I’d be far more concerned about Sony retrospectively censoring games I own due to their new puritanical policies to be honest.

I’m not too worried about digital per se, but I’m am concerned about the drive to the subscription model. We’ll end up with cheaply made games by today’s standards, lots of micro transactions, or an ever creeping price rise until people are paying more than they would for individual games they want per year (Fine as long as we can keep buying individually, so hopefully that last.)

@NEStalgia

As a hardcore adherent to physical gaming, I really can't agree more with that tough mental transition to digital. Reading your points, it seems you have put a lot of thought in the matter and definitely going deep into the conflicts between digital and physical pricing structures.

I'll say this, one thing holding me back from digital is there is no way I'm paying the same price for digital when there are no physical distribution or manufacturing costs. I always felt it should be around 10% cheaper for digital to incentivize me to change. It's not about the money really though, it's my belief it is unethical to charge the same price. It's a weird hill to die on but there it is.

I understand charging less for digital would tick off retailers, so that's why it isn't done. That, or people will buy digital regardless so if there is demand, why charge less. Still, I want to see some meaningful incentive for me to switch.

I've never thought about a digital currency rewards program... That's a really interesting idea I think has some serious merit. Even just 5% back in PlayStation funny money would be enough for me. Even though you say 5% isn't enough, I think it would get some holdouts like me to convert. 5% is nothing, I agree, but I just want to see them compensate for the obvious deficit in value in digital games versus physical. I just want to see it acknowledged basically, if for no other reason to validate my firm belief digital is a rip-off as it stands.

@oldschool1987

Such a good game. Story was a mess, but gameplay was unmatched. Sounds like they are giving it away for peanuts. Put well over 250 hours into it.

Hope the MGS1 Remake rumours are true...

@UnlimitedSevens glad you enjoyed the game as well, it was my favourite platinum to get. I put about the same amount of hours into it lol.

I hope it's true as well, that and Silent Hill.

Buy Limbo: it's awesome!

@thefourfoldroot @UnlimitedSevens Sorry for the second incoming essay! I write it...and then realize now long it is

Yeah the pricing is the problem. How does one lower the price on digital without it being a big middle finger to the physical retailers? That's why they keep it propped up. If they undercut Amazon and Walmart on their own store, Amazon and Walmart revolt. They can't do it. But it creates this weird gap of paying more to get less. That $60 game margin is split between Sony, retailer, distributor, manufacturing & transportation/fuel losses...... Versus all pure profit minus server/internet costs. It should cost less....and yet it's obvious why it can't.

It worked out ok on PC precisely because there's competing storefronts driving competition, and no physical retailers to offend. If they go all digital they lose having a retail footprint entirely (as with PC.) And consoles don't make retailers any money, that comes from selling games and accessories. If there's no games to sell, they won't sell consoles, either. Imagine not seeing video games & systems in stores ever again?

That's why a kickback/rewards program is probably the only practical method. Yeah, Nintendo's is cynical and cheap. But hey, it's Nintendo, that's how they roll. They still charge full price for 10 year old games.... Sony may be creeping that way too. But I figure, Game Pass offers 10% off DLC and upto 20% off GP included games to subscribers. Nintendo offers a cynical 5% kickback. There's room in that space. PS+ members getting 20% discounts like the Best Buy GCU used to do would be nice. But retailers could still see that as undercutting. But kickbacks....15-20% of purchase going into getting a PSN Wallet code could work, like Nintendos but less sucky. Nintendo tried it with their "vouchers" (Buy 2 vouchers for select games we won't tell you about, and pay only $100 instead of $120 (but include $20 games in the list....) I see what they tried to do, but it was weird, awkward, very Nintendo, and weirdly time limited in the US. Or make it "store rewards" type perks based on on fixed thresholds. Get $40 digital PSN cards for every $200 you spend. It's a less combative way of saying "20% off." That way it doesn't look like a direct competing offer for a single game, but if you buy all your games digitally you still spend the same in the end as if it were cheaper, and it still encourages buying more and buying direct from Sony rather than used games, etc.

(continued.)
Long term, though, without storefront competition like PC has, there's still a dangerous monopoly factor that I'm not sure how to resolve.

Ironically the "Matrick Box" idea might have actually been the best solution of all, even though we mocked it. Maybe we did ourselves an injustice by laughing him off the stage and running to Sony's open arms. When you really think about it, a lot of these issues were addressed by that: Physical game purchases purchased digital licenses - that meant there was retail competition for digital codes, which is missing in the physical vs digital schism we have instead. Internet shortcomings were addressed by still having discs as install media, something missing from the other half of the physical/digital schism. Game sharing with multiple people was baked into the model (without swapping physical hardware.) Used sales weren't eliminated but also monetized some of that back to the producers (and used game stores would have had to adjust pricing to compensate.) PS4 was supposed to have that same system along with X1. Sony revised the plan at lightning speed backstage after MS melted down and made the "this is how you share" video. But maybe we screwed ourselves long-term for a short-term win. (Matrick's camera, OTOH....... )

@thefourfoldroot at launch, digitals are not double priced. And if it becomes old, it becomes cheaper than physical. I share with my brother, We can share PS plus, games, everything, can play online each other too. This is also very convenient for backwards compatibility with PS5. So digital for me.

@NEStalgia
I don’t see it as being nearly so complicated.
Just drop digital pricing to a fair level. Then shops will have to drop theirs to compete. If they can’t, fine. I don’t see why platform holders need to keep physical gaming specific stores happy. Consoles and physical games can be sold in supermarkets and online. Secondhand games can be sold in specialist outlets.

@mrbone
I guess you don’t live where I do. Physical games after just a year are a quarter of digital prices in the U.K.

@thefourfoldroot This is the rare occasion I'll defend the corporate side a little They really can't drop digital prices without a retailer revolt. No retailer will accept competing against the manufacturer undercutting them on their own store without dropping the vendor. And when retailers drop games they drop hardware, too....hardware makes almost no margin.

The retailers can't really drop prices on new games. The wholesale price is likely providing fairly thin but decent margins for when they sell them on slight sales already, and that's with manufacturing and distribution costs built in. Big supermarkets/discounters like Best Buy, Walmart, Target, etc don't make much money selling hardware (or cell phones.) It's sold almost at their wholesale cost. They sell the hardware to get you in the store to buy games and accessories which they do make margin on. But they have to keep that margin up. If they're not making reasonable margin on selling Playstation branded components, they're just going to drop Playstation as a vendor.

I also recall, and this was years ago, but dedicated game stores saying they directed customers toward XBox products because MS was more generous with the wholesale pricing and they made more profit on XBox games than PS games....so Sony plays a little stingy with retailer pricing already...or at least they did a few years back. I'm sure Nintendo is stingy too.

After the 80's US video games crash, keeping retailers happy at all costs became a big part of operating in the console space.

@NEStalgia
I still don’t understand. If, for example, Sony dropped digital prices, MS would have to follow suit. If the stores then dropped hardware, so what? More stock would just be allocated to supermarkets and online outlets.

Ultimately, physical stores can’t compete with the platform holder, what they can do currently is sell second hand games, which the platform holder can’t / won’t. And that’s actually where the largest profit margin is to be made for them.

@thefourfoldroot Supermarkets and online outlets would be the places dropping hardware, though. I don't mean GameStop/Game - they can't exist without the hardware and software. It's the other stores that'll just stock more toothpaste and Candy Crush gift cards. What I mean is that if PSN/MSStore/eShop started charging $50 for games they're selling to retailers at $60 and retailers are charging $68 for, retailers - all forms including supermarkets and Amazon - are just going to dump the product. Or will start pressuring for reduced wholesale pricing to make it up. And they'll threaten (or do) dropping hardware to do it. Especially the big ones. We saw what Walmart did with preorders. They don't take no for an answer.

I see your point, but I also see the console vendor's point. Getting into a price war with their own partners isn't going to benefit them. Not unless they get to the point they're really ok ending physical once and for all. And then they have to up the console prices to make selling hardware profitable for retailers. So they keep digital artificially high so that it matches the retailers going street price or above. Then no conflict with the retailers.

MS bypassed that to a solid degree with a very digitally focused ecosystem now and subscription model. With most of their clientele firmly in digital now, they can play looser with retail. PS and Nintendo are still very retail dependent. But even MS still charges RRP for digital -albeit with more avenues to deeper discounts and the like for subscribers to end-run around it.

@Mpquikster I don't think the industry sees it like that though. Nor do they present physical as a premium product. And I largely suspect they really don't want to. That encourages the pro-consumer reasons many like physical which is the last thing they want to do. To them, they are the same thing. On a disc or a code online, it's a license to play a game and nothing more. And that license has, the way they are presenting it, the same value no matter what media you buy it on. If they started presenting physical media as something other than just a license, then that's a rabbit hole that doesn't benefit their control of the product. And it also plays a factor in a lot of markets outside the primary US/UK/Western Europe markets.

I don't disagree with your point that it's justifiably premium, I agree. But I think from an industry point of view, they're "the same product." even if we know there's value to it. I'd love to see it if $70 meant for physical games, and digital would be $55, and that the price increase was all about used games, and manufacturing losses, etc. Because it really is.... But I also understand why they can't really price it that way, at least without massively shifting the whole sales strategy. if it could work the way you say, I'd be thrilled, don't get me wrong!

@NEStalgia
Except the platform holders can just dump all their hardware into Amazon distribution centres or sell from their own online stores. They are large enough. I don’t think getting hardware into peoples hands is that big a deal in all honesty.
I could very well see game stores turn into used games only.

@thefourfoldroot maybe. But if i were Sony, replacing 2 aisles in every major retail outlet with as seen on tv direct sales only seems like a pretty big downgrade in image.... I can kinda see why they'll appease restailers no matter the cost

Still, it they want everyone to go digital, they really need to sweeten the pot, and $70 for a code ain't the way to do it while physical is like $45

@thefourfoldroot maybe. But if i were Sony, replacing 2 aisles in every major retail outlet with as seen on tv direct sales only seems like a pretty big downgrade in image.... I can kinda see why they'll appease restailers no matter the cost

Still, it they want everyone to go digital, they really need to sweeten the pot, and $70 for a code ain't the way to do it while physical is like $45

One thing that really surprised me though is with ps4 it seemed like the plan was to force an all digital conversion in the future. Yet with ps5 it feels like they're doubling down on physical media, and sending the digital model out to die. The price point isn't compelling, it doesn't encourage mass adoption of digital the way series s does. They reportedly made few of them. And their pricing and policies seems to assume physical always. This is a remarkably unexpected move from where it looked to be going in the ps4 early days. Not sure what it means, but it's interesting.

@NEStalgia

I'm thinking I like your rewards program idea, specifically applying it to purchases as a whole, not specific games. That would probably be less offensive to retailers. Spend $100, get $10 in PSN store credit back. Something like that.

Sony has done promotions through PSN along these same lines before, even offering up to 20% back in credit for every $100 spent, but they were always limited time offers. So we know it's viable because it has been done on a smaller scale.

I'd be looking for more something along the lines of a persistent cash back program built into the system, not a limited promotion though. This would totally keep retailers off the scent so to speak. Sony could keep their consoles in the big name retailers and incentive the transfer to digital purchases.

Also, there is a PlayStation Rewards program if you have a Playstation Credit Card. It works on a 5% cash back system for video game purchases. I've gotten $40 in PSN credit through this program. So we see the systems are in place to implement something like this for everybody. Opening a new credit account for a rewards program certainly isn't for everyone and credit cards rewards programs are a bit of a different ballgame but we see that Sony is playing with different ideas to close the gap. Just need to be modified a bit.

Sony just needs to find a creative way to get people on board with digital, because I think there is going to be a critical mass threshold where digital sales will hit a ceiling, say 90% games sales being digital, and the physical gamer holdouts will either just stop purchasing any new games or walk away from the system entirely, like you did with PC. A minority for sure, but it's still a significant slice of lost sales if they don't adapt. That's money left on the table.

Also, while I'm on my soapbox, I think Sony needs to acknowledge how much of a cash cow physical gamers are for them. Im talking about the hardcore physical-only or die types. This is highly, highly anecdotal, but when you look at a hardcore physical gamer type person, I think the profile for that customer is someone older than the average age with much, much more discretionary income. These old-school people, while neurotic and opinionated, are very loyal to their respective ecosystems and have insane attach rates for games and accessories compared to average. Again, very anecdotal but I really believe this is true in a general way at least.

I think the attach rate for games last gen was around 7.5 games per console sold on average. Which while seemingly low was some kind of record at the time. Using myself as an example, I've purchased over 200 PS4 physical games this gen. That puts me at around 2500% higher than average attach rate if those numbers are still accurate. I've bought nearly every officially branded accessory and 4 PS4s. I shudder to think how much I've spent on Sony's products the last 10 years, well over $15,000 easily if we are including Sony sound systems and TVs. And I bet some of you on here spent even more.

I say all this to make the point capturing the purist collector/physical-only gamer and somehow seducing them to go digital will put Sony on money street. Those margins on digital games are much better for Sony. This is a difficult task admittedly, like I said collectors are purists and highly opinionated, know what they want, and will pay stupid sums of money to get it. They want physical games right now, but I think there is a middle ground to get them thinking about digital.

One thing that struck me as a revelation was, of all things, the Sega Genesis Mini. The way it displayed the digital games, let you reorder them on a "digital shelf" with original box art. Even let you display the front box art or the binding as options. Sure you still couldn't touch them, but they were "there" in a more tangible way that I thought was pure diabolical genius. Most probably couldn't care less, but I truly appreciated that extra touch and would gladly shell out big money for more digital games, if for nothing more than to be able to look at the cases displayed on that digital shelf. Weird, but true. Sony needs to co-opt these ideas and maybe integrate trophies in a more meaningful way as well, but that's a topic for another essay/rant haha.

@NEStalgia
I don’t really see why it’d be a step back. It’s not like there are special shops exclusively committed to selling Sony TVs, phones or audio equipment.

I also don’t see that they are really prioritising physical over digital. It might seem that way due to MS making an inter generational system as a cheap Gamepass device with lower settings, but that’s a completely different strategy. Sony aren’t offering a low powered digital device but just offering the option for those who game exclusively digital and want to save a bit of money. The fact only one in three consoles made was digital reflects that most people still want physical.

@UnlimitedSevens Yeah, I mean the credit based option definitely doesn't suffice, and it's also as stingy as Nintendo's....but stacked on top of a bigger, general rewards program, that could be a selling point still!

And that's a good point about the collectors. That's a very different breed, but it's definitely a "whale" market. I, too, don't want to think of what I've spent the past decade (especially if we include the Vitas ) not on Sony alone, but across all 3. I have spare consoles to use as garden stones, I guess? 300+ digital purchases just on XBox alone. (I shifted most of my multiplat digital purchases over there because they were much more clear on their long term intentions for that library than Sony, and watching how Sony's handling (or fumbling) BC, I'm glad I did! The consoles are so cheap they're practically free compared to the long term costs of a library, and I felt more at ease about digital being as safe as physical with their ecosystem. The writing was on the wall about Sony's thinking there. That's something Sony's really forgetting about as they try to nickel and dime the "generational transition" rather than being generous. )

@thefourfoldroot Marketing. Right now console companies have significant floor space in major retailers everywhere. That floor space is a big marketing presence that is invaluable to them. You don't have to go seeking them. They're right in front of you wherever you go reminding you of their presence and that "everybody else" is already participating. No fancy TV ad can replicate the marketing a retail presence offers.

Compete against the stores, get dropped, retreat to your own digital storefront, and everybody forgets you're there. You lose that marketing edge, and purchases become proactive instead of reactive. That's a significant decline for them. And in the face of the Big Data companies entering streaming and pushing it hard (and you can bet you'll see Luna ads, and not Playstation ads on Amazon now! Including front page, deal of the day, and everywhere else on there), that takes them out of looking like the "mainstream" option. They're not going to give up floor space easily. That's worth more than even the revenues of the all-digital ecosystem.

My point with the digital, though was that with the tone during PS4, I was expecting an all out push to move people digital this time. At one point it wasn't clear that 9th gen would have physical media at all - and I expected they'd introduce, at worst, a discless system that is MASSIVELY cheaper than the disc version to really incentivize the shift to digital, and to also cynically make the disc version harder to get so people "have to" buy discless because that's all thats there.

I'm glad it didn't work out that way, but I'm surprised they seem to be prioritizing physical by making disc more available and not much more expensive.

That said, the rumors say disc was supposed to be overpriced and sold at $600 and was only cut back to counter Series X's price. That sounds more Sony. Rather than cutting the price of digital to incentivize digital, raise the price of physical to outrageous sums to make the normal priced digital look like the only sane option. I would have believed that was their original plan, but then, they didn't make enough digital units for that to have been the plan.

It's a positive turn of events, but not the expected one.

21% is still not enough for Ghost of Tsushima how old is the game by now? 🙄🙄

@yunsung game discs are just economic waste imo

@-Sigma- are you dam serious right now? 🤬🤬🤬

@thefourfoldroot where I live physical games are in fact more expensive that the digital competitive prices....

But don't tell that to anyone else, they may get offended by that 🙄🙄

@huyi
Really? That’s incredibly unusual. Does that even include the used games market? And are you only talking about games as they are released.