Topic: The Music Thread

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@Bundersvessel Oh it's not hoarding I've seen that show on Youtube, it's more organized and industrial. With hoarding it's usually a person who went without early in life and they surround themselves with things to feel achievement or some sort. I always had things, I just didn't understand that other people didn't. Raiders of The Lost Ark is accurate. With books I'll catalogue them then have a company scan each one, each digital copy goes on my home server for travel and the hard copies mostly go to storage. Maybe at some point I'll create a shadow library on certain encrypted networks, if only for educational use. I see the lack of education as one of the main causes for poverty, especially when I travel to places where they try to hide that poverty. If the material is available people have a better chance of learning something that would otherwise price them out of education or employment. I like general philanthropy too but there's a lot of red tape. If I have to I'll take that next step, for the right reasons. It's disturbing how many people are cheated out of life by a lack of education, it's a cycle.

Books need more care, some of the collections I buy weren't always kept in the best environment, a lot of older collectors lost track of their collections. They'd simply stack everything in the hundreds and then as they aged themselves they weren't able to take care of their things or themselves. I see that often with old Occult and Esoterica material. Their families have no idea what those collections are, some might even seen a landfill. Knowing the value of such books is a kind of lost art, I see it less and less now with collector circles. Those circles react most to what's trending, not what's of real importance. Vendors either aim too low or too high, they know the price of everything but the value of nothing and I don't want to end up that way.

With VHS it's critical. The US market use cardboard cases and those disintegrate and wear out even when shelved. The UK and European regions are easier to preserve, those cases are plastic and as long as they were stored away out of the light they still retain those punchy colours. DVD is a good example of when it was done wrong, those printers used a weaker ink for mass production which means some of the original DVD lines will start to fade in colour sooner than later. I've seen it already in a lot of collections that used cardboard for their special editions. They aren't exposed to that much light, it's the weaker ink that was used by those distribution houses. They never planned ahead, it was one big race for the retail market.

For VHS I mainly focus on old horror, especially factory sealed or unreleased promos. I don't focus on the price per-say, it's more keeping them safe from wherever they might end up. That was my original thought with retro gaming until I saw the passion people have for collecting those titles so I stopped. It didn't feel right to make such a dent on those collector circles, I don't collect to have the most. It's like you said stewardship. Movies and other media were and kind of are windows to the world, I feel a kind of duty to preserve them because they gave me something priceless.

That's what one of my movie collections look like. Usually rooms with six to seven levels of shelves that then span the walls. As for the numbers I have no idea, I remember hitting thirty thousand a couple of years ago and then I thought I better slow down. When I moved to England I watched four to six per day, they helped me learn English. I still use that technique for other languages, I watch one three times in a row in one language then three times in another language, slowly that understanding builds and then it flows with my text books. Tjuz asked how I learned seven languages, movies. Tutors too but I prefer my method, it's more entertaining.

I'm not uploading singular pictures it's too big and I think a screenshot of my phone's folder gives a better idea of what I mean. Those are ones I keep for myself because they mean something. I think it's easy to throw resources at something just for the sake of it, then the person and the collection become a kind of cliche. Maybe even a stereotype, sort of like just because you can have something you go ahead and have it. I don't think things really enrich my life all that much and that's probably because I see people around me constantly depending on things to fill something. I never saw or felt that when dealing with retro game collectors or VHS collectors but for certain other things like Art, bigger items, it's frequent. There's a similar feeling with movie props especially hero/screen used. They aren't doing it for preservation they just want the novelty of having something that no one else has, that's why I stopped.

I can't say much about Art except that some of the most beautiful pieces are in private collections, growing up I thought that was normal because I was surrounded by those same collections. The same for antiques, classic vehicles etc, I didn't understand that others were being cheated out of seeing something beautiful. Then I saw that public museums were a thing and understood that division even more. They are one of the only outside places I'll still visit and when I do I share in whatever it is that other people get by seeing those work of arts in that setting. It's hard to word, sort of like if you grew up in a museum for so long that you didn't realize it wasn't the normal. I love works of art, I'm just not sure how I feel about knowing so much never sees that public sphere. More-so in the last couple of years and that's not counting plundered locations like Syria, half of their history is now in private collections. That's a part of conflict that people don't see, they assume something was destroyed when really it found it's way into a private collection. It's not something I can talk about but it's done in many parts of the world, where there is conflict there is plunder. I see it all the time, it doesn't feel right. I don't think that's preserving anything, but obviously I'd never say that offline. What I say here and what I say offline are two different things, a system like that can't be changed.

I think anchored is a good word, I understand that completely. I'm anchored too and can't elaborate but that's a similar feeling to things eventually owning you. They don't define me, but they don't always add to who I am either. Hobbies do and I have many of those. VHS is a kind of art too. Those artists are dying off, literally. Sometimes their families will put those original prints up for auction but most of the time those proof sheets are lost to history. Iconic artwork for what are now cult classics, the distributor never did anything to save them. Most of them started off selling and renting Adult entertainment, Horror was only something on the side, almost nothing was preserved. Then ratings boards/BBFC came along and seized/destroyed the rest. Worse still modern distributors are moving away from that original artwork because they think it's dated especially for 4K. Then there are all of the global variants, so few remain now.

I'm going to steal and preserve that word tidbits, I don't think I've heard it before. Are you enjoying building you modest library? I think that's why collectors do it, not the vendors who sell in bulk but actual people who have that nostalgia. It's sad to think that digital is such a threat to genuine nostalgia, maybe it will be one of those things people won't miss until it's gone. I don't think a price can be put on nostalgia, you either feel it or don't and I'd never feel nostalgic for a slab of plastic with some code on there. I would for a piece of plastic that included a sheet of paper with art that was created by a human. A box tells a story, it's tangible and recognizable. If anything digital has made it easier for me to not buy or play new games, that feeling from PS4 isn't there at all. Digital feels more sterile, it might be hard to understand this next part. If your life revolves around curated services and then one day you wake up and realize gaming, movies and others now revolve around a similar system, something is lost. I used to go to stores for physical media and while it was nerve racking (agoraphobia) I liked the challenge and the reward. Other than old bookstores that feeling is gone. I'll get hints of it in other parts of the world but not England or Europe, companies care more about selling weird merchandise than games or movies and everything is steaming.

It feels like people are only now experiencing what I'd call convenience, I've know systems like that my whole life but there were always those little openings of normality, stores etc. I'm not sure what happens to a person when all of the media they consume because so readily available. Sort of like if tomorrow you could have every game ever made, you'd have everything but the time to play them and even then you'd be lost in choice. That's how digital storefronts and streaming services feel. I missed out on real gems because they were buried under the rest, I can't imagine that not happening with a digital future and if that's the case I'm not sure what people will do to find that more tangible something. I often ask myself how many people even seen real paint anymore, obviously if you have paintings in your home but that seems rarer than I originally thought and today Furious said some movie posters are being replaced by digital displays. It's almost like finding out the world isn't what you thought it is before you had a chance to experience it. Or it's just moving too fast to catch up.

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@Ravix Extreme sports, that's the word I was trying to think of. Those were the kinds of titles that labels like Roadrunner collaborated with and I'm convinced they helped to change the shape of genres like NuMetal, without those soundtracks I'd probably not even found those bands. Tony Hawks probably helped to put so many of them on the map especially internationally.

I don't think I've ever picked up a CD based on it's artwork, that's the problem with the internet it's too easy to learn what everything is. It's extremely rare that I'll find something and not know what it is and even then there is always a six degrees of Kevin Bacon connection with most of them. Either through mixing, producing or one of the band members. I'm trying to think of the most Punky my listening has been, I keep coming back to Skunk Anansie but so much from the 2000s gets tangled up with Hardcore/PostCore/Metalcore/Emo and Screamo so I could have been listening to Punk for years and not known unless those Punk Goes Pop collections are to be trusted. I don't think I'd call Falloutboy Punk, not compared to the S-x Pistols or even The Jam, the attitude and timing is so different. With Falloutboy it would feel like I was rebelling against bedtime, whereas someone like Johnny Rotten understood what to rebel against. I can't say much for Punk in Russia, it got very caught up with the skinhead movement and that right now is where homegrown Punk is hovering. It's weaponized, but aimed at the wrong people, it's more of a tool for racism and softer targets.

I'm not sure about the naughties, it was probably very different in England? Back home it was a time of transition and change through aggression and expansion. I'm sure somewhere in the middle there was music but I imagine it was more 80's styled. My Dad was different he liked Rock, collected motorbikes etc, I found some bands by going through his records. One was The Kinks, The Jam too, I imagine he was importing things for years. Maybe that's where I get it from. The further East I go in Russia today is like going back in time, like 80's music in Vladivostok etc. They are still catching up which I understand because I'm catching up too. I definitely wasn't introduced to Punk by another person, I most likely found it through the internet. I don't even know if it's right to say but it's energy and delivery seems to compliment the working class more than the others if you know what I mean. Have you seen a movie called This is England? sort of like that, it was set during the Falklands. That could also be why I was so late to find it and even now I don't know many of those bands. There was like you said war too, I didn't know bands like Ministry were so against war until I saw them live and they made their feelings known very vocally.

Right now I'm monitoring a lot of the music coming from back home, conflict has influenced every artist I listen to. One of them (on the top of my weekly listens) he is now a soldier so all of his music has changed in theme and all of his posts are from the frontline. There are countless albums about certain units, operations and PMCs, it's the new normal. I listen because like I said it seems like to the observer that I'm onboard with that thinking. If there is another side, well I don't think they are making music. You might call it oppression, how in America you get cancelled for saying anti-gay things? Musicians get cancelled for saying anti-conflict things, it's also dangerous to take that stand. One of my favorite Russian Metal bands aren't even on Spotify anymore, they were removed after they like so many adopted that stand of supporting the State. If that were England Punk and others would spring up in response, maybe that's where those English Punk bands came from, and the American ones because of conflict/Iraq etc.

The west and social media companies have certainly learned a lot from state controlled media tactics. Propaganda has always existed, on all sides, of course, but still, I'd imagine a lot of young people that aren't drawn in to fighting either side of the culture war will just be sick of it all, and punk kind of helps fill that gap.

• The music I'm listening to right now, that draws young people to war. I can't say the lyrics just that it's seen as a great operation to preserve the Homeland, it's packaged perfectly to get that response. This one right now, that guitar is shredding so hard and somewhere in the back of my mind I hear and feel that call to action. I think that's dangerous but that's exactly what it is. A couple of years ago such music would influence my entire thinking, especially when all other trains of thought are locked out.

There is no other side to it, no one saying 'don't do this', it's one hundred percent march on. I say I don't know modern music, Western yes, this music right now this is new and it gets provided weekly from home. Many CDs because 'listen to this' and because I don't have access to my Spotify accounts email I'm convinced someone sees my history through the PC App, so I'm being careful. Rebellion for me is talking to you, to Tjuz, to anyone not of that same mindset. I never even thought of it until tonight but that's probably why I can name so few Punk bands, maybe their anti-establishment standing is why they were magic'd away from me ever finding them or maybe they were a product of the time and now rebellion to most people is some nonsense social media post. If there were no social media then how would you reach people with such a message? Music, it makes perfect sense. Punk might be an endangered genre. At least as far as new bands and material is concerned. Everything I've seen (which is limited) seems softer, I don't know if that reflects on society as a whole. It might be easier to enter an echo-chamber than an amphitheater.

I think the spirit of punk is always popular, even if the music changes, kids and teens will always rebel. I don't see punk being a genre or a group of people or a scene, but as an attitude, even though it is also those things.

• Is there a risk there that such an attitude gets adopted by commercialism and loses it's spark or identity? Sort of like someone wearing a band shirt of a band they don't even know. Or do you mean when someone calls another person a punk for being unruly? or like The Warriors? I'm reaching for reference points. I don't know if a person can be Emo without listening to the music, maybe they can. But if you mean the attitude of anti-establishment-arism, I think I understand.