PS4K Is Codenamed Neo, Has Upgraded Specs, Will Not Supplant Existing PS4 Systems

so it's not going to mess with my ability to play future games!

that's OK then because that's all i was bothered about

I think it's quite exciting for the future. Despite the PS4 doing well, I think Sony is right to be worried about keeping up with PCs. The big problem though is that they're going to push some gamers to PC because if they're going to have to regularly upgrade their system to keep up, they might has well go the extra yard and get into upgrading a PC rig instead of consoles.

This seems less like anew issue for consumers and more so developers. You are REQUIRED to ship two versions of a game. That's going to cause some costs to go up. And how will that work? Will there be two copies on the store shelf?

I doubt it'll work like the 3ds where it's one copy but the game adjusts based on the hardware, since two separate copies are shipped.

Also, where's my Neo Vita, Sony!?

@Wesker I've always seen the big benefit of consoles is cost and how long it lasts. But this upgrade and potential frequency could mean that in order to keep up with the best gaming experience, pc is just easier or God forbid cheaper. And why would devs release two versions of a game instead of an options menu on pc to change settings for hardware. I'm waiting for the dropped ball now. Sony hasn't fumbled massively this month yet.

Apart from ratchet and Clank but I've already got SCEE surrounded.

@BLPs That's what I mean.For quite a while now, I've been thinking that my next big investment will be a new PC. It seems to be easier than ever, and Steam offers everything PSN does. Microsoft seem to be thinking the same thing because Xbox exclusives are turning into PC games as well. I see PS4K as kind of a cash grab before the market gets to far away from console gaming.

@get2sammyb That's more in line with the 3ds. But to be honest I will wait and see. Plus who the hell has a 4K TV?

I'm still waiting for those ps1 megaman games Sony. For a company that has such great online (allegedly) Nintendo sure does a better job at releasing games and making them work when we never got them, and giving us US copies with no issues....Ah screw it. It's not like they give a toss XD

I still find this to be disappointing. I buy consoles so don't have to worry about upgrades. If this the new norm then I see no reason to but the latest consoles until the upgraded versions are released.

I am extremely dissapointed in Sony. If they do release this then I may just go back to my xbox. If microsoft do the same then I will stick with Nintendo although the new 3ds makes me wonder if they will head down upgradable consoles too.

I only had my ps4 since Christmas and it will soon be obsolete.

OMG can you imagine the childish arguments all of this is going to generate within PS4 sites/communities! ,Between people who have the 4k ps4 and people who can only afford to keep the current one? who needs pc elitists or xbox fanboys to invade PS websites with Smack talk. When the crying will be internal!

_{Language -Tasuki-}

Its pretty much as I envisioned and as I have repeatedly suggested in these articles. This could of course be Sony's answer to the Nintendo NX which is rumoured to be more powerful than the PS4 and trying to keep ahead of the game and no doubt MS will be releasing something too...

Developers are NOT shipping two versions of the game. A game is more than likely already made to at least 4k and higher frame rate potential than the PS4k (or NEO) can deliver. All it means is that when it releases, instead of the game reducing the resolution to say 1080/30, it could reduce down to 1440/30 or maybe lock the frame rate at 60fps instead. Developers can 'patch' existing games to run at higher resolution and/or frame rate. This won't be a 'massive' patch to add all the 'extra' pixels or extra frames in, the game already has that. We have seen 'patches' in the past increase resolution from 900p to 1080p - developers didn't have to 'add' that extra resolution in the patch, just change the 'output' settings effectively. They lock it down to get it to run smoothly internally but the information is already there.

All the Neo is effectively doing is allowing the developers a bit more 'freedom' in their choice of how to get a game to run smoothly. At the moment, it seems that consoles are locked down to 1080/60. If that struggles to run smoothly, the developers have 2 choices, reduce frame rate to 30fps OR reduce resolution output to 900p. This is why we see games like Uncharted 4 running at 1080/30 for its campaign and 900/60 for its MP. With a relatively simple patch, a NEO version could increase the frame rate to 1080/60 across both - maybe even 1440/60 and then 'upscale' to 4k (in similar ways to Quantum Break - Super Sampling Anti Aliasing).

This won't make the PS4 'Obsolete' - to be obsolete, it would mean that it no longer receives support or games and cannot play online with others. EVERY game released in the future for PS4 will run on BOTH Neo and base. I doubt we will even see a 'change' on boxes - it will still say PS4. At most I expect a new line at the back to say something along the lines of PS4k enabled with its resolution/frame rate listed.

I've seen crazy stuff happen so I will wait until official news is released before commenting too much but I think it's pretty obvious Sony wouldn't be stupid enough to screw over the 40 mil who have already bought into the PS4. But as always consumers display their ignorance with comments like the console will be obsolete when that's clearly not the case. You don't have to upgrade, you'll still be able to play the new God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn or whatever else just fine on your current PS4. A hardware refresh is not an issue, the PlayStation VR, that's another story because there is potential there to split the fanbase if Sony does something dumb like make the next mainline game in one of their big franchises, Say Gran Turismo, exclusive to that device. PSVR is what people should be concerned about, at least moreso than a hardware revision because hardware revisions have been happening for a long time now.

Now that this thing is somewhat real I want to say that I am somewhat angered since I gave 409 euros close to launch and waited because it was sold out and now my console seems already obsolete.

The way AAA games now ship with problems it seems sure that PS4.1 owners will get a sub-par and not so good performance. It is like PC gaming when if you have a 2 or 3 year old model you get not great performance. Developers simply won't care to optimize the games to make them work properly on older hardware after the first few months like what happens in PC. This whole thing will make problems for community forums and review sites. I rarely complain on the internet but Sony making a new console obsolete for no reason is clearly something I don't like (adding to the Vita situation and this VR nonsense in my opinion). I think that this won't be something their loyal customers will like.

I don't believe this "no games will be PS4.5 exclusive" stuff. When sales grow the older platform will be abandoned like when a console generation changes.

_{Language - get2sammyb}

So what happens to old games? Will they be patched with a 'Neo mode'?

Pre order for me, will already have the dough for an awsome PC rig well before then. October is perfect for me as well as i'll be getting my PC at the end of july'ish so i'll have a few month's to get the £350 together for the launch of "neo", happy day's I so hope this is true.

@belmont
The current PS4 won't be obsolete though.

@get2sammyb it changes something. I assume you and most other websites will start reviewing games only on the newer models. So let's say you review a game and say it runs mostly at 30 fps with a few drops here and there. People who have the older model now need to wonder wheter the game runs acceptably or not on their PS4

@get2sammyb Granted it's not completely obsolete as a gaming console, but it is obsolete to me because I want the best graphics I can get from console gaming, I don't want to play games that are inferior to there counterpart because Sony took the decision to release a new console 2 years into its life cycle.

Stupid Sony making me buy a new console.

@get2sammyb Its basically what I have said since news of this first broke. I have a 4K TV (not bragging - just a statement of fact) so this would of course be of interest to me.

@ShogunRok according to the article, its entirely up to the developers of those games. IF they want to patch them to make use of the new 'power' that is entirely up to them BUT every game from October must have 2 modes - a base mode (just like EVERY game now) and a NEO mode (higher resolution and/or frame rate ONLY). No Neo mode can be below the Base mode. This means that IF a game runs at 1080/60 on the base, the Neo mode cannot drop to 30fps for example just to run at native 4k - It would have to be locked to at least 60fps.

Also, I am expecting some bigger games will release patches to upgrade them, unless this is more complicated and whole games need to be created with that in mind, wouldn't know really, but surely market will expect that? New lease of life to games already on the shelf for a long time.

To think that this would "obsolete" the current PS4 is ludicrous, Sony would not screw over 40 million+ people like @Gamer83 said. They better not either otherwise i'll need to replace my kid's 2 ps4's as well Sony won't do that it'd screw so many people over.

It would help if they changed the aesthetic design of the PS4 neo aswell, so it feels like you're buying a brand new car, instead of just upgrading your old cars engine.

That's a relief. I genuinely considered cancelling my pre-order of the limited edition uncharted 4 PS4 & holding out for PS4K.
I do think a half step was needed as I imagine PS5 will be more powerful as a result.

Microsoft will have to respond. The Xbox one is already weaker than the PS4 & it's well documented. I'd be shocked if they don't put out one themselves.

@Pinkman That is YOUR Choice. IF you don't have a 4K TV, then this could be pointless for you. You won't see any benefit in the majority of games. A few may have 'better' frame rates but overall the games in essence will be identical - same story, same content, same options, same trophies, same MP/Co-op lobbies

I'm going to pick one up (hint mrs noisy Xmas) But I want 60fps - if companies start favouring 4k over 60fps I will spit my dummy out.

That needs to be the requirement.

Also the revised NEO will have tons of fighting games and new metal slug it will be next gen and it will be called the NEO GEO!

As long as devs don't see it as an excuse to get lazy regarding resolution and framerate of games running on the original PS4. I mean some might try to get a game looking shinier and running at 1080p @ 60fps on the new hardware, and letting the old hardware suffer for it.

@Gamer83 pretty much what you said. All i ask is that the PS4 versions run decently.

Might affect PSVR sale's, some of the people that have pre ordered the PSVR will feel (rightly or wrongly) that they have to have the PS4K and I doubt many will want to fork out £700-£800 or whatever it'll cost for both.

@Fight_Teza_Fight MS has been rumoured to be releasing a new console too. Its obviously not going to sell well when Sony and Nintendo release much more powerful consoles but I don't think theirs will be a XB1.5 so to speak. With its UWP/Win10 eco-system, it could release a whole new Xbox system - effectively Xbox4. Because of the 'eco-system', it could play XB360 and XB1 games and cross generationally too - similar in effect to the BC XB360 games currently on XB1 - the lobbies are already 'mixed' with XB360 and XB1 owners. Party Chat can already mix between other MS systems too. If its 'powerful' enough, it could also offer Oculus Rift support to rival Sony's PSVR - we have already seen a 'partnership' as OR sells with an XB1 controller.

Anyway enough about MS and its plans!

So this is not so bad. If there is same gpu only twice the cores.

Its better than I was afraid of But still Im afraid, what will happen, if on ps4k game will be so so playable? What about VR optimalization?

Lets see

@WebHead
Yeah, admittedly I think that could be a concern, especially for graphic heavy games like God of War. That's on Sony to make sure developers don't half a$$ the PS4.1 versions of their games. I'll be honest, I don't love this idea, but it's not nearly as bad as some people are making it out to be and considering I'm one of the more pessimistic people who comments on here that says a lot about the b*tching some people are doing. I think what we all need to accept is that the console industry is changing massively and even with Nintendo there is precedence for these half-steps now with the New 3DS. When Nintendo is doing stuff like that, you know change is on the way. I'm not totally comfortable with all of it, but it is what it is. I've said for a while I think this will be the last gen of 'traditional' console cycles and it looks like that will come to fruition. Whatever the next PlayStation and Xbox are when they get released, hopefully no later than Nov. 2019, they won't be a PS5 and Xbox 'Two.'

Being in IT, I can say with confidence that QA is the most expensive part of the development process. And what this does is effectively double the amount of testing required to pump out a ps4 game, which will make the creation of games more expensive. Since the market won't tolerate more expensive games and profit margins are already very competitive, the added cost comes out of developers (not publishers) bottom line. For that reason alone this is a disaster and the quality of games will suffer for it.

@themcnoisy haha NEO GEO. Nice!

@Gatatog I doubt any developer wants to let 40m+ people down and play 'broken' games. Just look at Uncharted 4 for example - that game looks incredible! That is the 'standard' by which base PS4 games will be. At most, the 'biggest' difference will be in 'frame-rate', which I will admit can change the way a game feels a bit - the other change will be purely cosmetic enhancement. If you have a 4K TV, then you will notice this - If not then you are probably playing the game at its 'best' looking anyway! Most PS4 games run at 1080p now so you aren't going to see any benefits of ANY resolution enhancement on a 1080p TV. ALL 4k does, is increase the 'finer' details - its NOT going to make 'enemies' suddenly appear that you couldn't see on a 1080p TV.

@Mega-Gazz Games are already developed at higher resolution and frame-rate to the version console owners get. Its not going to take significantly longer to 'test' a game because we now have a higher spec model. Developers will test on PS4 and any 'difficult areas will be looked at on the 'Neo'. No doubt any fixes would apply across the board for ALL versions because those areas would cause frame-rate drops on ALL systems. If it runs on the PS4 - it will definitely run on the Neo.

In music, if there is a mistake in the master - its present across all formats, CD, Vinyl, digital etc. To correct that they go back to the master and fix it 'before' going to press. Its the same with games. If there are clipping errors, then this are fixed on the master and that fixes them across ALL platforms.

So we should expect a significant bump in file sizes starting in October. Hello data caps.

@Bazza78
There's already bickering, that's what everybody uses the internet for.

@get2sammyb But how? Of course there will be pressure to make functional games. But I dont believe developers will be pushed to achieve top quality on ps4 if they will focus on top quality on ps4k.

On ps4k devs can use 2times more powerful gpu. Will they use it only for framerate, resolution or extra effects? Or will be PS4 punished more in terms of playability? I think it also depends on fact how many ps4k will be sold.

I am really fan of inovation. But Im really curious here.

update: Im long time in pc game scene and there is sometimes pain in the ass, when game is badly optimized and runs smoothly only on best hardware. Big advantage of consoles always was one hardware which forced developers to optimize games for. What will be now main goal? Optimize for ps4 and then add ps4k effects/resolution/fps? Or Optimize for ps4k and then cut down for ps4? If first option - its good. If second option - sonys in trouble

@BAMozzy I do have a 4k tv. And yes it is my choice but Sony gave me the choice. It shouldn't be an option for consoles that is after all why so many people have preferred console gaming over PC for so many years.

@get2sammyb Sorry about the language, I edited the post, please remove the comment.

On topic @Pinkman expressed better than me what I wanted to say about being obsolete. I want the best performance from my console. My favourite PS4 games are Metal Gear Solid 5, Blazblue, Dear or Alive. I could play those on my PS3 without spending 409 euros but I chose to buy PS4 to go for the best performance. Now the PS3 is starting to become obsolete since PS4 has an install base so no sub-par FF15 for PS3 users. Sometime down the line the same thing will happen and developers will ask to stop PS4.1 games since they simply have to move on. I don't think I explain it that well but you get my point. Also what @Gatatog said I think may be true.

@BLPs shipping two versions will probably come down to the NEO version having better resolution and maybe more stable framerate, not really a big deal for developers. I imagine most won't even try to max out the ps4k and will continue to max out the original version as that is what most people will own.

Since FFXV releases on September 30th, will it too get a Neo Mode edition?

@BAMozzy thank you someone that i can agree with

@Wesker Completely agree with your point about pushing people to PC games. The message is, within 2 years your console is obsolete. I know the argument that you can still run games on it but I now feel like a second tier player. I don't get the same experience as another gamer on the 1.5 gen. So if I can now expect my console to be obsolete in two or 2.5 years, why not buy PC and be in a continual upgrade process?

There is NO need to ship 2 versions of any game. The resolution is already there. The game is 'limited' to run at a certain resolution and frame rate by the 'engine' to get the best performance for the hardware. With the Neo, developers have a less 'restriction' and so can run the software at a higher resolution/frame-rate. Uncharted 4 (for example) could very easily be unlocked to run at a 'higher' resolution/frame rate with a simple patch. It won't need a 'massive' patch to put the extra pixels in or the extra frames. That information is already there!!

@Gamer83 heck I would be surprised if NX makes use of supplemental computing devices, like Nintendo patented.

Also Sony has 4ktvs to sell, and their best shot is a 4k ready PlayStation.

I apologize if this was already stated, but my only question is with the discs themselves. If the new game discs are to be shipped in both formats, would that mean any original discs I already own wouldn't be compatible with the new system?

Any news on the actual console design ? Is it just the basic ps4 shell? Or a sleeker version ? Guess we'll know at E3

Happy with everything there I put aside money for PSVR so will probably pick up the upgraded console as well.

@WebHead
I didn't even think about that regarding the Sony 4K tvs. We saw what they did with bluray, had a vested interest and it made sense to have PS3 use that format as a way to push it forward. This situation is obviously a bit different but I could see that being something of a factor. I still think PSVR might be the biggest reason for this revision, however.

Is there any point in getting a new PS4 if your TV can only support 1080p?

I don't expect seeing well optimized games like Arkham City on old ps4s if this gets out. If you ever read a Digital Foundry article, you know how many effort developers put on getting the most out of the existing hardware, tweaking LoD changes and fine tuning everything to bring the better posible experience on limited hardware. If they target two systems, I'm pretty sure they'll bring the best version to the stronger one and just make it barely run on the old one.

@ElkinFencer10 yes is suppose there is you'll still have better FPS and smoother gameplay

So the PS4K/Neo concept is making games with two hardware configurations (kind of a PC thing) because to stop supporting PS4 at this point would be suicidal for Sony. Some 3DS games work like this, so you could say Nintendo (re-)started this idea on dedicated gaming hardware. The only problem I see is that developers might aim for the Neo better performance and leave PS4 with whatever is left, which is already happening on Nintendo 3DS, where some games are unplayable on the original hardware, e.g., Hyrule Warriors Legends.

@get2sammyb A few questions -

Will it have the PSVR external box built in, or just work the same as the old one?
Will it have an Ultra Blu ray player?
Is that $399 price based off of the current $349 or the probable $299 by October? ie will it be $50 or $100 more than the older model?

October is weird, it misses being boxed with FFXV by days. I can't help but think after 10 years FFXV wouldn't be a great game to show off Neo and bundle it, especially with it being a multiplat. FFXV anime and movie streaming in 4k on Neo as well.

BTW nice Matrix comment.

Hey Mr. Know-thy-enemy @TheRealThanos you may as well read the spec rumour at least, we can discuss how it stacks up elsewhere.

Stick or twist? I stick.

@BAMozzy Didn't really know that the Xbox operates in that way. In that case a new console altogether would make sense to keep pace.

@Gamer83 Besides selling 4k TV Sony also just started its 4k streaming service called "Ultra" but it only works on Sony tvs. I think PS4k Ultra will have it work on all 4k tvs. And I think PS4k Ultra looks different enough from PS4k, unless Sony doesn't want to learn from WiiU or New 3DS about bad names. If PS4k was a replacement like the slim the name is fine, but if they are going to have the boxes sitting next to each other on the shelf, and one is $50-$100 more, they need the Ultra on the box to both justify the price and advertise their 4k streaming service.

what an optimistic comment thread. I do not see this ending well myself. I can't see it as win win. Either the early adopters will get screwed, or the Neo will be useless, or Sony will get hit hard, or devs will be expected to do even more for the same return. I guess I'm feeling pretty pessimistic about this.

Side note - I don't think most devs will have a problem getting games running on the old PS4 b/c most games these days are multiplat so they gave to run on the Xbox One anyway. Unless Xbox 1.5 matches the PS4K specs that is. I would expect in house exclusive like God of War to have the most noticeable differnce.

@Pinkman Right ?! And by the time the upgraded version comes out It will just be another 2 or 3 years until the next one is out ( ps5 ) . So might as well wait for it . Except that 3 years after that ps5.5 will be out . I will wait for that , But if I wait just a few more years after that then ps6 will be out .... This really might change everything and chase console owners to PC .

Was really hoping that if the PS4K turned out to be a reality that it would also come with UHD disc player installed . I guess that would bump the price up a bit higher though . I have been happy with my ps4 since the start , so no reason for me to upgrade . I have owned a 4k tv for about 15 months now so a UHD disc player probably would have made me make the leap .

I am pretty sure at the top of the code you could have "PS_MODE" as a variable then (and this is rather simplistically), you'd have "If PS_MODE="NEO" DO DRAW_DISTANCE=45, OUTPUT=4K, FPS=60 ELSE DRAW_DISTANCE=30, OUTPUT=1080p, FPS=30".

It will be like making a PC game, only instead of a combination of everything, dev's will have to worry about fixed configuration a) or fixed configuration B)

I guess the only choice is if you feel you simply must upgrade for whatever "benefits" there are to being a "Neo4K" user, but this for me is no different to releasing a slim version of a console, but rather than smaller and more efficient, less power consumption on the hardware, they've gave you more horsepower for software.

@DG42Velka All existing Discs, digital downloads etc will run on the 'Neo'. The Neo will have exactly the same operating software and 'coding' that the PS4 has meaning that ALL existing and future PS4 software will run on it. The Only 'real' change between the PS4 and the Neo is the GPU. Its still an AMD GPU though. The CPU and RAM looks like its been improved in terms of overall speed boosts - meaning it can make more computations per second and a transfer DATA quicker - needed for higher resolution/frame rates but essentially its just a more powerful PS4. Its not like this is PS5.

If people have a 1080p TV and/or on a tighter budget, then the PS4 is a great option. Just look at the quality of games we have already seen and likely to continue seeing. All the Neo will do is boost the 'performance' of those games and by the look of things upscale to 4k. If you have a 1080p TV it maybe 'pointless' to upgrade. Maybe a few games might run at 60fps as opposed to 30fps but its not stopping you play the same content. You can still make exactly the same choices, experience exactly the same story, play with exactly the same 'friends' - even if some have a base PS4 and some have the Neo.

@get2sammyb
4k tvs will never take off. look at 3d tvs. How much stuff is in 4k just look at normal tv & see the bulk of it isnt in HD. The specs for ps4 neo would struggle in 4k I have a really expensive high end gaming pc & it struggles. Blu ray was supposed to be the next great thing go uk shops & dvd still takes up most of the space. I could understand them releasing a boosted vr ps4 but this will just confuse people.

So similar in idea like the New 3DS, games will look a bit better and run a bit better, but no exclusive titles. That doesn't sound too bad.

You cant get a 40inch 4k TV for 300quid, hardly bank breaking is it!

get2sammyb said:
@Anguspuss Read the article: PS4K will mainly upscale. 4K televisions are very affordable at the moment and will become standard in a few years.

its not the cost its lack of content. here with Bt they will have 1 match a week in 4k hd/ultra hd.

I have 2 little kids & trust me peppa pig cant look better in 4k than it does in hd

I up for a vita 2.0. But Sony use sd cards this time and make it at a low cost like 199.99 and include a 8gb sd card along with a great launch line up and you can beat Nintendo in there own fleid

Very disappointed.... why then buying consoles if they upgrade them mid-term?

Why also getting consoles at launch when you can wait a couple of years getting the new version and having then a bigger gaming choice?
This is also more pain to developers.... and generally looks like a potential backfire to Sony. What is important for lifespan sales, we have seen this gen, is the console's initial momentum... this is going all against that...

@Anguspuss 4K TV's are selling faster and in higher quantities than 1080p. It is estimated that by 2018, 50% of US households will own a 4K TV. In a few years it will be the minimum standard of TV you can buy 'new' - I expect that you could buy older 1080p models.

Sony are launching (or have launched) its 4K streaming service to compete with Netflix, Amazon etc. BT have a 4k TV Box and Sky have just launched its own 4K (capable) boxes with content due to launch later this year. Its signed a deal with Sony actually to bring 4K Sony Pictures (Ghostbusters..) first to Sky...

Its very different to 3D TV's and that content. With those, you had to wear 'glasses'. With 4k you don't. Almost all new cameras can record in 4k now so you can actually watch your own content in 4k too. Its not like you will need specialist 3D cameras - like 3D required, most digital cameras are already capable of recording 4K - some even in 8K now!!

@get2sammyb I'm quite looking forward to this and the cpu boost looks just as significant as the one to the gpu. From what I've read about any games the cpu seems to be a limiting factor on PS4

im from uk BAMozzy with crap internet speeds that struggle with HD

@get2sammyb Thanks, I actually just finished reading the GB article.

I think this part is weird - "The documents we've received note that the HDD in the NEO is the same as that in the original PlayStation 4," - surely all new P4K would have 1TB, no? My guess is the price increase will come down to inclusion of a UHD blu ray player or not. Since those things are so expensive I'm guessing not, and they'll just promote streaming.

My guess is they really didn't want this news out until after they sold a whole bunch of those $400 Uncharted 4 bundles. I'm not sure what the next big game is after U4 so E3 would be a fine time. NMS is a week after E3, and it's not U4 or FFXV anyway. (Almost related, I think Nintendo is waiting until after Starfox next week to announce NX. It's the last big Wii U Exclusive.)

Of course now what do I do? I was leaning towards waiting for an FFXV bundle anyway, but my birthday is in July, an dI Want to play U4 and R&C. Guess I'll at least wait until E3 b/c its still all rumours, beleivable or not.

I have a PS4 for convenience and exclusives, and my PC for the eye candy. I'd rather spend that $400 on a new PC component than a PS4 with some bumped up specs. This didn't work well for Nintendo's New 3DS, but then again, Sony is taking the correct path by not locking features or games behind the upgraded model. Stupid Nintendo!

The few of you saying you're being forced to purchase an additional system to upgrade are being a little ridiculous. I built my first gaming PC in January with a Maxwell GPU, when Pascal-based GPUs are coming out this Summer. Am I pissed? No. I'm not planning to upgrade until Volta anyway (which will probably launch around the time PS5 does).

Rip Off,And i've already been ripped off with the Vanilla.Should of made it upgradable -At least make the 4k upgradable for goodness sake.Who thinks it going to be 60fps all the way now? Yeah right,Upscaled 30fps,yo..

@Napples These are all rumors, despite the headlines saying "news." We don't know if "NEO" will have features the PS4 doesn't, but it probably WILL because that's how companies sell systems. And I think the New 3DS was handled swimmingly; low price, substantial hardware upgrade, enticing exclusive experiences. Happy to own one.

Neo, eh? Back in the day, Sony touted their Emotion Engine; now they've moved on to the Emotionless Engine.

Will old non Neo mode games work on the new console? Will devs even want to spend time on a Neo patch for a games that not selling well today? No more need to work hard to get the best optimization you can for the original PS4 now when you can just NEO it for the new console.
Its all still a very bad idea. Its also NOT a upgrade its a whole new console. Upgrades do not cost as much as a whole new console. In this case $50 more! In PC I can buy a upgrade say a video card but it's maybe 25% of original price of the whole PC.

Underwhelming specs imo, all this will do is alienate a chunk of the user base, and they've just lost one PSVR sale as I bet you'll end up needing it for some PSVR games to hit the required fps - as they say PS4 games, wonder if they'll word it so it doesn't include PSVR games.

I've already had one PS4 break and had to buy another due to their trash warranty so no thanks. Real shame I was looking forward to PSVR, but I'm going to get a decent gaming PC instead and look at Oculus I think.

Hopefully it won't come to market and they realise its a bad idea - but if the rumour mill is this strong I'm sure it is. Shame, should have just saved it and released a PS5 in 2018.

My concern is that now developers won't worry so much about optimizing their game for the basic PS4.

@Anguspuss I am from the UK too! I would check with BT (or your internet provider) to see when better internet speeds are coming because they should be! I used to live in a very tiny remote village but even that's now had an upgrade to its Internet speeds. It could be just your internet provider or the package you are on. You don't need 'that' fast for HD - I believe 5Mbps is the minimum - 25Mbps for Ultra HD is the recommended - for streaming but as this is just an PS4, online speeds are not going to affect your gaming anymore than it does now. If you struggle to play MP now, then you will struggle with the 'Neo' - exactly the same!
The ONLY difference is that the Neo can run games at a higher resolution and/or frame rate. If you can't watch HD streaming on your PS4, then you can't watch HD OR 4k on Neo. If you can play MP on your PS4, then you can play it on your Neo. The ONLY difference is how the game is output to your TV - not how it communicates with online servers.

EVERYTHING IS GOING TO BE ALRIGHT

No need to worry until some one says PS4K master race I playing Uncharted 4 at 60fps only peons are still stuck at 30pfs on PS4. Just to make your day...

So, is the PS4k being codenamed "Neo" just another taunting from Sony regarding Crash Bandicoot?

no matter how they spin... the requirement to submit both base & neo version means there will be disparity.... F*ck, I can't believe this is happening...
wait until u see a small line "video captured on PS4K on all PS4 games advertisement....

_{Language - get2sammyb}

Was going to buy a second PS4, but now, have to wait.

@Anguspuss I agree 4k is not major step. Like 3D (I admit I was early adopter of 3D on pc and on ps3 and really enjoyed it). But its already seen on pc, where theres no so much difference in gpu tech demos and possibilities like 10 years back. I believe VR could be breakthrough. Maybe its right time now.

@Biolan I wanted to preorder VR but now Im waiting. Because I bought PS4 primarily for racing games and mainly for upcoming gran turismo. Now Im waiting if I will buy ps4k or psvr for better experience. I really dont know. So waiting sony....waiting...not buying anything now....

Ah well after giving up on my PC rig this generation round and deciding to go all console it looks like I may have well just carried on upgrading and replacing my pc. It's a s**tty move by Sony no matter what way it's looked at and I for one will proudly say the original PS4 is the last console Sony will be getting me to buy. I'll stick with PC gaming. As for PS exclusives, I did without uncharted before this generation, I'll do without again. It's no biggie really. Especially when PS exclusives become a thing of the past as the games industry realise that they can reach other platforms with little/ no alteration to the game codes and minimal costs to them..

Jeezus, the comments. Remind me not to sleep in.

Well, if the leak is accurate, I won't be needing this "Neo" PS4, so I'm cool. My main worry is squashed.

This move, if it's actually going to happen, might spell the death of home consoles as we know them. I feel like this is just the next step towards a complete pc dominated platform for gaming on the big screen. In the future we will have whatever Nintendo is doing, mobile and a gaming console/pc with upgradable components....and that doesn't really sound that bad. The transition might get a bit ugly though, with multiple versions of the same console.

This feels like a rumour someone made in 5 minutes after reading what Sony said. Love how Giant Bomb says "Multiple sources" yet they dont show anyone or say something reliable about it, NOT EVEN A DAMN NEOGAF POST OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

A rumour without any source ? Is that it ? Journalism these days.

You can always wait for better tech years down the line or you can buy it and have it now. Wait two years and thats two years you can not use the product. Something better will always come along in the future thats just have tech works. Sony is not forcing anyone to buy this if you are happy with your current product then do that. If you want to upgrade now you have the choice.

@dryrain Have a feeling that developers will force the upgrade on you, sure it will run on the PS4 but at what cost ? "Plays better with PS4.5", i can see it happening any time now.

Imagine all games optimized for 1080p/30-60fps for the NEO, what about the Normal PS4 ? It will run, but nobody knows how, and guess what, reviewers will use the new tech so they wont know how it runs in the old hardware.

It will be like the 3DS vs N3DS situation, the difference is that time was a much easier price to swallow ($199) instead of this ($399-$449)

I fully expect to buy one of these, but only when I find myself upgrading my TV. So that basically means I have a choice now between a new TV or PSVR towards the tail end of the year, which is a bit of a toughie.

@MadAussieBloke Could probably skip PS4 and just wait for everything to get remastered or re-remastered for PS5 if this gen is anything to go on.

I am unsure of the point of this upgrade, Sony have the market share this gen and seem to be coasting so why would they risk their position by doing something that is going to annoy a lot of its user base? The upgrade itself seems relatively moderate, the CPU doesn't seem to have gotten too much of a boost and the memory bandwidth increase isn't going to lead to much of a boost in performance. Only the GPU seems to be notably more powerful, but it certainly isn't anywhere near a 4K capable system (I'd be surprised if it manages 1080p/60 on current games).

All I see happening is Sony causing some of its customers to be wary of purchasing their system should one be released next gen (although this kind of looks like their plan might be to release a revised system every few years - i.e. shorten the console cycle from what we are used to). If Sony are worried about PCs being much more powerful then all this will do is cause people to switch over to PC gaming since it will end up being cheaper. I really hope this idea fails as it did with the N3DS or it would certainly see me move to solely playing on the PC.

On the other hand I do look forward to the Digital Foundry comparisons where Playstation users mock Playstation users for getting a worse experience.

I have no issue with this upgrade if it is for 4k tv viewing and to have improved performance of ps4 games. The higher spec hardware just needs to provide smooth frame rates at 30 fps or 60fps and at 1080p. The ps5 can be where vast graphic improvements are introduced in 2018 or 2019 and with full ps4 backward compatibility.

So will this ps4.5 ship with a small 500GB hdd?

Well, I honestly can't see the point in releasing a stopgap like this. We all know the PS4 and (especially) the XBO were already way more underpowered than they should have been at launch, but I can't see how useful it might be to add other horsepower to an existing console. It simply won't be used because devs will have to make their games run on the older model as well, and this is exactly what was holding games back at the beginning of this generation, when almost all major games were cross-gen (thus not utilizing the newer consoles to their fullest potential).
So who wins in this situation? Probably only Sony since it can sell a revised console from 2 years ago charging at least 100 €/$ more than what it costs now. Other than that, I can't see it changing anything in the current gaming landscape.

@themcnoisy "I want 60fps - if companies start favouring 4k over 60fps I will spit my dummy out."

Aaaaaaand....THIS. How can Sony push the move towards 4K when the current consoles struggle with 1080/60 fps? Frame rate should always be the priority for a smooth experience, but obviously the average guy will buy the most visually stunning game on offering.

The problem I'm seeing is that devs will probably worry less about optimization in the 'vanilla' PS4. CD Project, for example, may not have been so adamant in optimizing Witcher 3 for the PS4, and just focus on the Neo version, leaving the PS4 version will many many framerate hiccups and the like. The hardware jump isn't THAT big, of course, and I would love it if they would just make it like a 1080/30 PS4 mode and 1080/60 PSNeo mode - that would be perfect.

But I fear that the vanilla versions will look half-baked and almost broken when compared to the Neo versions. I hope I'm wrong, but it's a scenario we may have to face.

@BAMozzy
That's not entirely true. As @Mega-Gazz said, they'll need two builds on every game they develop. The old PS4 build and the PS4Neo build with better graphics which will require both testing (framerates, bugs and all). Unless they add nothing to the Neo and just slap what they did on the OldPS4, then they may not need more testing. Even so, they'll still test it to be sure.

@get2sammyb I feel like it should've have been able to hit 4K native, I would much rather get something stronger as opposed to a console that has 4K potential but will be probably just hit a solid 1080 60FPS.

I have a strong feeling that's what gonna happen with this PS4 4K.

@whywai88 agree with that a lot. I don't see this being a good thing, the way devs code, none 4K owners will either get a down port or just have to upgrade.

Unless Sony create's a magical easy API, I don't see devs wanting to code for both resolutions.

@Gamer83 With cheaper consoles you could put out 2 consoles. The old PS4 for 299 good for the standard consumers with a smaller budget. And for the more hardcore Gamer maybe I have no idea what is best i have no idea. But I know I want one.

'if' true then I hope this don't f**k-up all the hard work SONY has done making the PS4 the must have console this Gen :-/ I would rather it just have a 4K Blu-ray drive really and I would be happy with that and would buy the PS5 day 1 to but if consoles are going to be upgraded every 2 or so years then I won't buy a console day 1 no more. Oh well.

@wittypixel How does it work on a PC do they have 50 different builds for a pc I don't think so. How many different PC's are out there I think almost no PC is the same.

@Flaming_Kaiser yup and none of them are highly optimized, which is the advantage consoles had over PC's. That may become a problem on consoles now.

hmmmm... still skeptical. Only time will tell if Developers will treat everyone equally, or if we will end up with a New3ds situation and a noticeably inferior Hyrule Warriors on Vanilla handhelds etc.

(T-T )

@get2sammyb 1000 bucks isn't expensive? lol

I'm a little on the fence regarding this. Doubt is natural at this point. Though I'm starting to lean more towards being positive about it. It's going to boil down to how they present this officially. For example, are there any other good reasons for existing owners to upgrade that we yet don't know of? It's a possibility, but what could that be?

@BAMozzy so tell me, how will MP function with the fps difference? I'm **** now, how will I fair against somebody with double the frame rate?

@Splatburst No they won't - they just use the same build and instruct the engine to output one at a certain resolution/frame rate and the other at a higher resolution and/or frame rate!!

@reddog Personally I would think that MP would be locked across both. Frame rate isn't going to make enemies appear 'slower' on 30fps to those at 60fps. All it does it make things feel a bit smoother. At 30fps, we are talking a frame every 3.333 hundredths of a second. You can have more advantage by setting your TV to game mode over those that just plug and play...

@BAMozzy
There's the ps4 build and the Ps4K build with better graphics. Again you're confusing what I meant by build. There's the old PS4 version and the better graphics PS4K version. There's a difference between the two versions which are the graphics/resolutions/framerates. They will test both versions if it's running on the framerate they are aiming. If not, they'll adjust the PS4K graphics down if they put too much detail on its graphics.

Sony President: (at E3 2016) And now, we have a surprise for you guys ...
Journalists & Gamers: Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight ....

@Nickolaidas A leak of Capcomical proportions!

I absolutely hate this and Sony if it's real.

It might not sound as bad as it may have originally, but I still don't like it.

@Splatburst What you seem to be confusing is the fact the PS4k is NOT a separate console and with a different operating system/coding. The build of the game will be identical, The only differences will be one that tells the engine to output and one set of parameters and the other to output at different set. EVERY game could very easily be set to output at higher resolutions or frame rates now! If you wanted to play Bloodborne (for example) at 60fps, the developers could lock it at that via a very small patch BUT to run smoothly, the resolution would take a hit. If you wanted to play SW:BF at 1080p, they could easily set the output to that BUT you would lose the 60fps - the cosing is already there in the build! All future games need is a line of code (for example) that basically says if PS4,Output to 1080/30, Is PS4K output to 1440/30 (or whatever setting they opt for)

@TomKongPhooey also remember, that Microsoft are now pretty much offering all of their XBOX One exclusives to PC too, which means you'll get all of those.

Not being salty here, but really - what PS4 exclusives could you not live without? I enjoyed Infamous but it was hardly amazing, and I know I'll be burnt at the stake but the Uncharted collection was not great imo, Order 1886 was pretty but a very shallow experience. Sure Uncharted 4 looks good, but those "amazing Sony exclusives" are few and far between.

I still think the BIG bonus to the new PS4 will be the VR experience. No Man's Sky dev said that getting it running well enough on VR would be tough... well I'm going to predict right here that there will be exclusive PSVR games for PS4k simply because they can't get certain things to run on the regular console - regardless of what they say.

@get2sammyb but do you think the PS4 4K will be able to actually play game at 4K? I'm thinking most games will just be upscaled if you look at how even ps4 struggles to hit 1080p natively.

@BAMozzy
Jeez, here we go again. I'm in no way saying they are making the same game from the ground up for the PS4K build. By the time you increase the "graphics", the "details", the " resolution", or the "framerate" of the PS4K build, the devs will need to test if they put too much "graphics detail" for the PS4K that the framerate will take a hit. You are mainly mentioning about resolution and framerate here. Are you sure the devs won't add more details graphically on the PS4K build? Like effects? Or just maybe the graphical details they are aiming?

Here's a scenario for the devs since you were citing PC games the last time we tackled this issue:

The PS4 is running on low settings (for PC), we (devs) can't just set the PS4K to run in Ultra settings (with better effects like tressfx hair in tomb raider) and be done with it. We will test it first if we set the graphics on Ultra. Unacceptable framerate dip on ultra? Change the graphics setting to medium. Too stable and too solid? Maybe push the graphics to high settings. High settings is a solid 30fps. If we aim for 60fps, some areas goes dip to 50fps after thorough testing which is acceptable. Okay, let's settle for high settings on the PS4K since it's the best output we can get after testing it on ultra, medium and high."

You see, you can't just amp up the graphics on the PS4K just because the old PS4 build works. You have to consider how much graphic details you will increase for the PS4K build since there is also a limitation on how much the PS4K can handle. I'm not talking about only adjusting resolutions and framerates here. I'm also adding details to the game to look better and maximize the hardware capabilities of the the PS4K.

There's also a problem/bug that may (or may not) arise through coding or glitch if you are developing a game for machines that differ on specs even if they have the same architecture or OS.

ATTENTION

Okay, we've really got to start watching the bad language now. Sammy's already issued a warning, so consider this the second and last. Anyone who swears from here on out is going to take a break I'm afraid!

Shouldn't be a problem. PC, smartphones and tablets all have different specs of the same game running and been doing it for donkey years. EG. Clash of clans, dead nation runs on galaxy s2 all the way up to galaxy s7. I can't wait to trade in my ps4 to a faster model

An 'upgradeable' console that is in fact a whole new console just says to me, 'go buy a PC'.