Topic: Nintendo Switch --OT--

@KratosMD
The Wii U was garbage, no doubt. The console poorly conceived (I said it from the beginning as somebody who thought the original Wii was a very good console) and the games, aside from a few, very meh. But the Switch has been different. Zelda and Mario Kart 8 (people here are hyping Crash, so Mario Kart 8 counts on the Nintendo side) in the first two months of the system. Arms - which is scoring better than I believe any Sony AAA exclusive outside of inFamous: Second Son scored in the PS4's first year - is due out very soon and then you have Splatoon 2, Super Mario Odyssey and Xenoblade 2. You can downplay it all you want, that's a better first 9 months than the first 12 months PS4 or Xbox One had and there's been a lot of enthusiasm around the system. You don't have to like what Nintendo offers, that's fine, but I don't see a dark ages 2.0 happening.

Three big exclusives for the rest of the year would be great for Sony or Microsoft, who balance out their release schedules with a plethora of third party titles. Three big exclusives when you have nothing else is worrying. Besides, the point was discussing "winning" E3, and we knew about all those games prior to the convention. What I was saying was that this Direct was an act of misdirection - it was like bringing on the beautiful assistant to draw the eye away from the sleight of hand of the magician. Sony pulled off a similar feat in 2015.

Nobody remembers that in 2015, Microsoft had a great conference. Nobody remembered that the day after they held it. You know why? Because Sony rocked up and said FINAL FANTASY VII, THE LAST GUARDIAN, SHENMUE III and everybody lost their minds.

Two years later, and one of those games came out six months ago, and the other two sound as if they're barely started. They "won" E3 by making us forget that they had no first party exclusives coming out for the rest of the year, and got us to pay attention to games that would be coming two, three, four, god knows how many years down the line. I called it out at the time but nobody listened because they were all too busy erecting shrines to Cloud Strife.

That's 2017 Nintendo. Yeah, we were all very excited about Metroid Prime 4. I'm even more excited about Pokemon. But if I'd thrown money at a Switch, I'd be more concerned about what I'm going to play on it before 2019.

Kirby and Yoshi of course!

@johncalmc Yeah, sure. Three big exclusives are all that's coming to the Switch this year. No other big exclusives (Mario+Rabbids, FE Warriors). No weekly release of eshop games. No notable third party releases (Rocket League, Redout, FIFA, Skyrim, etc.)

The fact of the matter is that Nintendo's system is the only one that has consistently great software releasing on it before 2018. Every month, in fact. It's awesome. I hope Nintendo can keep it up, because it's building momentum (or, as much momentum as you can build when your console is still hard to get).

Almost the entirety of 2017 feels for me, as a Switch owner, like the first quarter of 2017 did for PS4 owners. Great game after great game after great game.

^ It's surely reductive to say that three big exclusives are all that is coming to the Switch this year but the other games are kind of interesting, not really system sellers. Mario+Rabbids and a Warrior game are big exclusives? I'd pay not to have Rabbids in my game ever...

@Ralizah Perhaps I should have been less literal when I phrased that. I don't mean that's all that's coming. I mean that there isn't much in the way of marquee titles. Even Xenoblade isn't, really. Mario, sure. Splatoon and Xenoblade, not quite so much. Beyond that?

Fire Emblem is niche, Warriors is niche, and a mash up between them is, well, niche. Mario/Rabbids could be a winner... I guess. FIFA is the watered down version, Rocket League has been released on every other console already, and Skyrim is five years old.

It's nice to see people happy with their Switch's, but on a wider scale - I'm talking mass market - you can surely see how a lot of people think the line-up is sparse. On a personal level, Xenoblade Chronicles was my favourite RPG of the Wii generation - I know that's not tough, but it was an amazing game - and I'm super excited for 2. I'm as excited about Pokemon as anyone. But I can't look at what they have for this console and say, sure, these are killer apps. Third party support is super weak right now.

@johncalmc As if most of the best PS4 games released in early 2017 like Gravity Rush 2, Nioh, Persona 5, and Nier: Automata weren't niche? Not everything needs to be a superhit like Mario, CoD, Uncharted, Pokemon (speaking of which, I totally forgot about Pokken Tournament, which is also releasing this year!), etc. The console is steadily gaining a hugely quality library early on, which will likely lead to increasingly snowballing demand for it by the end of the year. I can't think of any other console that has had so many good exclusives in its first year.

Also, as TLOU Remastered and the Nathan Drake Collection have shown, software doesn't have to be entirely new to be relevant to the current market. As someone who never owned a PS3, TLOU and Uncharted remasters might as well have been new games (for me). The same will be true for people who never owned the Wii U.

@Feena Mario+Rabbids looks awesome. Pretty sure it's going to be one of 2017's sleeper hits.

@KratosMD Not quite sure I understand your point. Yes, the Switch is getting third party games that have released elsewhere, because it's new on the market, and, to my knowledge, time is broadly understood to move from past to present. As you guys have pointed out with regard to the PS4 and its early glut of ports and remasters, the point isn't that any individual game is hugely driving sales, but that they're building on and diversifying the system's library. Anyhow, Bethesda support for a Nintendo console is huge, considering the last console they released a game on was... what, the NES? It's a very good show of early support for Nintendo, especially after the Wii U crashed and burned as spectacularly as it did.

@Ralizah Yup. They are niche. But my entire point was that Sony and Microsoft balance their heavy hitters and niche titles alongside third party, multi platform games to keep a steady stream going. Nintendo don't have that luxury because third party support is weak.

Example: look at the PS4 launch titles. It's quite an impressive list. Sure, I wouldn't play most of them because I couldn't give a fig about games like Need For Speed or Madden or COD. But they're massive games. If you remove all of the third party, multi platform games from PS4, the list is limp and unimpressive. That's the problem I find with Switch.

For gamers who want big games, Switch is a non-starter unless they buy another console to complement it. This E3 didn't change that much at all, because their line-up is looking pretty sparse. That's all I'm saying. If you love Fire Emblem and Xenoblade then you're in heaven, but the man on the street needs a little more. That's why they namedropped Pokemon despite having nothing to show - to distract from the relative lack upcoming games that will make an impact.

I don't think switch is designed to be your number one home console. They've pretty much handed that award over. It's a console to fit around your life.

Personally what Nintendo has managed to achieve is a minor miracle. They were on their knees with wii u. Switch is great, you only need 6/7 games to see you through.

@KratosMD Rocket League on the move? That is huge news for the 180,000 people playing two nights ago on ps4 alone. It's current and fresh regardless when it was released originally.

I've actually just deleted it as I couldn't play anything else.

@johncalmc I don't disagree, but does the man in the street even watch E3? Nintendo's not going to get the masses on board for a couple of years, even in a best case scenario. What it needs to do, and what it succeeded in doing (if E3 opinion polls after Nintendo's event are anything to go by), is convince gamers that it's becoming a worthwhile device to invest money in.

I don't think anyone has pretended that it'll meet the same needs as a PS or Xbox console, which are, to the masses, third party machines. It never will, and it doesn't need to to be successful.

Agreed. People act like the Switch is a competitor to the PS4. It's not, and it doesn't need to be to achieve mass adoption, imo.

To be perfectly blunt, I think Nintendo would still be up a river if they hadn't made the Switch all about versatility and instead released a box to try and compete with Sony's box.

I totally agree - they have managed to find a place in the market. I am going to get it at some point (probably with Mario Odyssey or a cool limited edition) but it's kind of a splurge, I don't feel like I NEED it. Though probably I would have caved in for Zelda had I not have a WiiU. Virtual Console alone would totally change my stance on it. I'd buy one now If I could play the SNES library on TV/on the go.

@johncalmc You don't need all the big AAA multiplat titles right now. It's a good system with software popping up everywhere.

Originally prior to buying one I thought I wanted Nintendo to release a comparable system to Sony. That's not the case anymore as it's great for family gaming and fun games.

For you John I wouldn't buy one to play on your own, what's the point when you have more immerse games on ps4? But for a family, immersion is a luxury one can't afford.

@KratosMD I agree, but Rocket League on the move is new.

Im defending the switch as I never owned a wii u and so far so good. If you had a wii u I would be dissatisfied too, but hey that's life.

@themcnoisy Another good point. Even if a game is "old" (as if that matters when games like GTA V and Minecraft literally sell consoles to people), the Switch is the only platform on which you can play it portably.

I get that a lot of people here don't see the value in portability, but I do think there is market demand for a system that can big, home console-level games on the go. The Switch's early success seems to be backing that opinion up. Let's see how things progress.

The Switch wasn't really built for me. Its biggest unique selling point, portability, is of no interest what so ever. 1st party games would need to be 'numerous', appealing and something special for me to drop that much money on the console and games. My kids have grown up, left home etc so not likely to play 'co-op' 'kids' games - no matter how much 'fun' than be. I liked Tom and Jerry as a kid but I don't watch them now.

I can't get excited by just the Metroid name either. It 's not as if every Metroid game has smashed it out of the park either. As far as I am concerned, I am never going to play on the go, so I am not going to buy downgraded or content cut versions of the games I can buy on PS or XB. It really doesn't make sense. Like I said though, the console isn't built for me...

Skyrim could well be a test bed though to see how popular old games are on the Switch. You might not see Red Dead Redemption 2 come to Switch but you could see the first. If these are successful, Nintendo could bring a lot of PS3/XB360 era games to its users with the unique selling point of 'Mobility'. CoD WW2 might not make it but W@W could (or one of the others) to give Nintendo the FPS MP to play on the go. Last gen had a lot of great games and really was the era that took online gaming to the masses. It also had a number of co-op games as well as RPG's, action adventures etc that could come to the Switch so it doesn't all have to be shovel ware or 'indie/arcade' type games - but games that could take advantage of the online/co-op components on the go. It might not be the most current 3rd party games but if you are trying to appeal to the CoD, Fifa etc masses, how better than to offer these ad the opportunity to play them wherever?

@Ralizah the switch is great right now as in general peoples lives are more out of the house than 5-10-20 years ago. Whenever Im on holiday from work there's a good chance I'm also on holiday away from Merseyside, I used to take my Vita (which is a nightmare with kids) but this year we will take the switch and actually join in together.

If snes, n64 and gc games make it over - it's now a mobile retro player! Yes there are tablet versions of emulators but the switch would then become the official best way to play.

I think portability will make a difference. I was planning on Skyrim for Switch (may change with the VR announcement!) because picking up and playing that type of game on the go is just awesome. I spent last night on the sofa with a poorly child on me as I played Switch and the wife watched telly (#parenting).

If you gave me some classic AAA gaming experiences on the go, like Skyrim, I would be up for them as well as first party exclusives. Sure I would like brand new AAA experiences on the Switch but also, the idea of playing something like Red Dead Redepmption 1 on the go is incredibly appealing.

@Rudy_Manchego And that's where I see the Switch succeeding with 3rd Party software. It may not be 'exciting' for some looking for the latest games and only seeing a line up of 'old' or stripped down modern titles but as a 'companion' to a PS, XB or PC, the chances are that IF you want to sit down specifically for those, you wouldn't buy them on Switch anyway. Its the fact you can go anywhere and play these. Ok so you can just 'dock' it and carry on if you want but the Switch could still play some/all of the last gen games better than the last gen consoles could. Handheld, the visuals won't necessarily be 'improved' - although could get better lighting, shadows etc but docked could actually be the 'best' place to play these games again too...