Topic: The Movie Thread

@Ralizah I hear you. Not every movie has to have character development and an emotional journey of self discovery or personal growth and development.

It’s funny that you felt WW84 got too excessive with the visual hoopla, because as I agree with you that the midway section you referenced does make Diana’s journey a more interesting one (despite the overly convenient logic of why it’s occurring and how it is reversed) I felt that even after she’s flying around doing grandiose things, that in the end she didn’t defeat Lord with a flying kick to the head or smashing a bullet and volleying it right back at him. She had to make him confess and see the error of his ways and get the world to revoke their wishes. Sure, it came across slightly cheesy and a little nonsensical, but I can respect the director for trying a different approach, even if it didn’t quite work.

But the whole section at the beginning where she’s this little girl who is clearly the best Amazon warrior at what... age 11, that’s where it delves into the ‘this hero dropped from the sky in badass form, ready to go’. By the way, what was the point of that whole opening sequence anyways? Learning the value of honesty?

And I definitely need to go back and watch the ending credits. Not sure why I didn’t think to do that.

I was kinda thinking that Coco felt more authentic to me too after I was done watching The Book Of Life. Which is kinda odd as far as I'm aware Book Of Life is a mexican production @zupertramp unlike Coco and Pixar.

Ahh I was just going to repost it seperately but you've now seen it @Ralizah 😅

The artsyle was really the only thing the film had going for me tbh Ral. I do agree with you there that most cgi cartoons/film go for a very safe artstyle so I did appreciate that about The Book Of Life at the very least.

Also Ron Perlman as Xibalba was pretty good too cus it's Ron fudging Perlman

@Ralizah I know, what a grouch right? The Book of Life was trying way too hard to be, like, hip or something. That's it's biggest problem in my opinion. Plus, a bullfighter? Really?

And Coco, well, in reality I didn't dislike it that much the first time I saw it. It has its moments to be sure but I also live in an area where it's extremely popular and, well, I just don't think it's that good. Also the more you watch it the more you realize it doesn't make much sense. And believe me, I've seen it plenty.

Haven't seen Onward (actually didn't even know it was Pixar) and Soul really flew under the radar for me. It was just all the sudden out. I'd like to watch it but, like you, I haven't enjoyed a Pixar film in a good while. Toy Story 3 was probably the last good one.

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy yeah if I'd had to guess beforehand I would have thought the Disney movie was going to be the least authentic of the two but somehow it's way better at capturing the culture without being too much of an over the top stereotype. In my humble opinion.

@Ralizah @Th3solution Without wanting to get too serious about all this, I do agree (providing I've read the flow of the conversation correctly) that there's been an overt attempt to move from "character struggles with own flaws" and more towards "character struggles against society's flaws" which has created a modern trend of self-centred, overpowered protagonists. It's unfortunately made more obvious when said protagonist is a member of a historically underrepresented gender or minority group, and I'm wholeheartedly for correcting those mistakes and redressing the balance. I just don't think a bunch of seemingly perfect, my-way-or-the-highway glass avatars are the way to get an audience on-side. Using the example I have seen and can therefore speak about, I think Rey would've been a much more effective hero for Disney's new Star Wars trilogy if she'd been given a little more introspective context. Her best scenes were often the (rare) quiet moments where she was allowed to express her wonder at the galaxy around her, and her uncertainty about her place in it. Many folks could relate to those character beats, myself included.

I think all this is the result of powerful people's frustrations at not getting their own way, or at living in a society that doesn't always share their beliefs. That's a very inelegant generalisation which I instantly regret using, but it conveys the core of my point in a direct way. I'm not saying that all Hollywood executives are petty, petulant people with flags to wave, and the best filmmakers have always had something personal to say in their products, but... oh, I don't know. I'm in danger of typing myself in circles here. I just feel that we're in danger of losing good stories and good characters in the rush to generate "meaning" and influence.

As always, television is lightyears ahead of cinema. I'm currently watching Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. and it's a huge eye-opener, because it's packed with fantastic female characters who have drive and determination irrespective of their gender. I wish I wasn't even noticing it, and I shouldn't, but after the MCU struggled to balance out its bunch of fratbro heroes (sending Black Widow into everybody else's movies as they slowly plodded towards Captain Marvel) it's honestly refreshing.

Knuckles said it best. Yes, that Knuckles and no, this isn't a joke; it's actually a really good point.

Sorry for the rant. I'll brace myself for Mulan, but will give it a shot someday.

@RogerRoger @Th3solution @Ralizah Interesting stuff from all of you. Definitely some things I hadn't realized or noticed. At least not consciously. Seems like Captain Marvel falls into this category as well. Her only "flaw" was society (or Jude Law) was holding her back.

Anyway, thanks I guess. Have to keep an eye out for what seems like an obvious trend now that it's been brought up.

The movies I watched over the long Christmas weekend.

A Christmas Story (TNT) - Annual re-watch as part of the family Christmas festivities. Just a nice bit of nostalgia. Interestingly, I recently learned that they accidentally gave Peter Billingsly (the actor who played Ralphie) actual chewing tobacco during the scene where he was fantasizing about using the air rifle to save his family from burglars. It made him really sick, which caused the director to chew out the prop guy. They redid the scene with crushed up raisins and let Billingsly keep the gun.

Elf (DVD) - Another annual re-watch. It's always good fun, and believe it or not features one of my favorite romances in movies. I remember when it was brand new & a modern Christmas classic, but it's culturally starting to show it's age with the CRT TVs & VCR reference (it makes me feel old, lol).

Halloween (Blu-Ray) - Yes, you read that right. I actually bought this to watch around the titular holiday, but never got around to it until now (better late than never). It's actually a pretty slow film & not nearly as bloody as I expected, but the soundtrack was great at keeping me at the edge of my seat the entire time, and it was cool how the camera work made it feel like you were the one stalking the film's characters (and sometimes you were in that perspective!).

National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation (DVD) - Another traditional viewing. Great mix of comedy & heartwarming moments, with many classic scenes.

The Polar Express (DVD) - Another traditional watch. I always really like this one for the sense of adventure & somewhat more actiony feel, which is different for a Christmas movie. The CGI is definitely starting to show it's age, though.

The Warrior Queen (Prime Video) - Got one of those pillow/tablet stand hybrids for the big day, so decided to curl up & watch something on the small screen, which ended up being this schlocky 80's sword & sandal film. The wife of the Roman emperor shows up to Pompeii and is apparently upset with how the city's female slaves are being treated and decides to help them out, or something (it really doesn't seem to have much plot going on, as it's really just an excuse for some exploitative nudity, softcore sex/rape scenes, and poor action sequences). It does end up with some sort of Gladiatorial games that involve fatal renditions of arm wrestling, frisbee (no, seriously), and a pretty inventive sequence involving the combatants swinging on ropes over a death pit and trying to knock each other into it (though it doesn't have near the budget to really do the concept justice). Naturally it ends with much stock footage of erupting volcanoes, and people running around collapsing sets with shaky cam (and where all the bad guys get theirs). Not quite as terrible as the Deathstalker films.

Disney & Pixar's Soul (Disney Plus): 10/10 - I loved the movie was well worth the wait! As much as I want a sequel, I realize this was a one off.

DC's Wonder Woman 1984 (HBO Max): 7/10 - I was entertained enough to be happy about a 3rd movie being made, but definitely recognize there were plot holes and flaws.

We Can Be Heroes (NetFlix): 8/10 - I enjoyed it despite all of the cheesiness and cringe, but it helps that I'm a fan of Rodriguez's Sky Kids series plus the Sharkboy and Lavagirl film.

Watched Queen and Slim the other night. It was just bad. Not sure why it has received so much praise. It was just so poorly executed.

I went into it knowing nothing more than it had the Get Out/Fifteen Million Merits guy and after the film's initial set up I was like okay, this is shaping up to be a really good movie. Down to earth characters. Gritty, grounded, compelling premise... I was on board.

Then it abruptly turned into a cartoon. I like legitimately don't see who finds this type of drivel powerful or moving. Ugh. I read all the glowing reviews on rotten tomatoes and it's like I watched a completely different movie.

@RogerRoger Well said, and interesting thoughts added on to @Ralizah ‘s.
As an aside, and to add to @zupertramp ‘s comment, I really appreciate the interesting perspective that the forum users bring to the table when discussing movies, games, books, and current events. It’s what keeps me coming back everyday. I love seeing things through other people’s perspectives. I’ll never forget Ral’s review of The Last Jedi. It’s a movie we all like to dump on, but Ral had one of the most insightful takes on the film I’ve ever heard and it really helped me enjoy the film more. And I just find delight in breaking down and interpreting art with people that are so much more savvy and intuitive than me. I learn a lot from everyone.

@zupertramp I dunno, I quite liked it even if it went a bit mad towards the end. It’s essentially Thelma and Louise.

@Ralizah the remake of aladdin is OK but it's just really deflating in a weird way. Even the music sounds like somebody has just resequenced the songs using samples on Cubase or something. I did tap my feet a few times but I felt ashamed for doing so 😂

I quite like the cartoon of BatB too actually. I haven't seen the remake all the way through yet though. I actually worked on it as an extra for a few days during the song she sings around the town about being a contrary person or something, I forget the exact words. That's the only bit I've seen naturally as I tried to spot myself in it (i failed to find myself btw!).

@nessisonett Yeah it's just I expect all the characters from an early 90s outlaw, road movie to be caricatures and I fully expect the scenes to be contrived but idk, maybe it's because I'm older (than when I saw Thelma and Louise) and I just expect more from my storytellers but I just thought this subject deserved better.

There were some poignant bits no doubt and again, the first act is outstanding. Also Daniel Kaluuya is great as usual but oh man, side characters in horror movies make more believable decisions than these two.

Anyway didn't mean to crap on anyone's tastes, it's just one of those films where I'm left feeling like I'm taking crazy pills for not liking it.

@ralphdibny Oh wow, that's quite neat. Even if it's only as an extra, you're immortalized as a part of film history. Very cool!

@zupertramp Queen and Slim should have been good. I was quite into it after the start of the film, and a Thelma and Louise-style drama about modern racism could have been quite poignant. It kind of lost the plot when the ridiculous pimp uncle entered the scene, though, and the script was a bit lacking more broadly.

I didn't dislike it like you did, but it could have been better than it was. Missed opportunity.

@Th3solution Most of the regulars I speak to on these forums, including yourself, are great at holding their own in a conversation. It makes having these discussions a lot of fun. I'm glad I was able to help you appreciate The Last Jedi a bit more.

@RR529 Yeah, Halloween is practically bloodless, and virtually all of the violence happens off-screen or in shadowy environments where you can barely make anything out. It's much more Hitchcock than it is slasher, despite its reputation for kickstarting the growth of that horror subgenre. Easily one of my favorite horror films of all time.

I actually watched A Christmas Story for the first time a few days ago with my family, and was pretty happy with it. Its portrayal of childhood is one of the better ones I've seen in film, and it has a deep level of respect and understanding for its child characters. I love how its characters are allowed to be petty and sympathetic in turns, much as you'd find with real people.

@RogerRoger I do think there is some truth to people in the entertainment industry growing increasingly frustrated with their inability to more explicitly dictate the broader discourse of society. Especially in America after the election, when, like, every person who has ever starred in a movie came out to tell people how to vote, and, honestly, I think it just caused a lot of people to vote the other way out of spite. You could watch American TV shows and movies the season afterward and feel Hollywood screenwriters collectively working out their feelings of grief and frustration in the projects they were working on, lol. This was perhaps most explicitly captured in the season of American Horror Story made after the election, which ends with a Hillary Clinton-coded character shooting an alt-right cult leader in the head.

@Ralizah I'm definitely more visible in other films and TV shows thankfully though! I genuinely couldn't find myself in BatB so it's a bit of a write off in terms of immortalisation haha. They film loads of "Hollywood" movies over here around London!

@ralphdibny Wow, how many movies have you been in?

@Ralizah I couldn't say off the top of my head tbh, I've been doing it semi regularly since like 2011, the first films I worked on were war horse and captain America. The film I'm most visible in is the first Kingsman film and the TV show I've been most visible in was an episode of EastEnders (British soap) that was shown in January 2019 (I think?).

@RR529 Funny, I haven't seen Elf in a while and I guess I didn't realize it was really that dated. It is a good one though.

@Ralizah That makes me feel a little better.

@ralphdibny Sounds cool. I'm jealous.

@zupertramp ahh don't be! It's a completely mixed bag. It's really long hours in addition to travel time, you're often treated like cattle (but not always), but you normally get fed breakfast and lunch and it can be a good laugh if you're working with good people. Also it's not easy to just do by itself as a job for a living due to unreliability and last minute job cancellations. I like it though because I'm interested in film and TV so it's nice to work on stuff I'm interested in or on the same jobs as actors that I'm a fan of. But for every interesting job like Captain America, you'll get a rubbish job like King Arthur! At least it's a job though! I'm not sure what it's like in the US but it's quite easy to get into over here, basically just sign up over the internet! Might be worth a look into it you are interested. Do a bit of research on the agencies though to make sure they are legitimate, I've heard of people being scammed.

@ralphdibny I can see how it might be one of those things that's a tad dull after the initial bout of excitement wears off.

Still, sounds like something to experience. I could let the wife hold down a real job while I occasionally go stand around waiting to be told what to do on movie sets. Probably not too different from the military there. We just need to move to Georgia or something. I'll run it by her lol.