@zupertramp It’s interesting for sure. If we were invaded by aliens, you’d probably find that we’d be too busy arguing amongst ourselves about fake news and conspiracy theories that before we knew it, we’d be slaves to our new bug overlords.
@LieutenantFatman Oh yeah certainly. Forgive me if my comment sounded condescending. I'm an idiot a lot of the time and admittedly, early January, I was quick to dismiss it all as media sensationalism.
But there's power or wisdom or something in just accepting you probably know way less than you think you do and that it's okay to be wrong. Makes changing your mind so much less high-stakes when you take out all the ego.
Mostly I'm just mulling the connection between some folks' response to the pandemic and our capacity for stubbornness and doubling down with rationalizations.
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
But there's power or wisdom or something in just accepting you probably know way less than you think you do and that it's okay to be wrong. Makes changing your mind so much less high-stakes when you take out all the ego.
Mostly I'm just mulling the connection between some folks' response to the pandemic and our capacity for stubbornness and doubling down with rationalizations.
And it’s a valid concern about human ego and ‘doubling down’ on an incorrect or misinformed opinion simply because of pride. Being unwilling to admit to previous mistakes in judgment is what has kept many of societies social injustices and systematic crises active. However, on the other hand, the reluctance of people to accept that people do make mistakes and are subject to err can be equally as damaging. It’s what has resulted in the bipartisan entrenchment on so many of societies issues today. One side fails to admit they have made wrong choices and the other side refuses to forgive previous actions and focuses solely on someone’s past mistakes.
I’m a big proponent of tolerance and justice, and basically living an ethic of empathy and mutual concession. I think in some ways the internet has fueled the extremes of opinion.
We’re all only human. If only people could admit to it and improve and others could forgive for it because we all fail.
Wow, sorry about the sermon there. 😅
And that wasn’t meant as a dig personally; I’m just adding to the discussion in general.
And that wasn’t meant as a dig personally; I’m just adding to the discussion in general.
No worries here.
@Arugula That's my outlook for the most part as well.
Problem is when you have work, and your company is taking its cues from local leadership, and your local leaders are morons. My county is 5th out of 250+ in terms of deaths per capita but these people want to bring everyone back to the office despite working from home just fine since March. And they'll justify it using our county judge's recent lifting of the stay-at-home order.
It's like, are you people stupid? Nothing has really changed since this all started. Okay you don't have to be in the NBA to get a test anymore but other than that... same.
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
@Th3solution
To be fair, it's an excellent sermon! I wish I could articulate it as well as you, some inspiring wisdom there, well said.
@zupertramp
Not at all, nothing to forgive, I'm just reflecting on human behaviour like you. Seeing how differently people react to this pandemic certainly does shine a new light on where humanity is in the world today.
@LieutenantFatman Thanks, boss. The fact that this pandemic has not unified the public but rather divided it, has me frustrated and deeply concerned about humankind’s capacity to coexist. Typically an external threat will bring people together to fight a common foe, but instead ideological schisms have widened. I think that aforementioned concept of pride and forgiveness could be at the core of why that has happened. People become too inflexible, perhaps because finger pointing will persist based on past mistakes.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Arugula Sorry to hear about your situation. I really do feel for those whose work necessitates their presence. Given our economy's reliance on the service sector, I'd imagine this is a lot of people.
So in South Texas we've got what we call Winter Texans. These are people, usually older retirees, who come down to our area for the winter from the Midwest (mostly Michigan for some reason). Do you have something like that in South Florida? Or are all the retirees already living there anyway?
@Th3solution Very well said. This all started I'd never have guessed something like protecting yourself with a mask would become Left vs. Right. I've always been a tad bit jaded but wow, did that take me by surprise.
PSN: frownonfun
Switch: SW-5109-6573-1900 (Pops)
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
@Arugula Ah I see. Duh, snowbirds. I must have known that.
Anyway I only ask because we're gearing up for that here and in my mind this doesn't seem like a good time to be easing up on restrictions but that's been the trend so far. I know there's the revenues they bring with them to think about but geez, does the concern for economics over all else have to be so brazen?
It's like, so much for rudderless right?
PSN: frownonfun
Switch: SW-5109-6573-1900 (Pops)
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
@RogerRoger Yes, and you bring up an interesting point — that of civil apathy. Indeed, apathy is likely to be the more common threat to progress and developing global solutions than anything else. We (again, collectively speaking) are pretty myopic in our concerns. It’s particularly noticeable in the U.S. due to the large regional nature of the State system. Like you say, until it’s on our doorstep we tend to ignore it. I mean, yeah - sometimes it’s a coping mechanism, but sometimes it’s just plain apathy.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
sigh I know this isn't a Trump bashing thread but I cannot understand what's so enchanting about him to so many, especially in regards to his handling of Covid. Like this:
When asked about today's 200,000 deaths milestone here in the U.S., he remarked, "I think it’s a shame. I think if we didn’t do it properly and do it right you’d have 2.5 million deaths."
Yet just yesterday, at a rally, he's quoted as saying "It affects virtually no one."
How in the world can both things be true? 2 and half million people could have died from something that affects virtually no one?
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
@Arugula Thanks for the response. I just needed to rant a little. Though I don't so much want to go after Trump's flaws (I could) but I guess that's not ultimately my beef.
More broadly, it's the incoherence of the Right on Covid. It's a hoax, China needs to be punished, Vitamin C will ward it off, China made it in a lab as a biological weapon, it doesn't affect anyone, millions could have died, it'll disappear after the election, a vaccine is coming, you don't need a mask, BLM is endangering us all by not wearing masks, you should just live your life and not worry, you should worry about the mental health affects...
I mean holy mothballs! How does one's brain not buckle under the weight of all the inconsistencies?
PSN: frownonfun
Switch: SW-5109-6573-1900 (Pops)
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
@zupertramp Don’t forget ‘BLM protestors are endangering us by not wearing masks’ despite Covid protestors currently in Trafalgar Square with no police on horses in riot gear...
@nessisonett It's depressing enough keeping up with current events here in the US so I wasn't aware. But it sounds about right.
PSN: frownonfun
Switch: SW-5109-6573-1900 (Pops)
"One of the unloveliest and least enlightening aspects of contemporary discourse is the tendency to presume that whatever one disagrees with must be very simple—not only simple, but also simply wrong." - Elizabeth Bruenig
@Kidfried That "debate" was the most depressing and humiliating spectacle I've ever witnessed. Terrifying to think a country as politically unstable as the U.S. is now has access to such a large military.
But yeah, it's fitting this diagnosis is made known merely two days after Trump mocked his opponent on live TV for wearing masks.
Currently Playing: Resident Evil Village: Gold Edition
The optimistic side of me says that maybe this will be a good wake-up call for people who have been downplaying the reality of the virus and the persistence of it’s far reaching effects and get a little more support for control measures (masks, keeping businesses and gatherings in check, etc)
The pessimistic and conspiratorial side of me theorizes that maybe this is a fabrication engineered by his camp to detract from the overall poor reception of his performance in the debate. Surely not. But even if not a fictitious illness, a potentially worse outcome is it may serve as an escape goat in the event that he loses election, blaming his 14 d quarantine during this critical time in the final push toward Election Day a month from now. I could see a call from his supporters to invalidate results or even postpone the election, especially if he ends up in the hospital or with a protracted long illness. (Of course the absolution worst outcome is severe disability or death of anyone infected. No matter one’s leanings, no one wants that)
Furthermore, Biden has to be pretty nervous with the recent contact they had at the debate, despite being socially distanced, there was enough raised voices in that room that COVID particles could have filled that entire airspace to saturation. Biden is high risk for complications too based on his age, so that’s got to be concerning. Wouldn’t that be a disaster if both candidates got the virus. Wow. Truly unprecedented times we live in.
The year 2020 continues to be a complete and utter wreck.
@Th3solution He wouldn’t be the first world leader to fake it. Looking at Boris’ remarkable recovery/absolute lack of any lasting effects despite being the right weight and age for it to affect him 👀
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