There's always multiple factors to look on when it comes to anything in life worth it's salt. There is way to much to say when it comes to the current state of gaming, and debating is always good and healthy, I've read through the last 3 pages and seen some really good points brought up, many that I agree with.
Ultimately whether we like it or not, whether we want to see it or not, we live in a world, where the rich want to be richer, and the gaming industry, the "big" boys at the top, Sony, MS, Ubisoft, Nintendo, ect. They now only care about one thing. How do we extract the most money and time out of us, the player base. That's it, that's all the care about. The guys in the board rooms do not care one bit if we think their making the best games ever or if we're all enjoying ourselves in some gaming utopia of amazing games we all want as long as we are all satisfied enough to still be spending money on their products.
I know there's loads of analytics and major cooperate board meetings, schedules, budgets, trends that drive their beliefs and at the end of the day they do what they thinks going to make them the most money. For some reason we gamers still believe this is the 80's and 90's where gamers where making games for gamers and profit was if you make a million or 2 on that and everyone enjoys it then everyone goes home happy. Sadly overtime like anything in life when the "business minded" business degree money men, leaches and powers that be, see anyone making any sort of money then they want a part and not even that, these type of people are not satisfied with 1 million profit.
We live in a world where if I make 1 million profit doing something but another guy makes 50million do the same thing, I'm not successful. Or atleast I'm not as successful as they are, or as successful as I could be. There's been so many games now that get classes as failures because they didn't sell well. Not that failures because there bad games, in fact many failed games are actually good games but they didn't make the profit that the company was expecting.
The people in relevant positions within these companies are not longer gamers. They say they are of course. But there not. Not in the way we are gamers. You know how you can tell when a games made by gamers, it looks like Tomb Raider in the 90s, any final fantasy game up to 14, The Witcher 3, Mass Effect, Gears of War, Hall, Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Diablo 1 and 2, Resident Evil, this list goes on and on because we used to have so many games made for gamers by gamers who knew they would make a little bit of money doing what they loved. We have for 15 years now had games made by people who want to make as much money as possible, so Just like anything in life, movies, series, music, hell even food products are at it, less qaulity, less substance, less in size but more in price so maximise PROFIT. We don't care what we sell, them idiots will still buy it because they always have. That how these cooperations think about us, you see it in every walk of life, houses built here in the UK are made cheaper but are more expensive, its just the way of the world sadly.
Yes we as gamers suffer, they are all chasing the Fortnite, Roblox players, because them guys are spending £10 to £20 a week sometimes and believe it or not there is now more of them types of gamers than there is like me anymore. The younger generation for example nearly all play Roblox or Fortnite as their main game, hell the majority of people I know who game are casual CoD, Gta, Fortnite, Fifa, 2k players. Why do you think we're all on forums online like this because we come here to talk about our passion for gaming and there's not a lot of people out there who play like we do. Atleast not in my experience. I have about 4 or 5 people who I can really talk to about games, yet sports or movies or the weather I can talk passionately to almost anyone because they all have that interest too.
There's also another side to this. We single player gamers who enjoy gaming are actually at home playing our games, games in general that are good Just don't get shouted about as much because a lot of people play them and then move on and don't go online or make videos to rant about how much they enjoyed something. But there's also this group, in any walk of life who when they don't like something are louder than every one else. It's why we see so much negative stuff online, we as humans are drawn to it. So because there's so much more of the negative stuff, people in general just think oh well that's bad, because I haven't seen anything good about that game only bad. Yet everyone who's enjoying it is for the most part staying silent.
The big gaming companies have for far to long got away with it, slowly but surely we are seeing a backlash from it now though. Many companies are putting out failing products, then blaming quite funnily gamers. This shows how out of touch these people are, they believe their own hype, they believe they are the golden goose. Ubisoft and many other companies have been their own downfall. Gamers will literally tell you what they want. Look at BG3 and Expedition 33 as examples. But yet the companies see only a limited amount of money so they still don't heed the call. They just believe their data. And this is the funny thing about data, we see it all the time, sports is a prime example, we see data driving sports now more than ever but data doesn't always equate to real life. How many sports teams have all the data but still loose to a unlucky pass or something happening that they didn't expect or the data didn't predict.
These companies will continue this trend for almost all of time now. The money men are involved so that means money is the most important factor. I know money always is but what I mean is the people running gaming and making the decisions don't love gaming, they love money and it's naive to believe other wise.
As to the blueprint closure, it's a loss for Playstation in my opinion. But will it be the end of Playstation, it certainly will not be. Companies are just basically mini versions of governments and what they do won't always be liked or even understood by us "peasants" but you can guarantee your life that they have a plan, they've done this for a reason and one that benefits them.
For the most part, I just play the games that I want. I have no interest in the politics, the online heresy, the mass hysteria or widespread disconnect and discontent that people seem to feel for games and gaming in general. I play what I want and I enjoy what I get out of gaming. No one's going to tell me otherwise. If a company wants to make a game and I don't think I'll like it, then I'm not buying it, good for anyone who does but I'm also not going to whinge about it. If it makes money then well done and if it doesn't then I'm not going to cry about it either. It's not like it's going into my pocket so what the hell do I care if someone makes £1 or £50 million.
If someone wants to make a game with a story or a character that in my opinion is a load of crap, then go on, knock yourself out, I'm not going to act like I'm mad that someone hasn't made their game, which they created for me and my tastes.
@graymamba That’s exciting. With the way this generation is panning out, I’m beginning to think it’s time for me to jump on board the Pro train. I have a great TV but it’s not HDMI 2.1. Think it’s worth upgrading still?
“Reason is the natural order of truth; but imagination is the organ of meaning.” -C.S. Lewis
@Metonymy obviously hdmi 2.1 would be beneficial in terms of 120hz and VRS but I honestly think it would be worth it anyway just for the fidelity. 60 fps on fidelity with ray tracing… no downside imho.
@graymamba Thanks! Feels like the right time. I was going to upgrade the TV but it’s still going strong so I’m leaning towards the Pro but I’d be disappointed if there was no real discernible difference due to my current set up. Love to hear that it’s beginning to deliver on its promise.
“Reason is the natural order of truth; but imagination is the organ of meaning.” -C.S. Lewis
@Metonymy I would recommend getting a tv with hdmi 2.1 in the first instance. I got one a couple of years ago and have been very impressed. I consistently get 4K 60fps and then 120fps on a few games, even when the game doesn't support it. Don't recall any games that suffer from performance issues either. Makes me think that I don't need a Pro anytime soon, but obviously everyone will be different in that regard.
Life is more fun when you help people succeed, instead of wishing them to fail.
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.
@Metonymy As someone who has both and absolutely loves both my HDMI 2.1 OLED with VRR as well as my PS5 Pro, I think ideally you’d upgrade and get both. I have my base PS5 hooked up to a smaller and lower end non 2.1 4K LCD TV and honestly the picture difference isn’t drastic but the quality of the experience is significantly less on my PS5 set up due to slower load times, lesser frame rates noticeable on some games, and less robust or absent ray tracing. I now almost never even turn on my base PS5. Even if the big TV is unavailable, I just play on my Portal rather than turn on the old TV and old console.
As I’ve mentioned before, if you take into account the extra 1.2 TB of drive space the value proposition starts to look better for the Pro. Now with PSSR update next month, there’s a sudden jump in the value of the Pro also. I’ve already grown spoiled by not having to choose between performance and fidelity. And I am a big fan of ray tracing. I feel like it adds so much to the way a game looks and feels, so for me I wanted the machine that can more consistently perform that. I’ve only had the Pro for about 6 months, so I’m still getting accustomed but it’s a purchase that I’m getting happier and happier with. And the fact that PS6 release is rumored to be pushed out makes the Pro an even better value proposition.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
Thanks! Definitely have some things to mull over as it’s hard for me to financially justify upgrading both at this point. Ramageddon (thanks colonel!) has me leaning towards the Pro but then the benefits of a new TV alone are no small potatoes. This new PSSR update has really peaked my interest. Ahh!
“Reason is the natural order of truth; but imagination is the organ of meaning.” -C.S. Lewis
@Metonymy They’re both a luxury, to be sure. Taking finances into account, upgrading to the Pro is probably less of a blow to your budget if you sell your base PS5. I’m too lazy to have sold mine and I had convinced myself that I wanted two gaming setups (which as I mentioned has turned out to be superfluous with my Portal), but the logical thing to do is recoup about half the cost of the Pro that way. I think GameStop was going to give me around $200 for my PS5 and so the Pro was going to run me around $500. Selling it on your own through eBay or FB marketplace will net you much more; a quick glance shows many people are asking around $300-350 for theirs. So if you have the patience to sell it yourself then you make a lot more.
Also when I was considering the GameStop trade-in route, there was issue of wanting my old unit to do the transfer process to port the data over to the Pro, which is a lot faster than downloading everything from the internet and the cloud again. It was going to be complicated and a bit cumbersome. But the transfer process if you still have your PS5 is fairly smooth.
Of course you could do the same and sell your current TV, but chances are that wouldn’t get as much value back and there’s a real wide range of what you can spend on a new one. Maybe roughly $500 for a decent one on the lower end and then sky’s the limit if you want the best and a really large screen
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Th3solution Yeah, I’d definitely be selling my base model. I put an extra terabyte of space in it too. That said, I’d likely be selling it to a friend so they’ll be getting a deal. Still, every little bit helps. Pro’s are over $1000 in Canada 😬
I know you’ve been very positive on the portal. I finally got to try one recently and I’m very impressed with it. Sony’s definitely on to something there. I just wish it wasn’t remote play only.
“Reason is the natural order of truth; but imagination is the organ of meaning.” -C.S. Lewis
@Metonymy it really depends on the current tv, current budget and your own preferences. And if you upgrade one, if you'd still be likely to want to upgrade the other in the future to get the best of both worlds.
Having no hdmi 2.1 means 60fps max, no unlocked frames, no VRR (VRR really makes games super smooth once above a certain FPS output) things like that, and those features, to me, have made games feel so much better. I never got on with the previous "locked 60fps" modes in games because they looked worse, and most of them didn't actually feel realistic in motion or had fps dips anyway. They were supposedly 'smoother' but they felt wrong at looked wrong. But now with the pro pushing higher unlocked FPS paired with VRR I am finally converted to higher frame rates, but mostly now the Pro is providing that experience whilst still looking like quality mode on ps5, at least. As i'd still choose quality mode (or 40fps vrr balanced) on base PS5 for most games.
But apart from those things, the pro alone will generally upgrade visual resolution and have PSSR avaliable, it's just it will be locked in at 30/60 depending on the game and tv capabilities and you might not be getting the best of everything with some modes or features locked off, depending on the specific game and the modes available. And if the tv is at its limit anyway, you might not get the true value out of the upgrade. It is so dependant on your own priorities, tastes and current set up, though.
What is your current tv? Age, Size etc. I know when I moved from non-oled to OLED it made games look much better on the base consoles, and VRR being available on 2.1 became one of my favourite features because it handles frame issues on PS5 to some extent, and it handles the higher powered unlocked frame rates on ps5 pro to a great extent, giving you some really smooth looking and feeling gameplay.
So, yeah... upgrading either the tv or the console will see improved quality, but i'd honestly lean towards upgrading the TV first, (depending on what you currently have) because the PS5 is still a great console and will also use some use of hdmi 2.1 features. But if your TV is still pretty good quality, but simply doesn't have 2.1, then maybe upgrading the console would be enough for now.
Tldr:
go for a tv with hdmi 2.1 if you want a smoother experience and better frames rate options and future proofing.
Go for a 4k OLED if you want the real visual pop upgrade (mini LED and other tech is catching up though, so you'd be vest seeing them for yourself (some brands like TCL and Hisense are providing some great midrange stuff these days with all the bells and whistles anyway)
upgrade to Ps5 pro if you want the upped resolution and fancy graphical tweaks, better performance or a mode with pretty stable 60fps that will still look like the quality mode on ps5.
(And yes, I realise now that you said the tv was already great, so maybe lean back towards pro again 😅 as long as you do plan to go 2.1 in the future as that is when you will start to see the real bonus upgrades and it start to feel even more worth it. Still it'd be cool to hear what you prefer when gaming to really know what would be best for you. Is is purely looks (rt, lighting, immersion) performance, stability, pure resolution and what you'd most want upgraded if you could pick from the features mentioned?)
@Metonymy I will also add that when I got my 2.1 tv it unlocked Atmos. With my old TV it was always problematic getting Atmos to work consistently. With my current tv it just worked pretty much straight away with my ps5, 4K player and streaming apps on my TV.
Life is more fun when you help people succeed, instead of wishing them to fail.
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.
Thanks for the help! I have a 65” LG OLED. It’s got pretty much everything ( 120Hz, Dolby Atmos and Vision, HDR10…) but no 2.1. Bought it in 2018 so I’m due for an upgrade soon but it’s still going strong and still looks absolutely gorgeous. It’d be nice to not have to sacrifice resolution for performance. This was especially noticeable in FF7 Rebirth.
“Reason is the natural order of truth; but imagination is the organ of meaning.” -C.S. Lewis
@graymamba Oh my…. So happy to have Push Square as my home for gaming news, reviews, and content. Pretty sure Sammy, Liam, Stephen, and Rob are all real people. Not so sure about that guy @johncalmc … could definitely be an AI.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
Wow… this is a super interesting review, and it’s a shame seeing review-theft so rampant, especially with the advent of generative AI. 🙁
Bizarrely enough, this might be a larger industry issue, rather than a selective AI issue. See, not that long ago, almost a decade ago in fact, an ign reviewer plagiarized a niche dead cells review.
It was rather catastrophically blatant, and a real low blow from the big heads back then.
However, wouldn’t you know it… the big N responded!
Addressing such allegations was likely not part of the company’s MO at the time so I imagine this was a hugely unorthodox and deeply discomforting video to make for the higher ups who genuinely had no idea.
Long story short, the reviewer seemingly got fired from the big Eye-gee-N and we never heard of him again. Justice served? Definitely a rare moment of peace.
Playing Xenoblade, feel free to add me on switch or steam.
Party in XB1:
Shulk - lvl6
Reyn - lvl3
Fiora - lvl5
@Yousef- I do remember that incident as it goes, though I’d never actually watched the video you posted from boomstickgaming. Wow, how embarrassing.
As an aside, I remember that i was accused of plagiarism on my first assignment at uni. I was fuming as was adamant that I hadn’t… and it was over the use of a very generic term often used within film and cinema. I made an appointment with the head of department and it was overruled without question. The lecturer in question never got to review any of my work for the remaining 3 years… maybe a positive, maybe not 😅.
@graymamba@Yousef- I wonder if these fake AI reviewers are mining content from the Push Square forum review thread! 😄 Honestly, most of the user reviews this forum produces trounce that which is published out on the wider internet.
I don’t usually veer too far from Push Square for news and reviews, but sometimes I will and it is becoming more apparent that some of the stuff out there is AI drivel. The other internet news and opinion articles that I read a lot of are sports sites and I’m noticing the same thing on some of those platforms as well— generic and bland AI sounding articles that just regurgitate what you’ve seen elsewhere. Often these sites will have the exact same news blurb word for word, copy and pasted.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Yousef- I do remember that incident as it goes, though I’d never actually watched the video you posted from boomstickgaming. Wow, how embarrassing.
As an aside, I remember that i was accused of plagiarism on my first assignment at uni. I was fuming as was adamant that I hadn’t… and it was over the use of a very generic term often used within film and cinema. I made an appointment with the head of department and it was overruled without question. The lecturer in question never got to review any of my work for the remaining 3 years… maybe a positive, maybe not 😅.
😥wow colonel, that must’ve stung. Well, serves them right for staying as far away from you, good riddance I always say xD.
@graymamba@Yousef- I wonder if these fake AI reviewers are mining content from the Push Square forum review thread! 😄 Honestly, most of the user reviews this forum produces trounce that which is published out on the wider internet.
I don’t usually veer too far from Push Square for news and reviews, but sometimes I will and it is becoming more apparent that some of the stuff out there is AI drivel. The other internet news and opinion articles that I read a lot of are sports sites and I’m noticing the same thing on some of those platforms as well— generic and bland AI sounding articles that just regurgitate what you’ve seen elsewhere. Often these sites will have the exact same news blurb word for word, copy and pasted.
That makes two of us. ; )
I did try, and never quite vibed with news media outside of what PS represents. My first coming to push square was actually more than 12 years ago when Robert published a dynasty warriors article, a rare commodity back then. Got me hooked on the spot and never looked back haha.
Interesting to bring up bland articles that blend into one another, that’s an issue that unfortunately somewhat dates back all the way to the 2000s when there were hundreds of “top ten” gaming articles that regurgitated the same basic takes and opinions.
Suppose the more things change, the more they stay the same.
Playing Xenoblade, feel free to add me on switch or steam.
Party in XB1:
Shulk - lvl6
Reyn - lvl3
Fiora - lvl5
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