@Rudy_Manchego@Ralizah I've been thinking of playing snatcher actually, will be emulated though, mega CD does run on the raspberry pi. Shame it doesn't get a re release, I think id be interested in trying some of kojimas non metal gear games
@Rudy_Manchego I think I will too. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention with your excellent review.
I've only owned two 8bitdo controllers - the SN30 and M30. While the former is an impressive replica of an SNES pad (I even compared it side-by-side with an actual SNES controller I own), the buttons gummed up disturbingly quickly. The M30 has been grand, though: not a single issue with it since I bought it, and I use it multiple times a week. I only paid $29.99 for it at launch, but it feels premium.
On the topic of emulation, and this is directed at @ralphdibny as well... I've really come around to it. Some emulators are good enough that you can actually achieve superior performance than you could on the original hardware (PCSX2 and Dolphin come to mind), and it's a great way to experience games that would otherwise be largely lost to time due to their rarity. I've actually taken to ripping some of my PS2 discs so that I can play them at higher resolutions/with anti-aliasing on my PC. It's very cool.
I know the topic is mixed into the same murky waters as software piracy, but I've never, for the life of me, been able to see who is being hurt when someone downloads some obscure, decades out-of-print game that would otherwise cost hundreds of dollars to experience on the real hardware.
@Ralizah Fellow ripper here, I don’t see much issue given the copies are mine. The waters do get murkier but I draw the line at lazy piracy of games that I could just as easily buy. PCSX2 and Dolphin have come leaps and bounds recently and I actually made use of emulation a lot with my Tekken binge as I put the first 3 on my Vita and ripped Tag Tournament and 4 onto PCSX2 after my eyes bled. I might delve into it a bit when I eventually write a Tekken roundup.
@Ralizah@nessisonett Going off topic I guess and I know emulation is a non-topic on the site but my view point is that I will always try and purchase an old game legally if I can and I will also backup and use ROMS of games that I own. For example, I have a paid copy of Castlevania:SOTN on my Xbox One - I also have an emulator version on my Pi. However if a game is out of print and I can no longer support the developer or publisher than I have accepted ROMs before. Snatcher is a case in point - allow me to buy it and I will but otherwise this game is lost to everyone. I bought an Evercade and have a good few cartridges because the rights holders get the money.
I really wish game preservation was more of a priority for game companies. I know rights issues get murky as time goes on but ultimately, if all the publishers got together and put a paid library of retro games out there, I'd subscribe day one.
Now I may be an idiot, but there's one thing I am not sir, and that sir, is an idiot
I think I must be the most idiosyncratic pirate ever. I'll happily engage in the lazy pirating but I'm also a sucker for games and collecting in general, so I'll almost always buy any new re release/collection/port/remaster of something I like. Digital and physical that is.
That being said, by storing data I do feel like one day I may be doing somebody a service by being able to provide the data. Much like how the BBC has an open request for people to submit old TV programs that they may have recorded at home because the then not forward thinking BBC just taped over all their master recordings!
But yeah I don't feel bad about it. I've given Sony, Nintendo, Sega etc thousands of pounds of my money and I struggle to store all the junk I've bought from them. Sometimes emulating just gives you a better quality game experience too over the lazy poorly performing collection (that I've inevitably bought anyway - such as mega drive collection on switch) that has been officially released.
I do basically live in a museum, I have like 9 book shelves of varying sizes (as well as home made extensions) full of books, dvds, blu rays, games, comics etc. Begrudgingly so in some cases too. I have all of star trek, bought and paid for and I'm rewatching Enterprise only to find all the DVDs I've paid hard cash for have disintegrated so much that they are barely playable -_-
@Kidfried I completely agree. Nintendo were really on to a good thing with the Virtual Console and I was really really expecting the Switch to carry that over and allow people to keep developing their libraries, particularly since the hardware was up to a point that you could run pretty much all previous gen titles . When they ditched it in favour of the far inferior Online service and countless re-releases at high cost, it really disappointed me.
Now I may be an idiot, but there's one thing I am not sir, and that sir, is an idiot
@Kidfried Sony had a Virtual Console in the form of the PS Classics line, and they completely abandoned it with the PS4. One of the few ways in which I'd say that console was a massive downgrade from the PS3.
Anyway, aside from the limited availability BS, I don't see how re-releasing Mario 64 on different consoles is really any different than a company, say, re-releasing a movie on various media formats over the years. Although I do agree that the complete absence of the Virtual Console on Switch sucks, just as Sony's abandonment of the PS Classics line in favor of a handful of "remastered" PS2 games sucks.
@ralphdibny@Rudy_Manchego Most of the "pirates" I know are people who are just massive gaming enthusiasts and don't want to wait years or decades for classics to re-release on the modern hardware they prefer to play games on. Hell, speaking personally, I've had a complete library of ROMs and ISOs for a ton of old systems over the years... and I've also purchased hundreds of older games via Virtual Console, Playstation Classics, and various retro collections over the years, even though I technically already have access to nearly all of them.
Now, this isn't to say there's no harm to be had with piracy (anyone who remembers how common piracy of new Nintendo DS titles was after people learned about R4 cards and whatnot can attest to that; tons of people bought the console and then refused to support actual releases on the system), but, in general, it's a symptom of a problem or deficiency. People tend to pirate when the official channels for game distribution are sub-standard in some way. As Gabe Newell famously said, "Piracy is almost always a service problem[.]"
It is absolutely a shame the industry at large doesn't maintain more interest in game preservation, though. Some games are only preserved BECAUSE they're illegally distributed. Companies should be taking advantage of the demand for older games instead of leaving countless masterpieces drifting in a legal twilight world.
What I've always found interesting are people who think there's some great evil in pirating old games that won't be making anybody any money anyway, but will happily buy all their modern games used from Gamestop or Ebay in order to save five bucks. I almost never buy modern games used primarily because I feel like there's a level of harm in paying Joe Mac from Pennsylvania for [insert modern game] versus the actual publisher who relies on sales from the game to stay afloat in the first place. Every copy of a modern, accessible game that is recirculated via second-hand market transactions is arguably a lost sale. Which isn't to say that people shouldn't buy games used if that's what they want to do, but it has always struck me how, in terms of almost all pertinent moral issues involved, a person like that is almost indistinguishable from a person who just downloads everything they want to play from torrents on the internet. Granted, the former person still pays money, but that money ends up in the accounts of random people with no connection to the industry.
@nessisonett Another reason I sometimes emulate my old games versus playing them on the OG hardware I bought them for is because it's easier to take screenshots of them. I probably should have done this with Digital Devil Saga 2, but I wanted to take advantage of my save file from the first game on my PS2 memory card.
Currently Playing: Resident Evil Village: Gold Edition
@Ralizah I think you've pretty much hit the nail on the head with regards to most of your points.
It really isn't a morality thing for me, if I wanna play a game on PS4 and it's cheap price entices me then I'll buy it there, same for Switch and Xbox. If I want a boxed copy of Snakes Revenge on NES then I'll turn to eBay. If I just wanna play the game I'll play it on the pi. It really is just about what you as a person want to play, how you want to play it and how much, if anything, you are willing to pay for it.
An example of where I turned to the black market over legitimate means is NowTV in the UK, I was subbed to it so I could watch all my American shows but the quality was rubbish (sub-HD), I had something like 30 days to watch the show before it went offline and some other BS. I ended up torrenting the shows at the same time as paying for now TV for a while.
All that said, I am looking forward to playing my new in box copy of Mario 3d all stars when it arrives 😅 despite owning all of the games and some of them in more than one iteration...
I just realised I sounded quite militant in my piracy there... I will clarify that I buy a lot of games.
I will say that I'm more inclined to play a game I paid for too, especially if it was full price. And I don't torrent anything more recent than two generations ago because I have all the consoles that can still play those more recent games and I can buy them.
But I do have some of those full sets of ROMs downloaded but I doubt I'll get around to playing anywhere near the amount of paid games that I own that I'll play. I normally have a flick through them if I'm playing a series and I can't find a particular game on a modern platform. Good to have for posterity!
So, I've been playing Shin Megami Tensei: Digital Devil Saga 2 on the PS2 for about twenty hours or so, and so far...
POSITIVES
The mantra grid itself is significantly improved in this game. So, in the Digital Devil Saga games, your characters turn into demons who can weaken and terrify other demons, and then consume them. You consume demons to level up a 'mantra' the character has equipped, which, when fully leveled up, allows the character it's equipped to learn a new set of skills. Normally, in an SMT game, you would negotiate with demons and then fuse them together, which become stronger demons that learn new skills. DDS/DDS2 lack this Pokemon-esque setup and are structured like typical, linear JRPGs, so this system is meant to allow for the learning of progressively more powerful skills. Whereas before, your characters were just unlocking nodes on separate charts to learn new skills. this time all of your character work across similar similar grids. Secret mantras are locked up throughout the grid, and are only unlocked when all of the mantras around them have been unlocked. The primary ingenious addition to this sequel was making it where multiple characters can work together to unlock secret mantras by each partially clearing normal mantras around them. If character A unlocks two mantras, character B unlocks two different mantras, and character C unlocks the final couple of mantras surrounding the secret one, their collective effort will culminate in the secret mantra being unlocked for everyone. Sometimes these mantras just unlock stat bonuses for the characters, but other times they allow for the learning of unique new skills that wouldn't have been available otherwise.
This game is significantly more story-driven than the original so far, which is a plus for me. I felt like DDS1 kind of spun its narrative wheels in order to pad out a story where nothing much of consequence happens, because almost all actual plot development seems to have been reserved for this game.
The setting - a hellish daylight apocalypse where the sun's light turns people into stone, and the last remaining humans are holed up and desperately fighting for survival against people infected with a demonic virus - is evocative, and a different sort of desolate from the lonelier Junkyard world of the first game. It reminds me a bit of Nocturne's vortex world, actually.
The voice acting continues to be excellent for a PS2 JRPG from a small-ish developer.
The SMT-themed shmup easter egg in the underground city is a very cute addition. I suck at it, though. I hope this becomes available to access at any time once I complete the game.
MIXED
Karma rings are OK, I guess. I kind of like the customizability, but they don't really seem to change the dynamic of the game very much.
Same with this new mechanic where, at peak solar energy, your character enter some weird half-demon/half-human hybrid state. Atlus could have designed something interesting around this, but I found that my characters either one-shotted all the enemy demons with ease, or missed all of their attacks and left themselves vulnerable. Didn't add much to the game, IMO.
The weird humor in this game. Granted, there's weird humor in all MegaTen games I've played to date, and I generally appreciate the way it balances out the frequently grim plot elements in these games, but it gets a bit much in this game. For example, there's a deeply weird sequence where you're locked in a cage in a 'human farm' by a powerful demon who survives on minced up human flesh. The characters surmise that they can weaken him by tricking him into eating demon meat instead. So, you sneak through the facility, feed a demon body into a meat grinder, and then substitute his human flesh meal with a demon flesh meal. This inflicts severe gastrointestinal distress on the demon, which allows you to kill him. Throughout the fight, he makes constant, agonized references to "not being able to hold it in much longer," which... yeah. It's a very weird set-up that goes on for a lot longer than it probably should. There are other moments throughout the game that kind of betray the tone the story is establishing as well.
This entry feels a bit... on rails and rushed compared to the last game. On the upside, this leads to a lack of confusion about where to go or what to do next to advance the plot in the game, which was occasionally a bit of an issue in the original. On the other hand, there's next to no downtime: you're constantly being shuffed off from one dungeon or setpiece to the next, with very little time to engage in side activities or collect your bearings. Something is ALWAYS happening in DDS2.
The storytelling could be better. There's an interesting early-2000s philosophical sci-fi tale here, but I feel like the game tosses out terminology and weird concepts without really explaining itself well. Maybe there's a reason for that (perhaps the player is supposed to be mystified by what was supposed to be Nirvana alongside the other characters?), but it feels like lost potential.
The music is still very hit-or-miss for me, which is unusual for an Atlus game. I think it's overall better than the first game's OST, but I strongly preferred that game's random battle music.
NEGATIVES
While this also happened some in the first game, one thing I'm really not appreciating is how frequently characters disappear from your party for plot reasons. It's bad enough in a typical JRPG where it just means having to re-orient your battle strategies around a new party member, but, as mentioned, party members work in tandem in this game to unlock secret mantras throughout the grid, and, moreover, it's disconcerting when you invest a significant amount of macca into learning a powerful mantra, only for that character to disappear for hours at a time, or perhaps even permanently (still haven't seen certain crucial party members again).
The dungeons suck in this game, compared to the original. They're WAY too long and are lacking in the more engaging, puzzle-like design of some of the dungeons from the original. Thematically, they're uninteresting as well. It's just hours of running down endless corridors between cutscenes.
This isn't a complaint unique to this entry, but I still wish it'd allow me to explore the overworld like in mainline SMT games.
A lot of new characters are introduced in this entry, but they're mostly pretty forgettable and/or are disposed of too quickly. The only interesting personalities remain the people you met in the first game.
If the game has side-quests, then I haven't noticed them. Just another way in which this game feels sort of rushed.
I'm enjoying it so far, but it feels like it substitutes one set of design drawbacks for another. I can't help but feel like Digital Devil Saga would have been better off as one somewhat longer game versus two shorter games that don't feel well-balanced.
Talk about an impressions piece @Ralizah! You've been playing a lot more then I thought you had!
I will say: when I first start a MegaTen game, I get immediately absorbed and the first 20-ish hours, at least, goes by in a flash. I blitzed all 100 hours of IV: Apocalypse in a couple of weeks, actually. Thanks to the easy portability of the 3DS, I was basically living and breathing that game when I wasn't actively working or sleeping.
I know you're past the factory at least... But unfortunately all the main plot points/markers I can think of are pretty spoilery so saying twenty or so hours unfortunately doesn't help me pinpoint where you are exactly 😅
I believe I stopped playing around when I first arrived at the airport. It's not long after the long story sequence where you fight heat and learn about Serph apparently being some sort of mad scientist when he was a real human.
There's some character development and some really good stuff that happens later on in this... But there's just something about the first, the character development the cast takes through it and the whole set up of the first game with the junkyard that I personally quite like.
The first game's setting felt a lot more fully-realized. Probably because I had time to actually poke around it instead of being rushed through the game (I feel like I'm speed-running it or something, despite not going out of my way to only do story-critical content).
One of the best things about DDS 1 & 2 is the voice cast. I think they're pretty much perfect for the casting. Very little in the way of weak performances.
Cielo can be a bit much, but it's honestly difficult to think of a PS2 game with better voice work.
There is?! I've played the game through twice and didn't know that!
Yeah, after the first initial set of dungeons, I think. Talk to the kid in the underground city and he'll talk about playing some sort of game he found. That's when you can access it.
My guess would be in that it's partially due to the original writer, Yu Godai, leaving? The Quantum Devil Saga novel seems to follow the events of the first game fairly closely but looking at the summary it's towards the end of the first game and the second where the novels seems to deviate more and more. It doesn't help only two volumes have been officially translated so it's not 100% there...
Maybe. This IS a really common problem with anime as well when they catch up with the original manga. It's almost always better to wait for the original writer to finish their vision than to make something up on the fly.
I actually own that first novel as well, although I haven't gotten around to reading it yet.
The dungeons are pretty pants, the party members shifting around is really annoying, the new characters (Not sorry in the slightest Roland) aren't as good and there are pretty much no side quests beyond the bonus bosses (Which there aren't as many of compared to the first).
Oh, are there bonus bosses? I should look them up so I don't miss out on them, if it's not too late.
Yeah, Roland is... whatever (his last stand against Meganada is pretty cool; I don't accept that Argilla is gone, though; I just won't), and I'm not really feeling Fred. Goofy child sidekicks just don't do it for me. That old woman working for the Karma Society seemed like she might be an interesting villain until Angel straight up smokes her not too awful long into the game, which was kind of a shame.
Oh and what'd you think of the Jack Frost quiz encounters?
Well, he shows up, I answer a question or two, inevitably get one wrong pretty quickly (because who actually remembers all this stuff?!), and that's it. Maybe I should use a guide to get through his questioning. Is there a way to trigger the encounter, or is it pure chance when he shows up?
The airport's a pretty crummy dungeon and there's one annoying boss (At least he was to me when I first played it) later on in the airport but you're actually like 3/4 of the way through the game.
I'm a little surprised you're at the airport in just over twenty hours to be honest as I swear it took me forever! Though that might just be the dungeons being a bit boring in design...
You know the really weird thing? It's 20 hours checks time 22 hours, and that even includes at least a few hours spent grinding for macca overall. Just how short is this game?
I quite like Cielo myself but I can understand... I thought his moments were pretty good in the sequel. As for a ps2 game with better voicework? I'm partial to Odin Sphere's voicework, the shakespearean melodrama really works for me though I think that's a bit more depending on your taste or not.
The only other ps2 game I think of with a stellar voice cast and voice work is probably Metal Gear Solid 3 (And 2 I guess)... But that's a tentpole title franchise
Yeah, I guess the voice acting in Final Fantasy XII was pretty excellent as well, but yeah, clearly DDS1+2 was standing with the big boys at the time in this regard. In that respect, I do have to wonder why Nocturne DIDN'T have voice work. Maybe it would have been too much for the data limitations of a PS2 game?
Ooooh... I have played it. I completely forgot it existed. Apologies it's been a good 6 years or so since I've played DDS2. I was terrible at it too 😅
Did you play it on normal or hard difficulty? Normal is a bit too easy for me so far. If I play it again, I'm doing the harder difficulty. I guess I just expect Nocturne-level difficulty on normal for older MegaTen games. I'll never, ever play that game on hard mode, because even Normal mode can be brutal.
I will say: I'm at least happy with how well-distributed save points are throughout the dungeons.
I think you've missed a few of the bonus bosses already? If you're playing on Hard there's the super boss of Satan who is just as evil as a certain super boss from the first game.
The Archangels are what you've (possibly) missed so far.
All the other bosses are in the final dungeon so don't look it up til you're there... Including a certain He-Ho!
Gotcha. Might give those bosses a miss, then, and just try to beat the ones in the last dungeon.
I unfortunately remember so much useless information it's untrue
It's mostly luck I think? I believe he shows up more regularly in the final dungeon though... you need to answer all 100 of he-ho'ing questions to be able to face him though as one of the bonus bosses
Oh wow. Haha. I'm impressed you remember all that stuff. I don't, so I'll be using a guide. It's good to hear he shows up more in the final dungeon, though.
Does my party composition settle into something stable eventually? I'm finding it very hard to part with macca for a powerful mantra when a character might just up and vanish at the end of a dungeon.
Also, it's kind of weird having Serph and Sera in the same party considering they're nearly identical.
Currently Playing: Resident Evil Village: Gold Edition
@RogerRoger, I remembered reading about that game in Nintendo Power back in the day, but hadn't heard anything about it since. Interesting write up, I'd always wondered what Sonic would be like as an RPG (really weird that SEGA would choose to partner with a western developer for it though, rather than a fellow Japanese developer. I wonder what the thought process was for that).
Currently Playing:
Switch - Blade Strangers
PS4 - Kingdom Hearts III, Tetris Effect (VR)
I've thought about picking this up over the years, but I kept getting scared off by the almost universally negative reception from RPG AND Sega fans I talked to. Maybe it's because, as you point out, the game is sort of basic and casual, but I don't see how that should be a problem: virtually every Mario RPG I've played to date has been very mechanically basic, but the combination of Nintendo charm and rudimentary RPG game design makes them work well and possess a sort of unique identity. In a better world, this could have been Sonic's Super Mario RPG moment, opening the floodgates to a miniature industry of casual hedgehog-themed RPGs.
What elements were taken from the Archie Comics line, by the way?
Currently Playing: Resident Evil Village: Gold Edition
@RogerRoger I liked the review - especially the behind the scenes shenanigans regarding EA. At first I thought, what there was a Sonic RPG but on reflection... of course Sega tried a Sonic RPG! I don't think simplicity is a downside to a game as long as it is engaging and knows how to make it work which it sounds like this does.
Now I may be an idiot, but there's one thing I am not sir, and that sir, is an idiot
@RogerRoger really nice review of sonic chronicles. It's a game I've always wanted to try out but just never got round to! I think I had it in my eBay watch list earlier this year but couldn't get it for cheap enough. Are the touch controls compulsory out of interest? Or can everything be done by buttons too? I just wonder if it is a game better played via emulation on a TV. Somehow I doubt it would be on the Wii U VC, at least you can set the monitor portrait on those releases and use the touchscreen on the game pad...
I really like the sonic supporting cast, especially when it was more varied. They sort of just started adding hedgehogs for a while though (Shadow - cool, Silver - OK, Classic Sonic - can we have a different animal please lol). I wonder if Blaze the Cat was the last non hedgehog character introduced into the main-ish line games that sort of-ish stuck around. Except the custom character of sonic forces I suppose.
I actually really like (liked; haven't read the new comics) the Archie comics and the derivative Saturday morning cartoon that's based on it. It's amazing how much narrative complexity and emotional depth they wrangled out of a universe centered around a blue hedgehog. I collected the comics as a kid, and have thought about tracking down whatever volumes exist of it now. Although it was serialized almost as far back as I can remember, so I imagine reading all of it is likely a Herculean feat!
And yeah, Digital Devil Saga 2... it's still a solid, interesting game, overall, like the first was, but Atlus is one of my all-time favorite game developers, so anything that's not A+ work is going to disappoint me a little.
Currently Playing: Resident Evil Village: Gold Edition
@Ralizah I have finally finished doom 64! It's pretty good and I had a read of your review too!
One of the highlights for me was definitely the music. It was brilliant, just really scary. I know they had to tone down the music because of the lack of memory on the N64 cartridge but what they came up with, though vastly different, was excellent. I know I mentioned the constant senses I had when playing doom 1 and 2, this one felt more like Doom 1 where I had the constant sense of dread or indeed "doom". It was very scary and the music really helped with that, especially the track that @RogerRoger mentioned in their reply, with what sounded like screaming babies was terrifying, in a good way.
I think also, the level design is really tight. It's almost like they played on the limitations of the N64 and created stuff where you had these overly complex puzzles all set in a small area because of the lack of memory on the N64 cartridges. It's a good thing though, often limitations or what might seem like an overly restrictive brief can focus a person's artwork into a better product. Free reign can often allow work to dawdle into unremarkability.
That is what plays on the weaknesses but of course the N64 was better in a lot of ways which resulted in the improvements that you mentioned in sprite detail, scripted level modification and the ability for levels to have rooms/pathways over the top of other rooms. I didn't actually realise this was a limitation of the original Doom until a week or two ago when I was reading about the Build engine used for Duke Nukem 3D and how it offered rooms on top of other rooms as a feature.
I'm not sure if I prefer the new designs for the villains, whoever designed the new heathenous pain elementals is probably a heathen themselves! But all in all, I liked the designs, I just don't think I necessarily preferred them over the originals.
Generally I'm not sure if I have a favourite out of the 3 games, they are all really good. Doom will always have a soft spot because it's the one I played as a kid, well at least what was included in the shareware version on PC. It wasn't until I had the GBA version that I found out I had only played a third/quarter of the whole game on PC! Doom 2 was just crazy and I loved it for it and Doom 64 was just a really good tightly designed evolution of the previous 2 games. As a trilogy though, they work really well.
Did you ever get around to the Final Doom megawads out of interest? I can't really remember if you said you did or not. Anyway, I think a short break is in order before I move onto doom 3. Hopefully I can get through that and the expansions before I replay Doom 2016 for game club!
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