Topic: Unpopular Gaming Opinions

@Ralizah @KratosMD @DerMeister @kyleforrester87

I would like to add to the point that @QualityGeezer has made. I was a huge fan of Nintendo - so much so the GC was my first console of the Gamecube, ps2, xbox era. I had a Game boy advance, wavebird, multiple game cards and peripherals. Super Monkey Ball, FZero GX, Rogue Leader, the best version of Soul Calibur 2. Absolutely awesome.

However by the end of that gen I had absolutely enough of Nintendos output and its big hitters. Something changed in the way I felt about the games.

As they keep reusing iconic characters Mario, Link, Samus etc to me the games have become whimsical churlish experiences. Put on Mario Odyssey. Great there's Mario Again doing what Mario does. Put on Smash Brothers. Great there's mini characters fighting mini characters again. Put on Zelda, there's link again doing what Link does to fight the boss to basically do it all again. None of those games are bad. They are all amazing, gameplay perfection. But due to the recycled events, characters and mechanics I have had enough.

Nintendos games are too safe, samey, cosy and benign. This can also be applied to Uncharteds semi game / movie template. Fifa and Cods annual iterations. Same sh£t different day.

For me variety is the spice of life and I like new things. Like @KratosMD encouraging me to play P4G. Chatting to @kyleforrester87 about the secrets in Fez. Getting advice on Danganronpa from @Ralizah or talking fighting tactics on a plethora of fighting with @DerMeister

That's way more interesting than talking about how many moons I have collected in Super Mario 72.

@themcnoisy Peoples tastes change over time and what does it for you one decade might not the next, it doesn’t mean you won’t swing back to enjoying Nintendo’s output. As for reusing characters etc, I don’t really buy that. Each new instalment tends to stand up on its own, and its only so obvious since it contrasts with Sony’s approach of dropping mascots every few years, which in itself can be a bummer as good franchises get lost to time.

In my opinion....

Breath of the Wild - Best openworld game of all time
Odyssey - Best 3D platformer of all time
Xenoblade Chronicles 2 - 3rd best JRPG of all time

It does help that I have never been a huge Nintendo gamer, I missed a lot of the Mario games.

I don't think engaging in a diversity of software and enjoying consistently excellent Nintendo series are mutually exclusive, personally. Besides, there's a lot of variety in some of their big series. Games like Breath of the Wild, The Wind Waker, and Majora's Mask are all radically different experiences from one another, for example, despite all being in the same broad "Zelda" category. And even if you ignore the big series, you still have stuff like Splatoon, Pikmin, Metroid, Xenoblade Chronicles, Fire Emblem, etc.

Of course, I couldn't get on with JUST their stuff, which is why I'm a multi-platform gamer, but, of the big three manufacturers, their game design philosophy is the one that appeals to me the most. Perhaps because they're still, by far, the one that has kept most in touch with their Japanese roots (Xbox never had any to begin with, and Playstation is basically an American brand these days). Nothing Microsoft makes anymore excites me on any level (aside from Cuphead, if that counts, and maybe the Ori games). Playstation's games are often too realistic, cinematic, and violent for my tastes, although I usually find some stuff from their first-party developers that I like (HZD is fantastic, for example). I don't like ALL Nintendo games, but I find that their commitment to mostly family-friendly entertainment that is laser-focused on play, accessible challenge, and discovery fits my preferences most closely.

Also, I'm much bigger on the Big N now that they're developing for a hybrid system as, at heart, I am primarily a handheld gamer. I LOVE being able to play my games away from the TV. If Sony ever develops a hybrid that isn't reliant on streaming, then they'll be getting a lot more of my money.

Historically, I've been more of a Sega and Playstation guy than a Nintendo guy, though, and I have very little nostalgia for a lot of their older systems.
For me:
Genesis > SNES
PS1 > N64
PS2 > Gamecube

@kyleforrester87

Odyssey - Best 3D platformer of all time

That's a lie. Astrobot is better In every single way. In fact Astrobot was like playing Mario 64 for the first time. How it wasnt voted goty last year is a mystery professor Leyton couldn't solve.

Xenoblade Chronicles 2 - 3rd best JRPG of all time

Never played it. Might give it a go when I trade Mario odyssey In.

@Ralizah Maybe that's why I have gone off Nintendo. Been playing their stuff all my life and when I played odyssey my immediate thought was to go back and play 64 or sunshine instead. Extremely similar games which I knew very well without ever mastering them. That's not restricted to Nintendo though, playing Disgaea 5 or Sonic Mania - I just wanted to put Disgaea 2 and Sonic CD back on for the same reasons.

@themcnoisy i’m not lying when I say it’s the best 3D platformer of all time in my opinion 😂

Astro Bot sounds fun. Too bad it's reliant on an expensive VR headset!

@themcnoisy I've played a lot of their older games, but only years later. Didn't play OoT or SM64 until I was already an adult, for example, and I don't particularly enjoy either. Sunshine on the Gamecube is fantastic, though, and has aged brilliantly. The good thing about being a very late blooming Nintendo fan is that I get to look back at a lot of their big games from years past without the nostalgia goggles.

Before the Wii U, I primarily owned Nintendo consoles for Pokemon games. The only games I played on the N64 when it was new was Hey You, Pikachu! (ugh...), Pokemon Snap, and Pokemon Stadium, for example. I didn't play a 3D Mario game at all until Galaxy on the Wii. Ocarina of Time 3D was my first 3D Zelda in 2011. Fire Emblem: Awakening was my first FE game. Pikmin 3 was my first Pikmin. I didn't play Super Mario World until 2014 or so. You get the point. My trajectory has been very opposite of most of y'all, in that Playstation-branded games were very much my formative gaming experiences, and I've only discovered most of Nintendo's big franchises within the last decade or so.

I personally find Nintendo games to be consistent, but generally well made games you could play repeatedly, and a good palette cleanser with my current game lineup. Right now I tend to go through an open world game, an RPG, and a fighting game to wind down (As much as my competitive self can, anyway) from both. With that in mind, playing something like Super Mario Bros. 2 is a relief. Something I find enjoyable and not too taxing on my brain. Not to mention how AAA games tend to be samey themselves, currently with it's open world, "mature" story, look-at-the-graphics love affairs, seeing Nintendo still hitting sales charts tend to be a sign of confidence for me, knowing that the old hands aren't going anywhere.

This carries on to a thought I just had: While Sony and Microsoft take more risks, some that might not be appealing to gamers, Nintendo can be seen as the steady hand of gaming. Yeah, making a hybrid system was a risk in of itself, but they've kept the quality high as far as I can tell. It's great to know that what you're getting is a good product. Yeah, I imagine if you only or mostly play Nintendo games, it can get stale, but if you're a multiplatform gamer, it's probably more a comfortable feeling. I also understand that the greatest games tend to challenge the medium or bring something we've never seen before, but that consistency of making a quality title, even if it's familiar, is something I value just as much. Many of my favorite games don't push the medium much, they're just good games that I love to play over and over.

I dunno if I can really say I'm much of a Nintendo fan. Super Mario World was my first game ever, I've had every handheld since the Game Boy Color, had a Wii, but for multiple reasons I've probably explained before, there was a lot of Nintendo I missed out on, and PlayStation was always my system of choice. But I can't personally deny any value they have.

@kyleforrester87 @Ralizah @DerMeister What's even stranger putting the boot in over Nintendo. I have been watching an in depth deconstruction of a Mario 64 speed run (which is the most complicated thing I have ever watched Mario moves through dimensions literally) and the blind Mario maker speed runs from games done quick over the last couple of days.

Great watch.

I'm curious as to how you found this experience? (Especially considering that, to this day, SMW is considered the pinacle of 2D Mario).

Personally, it remains my favourite 2D Mario. I didn't play it until 2003 or so (althought, despite it being over a decade old at the time it was still Mario's most modern 2D adventure). SMB3, although always considered a contender for best 2D Mario, never felt quite the same for me - it was just that little bit too archaic relative to SMW.

@Buizel I actually think every 2d Mario game is great, bar the one on the Game boy. When you see the stuff churned out on Mario maker you know the series has reached its climax with the community making the levels. It can't get any better its probably why they decided to finally make Mario maker in the first place.

@Buizel

I don't like it. The relative lack of power-ups compared to SMB3 always bothered me. I found the dinky SNES music and sprites very weird. I don't like the feel of the platforming. The cape feels like a total downgrade from the Super Leaf. And it introduced Ghost Houses to the series, which are my least favorite set of levels in any Mario game.

My opinions on Mario games are kind of unusual, though. I found Mario 64 to be a thoroughly miserable experience for a variety of reasons. I actually really loved Sunshine and consider it to be the strongest of the more exploratory Mario games. And I consider NSMBU and NSMB2 to be the second and third best 2D platformers in the series after the classic SMB3.

@Ralizah I always felt SMB3 was better then SMW. Yeah SMW looks prettier unless you compare it to the All-star version of SMB3 but SMB3 just played better. The variety of powerups not to mention the Airships made it feel special at the end of a world rather then always being a castle.

I use to get into arguments on the playground on which was better 3 or World lol.

@Tasuki Yeah, SMB3 is a masterpiece. One of my favorite NES games (alongside the original Contra). Some people don't like the more controlled jumps, but the platforming and physics in this game always felt really good to me.

@Ralizah here is an unpopular Super Mario opinion for you, Super Mario Bros 2 is great and Super Mario 3D world is better than Super Mario 64

(fun fact did you know that originally Shigeru Miyamoto wanted to make the Japanese Mario 2 a game based around lifting and stacking objects, and scrolling the screen upward — a design too complex for the Famicom hardware and so it was postponed in favor of a quicker upgrade to the original Super Mario Bros they which was released as Super Mario Bros 2 in Japan (the Lost Levels over here) he then turned that concept into Doki Doki Panic which was then rebranded into Super Mario Bros 2 in the west, so the version of Super Mario Bros 2 we got is IN fact what they was originally going to do so you could say it IS the TRUE SMB2)

@themcnoisy Which Gameboy game? What I really appreciate about Super Mario Land 1 and 2 is that they're very much unique - SML with it's culturally-inspired setting and SML2 with it's very unique zones. That said, SML in particular has aged very poorly.

@Ralizah That's interesting. One reason I prefer SMW is because of the power ups. I prefer a smaller number of more versatile / useful powerups to an expansive set myself (can't stand, for example, the frog suit). And the cape, despite being less intuitive, always felt more satisfying to use once I'd learnt it. I'm with you on the Ghost Houses though.

When did you first play SM64? I had fond memories of it as a kid, but I sometimes wish I never went back to play it as a teen/adult because I don't believe it to have aged well at all (and I agree that Sunshine is a far superior experience).

@FullbringIchigo I love Super Mario Bros 2.

@FullbringIchigo Oh yeah, I absolutely enjoy both of those games more. SMB2 is... well, I'm not sure it scratches the Mario itch, but it's a neat platformer in its own right, and I always enjoyed the innovative system where each of the characters had their unique ability. And, of course, it's the first time that we get a playable Princess Peach, so surely it deserves credit for abandoning the reliance on victimizing her so early in the series!

Super Mario 3D World is a lot of fun. Lots of cool ideas, and I appreciate how they evolved the scope of 3D Land in such a way that it felt like a game that belonged on a home console. The game is just exploding with creativity.

3D Land is pretty great in its own right, too. The level design is more focused than 3D World, the way it utilized the system's stereoscopic 3D was great, and it's one of the few games I sat down and 100%ed, from beginning to end, without stopping. I actually think I prefer it to 3D World in many respects.

@Buizel Around the same time I played SMW. It was the period after the 3DS turned me into a Nintendo fan where I was actively seeking out their older games. So I don't get the benefit of nostalgia. And yes, the game has NOT aged well. The in-game camera is borderline schizophrenic, Mario's physics are weirdly slippery, the levels feel barren compared to every other 3D Mario, and, even for an N64 game, it's ugly as sin.

The N64 is my least favorite Nintendo console, and it has my least favorite set of Nintendo first-party titles (I actually really like Majora's Mask and Star Fox 64. but the 3DS remakes make the originals pointless to me, imo).

@Ralizah i also really like the 4 player co-op 3D World has, the whole family can get involved then and it's loads of fun

I find the Metroidvania style of game construction annoying. I don’t understand the appeal. And now every game is adopting some form of Metroidvania map outlays. 3-D Metroidvanias are a little better, and I usually do fine with those if the rest of the gameplay is good, but the 2-D Metroidvanias are maddening and, frankly... boring.

I prefer Black Desert over ESO. I used to like ESO before they changed it to all monsters are the same level as you. I know you can eventually level up past them, but then it becomes more group heavy I found and I'm the more rare solo MMO player. It also may be from my Everquest days or dice rolling days of D&D. There is something about going back to an area you used to struggle in and simply annihilate everything. Maybe Black Desert will taper off, but for now it is far superior for me to ESO.