Topic: Team [404 - Team Name Not Found] Deliberation Station

I'm a huge Dynasty Warriors fan. Having played most of the games.

Even now I have Warriors All Stars looking at me to play this week. One of the problems with DW is the games are always scored badly on Metacritic / review sites. Some of the criticism is fair - most is actually well out of line. You often hear reviewers saying they are too easy, that's an absolute load of BS if I'm being honest and if the reviewers admitted to playing on Easy mode then we would all call them out.

That said some are better than others I will start with the Gundam series.

Dynasty Warriors: Gundam Omega Force - Existing
Dynasty Warriors: Gundam 2 Omega Force - Not Important
Dynasty Warriors: Gundam 3 Omega Force - Important

The problem with using the DW model with Gundam is its nothing like the Anime. You dont have flying sections as they are brawlers. However they have incorporated the stories amazingly well and the amount of Mechs and pilots is staggering.

Gundam Warriors 1 was a great introduction but suffers technically. 2 is very similar to 1 and doesn't push the boat out. Gundam Warriors 3 really upped the bar using cel shaded graphics, new gameplay elements, more characters and well written stories with amazing voice overs. It's my favourite Musuo game ever made. It has depth at higher difficulties and the animations are awe inspiring.

Most of the reviews on the other hand are a complete joke. Eurogamers review (8/10) is the most in line with how it actually is. Love it.

@themcnoisy Good to know you are a Dynasty Warriors fan. I was dreading doing research on those. 😅
So it sounds like as for the Gundam series, #3 is the most important one, with the first more akin to existing and maybe the second not important.

Yeah, as far as Skyrim, I want to say that despite the PS3 version being a bit of a technical flub out of the gate until they patched the weird gradually increasing save file glitch, the game was just huge in every single way. It’s had so many re-releases it’s ridiculous, including on the Switch and PSVR — Which amazingly for a game that was released in 2011, it is still relevant on current consoles. I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if a PS5 version is re-released.
I was just looking at the NintendoLife article released this week on the top 50 highest user rated list (due to recent discussion over on the Chit Chat thread) and I think Skyrim is #17, ahead of exclusives like New Super Mario Bros U Deluxe, Pokémon Lets Go Pikachu, and Arms. The longevity of Skyrim is just crazy. And even though I read reports of crashes and save corruptions on PS3, I was fortunate to never have a problem and I played that game to death on my PS3. My save file was gradually growing, but fortunately they fixed that before it affected me. So I know we might have people come on and challenge that the PS3 version was so bad that it should be dinged down for it, I am of the mindset that it was still perfectly playable, it was eventually patched and ran fine in the long run, and the game was a technical achievement of epic proportions even with its flaws. It sold millions, it won countless GOTY awards, and affected open world game development for years to come. Very Important.

..............

And now since I have a little more time, here’s more thoughts on Enslaved: Odyssey of the West —
This game was not very influential because it didn’t sell particularly well (800,000 copies) and has become more of a cult classic for enthusiasts. Much like it’s predecessor Heavenly Sword, Ninja Theory showed here how great they are at video game development but how poorly they are at marketing and selling their products. Ironically the under performance of Enslaved not only killed the plans for its sequel, but since the team took a break from developing the Heavenly Sword sequel to make Enslaved, this game may have contributed to the death of the Heavenly Sword sequel and franchise. With Microsoft now at the helm of Ninja Theory, who knows what will happen to the oft rumored return to that world. But I digress .... we’re not in the “H’s” yet. 😄
Critically, the game was well received. (Metacritic 80)
In technical achievement, I would say the game is a solid performer but not particularly an innovation. It did borrow from the multiple third person action games of its era (notably God of War, etc)
Now artistically, Enslaved is a joy to behold, with a mix of a futuristic and fantasy world, with a wonderful use of color. Characters are a crazy and interesting mix. The gameplay is smooth with a mix of platforming and action combat. The story is well told and the protagonists are very well characterized and memorable to this day, even many years after I played it.
So despite my personal opinion of the game being so high, the best I can honestly say for it would be ‘important’ because of its poor sales. I honestly think that even if they would have come up with a less awkward title, it could have helped the game get a little more attention. And I think Namco Bandi sent the game out to fail with the lack of marketing, which is no fault of the game.

If you guys want any input on: FEAR/2/3, EyePet/& Friends, The Eye of Judgment or even EA Sports Active (yep, fat me did video game exercise!) - give me a shout.

@KALofKRYPTON It would be good to have some input on eyepet and friends. Thank you.

@themcnoisy Well, EyePet and it's follow up were much better than you might expect.
It helps that my daughter was tiny at the time and really, really loved the thing.
I'd had the PS Eye for a while by the time EyePet came out as I'd got it for The Eye of Judgment. I was skeptical as to how well the actual EyePet would interact with people and surroundings - but credit where it is due, with a good set up - the little monkey-cat emerged to be a rather charming and fun virtual pet.
While the mini games in the original became boring fairly quickly - the reactions displayed by the pet and multitude of cosmetic customisations kept my daughter interested more than anything.
With the Move update, things became a lot better. Even with the very well implemented PS Eye motion tracking, sometimes it was just a bit too hard to get an ideal lighting set up.

With Move, the interaction with the pet was much better. The '& Friends' update really was more of the same, but you have another pet at the same time. Didn't spend much time with it as my daughter was a bored with it by then - but that's my fault for letting her play with Power Master Optimus Prime!

Anyway - Fair to put them in the EXISTING category. Excellent use of the technology and certainly had their impact on the viability of such games, didn't set the world on fire though.

@KALofKRYPTON sweet nice one. I quite enjoyed the eye toy too.

I rmenebr haing eyetoy for the PS2 for some exercise game. It worked fairly well I remember. I can believe that about PS3 eyetoy.

My initial impressions

Dynasty Warriors 7: Xtreme Legends Omega Force - Important

Dynasty Warriors 7 Empires Omega Force - Not Important

Dynasty Warriors 8 Omega Force - Existing

Dynasty Warriors 8: Xtreme Legends - Omega Force - Existing

Dynasty Warriors: Gundam Omega Force - Existing

Dynasty Warriors: Gundam 2 Omega Force - Not Important

Dynasty Warriors: Gundam 3 Omega Force - Important

Dynasty Warriors: Gundam Reborn Omega Force - Not Important

Dynasty Warriors: Strikeforce Blue Omega Entertainment - Not Important

Earth Defense Force 2025 Sandlot - Existing

Earth Defense Force: Insect Armageddon Sandlot - Existing

EA Sports Active 2 EA Tiburon - Not Important

EA Sports MMA EA Tiburon - Not Important

Eat Lead: The Return of Matt Hazard Vicious Cycle Software - Pointless

Echochrome II Japan Studio - Important

El Chavo Kart Effecto Studios / Slang - Existing

El Shaddai: Ascension of the Metatron Ignition Tokyo - Not Important

The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion Bethesda Game Studios - Very Important

The Elder Scrolls IV: Shivering Isles Bethesda Game Studios - Important

The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Bethesda Game Studios - Very Important

Enchanted Arms From Software - Not Important

Enemy Front CI Games - Not Important

Enemy Territory: Quake Wars Splash
Damage / Underground Development - Not Important

Enslaved: Odyssey to the West Ninja Theory - Important

Epic Mickey 2: The Power of Two Junction Point Studios - Existing

Escape Dead Island Fatshark -?

Eternal Sonata tri-Crescendo - Existing

Everybody Dance SCE Studios London - Existing

Everybody Dance 2 SIE London Studio - Pointless

Hot Shots Golf: Out of Bounds / Everybody's Golf: World Tour Clap Hanz - Important

Everybody Sing O-Games - Existing

EyeCreate SCE London Studio -?

The Eye of Judgment SCE Japan Studio - Existing

EyePet SCE London Studio - Existing

Eyepet & Friends SCE Studios London - Existing

F.E.A.R. Monolith Productions / Day 1 Studios - Very Important

F.E.A.R. 2: Project Origin Monolith Productions - Important

F.E.A.R. 3 Day 1 Studios - Existing

F1 2010 Codemasters Birmingham - Not Important

F1 2011 Code masters - Very Important

F1 Race Stars Code masters - Not Important

@Frigate Race stars is a kart racer with weapons which is forgettable. The handling and courses were okay but the game was rubbish I can't remember why but I put it down pretty quickly. It was a very generic Kart racer.

2010 was when Codemasters just got the f1 licence. 2010 did a lot well but 2011 and then 2012 were brilliant. 2011 introduced Drs and kers, safety cars and you got to move around the paddock. It was really good. On the back of 2011 they built the f1 franchise from a niche game selling moderately to what we have today.

I have some good memories of playing the Suzuka track. To cut a long story short we had Forza running and my mate was taking the mick out of my brake turning on one of the corners near the end (long straight to a left hand 90 degree turn onto a chicane just before the finishing straight). He set up his PS3 F1 2011 and could run that corner almost flat out. From then on we played F1 almost exclusively as our racing game of choice as it was just better at that point in time.

It was tough, if you played as a Sauber you were just trying to make the points at best. So it was pretty realistic and the racing was tense.

@KALofKRYPTON Sorry bro, what's your opinion on eye of judgement please?

I found a review for El Chavo Kart off the legend @simon_fitzgerald

https://www.pushsquare.com/reviews/ps3/el_chavo_kart

Sounds like my cup of tea. I'm putting it in existing due to the decent write up.

@themcnoisy that’s an old review, I remember it well

@themcnoisy
I went in pretty deep on Eye of Judgment, so consider my thoughts fairly biased.
The game itself was sold in a big boxed set with the a stand for the PS Eye, the first set of cards and a 3x3 grid playmat. Set up is fun and easy, and I rarely had any issues with lighting. As I said about EyePet, it’s a fantastic showcase for the technology.

The game itself is a relatively run-of-the-mill CCG (that’s Collectable Card Game) that follows many a trope and there’s a decent bit of lore that plays out around proceedings that feels very ‘Magic: the Gathering'; it's all ‘nations in peril’, ‘unknown creatures’, magic, mana and whatnot - and that’s essentially where the game lives or dies. If you’re in to, have been in to or wanted to get in to fantasy CCGs, it’s a brilliant thing for either entry in to the game type, or as a ‘new media’ take on something you like anyway.

It’s two a player affair (1vCPU, 1v1 local/online) that utilises a player created deck made up of 30 of the included cards (and of course, later released sets and booster packs). Each and every card is marked with a unique pattern intended to be ‘read’ by the PS Eye (it’s some sort of proprietary barcode technology). As with any CCG, the more cards you have, the better deck you can build and The Eye of Judgment certainly held firm to the deck construction nuances of CCGs (card rarity, duplication, intended strategy etc).
The general gameplay of defeating your opponent was based on several elemental card types, non-elements, a neutral type and spells; turns begin with collecting mana (fuel for your chosen actions essentially) then taking actions, casting spells and summoning a card.

The action in the game takes place on the 3x3 playmat. The PS Eye is positioned above the mat on the included stand; the grid is then seen real-time on the battle screen lined up perfectly with the onscreen grid. On screen the graphical representation of the grid is shown with varying surfaces with specific buffs or de-buffs for certain card types based on the elements on the grid. Think, Fire card on Fire square, get a buff; Fire card on Water square, get a de-buff.

When cards are played, the AR magic happens. When played and laid on the grid the unit type/spell is shown in with nice animations and any grid specific effects take place – actions for units were governed with an action card that is read by the PS Eye and determines targets for attack. Battles between opposing units were shown in a zoomed in view which were again, very nicely animated.
All of the bookkeeping and tracking of the game was handled by the system, so it offers a somewhat streamlined CCG experience.

Online play went pretty much the same as the single player story mode, though decks used had to be scanned in prior to play to prevent cheating. I played online a fair few times and everything was pretty solid as I recall.

In all, there were at least 200 cards released for the game and I very much enjoyed my time with it. Support didn’t last long and the player base was likely very small. It was a niche product for sure, and one that I always wished had received more love. It was fun, it worked really well (possibly the most important bit) and scratched my MTG itch well enough.

To summarise, TEOJ was a pretty great game – had it been a licensed game by the likes of Magic: the Gathering or similar, I’m pretty sure it would’ve had a little more longevity.

There was a PSP version which didn’t use the cards, I never played that but it looks essentially the same but without the physical element.

As for ranking it… Well, it was pretty important for me as spending £60 or so on a the game set up and a few extra cards was by far preferable to falling in the MtG rabbit hole, but it didn’t particularly alter the public consciousness or even make waves in CCG circles. A lot of PlayStation gamers (even at the time) probably don’t know that it exists.
So, EXISTING?

I did a little research on a couple games that haven’t been mentioned.
Since I played the first Echochrome, I looked at Echochrome II —
The first game was pretty interesting, as a puzzler that used switching perspectives to make pathways to guide your drone across a puzzle. This sequel uses the Move controller to be a light source to accomplish a similar perspective based puzzle mechanic. The visuals are an beautifully simple, and the idea is interesting and innovative. As most of these move controller based games, it just doesn’t have the reach to have been influential enough for its ideas (Probably borderline Important)
El Shaddai: Ascension of the Metatron —
The title is indeed a mouthful, and I had never heard or seen this game. It is a rather competent third person action game with platform elements. Combat and gameplay was apparently decent and the art and visuals are quite nice. A 78 Metacritic, it appears to have done nothing special but was a solid title. It led to a spinoff game The Lost Child on PS4 and Vita. (Existing to maybe Important)
Enemy Front —
A 55 Metacritic scoring World War 2 FPS, that had an interesting story and I think the references to real historical events sounds appealing. It had and some basic multiplayer, but doesn’t appear to have set itself apart from the FPS pack mostly due to subpar AI and poorly implemented stealth. It just wasn’t a very good game in general in a crowded genre. (Not Important)

@Frigate Cheers!
In writing that I've pretty much convinced myself to buy the PSP version - I'm probably going to get a PS3 again at some point to play it properly, but the Vita/PSTV will do for a bit.

Just had a check, over 300 cards! Some of the rare ones still go for £70 on ebay!

@KALofKRYPTON @Th3solution thanks lads I have updated my initial impressions list.

Dw strikeforce was one of the first DW games on the Ps3, it uses the DW6 engine and in many ways is like All stars I am playing atm. Its OK but a shallow imitation of the main line series with a gimmick. Not Important.

I didn't even know about Gundam reborn. Again it was released only 5 years ago so everyone had moved on. Its not as good as Gundam warriors 3 by all accounts so this gets pushed down to not important.

@KALofKRYPTON Huge thanks for your input on out list, buddy. Excellent reads!

@RogerRoger No worries