Topic: Official Push Square Xbox Thread

@Qu1n0n3z On Game Pass:

The Gunk
The Ascent
Tell Me Why
Sunset Overdrive
Ryse: Son of Rome
ReCore
Rare Replay
Quantum Break
Perfect Dark
Ori and the Blind Forest/Ori and the Will of the Wisps
Octopath Traveler (it's also on Switch but it's not on PlayStation)
Fable
Crackdown
Crimson Skies
Blinx the Time Sweeper
Battletoads
Banjo-Kazooie
Conker
Alan Wake's American Nightmare (the expansion is still exclusive to Xbox)

There are also a bunch of backwards compatible games and I think you can buy most of them digitally:

Lost Odyssey
Blue Dragon
Condemned: Criminal Origins
Gatling Gears
Hydro Thunder Hurricane
ilomilo
Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet
Ninja Gaiden II
Witcher 2
Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind
Jade Empire

@LtSarge I didn't know Octopath hasn't released on PlayStation 5 (yet), that's a pretty good shout then.

These lists bring back a lot of memories of games that I used to play, though (Xbox was the console I gamed on most for a short while). A lot of those games, even though I have played a lot of them, aren't particularly good, like Crackdown. On the other hand there are a lot of forgotten gems on there too: Jade Empire and Lost Odyssey!

@R1spam Indeed - there was nothing else like it at the time and so the 'issues' were not as important. The frame rate may of been poor, but it was comparable to a LOT of games. Even the control scheme 'worked' because you had no preconceived ideas on how that could be 'better' - at least until Halo revolutionised the FPS on console with a 'controller'.

@Qu1n0n3z I wouldn't dismiss all Forza, Halo or Gears games as there are 'spin-offs' that offer a completely different type of experience albeit set in or 'linked' to the Original IP. For example, Forza Motorsport is that 'traditional' Racing Sim (think Gran Turismo) but Forza Horizon is more like Burnout Paradise (albeit without the 'take-downs) and MANY gamers who don't like 'Racing', like Horizon. Its an Open World Arcade 'racing' game. Halo is not just a First Person Shooter either as Halo Wars is a RTS game (more like C&C) and Spartan Assault/Strike are top down twin stick arcade style shooters. Gears of War is your 3rd Person Action Adventure, but Gears Tactics is a Turn Based tactical game like Xcom. Even Flight Sim isn't as 'boring' (anymore) as it sounds if you want to 'Race' aircraft with the Reno Racing expansion...

Point is, from '3' IP's, you have 'numerous' different genres of gaming. Maybe you don't like FPS games but enjoy RTS, don't like 'Sim' racers, but enjoy Arcade racers etc.

As LtSarge lists, there are a lot of other options too and with Game Pass, you have the ability to try ALL those games, inc those you have 'written off' for 'free'. You have little to lose from trying these (as well as access to a LOT of other games too) and will get access to 'new' games (like Stalker 2, Plague Tale, Starfield, Redfall, Fable, Perfect Dark etc) when they release.

@Kidfried I thought the first Crackdown was okay, but Crackdown 2 was really good. There's a severe lack of open world games with superpowers nowadays. During the PS3/360 days, we had games like Prototype, Crackdown, inFAMOUS and so on, and they were just so much fun. If anything, Crackdown could be a nice breath of fresh air compared to most open world games today.

Still haven't played Lost Odyssey yet but Jade Empire is indeed a great hidden gem! For those who love the Mass Effect series, you absolutely need to play Jade Empire. I would've mentioned Knights of the Old Republic as well seeing as how you can only play it on Xbox for now, but a remake for PS5 is in the works now so it's probably best to play that one instead when it comes out.

@Qu1n0n3z And like @BAMozzy said, you really should give Forza Horizon a shot. People who don't like racing games tend to find Forza Horizon to be a lot of fun. I mean, if you like racing in open world games like GTA and whatnot, then you will love Forza Horizon. You can drive pretty much anywhere in the open world and there are also crazy showcase events where you race against monster trucks, airplanes and jet skis. It's definitely tons of fun, you can't really go wrong with this series.

@LtSarge The original KOTOR is on Switch too!

(Personally I wouldn't say there's been a drought of superpower open world games during the last gen. I've played two Infamous games, the Batman games, Gravity Rush, two Spider-Man games. Then there is Saints Row IV, Megaton Rainfall and I think you could classify some of LEGO games as open world too. But I guess it depends on your taste what you'd call 'severe lack'.
I've tried the two Crackdown games and struggled to find anything appealing, but that's probably a matter of taste. I remember many people liked it back in the day!)

@LtSarge Forgot to say thank you for posting that list. I know somewhere in the foreseeable future I'll buy a Series X for the exclusives, so it's always good to be reminded of what's on there. Right now Xbox still doesn't have enough for me to warrant a 500 euro purchase, but I'm sure that day will come.

@Kidfried Well I mean, most of those series you mentioned are not seeing new releases anymore. Last inFAMOUS was in 2014, Batman in 2015, Gravity Rush in 2017, Saints Row in 2014 and so on. Protoype and Crackdown haven't seen a new entry in years and we probably won't get new ones anytime soon. So I do feel like this type of open world games is dying out. Granted, we're getting two new DC open world games soon and Spider-Man 2 next year, but I would love to see some original stuff as well. Hopefully the new Wolverine game is open world, would love to climb on buildings with him!

@Kidfried No problem mate, glad to be of (future) help! And yeah, for most people buying a Series X is not worth it right now. I'm sure by late next year it will be worth it since hopefully a lot of the announced games have come out by then. Are there any upcoming Xbox first-party titles that you're looking forward to?

@LtSarge I'm interested in Replaced, Hellblade 2, Shredders, Lake and Tunic! Most of them not first party I believe, but (timed) console exclusive nonetheless. But I expect more announcements in the next year. And my partner is a big fan of Bethesda games, so they'll probably not want to miss out on Starfield if it turns out to be a great game.

@Kidfried I'm also looking forward to Hellblade 2 and Tunic, they look very promising! I'm glad that you're interested in checking out Lake because I recently finished it and it's such a relaxing game, I think you're going to like it.

Based on these games and The Artful Escape that you mentioned earlier, it seems that you're a big fan of indie games, which is a good thing when going into the Xbox ecosystem. Because if there's anything Xbox has a lot of, it's great indie titles and the fact that you can play lots of them through Game Pass is such a nice thing. I hope that you'll give the service a shot whenever you get a Series X (the first three months or one month depending on if they've changed the deal is only €1) since I think you'll be amazed by the output of great indie games. I know you like the SteamWorld Dig games, so I think you might like The Gunk as well since it's made by the same developer.

We all know Xbox relied heavily on Forza, Halo and Gears through the last gen - albeit with different gaming genres (Forza M5, 6, 7, FH2, 3, 4 & 5, Halo W2, Spartan A/S & Infinite GoW4, 5, Tactics) that's a 'bulk' of the Exclusives and account for quite a 'few' games over the Generation so would need to go back further in history for games - other than those mentioned already like Ryse, Sunset Overdrive, Crackdown 3, Sea of Thieves etc that also released of course. A lot of exclusives too ended up coming to other platforms later, like Rise of the Tomb Raider or the Medium so that also helped bolster the 'exclusive' rosta during a time when Xbox had 'few' studio's to make games - hence perhaps the over reliance on those 3 IP's but at least had sense to try and do different gaming genres to add variety...

That's why there isn't that many games outside of Forza, Halo and Gears because that constituted the bulk of releases, topped up by some great 3rd party exclusives (Sunset Overdrive or Titanfall for example), some timed 'exclusives' and Indie games too which perhaps don't get the same credibility as AAA games but I guess that also comes down to what people want to play.

If its 'Xbox Exclusives' in particular you are looking for, the last gen is the weakest which is why MS had to go on a big drive to acquire more. Playground (Forza Horizon & Fable) had talked about making an open world RPG and expanding to do so before MS acquired them (Push Square did an article about it because it potentially could of been multi-platform - maybe pushed MS into asking them if they'd like to do Fable and then acquiring them to make sure they had the funds and support to do it).

Now with Game Pass as their priority platform and knowing they need big hitters every 'month' to both encourage and then keep subscribers, they have Xbox Publishing and of course ID@Xbox too to bring games 'exclusively' to Xbox/Game Pass - like Avalanche's (Mad Max, Just Cause) Contraband and some other AAA developer games have been rumoured too - inc the 'on-going' Kojima cloud based project. On top of that, there will be deals for day 1 release of multi-platform games on Game Pass - like Outriders, MLB21, B4B and the upcoming Plague Tale for example so even if they haven't got a 'big' First Party release (like Redfall, Starfield, Fable, Perfect Dark, Avowed, Hellblade2, Outer Worlds2, State of Decay 3 etc as well as Forza Motorsport and no doubt more entries in the [Forza] Horizon, Gears and Halo games too), don't have Big Xbox Published games that month, they at least have a big 'multi-platform' title coming Day 1 - as well as new 'indies' every month and access to a big library of games that span 'decades' of gaming history inc many of the Xbox exclusives (probably enhanced too on Series X) that you can play for a small monthly fee (Ultimate adds streaming on any compatible hardware, Gold on Console and its 'perks' and the 'other versions' (PC/Mobile Game Pass to play on any platform and EA Play on console too so get games like Star Wars Fallen Jedi for example too)

At least with Game Pass, you can try any of those games 'free' under your subscription. Even if 'Forza Horizon 5' isn't really your thing to 'risk' spending the $50+ (or whatever it costs now) to try it, you can play as much or as little as you want with NO obligation to buy or spend any 'additional' money to unlock the 'same' content as those that bought it - its the whole game 'free' for as long as it's in Game Pass and as long as you remain Subscribed. When it leaves, you get an extra 20% off whatever the price has dropped to as well if you want to own it. Its the same experience for 'free' and if it's not your thing, there are 'hundreds' of other experiences to try...

@LtSarge @BAMozzy For me it's a bit hard to assess if Game Pass is worth it. It's not like I have loads of free time and just wish there were more games to play. If I look back at last year, I would have gotten about 100/120 euro worth of games that I am truly interested in. That's about worth it, but on the other hand when I buy these games myself I can play them forever instead of being vendor locked.

@Kidfried Why not use a combined approach where you continue to buy games you really want while using Game Pass to try out titles that you're not sure if they're worth buying or not? I'm sure you've bought some games expecting them to be good and then realised they weren't worth the money. That's why Game Pass is a great complement to any gamer who just love to try out different games while saving money in the process.

But yeah, it's hard to decide whether it's worth it or not until you've tried it.

@LtSarge The way I see it, most games I'm interested in don't appear on Game Pass. So a Game Pass subscription is basically just an increase of 10 euro to my monthly expenses. And I do sometimes make a purchase that's not worth it, but that won't change when I have Game Pass, because I'll still have to pay for the majority of the games I play.

I don't believe Game Pass is a good fit for any gamer. And like I said, you don't own the games you play on Game Pass, which is something I also don't really like.

@Kidfried If I look at just the games I would of 'bought' - especially at launch when they are the 'most' expensive, then Game Pass may not seem great value. I would of bought Forza Horizon 5 for example but I would probably of waited to play Back 4 Blood or Outriders until I could pick them up in a sale. After 2020's Halo showing, I wouldn't have paid the asking price for literally 'just' the Campaign either so the price may seem to be quite steep for the 'actual' games I would of bought.

There is no way I'd spend money on games like the Artful Escape, the Gunk, Aliens: Fireteam, the Medium, Psychonauts 2, Marvel's Avengers, The Ascent etc etc and its not 'just' new games released this 'year' but also all those older games I missed because at the 'time' I didn't think they would offer what I would want from that game at the current asking price - like Psychonauts or Recore.

However, as there is 'no' barrier to try, no 'risk' to trying and 'no' expectation because IF I am paying £50+ for a game, I have a certain expectation. If I don't think a game is worth the asking price or even think that another game would be a 'better' use of my money (like buying an RPG over a short 8hr game because RPG's can offer a LOT more hours worth for my money - I hate spending £50+ and a few hours later have finished with the game - but that's me), then it doesn't get bought. However much I intend to maybe buy at a 'later' date, there is always something 'new'.

However, with Game Pass, it doesn't matter whether or not I think Halo: infinite is worth the asking price, whether or not its worth taking the chance on, I can jump straight in and make up my 'own' mind.

I didn't think I'd get my 'moneys' worth from Game Pass - I'm a 'collector/hoarder' by nature and like buying games on Disc, having that case on my shelf (preferably a Steel Book - as I said I am a bit of a collector) and the thought of not 'owning' my games didn't really 'sit' with me - part of the reason I would NEVER buy an Indie and also the fact that I could buy AAA games on Disc in sales for less money. However, I decided to 'go for it' with the release of the Series X and have no regrets at all.

I wouldn't have played the Medium, Outriders, the Ascent, Psychonauts 2, Artful Escape, Back4Blood, Halo: Infinite, FH5, Aliens Fireteam, the Gunk etc as well as 'older' releases I missed for (up to) £132 (the cost of GPU for a 'year') and 'at best' the money saved by 'not' subscribing would of allowed me to buy a couple of those games. Do I care that I don't 'own' these - NO - some I wouldn't buy when they leave Game Pass - the Medium for example I have fully completed so not really interested in 'replaying'. But then when it does leave, I get an 'extra' 20% off the current price. If its now only £8, I pay £6 for it- that's a LOT less than buying it Day 1.

Looking ahead to 2022, we have Stalker 2, Redfall, Starfield (already more than £132 worth), A Plague Tale, Warhammer: Darktide, Scorn, Atomic Heart, Sniper Elite 5, Weird West - as well as Deathloop of course and numerous other indies already confirmed. This is the 'new' games coming on Day1 - not counting any games you may have wanted but haven't yet bought added too.

From my perspective, as someone who prefers to buy Physical, Game Pass is allowing me to play many, many games I would never of bought - like Ori, Cuphead, Sea of Thieves, the Medium, the Artful Escape, Psychonauts etc and play many games Day 1 which isn't possible with my Gaming budget. Take just the holiday season with everyone releasing their big holiday titles, usually at least 2-3 big games a month from sept and with Christmas ahead, It would cost me more than a 'whole' year of Game Pass to play all those.

Also with Xbox Rewards, you can earn points which can be exchanged for Game Pass subscriptions so you can use those to reduce the annual cost. One programme I am with, I can earn 1 month of 'free' GPU every 3 months so I only pay for £88 a year for mine - and keep my rewards to convert to Gift Cards (like topping up your PS+ Wallet) so I can use those to 'buy' games in the sales or when they leave GP.

Game Pass is a 'curated' list of games that for a 'small' monthly charge gives you access to all Xbox exclusives on Day1 as well as a selection of 3rd Party games (exclusives, timed exclusives and multi-platform releases) on Day 1 and a selection of older games going back over 20yrs of Xbox history. There is enough on there, and frequent enough 'new' stuff added that you 'could' just keep your Xbox Console for Game Pass games - never spend more than your Game Pass Ultimate Subscription (which also gives you Gold for Online gaming and the perks of that subscription service, the ability to use Game Pass on PC/Mobile too at no extra charge, stream games to any compatible hardware, EA Play access and 'perks' for Ultimate subscribers (like a free month of Disney+, months of youtube Premium, bonus in-game items etc).

Lets be honest here, the 'cost' of Game Pass Ultimate (£10.99 here in the UK) is 'less' than buying 1 'indie' game a month. The Anacrusis which releases on the 13th Jan will cost $29.99, with a discount for launch week to $23.99 (according to their information) which is 'two' months of Game Pass - whether its your thing or not, this is 'just' 1 GP release this month and whether you'd buy it for that much or not becomes 'irrelevant'. All that does become relevant with ALL the Game Pass games is does it look 'fun' enough for me to give it a try for free.

Owning Game Pass has changed my interest in games. I used to watch trailers and think that doesn't interest me enough to spend £50 or just dismiss 'indies' for example because I don't buy 'Digital' but now look at GP game trailers and my only thought is has it done enough to make me want to try. With Ultimate and streaming, the hassle of downloading to 'try' something is also removed - that's how I played the Artful Escape and Marvel Avengers. For a maximum of £11 (here) a month, less than £3 a week, you could literally never need to buy a game for your Xbox again - you'd also be getting Games with Gold and EA Access on top of what games are in Game Pass...

And another thing about Game Pass is that I can still buy Halo, FH5, B4B, Outriders etc etc on 'Disc' to add to my 'permanent' collection if I want to but I can 'buy' them when they drop in price to a point I am willing to spend. I still have that Day1 'experience' but without the £50+ price tag. You just don't get the 'extra' 20% discount on Physical but then its a lot cheaper now than at release.

Like I said, you 'never' need to buy a Game on Xbox again - just buy the games on Playstation that aren't on Game Pass. Use Game Pass for all the Xbox Exclusives, 3rd Party games, indies etc that you can play and save yourself money for the games you 'have' to buy!

You can even play the entire Mass Effect trilogy (legendary Edition) through Game Pass Ultimate thanks to having EA Play as well...

@BAMozzy I'm happy Game Pass is great value for you and many others, but it's just not per se a great value for me.

Time is limited, so I really just want to play the games I am interested the most. Not play games 'because I can' or 'because I'm able to give them a try'. If I'm most excited for Returnal and Death's Door then a 100 euro spent on them is the best value for me, regardless of any amount of games Game Pass has to offer.

Quoted for truth!

@Kidfried Fair enough!

Its not like you (or anyone else) has to 'commit' to Game Pass and you 'could' try a month as and when you have the time and/or games available to take advantage of the catalogue, try the games you weren't sure about etc.

I must admit, I hadn't really considered the amount of time someone has as a significant reason to be concerned with the value proposition but I do appreciate that everyone is in a different situation to myself.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy what gaming time you do get and get to enjoy all the games you want to...

@BAMozzy Yea, very true. Trying it for a few months to play and try some games is probably a good idea anyway. And I'm pretty sure the service will evolve still, so its value could still increase for me.

I'm definitely not against the service, just not convinced yet.

One of resolutions for this year is to work less and change my contract. I will probably manage financially, but it'll be somewhat of a challenge. So as soon as I have some more free time on my hands, I might also be able to game some more, like I used to. We'll see!

Also, thanks for your well written posts in this thread. I learned a bit about Game Pass I didn't know yet. Cheers!