Update: Insomniac Games community director James Stevenson has now stated that, in the case of Marvel's Spider-Man: Miles Morales at least, your PS4 save will carry across to the PS5 if you utilise the title's free next-gen upgrade. This situation seems to suggest that cross-save has not been mandated by Sony and so some developers may opt not to support the feature. It also worth noting that the free PS5 upgrade for Maneater also will not carry over your PS4 save — that makes two games then so far. We shall continue to update this article if we learn more.
Original story: Well, this isn't what we wanted to hear. As Yakuza: Like a Dragon confirms that PlayStation 4 save data will not be carried over into the upgraded PlayStation 5 version, Gene Park of The Washington Post has said that this may be the case for many other current-gen titles you'll be able to get a free upgrade for. He says he has heard "a lot from different devs that PS4 saves won't work on PS5. Xbox Series X seems to bring your old save files with you". He then expands: "It's not strictly about [backwards compatibility], it's about PS5 upgrades like Marvel's Spider-Man: Miles Morales [and] Yakuza".
We must clarify that the quote is targeted at PS4 games you will be receiving a free PS5 update for rather than those simply playable through backwards compatibility. This includes the likes of Watch Dogs Legion, Call of Duty: Black Ops Cold War, and Cyberpunk 2077. If this is proven to be true then it means that we would have to start single player games over again, even if we were halfway through a lengthy campaign. There's no better example of this than Assassin's Creed Valhalla. The game releases on PS4 just two days before the US launch of the PS5 — are those who choose to buy the current-gen version and then upgrade maybe a few weeks later going to have to start the game all over again? If someone beats the Cyberpunk 2077 campaign on PS4 and then wants to play the DLC on PS5, what happens there? Surely they would need a fully-levelled character and they won't have access to that.
Again, we must stress that the claim is currently unconfirmed, but after Yakuza: Like a Dragon has announced that will indeed be the case for that particular game, we can't help but worry a little. Let's hope Sony has come up with some sort of feature to convert a PS4 save into a PS5 one because this could quickly become a real problem.
[source twitter.com]
Comments 164
With the amount of time I have put into Avengers, I will be seriously annoyed if my save doesn't carry forward.
Yikes. Talk about a pointless upgrade.
To be honest I won't mind replaying some PS4 games upgraded on PS5 from the beginning.
To update or not to update? That is the question.
. . . another bad news beat for Sony. This is unacceptable and shouldn't be this hard--especially with Microsoft hitting it out of the park on BC.
.....SO WHAT'S THE POINT OF HAVING AN UPGRADE SYSTEM IN THE FIRST PLACE
Kinda makes it pointless for me. Unless it's a game I haven't started from my backlog. Seriously could this not have been worked out. I don't mind paying premium but I want a premium experience.
@torne same! Ridiculous if you can't transfer the save
Are the trophy lists separate? Are we going to end up with a bunch of half-complete trophy lists for the PS4 version of the game and a new trophy list for the PS5 upgrade version?
I know SpiderMan is like this; but I am hoping that other games are not.
This is another reason for me to just skip the PS4 version and go ps5 from the beginning.
Bit of a pointless exercise really imo...
This Jim Ryan-led PlayStation division is really on the ball.
Wouldn't surprise me as I've experienced the same thing on GOTY editions, Witcher 3 I think it was. Microsoft have designed their systems for backwards compatibility but for Sony it seems to be an afterthought
But Avengers confirmed that Save Games carry over?
https://press.na.square-enix.com/MARVELS-AVENGERS-CONFIRMED-FOR-PLAYSTATION-5-AND-XBOX-SERIES-X
@IonMagus Maybe because Avengers is an online focused game where they use their own servers allowing save data to transfer? Just a guess but it seems like that would be plausible!
I am sure Sony will have some good news at some point in the next few months
PS4 save data not being transferred to PS5. I really hope this won’t be the case.
Here we go again
@Dodoo I agree and this is how I operated last gen too. For the titles that are cross gen I will get the XSX/PS5 version, not the last gen version even if I have to wait a few months.
@IonMagus This might be the case for online games with a single player component, but I think the article is talking in the context of purely single player offline games.
@Dodoo : Some of the PS4 versions are cheaper, so its still worth to compare first.
Many games near launch anyway so no issue if your an early adopter.
They should hire me to sort this train wreck out. I’d fix up Final Fantasy, Metal Gear Solid, Tomb Raider and Resident Evil in the process.
It’s crazy really Sony have been on the back foot when it comes to communication and what does and does not work backwards compatibility wise and game save wise etc.
I think some of it is they really want a generation transformation like they said originally. But maybe due to the 100 million PS4 owners they decided to have certain games run on the PS4 like the new spider man and sack boy game. It does make money business sense to sell the game to as many as possible.
They just need to be at bit more forthcoming and communicate.
Like today we have series x console previews and backwards compatibility and loading time reviews with digital foundry.
Very good upfront communication.
I do feel at times Sony needs to get its finger out get informing its many many loyal fans.
My biggest worry after hearing the series x is like silent in operation and the noise my PS4 Pro makes I have my fingers crossed the PS5 is a quiet console when my preorder arrives.
@TheFrenchiestFry But why? There were many PS3/PS4/PSVita Games with Cross Save Function
@WizzNL yeah that’s true. It could be that I just end up waiting a while for prices to come down. Have still got loads on PS4 and switch in the mean time...
Yikes. Not gaming stuff again
@IonMagus Oh I'm not like justifying it. It's still stupid
But like I'm trying to find some sort of logic in this decision
How is it they could transfer saves from PSVita to freaking PS3 and back, but they can't figure out how to transfer saves from one x86 game to a patched version of the same x86 game??
Now I'm starting to really understand "we believe in generations." It wasn't about a strategy of putting a new generation's best forward. What they were really saying was that they've designed their entire platform around the dated idea of separate generations and that even internally, content of the prior generation is fundamentally incompatible with the new generation. It makes me wonder if their idea of PS4 back compat is more like WiiU or the X360 games where it shadow loads the old console's OS and emulates the whole old hardware. Eeeewww.
That makes me pretty unlikely to even START playing any of my backlog until I know if upgraded versions are coming. And certainly not buy any new ones at all! Sony'd better start talking about it's plans for existing games!
#SackJimBoy
@JoeyTS i hope this would work for monster hunter world aswell
@JapaneseSonic Cerny's a genius. The PS4 was powerful while still being reasonably quiet for the most part, and I expect no different here, especially with how THICC the new console looks which will probably accomodate for better cooling solutions.
@torne me to. All chars level 50 and 4 of them at power 150.
@JapaneseSonic
Good read thank you.
But until they send out units to the likes of digital foundry I guess we won’t know.
Then again I’m not sure if Sony are doing that sort of thing. It maybe when we get ours we will know. Well the USA go first so we will before in the U.K.
I'll be able to use saves for my current PS4 games as they are while playing those games on PS5, but I might not be able to use those saves for the upgraded versions.
It's not the end of the world by any means, but during a period when MS's excellent PR campaign has resulted in extra scrutiny on Sony, I'm surprised they didn't mention this sooner.
Hopefully Sony restart the hype train soon so we can all start getting excited again.
EDIT: Now that I think about it, I was expecting to have to start Spidey over again from scratch with the upgraded version.
I suppose this news isn't too disappointing if it applies to all games, but options are always nice.
@JapaneseSonic well yes, it could be an easy fix, depending on the game. We are however essentially talking about completely different games when you move from PS4 to PS5 in many cases, and save files might differ because of it. There are games within generations that suffer this problem because of the way the save file data is formatted. For instance my disc copy of Horizon Zero Dawn got a scratch on it somehow, no idea how, not important, so I bought the complete edition, my save didn't carry over. However, writing a conversion program to upload saves to shouldn't be too onerous. I think Gearbox did it if I'm not much mistaken with Borderlands 2 with PS3 to PS4 saves. I'm sure I read a paper on it. Wouldn't be too much work I'd have thought in most cases. The difference is Microsoft planned for this, Sony did not, it wasn't part of there strategy. They were fine if that's what developers wanted to do, but they didn't mandate it like Microsoft did. So it's extra work the platform holder isn't required, which sucks, because if they don't "have to" quite often they won't bother. I'm pretty certain it'll be a mixed bag. I expect Cyberpunk and maybe Ubisoft to support transfer saves, but some others? I'm not so sure, and there's not likely to be a uniform way of doing it either.
Hello Sony just talk to us and send out some decent details on you BC and saves etc.
You know so should your future PS5 owners.
Just because you sold over 100 million consoles and have some of the best studios in the world.
Don’t go all big balls on us.
Doesn't bother me, but this is gonna make a butt load of people mad! Honestly, I was always going to wait a year or two to get a PS5, no sense paying full price when price drop is inevitable. But also some top games are also going to be available on the PS4. Couldn't care less about the gimmicks in the controller so why not wait till they sort out all the crap! I love PlayStation, but I feel like there not off to a great start already...
I want a new game play-through with a fresh Trophies list if possible for most games. not bothered about old saves for another system.
Come on Sony. Get talking. We need weekly updates giving us the key info now. No more hiding.
We need the console in the hands of the media. Not Travis Freaking Scott. Digital Foundary just ran an EXCELLENT piece on backwards compatibility on Series X. Get on with it.
Whilst i am happy to see what arrives on my door step, with each passing day you are yielding more and more market share. Which means you have less money to invest in making the quality software we have come to know and expect from you. And that is when we have problems.
It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see the way the narrative has turned ahead of this generation. You simply cannot afford to string your loyal customers and player base along any more.
Start. Talking
@NEStalgia
I believe Mark Cerny already talked a little about this during the PS5 deep dive. Games will run using their respective hardware profiles (PS4, or PS4 Pro where applicable). I believe he said there would be a Boost Mode available for games to use the full hardware of the system (in the same vain as PS4 Pro Boost Mode), but with the caveat that some games may not run as intended/not take advantage of it at all.
This doesn't really bother me personally, but that being said, I can see absolutely no valid reason why this should be the case, apart from 'the individual developer wants it that way.'
Why they'd want it that way, I don't know... except perhaps as a form of encouragement to buy a PS5 version. But it's just data... there's no reason you couldn't just copy the file and have the game read and convert it as necessary.
That would clearly annoy me. I like to start with a NG+ on my second playthrough and I was thinking about replaying some games on ps5 to enjoy the upgrade
@JapaneseSonic I could go into more detail about what save files are, but I'd probably bore the pants off people. The simple thing is this, games are just a series of instructions, "if this then this" sort of stuff, and how games are structured to run on one system, might not always be the same on another, it might be less optimal on one system to log progress with certain tags. So getting the game to read the file might not be possible without some sort of conversion of the original save file values to a format the upgraded game version uses. Clever developers will have built work arounds into their work flows and project management... others might have not done so for various reasons. I'll leave others to judge what those reasons are.
Yea, we've already seen with PS4 games that stuff like a game and its GOTY edition get a separate trophy list. Which basically means for Sony that they're not the same game, and their save games are not related.
This mistake or lack of foresight in PS4 software architecture will also progress into backwards compatibility. I'm not really surprised.
What developers might do is just build their own save game converter, but there's no way for Sony to create a catch-all solution right now. Software architecture is a difficult thing.
I just HOPE they will have fixed this stuff for the PS5 games and on, so we don't get this stuff again next gen.
@torne I think that games that save your progress on the game's servers and link it to your profile (like Mortal Kombat 11) should be fine.
@Kidfried don't bet on it, the PlayStation is the wild west of console development. Anything goes as long as it works here and now.
This is terrible. Sony should not let this be a thing at all. Sony is not having a fun time right now and their lack of communication is looking worse and worse.
@SirAngry I would never bet anything on anything regarding Sony. Even after all these years the company remains a mystery to me.
Nobody: "..."
Absolutely nobody: "..."
Sony: 🤡🤡🤡
I probably won't even be able to move over my PT download to the PS5. Xbox might be my main console next gen, and I never would have considered that before.
@Nickolaidas that would be great. Just need them to actually announce that then.
Yet another reason for Sony to do a tell all showcase type thing. It feels like there is no plan for whats going on, no faith in what their machine does and zero interest in listening to the folks that they are asking to lay out £450 in blind faith.
Now, im aware that could all be completely wrong but thats the feeling thats starting to creep in more and more.
There are some games that I don't care if they let me have my saves like Ghost of Tsushima, Bloodborne, Yakuza, or even P5R but if its something like Monster Hunter World or any type of live service I will lose my *****.
Sony's gotta turn the bad news boat around soon. Xbox is looking more attractive to the average gamer by the day at this rate.
Well that’s just really poor, but is it on the devs or Sony if it’s true? But yeah some of these games people will have put hours and hours into and won’t want to start from scratch again.
I don’t know if I buy this especially since borderlands 3 has announced a free upgrade and announced that saves as well as all purchased dlc carry over
@kyleforrester87 heh, we're still waiting for you to start your job as the new face of Push Square, and you're already offering yourself to Sony? Talk about opportunistic 😉
@KirbyTheVampire That's seriously true. What we have at least in terms of PR optics right now is basically:
MS: Hey, tech guys, deconstruct and analyze our hardware! Check out BC. Improvements across all generations! Plug in your old games and they just run better and everything carries over! Get upgrades to your old games when available automatically! Here's the details of how it all works! And for a cheap subscription just try loads of stuff!
Sony: ....................................... Check out our great games coming! Do we get upgrades? No. Can we buy upgrades? Kinda. Do our saves carry to the upgrades? No. Can we find out how the hardware works? ............................ uhm, ok so....how do older games run? They don't. But last gen does? Yeah, unless we upgrade them, which we'll charge you for. Then you cant run your old game data. It's a new game. So....how do the old games run? Same as before. Maybe a little better. Why should we buy this new console? New games are coming and they'll be good. But don't most of them also run on the old console? Yeah. But the ones after that won't and they'll be better. They'll cost more though. Can we at least check out how it performs? No.
@Medic_Alert The sad thing is it does make them money. You can still buy PS3 and PS4 games. It's still sales, they just don't get to re-sell the same games to the same people every few years Nintendo-style.
Given how Sony is dealing with BC, I think for anyone with access to an XBox or PC, buying any multiplat on a PS would be self defeating. They're making clear your library doesn't truly go with you in the future, while MS makes clear that it does.
@GamingFan4Lyf Cerny's deep dive was referring to, or appeared to be referring to how the hardware handles it. Clocking back to PS4/PS4 Pro specs. Not ideal, but ok. But this is almost sounding like WiiU style emulation of Wii or X1/Series emulation of 360 where its actually fully emulating the old hardware with the old OS loaded. That's not cool at all for PS4 compatibility.
@JapaneseSonic Considering what else the Sony execs have said over the last year, which then turned out to be false or twisting of the truth.. I’ll believe it when I hear it with the PS5.
@NEStalgia It's truly been a PR nightmare so far. Unless they shift course, it's gonna be pretty much purely the good will they've amassed over the PS4 generation that will carry them forward in any capacity. I mean, that's basically the only reason I'm trying to buy a PS5.
you just misunderstand the case. Games via BC your save will work. the remaster or upgraded version won't.
I guess if they're different clients I understand why it's this way, but it somewhat defeats the point. And the terrible communication from Sony means that niggly little stories like this continue to blow up in their face.
Once again, it's an issue blown way out of proportion. Most gamers don't even care or use BC. The Switch and Ps4 have done extremely well without it.
I hope the rumour isn't true, but it's not the end of the world.
@Medic_Alert actually, they don't want you ASAP, because they can't have you ASAP since Ps5s sell out immediately everywhere. Plus, plenty of ps5 games are confirmed to cost no more than ps4 games do.
@naruball Except the story isn't about backwards compatibility.
@torne I'd be upset if I spent time playing that game, too.
@naruball Firstly this story isn't at all about BC. It's about the simple act of transferring PS4 game saves to PS5 versions of those games as what was advertised with the free upgrade program by numerous developers
Secondly, game preservation is becoming increasingly important as we're moving closer to a more digital age and as an increasing number of titles tend to get left behind simply for the fact that they're on outdated hardware. These games are then basically borderline inaccessible to newer players after said hardware gets discontinued with no other alternatives to buying said games. Backwards compatibility will ALWAYS be important no matter how many people use it.
Sony. Communicate. Sony. Sony! HEY! SONY! JIM! TALK TO US JIM! HEY! HEEEEEEEY! SONY! COMMUNICATE! SONY!
SOOONYYYYY!
SONNNYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
I think those who are getting upset, should cool off, and keep in mind that this is so far, a rumor, not a fact. Sooner or later, Sony will likely respond to it, or all our questions will be answered in their next chunk of news.
Sony takes another L before this console even releases. So glad I secured an X now
@Medic_Alert well, they have me there day one, buying a 70 game it two. And then that's it. The rest I'll wait for sales. And the uncertainty around what they're doing with old games and the lack of upgrades to them being free, automatic, or announced means I'm probably not going to finish hzd or gow for a while while i wait to find out. Which means I'm not interested in hzd2 or gow2 until i am. Which means they're all going to be cheap by the time i do. And everything else gooes to ms. So they "have me", but i may not actually be profitable as a result.
Forgive me, but isn't this the ultimate first world problem? You can still transfer your PS4 save via backward compatibility and play the PS4 game you purchased on PS5. I just had to restart Mario 64 from scratch on Switch after getting 50 stars on the Wii U Virtual Console version — no one forced me to to this, I could have finished the game on the Wii U; related to this, I see no one complaining about Nintendo's handling of saves on prior iterations of their games. This is creating an issue where there is none, in my opinion.
I've put 150 hours into Avengers and this was one of the games I was going to continue playing on my PS5, this better not be true.
How can MS handle backwards compatibility and save transfer much better than Sony?
I'm just curious how PS4 games will work if you're upgrading to a PS5? Will players need to reload their games onto the PS5, or can we simply install them on an external drive with the PS4, unplug the hard drive from the ps4 and then hook the external hard drive up to the PS5 to play our games?
Hype level for PS5 is definitely dying with so many bad news, poor communication and a lot of bad rumors
I love Sony, but they really seem to be ruining a lot of the hype surrounding PS5. Guess I’ll stick with a PS4 pro and try to find a series x next year. I really want to play Demon’s Souls though...
@kabal82 Sony hasn't actually clarified how the process will work yet, but I think you'll simply be able to head to the PlayStation Store on your PS5, and it'll automatically register that you qualify for the free upgrade. Then you'll just download the PS5 version straight to the new console.
That's a HUGE no from me. This is beyond ridiculous. I was thinking of maybe buying Miles Morales on PS4 before getting my PS5 later down the line. That would definitely stop me from getting it, and any other game with free upgrades. It kills the purpose of the feature.
@Axyuji Marvel's Avengers saves are already confirmed to carry across.
I think what we've got here is a situation whereby Sony leaves it up to individual developers. So it's basically up to SEGA to support it in the example in the article.
@naruball no this is not the case. I am one of the gamer who want to re-experience some games with 60 FPS and faster loading times. Xbox made and still have the upper hand here no one can deny that.
This is probably based on the trophy system. If you have a game on PS4 and unlocked all the trophies, then have a "free" upgrade to PS5 it seems kinda cheap to instantly get a full platinum worth of trophies for literally doing nothing. I get the frustration but in the case of Spiderman it's a brand new trophy list. I look forward to unlocking Spiderman again on PS5, because I earned it. If games are mainly backwards capable and have no free upgrade then this won't be the case, you just earn the trophies for a ps4 game while playing on PS5. Also if you really love the game then play both versions seperatly.
The article has been updated with new information.
Sony need to learn a lesson from this: rumours like this spread if you don't get out in front of them.
Fortunately it sounds like this works like cross-save on PS Vita, so it's up to the developer to support it. Hopefully SEGA will implement it into Yakuza before launch.
Rumour . = probably no truth
@torne why?
Is this a rumor though? I feel like I've seen from similar places that this indeed would be true. I mean it kind of sux, but I'm pretty sure I couldn't carry my 360 save of the tomb raider reboot over to the definitive edition when I played it on game pass. I never actually played it despite getting it on psplus, but I doubt I could load up my TLoU save when I played the remastered version.
You can get the Platinum for it in under 15 hours so it's not really that hard to start from scratch, better yet you actually can Platinum it twice if you so desired.... but then there's screwball....ugh nevermind.
For an even better/recent example because I forgot about it, you cannot use your saved data from persona 5 for persona 5 royal for progression.
@BowTiesAreCool why what?
Why would i be pissed that my save didn't transfer after sinking a bunch of hours into it?
Probably because I worked hard for the progress and want to continue from where I left off.
Whether true or not this just adds one more layer to the great PS5 mystery that Sony is selling.
I understand a certain level of intrigue and not wanting to spill everything at once - drip feeding is tried and tested marketing tactic - but this is taking it to the extreme.
Can they not see that their optics are currently awful and the public narrative has turned against them. Control it!
@get2sammyb As I said at the time, your on-point soapbox article didn’t go far enough. Perhaps should have been titled “101 things we STILL don’t know about the PS5.”
Come on Sony. Stop. Dropping. The. Ball!
OMG Sony, just say something! I want to shake some sense into them.
Sony’s got a mixed messaging problem going into this generation that they need to fix. I love em to death, but they’re raising the bar in some places and totally dropping the ball in other places. Not a good look for a company that absolutely slaughtered the competition this generation.
A game like Uncharted 4 or The Witcher 3 i'm fine with starting fresh as the whole point of playing them on the PS5 is playing them with the power of the PS5 behind them. A game like No Man's Sky, Avengers, MK11 and so on though i really don't want to have to start again though, these types of games you can spend 100's of hours on because that's how they're designed so ditching all that time and investment is a real kick in the teeth.
Hate to say it but Sony have really dropped the ball with the PS5 and it feels like the early PS3 days, honestly they're lucky they have those 1st party games because the Series X and what MS are doing is far better then what Sony is offering. The Series X can play ever X1 game and every single Xbox and 360 game that the X1 can run and i'm pretty sure the saves can be carried over like, you then have Gamepass and the fact the Series X has been an open book. Sony have gone in thinking they have a free win and honestly i hope the Series X gives them a wake up call because when Sony are fighting like they were last gen they were at their best.
@Medic_Alert Yeah this isn't the launch any of us imagined when they spent 2 years saying they were preparing for ps5 (though maybe it was an omen when it took a year to mention the "next generation PlayStation" would be named "ps5" )
They've dropped the ball on communication, but it appears also in planning. Their slipshod approach to maintaining the old generations model and problems such as this cross save issue and their total approach to bc means they missed all the market cues about where the industry was going. From xboxs approach starting with 1x/s (and i don't mean gamepass) to stadia, epic, cdpr, and the major publishers flowing with those moves. Guillemot flat out saying the future was 100% streaming over a year ago. Yves was talking nonsense but it was a big cue where the industry and consumer was going. And Sony came into this launch prepared for none of that. They want to turn back the clock to a world where they're a monopoly fighting aging sega. This is the twilight zone. And worse, they're so used to being reactive, they're not seeing this unfolding and pivoting on it. The ps4 launch crew pivoted their entire strategy in mere hours live backstage following ms' melt down. These guys have weeks and can't make a single focused statement, and any time a rumor gets out it's always bad. Meanwhile the big leagues are digging into XSeX bc bench marks and heaping praise on it as we speak, and Sony's shipping some units to YouTube influencers... They're either bumbling and clueless or desperately avoiding anyone peeking behind the curtain. (Reminds me of the time ms got caught at ces with the og xbox demo being an empty shell with cables running under the table to a quad Xeon nt4 box...)
If i think of the disastrous launches in memory i think id rank then:
X1: top list because it's not just bad, it's infamous.
Sega saturn: the final nail that killed Sega. They were dead before Dreamcast launched. They launched Dreamcast anyway to go out with a bang and hope for a miracle.
Wiiu: the launch so botched they forgot to show the console.
Ps3: sorry, Sony faithful but it was doomed from "599.99" everyone gets love in this list of hate.
I feel like ps5 is going to slot in this list, but I'm not sure where yet. It depends what, if anything is done to fix this mess before it spirals out of control or launch day arrives and we find out why theve been this silent for real.
@torne ah. Is your ps4 game going somewhere or something? I bought a PS4 game for my PS4, how DARE Sony not jump through hoops for poor
entitled, spoilt old me
@Gamer83 Let me in on the Jim Ryan bashing 😁
Xbox is getting a ton of positive coverage right now cause the head people put the system in the hands of reviewers and various tech people. If we had smart leadership we would be doing the same and would be trying to turn all the recent negative Sony articles into positives ones 😑
@BowTiesAreCool yes I am spoiled for wanting to take advantage of a free upgrade that the developers promoted while retaining the work that i already put into the game.
Had I known that it was a possibility that game saves may not work moving forward that would have impacted my purchase decision. I would have waited for the ps5 version instead.
Yes i know the ps5 is backwards compatible. Yes I know avengers will play on my ps5 regardless of if it is a ps4 version or a ps5 version, i know it has also been confirmed that at least avengers will work properly, and finally yes i would like to play the most updated version of the game on my system of choice. If this is confirmed to be a developer by developer decision then this is going to impact what games I buy because I am not going to play a game partway only to have to start over should I choose to upgrade.
How dare me as a consumer be so spoiled to be frustrated at the possibility of some of my save data potentially not working with the upgraded version.
Haven't yet read the article but I would imagine playing ps4 on the ps5, the saves still work. Ps5 upgraded versions of ps4 games are technically brand new games. Personally I'm excited for twice the trophies.
@Oz_Momotaro it does if you've ever developed a game. A well managed team, with good project managers that lay out ground rules and standardized naming and tagging conventions for code absolutely should have no problems, and probably will have save files that will carry across generations. Not all teams work likd that with well managed agile work environments. Save files relate to tags in code, it's as simple as that, and quite often between platforms / generations that code can look significantly different. So taking a file which relies on one set of tags and trying to get it recognised by a similar but different set of code, which doesn't use the same tags would require some kind of conversion process. If you plan for it, it's simple, really simple. If you don't you can end up with problems like these.
@Oz_Momotaro also read my comments again, I clearly say if teams planned for it it's simple. If they didn't well, sorry, but I've seen teams on different versions of the same game diverge massively in terms of how a game us put together... and it's a nightmare. It's becoming less and less common, but it does still happen from time to time. There are however other reasons as to why save files might not transfer over, and that could be by design.
it looks like people here reaaally have a hard time reading
1. This is a rumor
2. Your ps4 saves will still work with your backwards compatible games
3. in the past, games have rarely let you transfer data from one version to the next
4. games such as avengers have already been confirmed to keep their save data
@doctommaso Yeah, on its own, this isn't that much of an issue. But compared to what Microsoft are offering, it's poor.
@FindMeCampin things that are in the past should stay in the past.
@Dezzy70 It seems like something simple for Plus users, at least - copy the PS4 save down from the cloud and convert it (if a conversion is even needed). I think they're trying to keep save games from being copied between players, which I get, but this seems like something simple to fix.
If they really leave it like this, that's embarrassing for Sony!!! I struggle with saying that Microsoft is doing it better, but it sure does seem like it right now, doesn't it?
@FindMeCampin when you have cross-platform play, cross-generation play(soon), cross-platform/generation saves now, I dont see why it's not a 100% available option.
@Oz_Momotaro It's not so far removed that it actually is a different game, most of the story is the same except they added sosuke aizen and a girl he used to fuel his delusion.
I would like it if the saves didn't carry over. I'm a big AC player. It's my #1 game to play. I've platinum'd every game. In the case of ps2/ps3 game releases, I've platinum'd them twice. Ps3/ps4, same thing. On the ps4, they re-released a ps2/3 game again, so I've got the platinum for the same game 3 times. So if they don't carry over, I'll have a double platinum for Valhalla. (and any other game I can replay on the ps5.)
Well there you go. So everyone overreact as always, move along guys.
@torne TBH I would too but I actually enjoyed the story and wouldn't mind playing it again. Now if that's the case for Spider-Man PS4 and the save doesn't go over to the remaster I would have mixed opinions, for one I enjoyed 100% ing the game but on the the other hand that took a long time.
@MammothCape35 yea i enjoyed.the story in avengers as well and wouldn't mind replaying it either, BUT and this is a big BUT i do not want to forego the amount of work I have put into leveling my characters in the post game.
Spiderman is a different story and I am fully okay with 100% clearing it again. You are right it did take a while to do, but i thoroughly enjoyed it. Plus apparently its a full remaster as opposed to an upgrade, so I guess its a bit of a different story?
Either way it would be cool if it just all worked.
Oh, well...another rumor
@torne You are right about Avengers and how the leveling up again would be annoying
Jim Ryan got to go
And some people bad mouthed the article this site wrote about the lack of communication from Sony's part. And now they act shocked in the comments. Didn't some of you say that article was pointless because the messaging from PlayStation is not necessary
Another why would they statement from me.
@Juanalf
If the PS5 is going to succeed it's going to be in spite of Jim Ryan and co. not becuase of them. The current group running Sony as a whole, not just the PlayStation division, are freaking idiots. While I know none of these companies are truly pro-consumer some people are good at putting on the act and generating good PR. All those people who did that at the start of this gen are now either no longer with the company or are in a reduced role. Ryan actually was there for this whole generation, too, but while the other execs were doing their best to create a positive message you had this moron saying stuff like 'who cares about old games?' and other nonsense. And while I may agree that backwards compatibility isn't the most important feature, others love it and to outright dismiss it like he did was dumb.
Don't really care tbh, but for games that are promoted free upgrades this is pretty balls. At least it seems like we will know upfront, so everyone can decide whether or not it's worth it. I mean I hope.
I have not started ANY Ps4 game that will get a Ps5 upgrade.
I never wanted to chance the posibility that the save wouldn't be cross play from Ps4 - Ps5???
@kyleforrester87
Well I don't know if I can help you there but I might hire you to mow my yard if you promise to sign a liability waiver and wear a helmet.
Why not just emulate the save slots like when you make a virtual PS1 memory card on the PS3. That’s my layman suggestion anyway I’m not an engineer or programmer.
@I_Like_It this was my immediate thought too. On my current PS4 I use an alternate account to replay games and have all the trophies reset so I can collect them again!
So yeah I wouldn’t be terribly upset if the rumour is true but I don’t see any logical reason why Sony would allow backwards compatibility without including saves. They would get hate mail for years.
@RobN
Microsoft seem to be doing better in every way at the moment except for one big thing. Big AAA exclusive games. That’s why Sony sells loads of consoles and gets sales and deserves to do well. If Microsoft had the exclusive quality big games at launch and next year things might be different.
Will be interesting to see if the multiplate games like assassins creed etc perform better on the series x or the same.
@SLEEVExOFxWIZARD teraflops mean absolutely nothing. They do not indicate level of performance, difference between chips (even when comparing the same architecture), they mean NOTHING. They are an arbitrary number invented by the tech community that provide zero real-world measure.
There has never been, and will never be, any singular number that gives even the remotest indication of chip performance.
People need to stop using them, they don't even get you in the ballpark of performance. Architecture is what matters and the architecture giving the other components more direct and almost instantaneous access to storage media is the single biggest change to gaming technology that has ever occurred. Developers that choose to leverage it will find themselves capable of making games that are impossible even on PC.
@Dezzy70 not even remotely.
@Gamer83 except, while his comment was very generic it is true. Retro games are a VERY niche market. It nets them ZERO money, and has almost zero impact on overall sales. Wanna play your old games? Fire up the old console, it's that easy.
@Oz_Momotaro if that was your point, then making it to me was redundant as I'd already made the point. I was responding to a question @JapaneseSonic asked as to why this might be the case. For the record a game using the "same engine" does not mean that the code, or even how it is structured is the same across platforms. Not even remotely. I don't want to get into a discussion about it because we're on the same page in general, and I was only answering a question for Japanese sonic.
Update:
Insomniac Games community director James Stevenson has now stated that, in the case of Marvel's Spider-Man: Miles Morales at least, your PS4 save will carry across to the PS5 if you utilise the title's free next-gen upgrade. This situation seems to suggest that cross-save has not been mandated by Sony and so some developers may opt not to support the feature
@Medic_Alert I’d put my money on it too. I think we’re going to see better graphical fidelity and performance on the X, while the PS5 could load games a couple of seconds faster. There’s no doubt the raw power of the X is more than enough to give it the edge.
@Medic_Alert i'll put my money to what i saw with my own eyes..not tflops and paid digital foundry tech analysis..what we saw so far was a halo infinite flop running on pc and on the other hand we saw breathtaking graphics with spiderman,demon souls and R&C..hell even last gen sony games (tlou2,ghost) look amazing and still unmatched..
For some reason I don’t really care... I can’t explain it! Maybe I’m ready for a blank slate. Sony really does need to clarify all these things though. I (and countless others) have preordered a device we only have 1/2 the info about. Why always so tight-lipped?
@Medic_Alert after the halo fiasko that DFwas trying to convince people that the lighting was the problem? ridiculous is you trying to devalue 3 exclusives with numbers about resolution and frame rates..go to an xbox site my friend..we don't care about your numbers we care about games..go grab an rtx3090 and count the frames in lol and cs go.
@Medic_Alert That's how it is now, excuses need to be made to cover up bad press. Why they can't just debunk it is beyond me.
@zebric21 Paid? Ok the buddy keep making excuses.
@Captain_Quark if you don't see that big youtube channels are just glorified advertisers (including sony products) then you must be like 12 years old..
@zebric21 Coming from the guy who said one person was a shill for an opinion? Well I don't think you can call anyone 12 years old. 👍
I can see how this would be annoying for people. I guess the way the two consoles retrieve data is different enough for workarounds to be needed.
Personally, I always planned on finishing up games on my PS4 before release day, but some people may not be able and also may want to sell their PS4, so this must be frustrating for them.
@Medic_Alert i might not bother, i'm totally happy with my ps4..both next gen consoles still have to prove themselves to me..i'll make a purchase decision when i have the full picture.
@zebric21
I can understand waiting to learn more.
I guess for me the stuff they haven’t shown I don’t care about. I keep all my consoles, so save transfer and extent of BC doesn’t matter to me. The UI would be nice to know but also not important. As long as I know I get to play the next R&C, GT, FF etc, that’s enough for me to stick with PS just because I’m so invested in their ecosystem.
The only piece of news I would genuinely love to see from Sony is their rolling back of their punitive and puritanical censorship practices.
@Shepherd_Tallon I can understand with some games its not a problem but with RPG's. 😬
Dragon Quest Heroes 2 200 hours. 😭
@Flaming_Kaiser Oh yeah I completely get it. But is this true for every game? Doesn't seem to be an issue for Spidey.
@ShogunRok Just say you're WIRED Push Square,or Push Forbes, or Playstation Blog Square, given Jim doesn't seem very chatty with gaming press,even Playstation focused ones!
Jokes aside,its frustrating that when the so-called content/communications people in charge of the blog & other areas are silent or talking anything but ps5 on twitter, we're still trying to divine the talking points from the GDC chat because we've lacked any follow up since what's under the hood.
They've been giving team green way too much air time.
@Shepherd_Tallon The free PS5 upgrade for Maneater is also confirmed to not carry over your PS4 save. That's two games so far now.
@Medic_Alert @LiamCroft Oh dear. It's not a good look really is it?
But why some games and not others? And when so many devs were very excited about how easy it is to develop for PS5?
I was saying the other day that people need to settle and stop fussing over how silent Sony are being, but they really need to start dampening some of these fires before it all gets away from them.
Anyway, thanks for the info, fam.
@JapaneseSonic I get you. I personally make a rule of not defending corporations (I try to get all consoles when they have games I want to play), but I had noticed a slant against Sony in gaming media in general lately.
Both MS and Sony are getting some things right, and some things wrong, but the focus is massively on Sony.
And stuff like this issue with saves doesn't help.
They really really need to kick off a serious and prolonged PR campaign asap.
Maybe SONY shouldn't bother at all with any form of B/C because every Gen it seems allover the place :-/ But saying that if I stick a PS4 game into the PS5 and it reads my PS4 game saves then I am fine with that. But knowing SONY it won't be that easy
@LiamCroft That’s great that we have an update on this, but also bad as this is from a developer and NOT Sony, who haven’t said a word on this at all. It’s more evidence of rumours being made simply due to a complete lack of facts or information from Sony, 40 odd days from launch! And even then in your story the developer seems to only discuss how there own game will work.
I've been saying all year that next gen was giving me a 7th gen vibe. And it has only been getting stronger with things like this.
During the 360, MS had a clear new vision for what gaming was going to turn in to, and built their console accordingly. Meanwhile, Sony, off of the huge success of the PS2, built an expensive, uncooked system and had to spend years catching up with the features the Xbox had.
MS saw the value in offering a robust cross gen vision, and Sony just wasn't prepared to play that game, instead they just tried to leverage the success of the PS4 to sell their next console. And given how the PS3 went, I wouldn't be surprised to find issues with the base PS5 (both hardware and OS wise) that aren't fixed until the slim releases.
And here's the thing. I'm not planning on buying either console yet. I'm not ready to upgrade, and neither console offers something I really need. But I'm at least happy to continue gaming and buying on my xbox because I know I won't lose anything I gain from now until I upgrade.
This isn't as big of a deal as people are making out. Anyway any new PS4 games submitted for certification after July 13 will have to be PS5-compatible for BC, so it's highly likely all new game save files with also carry over to PS5 as well.
I don't really get why this is such a big deal when we should be asking the important questions like do the PS5 free upgrades come with new trophies
Well, that sucks to say the least.... Thanks for nothing, Sony
@KirbyTheVampire
You’re 1000% correct.
I’m a hardcore Playstation fan. I love Playstation, always have. I’ve owned every single system with the exception of the Vita, and I did have a PS TV so it was close enough.
But the way this pre-next gen is going... I’m real tempted to go to Xbox. And I’ve only done that once. I owned a 360 before a PS3 because Sony’s launch was so terrible and I wasn’t going to blow 600 bucks.
I picked up a PS3 later in its lifecycle and loved it. But it had a lot of growing pains and it alienated a lot of people like me in the beginning.
I’m getting some PS3 vibes out of the PS5. I didn’t preorder specifically because of my concerns for back compat and the upgrade policies.
Sony needs to do a deep dive and alleviate our concerns.
Well here I am thinking that was the whole reason to purchase a remaster or remake on the PS3 - PS4 games. To replay the whole new game with a complete new trophy list! Do you really want to pay $20 for the Spiderman game to boot it up and you instantly finished the game?
If you want to just continue your progress just play the original PS4 game as BC. Then I would expect game saves to carry over.
@ChipBoundary
I'm just a gamer, I don't worship at the altar of Sony like most here so I'm not concerned with the company's financials, it makes more than enough money in other sectors that regardless of how niche it is or how little money backwards compatibility brings in, it's a feature that should be part of the experience especially when the direct competition is doing a great job with it. I gave Sony a pass this gen, but since because I'm not a hardware designer and maybe it really would've been too difficult and too costly to implement PS3 bc. That's not the case now and when I see MS doing well with something that Sony can do just as easily, I'm going ask for better. This also extends to things like upgrading your current gen games. If MS can make save files work between the different versions, there shouldn't be an issue on PS5.
@Dezzy70 Not sure Microsoft is doing EVERYTHING better.
I like the budget console being the same as the full-priced console except for the drive - win for Sony.
I like that the expandable storage, while it won't be cheap, will be an industry standard and not proprietary - win for Sony.
I think the terraflops vs throughput question won't be clear until we're well into multiplatform games optimizing for each system, but I wouldn't be surprised if Sony ends up winning that one in the end - extra terraflops that have to wait for the drive to deliver data are useless. This one's a tossup for now - and maybe for the next year or two. It could end up like the PS3 - before developers learn to harness the power, the PS versions are weaker, but once they develop PS-first, the PS multiplats are superior. We'll see.
New controller with actual new features - win for Sony, though a lot will depend on developers actually USING those features.
Lower price for new games? First-party new releases on the subscription service (for less than the price of three new games a year)? EA Play included in the subscription service? Simpler upgrade of current-gen games to next-gen games? Microsoft wins, all...but each one of those Sony has a chance to compete in post-release, more easily than hardware changes.
Reading what insomniac have said and the Maneater FAQ, it's simple if game has cross-buy then saves transfer over but if a new game which Maneater PS5 is it have it's own trophy list etc where Miles Morales will share a list on both PS4 and PS5.
@Shepherd_Tallon Yeah i know but with RPG's i cant do it start from the start. Especially with the RPG's with horrible grindy trophies.
@Flaming_Kaiser I hear you. It's far from the ideal scenario.
@Shepherd_Tallon But lets hope they find a workaround. But with all the stuff thats going on this isnt really a big issue.
@Gamer83 so.... because Microsoft does it, they should do it? Then how come other flagship phones aren't running iOS?? Their competitor is doing it! We need our iMessage and FaceTime!
Sorry chief, not how that works. We get it, YOU want backwards compatibility, and so do a few others. They've chosen not to do it and chosen to throw their money at other features and it will in no way impact their overall sales.
@deathaxe this isn't Playstation related or even remotely related to the article...but the issue with the CTD was resolved by a driver update. This was to compensate for the AIB partners using inferior quality parts on their cards. Which Nvidia has zero control over.
@Medic_Alert I'm sorry, but there are literally millions of old consoles floating around, enough to keep the old consoles running for people that want them for hundreds of years. That being said, they are not difficult to repair, and they aren't unreliable.
Especially the super-retro consoles. If they break, it is because YOU did something. Overall, if you take proper care of them, they don't break, period.
HAHAHA nice save with that "Update" Pushsquare. I guess that made up nonsense you spewed with this article was just that, nonsense. Stay classy and hateful.
@Medic_Alert well, a quick ebay search will easily debunk your entire argument. Not to mention, console repair/refurbishment is part of what I do for a LIVING. That being said, as mentioned, if you take care of your consoles you won't NEED to repair them.
I have my day 1 Playstation, my day 1 PS2, my day 1 PS3, day 1 Xbox, Day 1 360, day 1 Xbone, day 1 ps4....all in PERFECT working order. You have NO clue what you are talking about. And yes, in theory it IS a matter of time, but as mentioned it will literally take hundreds of years. Not to mention, that's only for the console-specific parts. Generic parts such as capacitors, resistors, etc are will ALWAYS be in ample supply.
Glad I didn't manage to pre order a PS5. Will wait for this to all be sorted out. Sony are getting it all wrong at the moment.
@NYJetsfan123 Same here!
Totally agree.
@torne I just got info that Avengers will support a save transfer because its a service game.
I'm also curious how the trophies will look. My OCD is not going to like it if, for example, Avengers and Miles Morales don't have a shared trophy list across both generations, like some games have across PS3/PS4/Vita.
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