Sony Sued for 'Abusing Its Dominant Position in the Console Market'

Shouldn't They Be Sueing Microsoft Their the ones trying to push you to buy digital not to mention selling you full price games with part of the data on the Disk.

@Areus don’t think the Dutch use the Xbox much so it’s not an issue for them

Not the first time it happens.

I kept wondering why digital games seem to take a long while to go on sale. Copies of Dragon Age 4 sell for $12 physically on woot, but digitally, even at its lowest, it;s $30.

This likely won’t go their way. Sony isn’t responsible for pricing. As far as i know, third party sets their own pricing, even in the Playstation store. So how can Sony be sued for prices they didn’t set?

Unless they confine their whole case to only Sony’s games. But then Sony could easily just say that their prices are dictated by the market and what competitors do. Their game prices are now even lower than their main competitor.

All in all, doesnt seem like a very strong case. But since my legal expertise is basically zero, i’ll just leave it with those speculations

It's one of those "we're a non profit org who doesn't give a s*it about gaming but we need quick and easy money from big gaming company" sue case.

Lol. Good luck with that

You can sue anyone for anything. Most of the time it’s a waste of everyone’s time and money. It’s a good thing for lawyers who don’t care about their oaths though.

Holy frivolous

I fully support this type of action. Digital gaming prices are disgraceful! I have purchased many second hand games for a 5th of the cost of the digital versions. If things don’t change I’ll stop gaming the second we go full digital.

Easy way to fix the problem is by letting people sell digital compiles of games, we all know they will never allow that though.

Most of the time, here in Canada anyway, the PS Store is cheaper than buying a disc game.
And, I bought a PS5 Pro and I bought a disc drive. Sony didn't force me to go all digital.

@Areus it's nothing to do with Microsoft how Sony decide to fleece us on the digital prices of its games. There is no reason for the games to be so high at all as there is no physical shop,packaging or delivery fees..its daylight robbery plain and simple.

@EfYI exactly this..there is nothing anybody can do about it. You could say I'm going to stop buying games but nobody would actually do that in reality to be honest. I'll just stop buying on day one and wait for a sale. Its not like I have about 400+ games to choose from whilst I wait it out.

@LogicStrikesAgain not entirely. I have read elsewhere that indie devs cannot dictate when their games go on sale on the PS store, and only allocated to certain sales. Don't know if that was resolved.

I stick to retail because i can get a new game significantly cheaper than on ps store

Its true that physical games can end up being alot cheaper than digital and go on sale quicker but that comes down to the fact sales for physical are declining.

Playstation either way arent pushing anyone really, they offer a ps5 base with or without a disc drive with an option to purchase a drive drive at a later date if one decides they want it.

The ps5 pro doesnt come with a disc drive but you can buy a disc drive. The reality is this isn't really a push its just where the market has gone. Whether we like it or not.

Also the only pricing they can control is their own games as its up to the third party and indie developers/publishers for what price they sell at.

I mean at this point there are that many games now that i can pick and choose what I buy at full price or not, no ones pushing me.

I'm still old school that I believe we should take responsibility for our own actions not blame others. Which in this modern age seems to be a rarity, everything is blamed on someone else and not the individual anymore.

On this topic, should I go out and sue the likes of Tesco, Morisons, Co-Op, Sainsbury's?

As they literally all inflate their prices to extreme amounts, blatantly, and publicly pushing you into registering for their loyalty cards, as its the only way to get the items at their normal price.
Now that's pushing and entrapment, as these items could be sold at the "club card" price without having to register for the "free" card.
That is a cause for law suit.

Playstation and anyone else has the right to sell their products at whatever price they see fit really.

Just like the guy down the road making custom made tables sells them for 1000s because they are "handmade" compared to a furniture shop.

It is a bit different from what is written here though. The lawsuit is not only about the pushing to the digital market, it’s also about digital content only available for purchase in the PS Store. Sony does not allow third party retailers to sell download codes of certain content (indie games, digital deluxe packages, season passes, deluxe upgrades, etc), so that people get to choose where they buy their content. Meaning Sony is owning the digital market, giving them a monopolised position. (Which is not allowed by European laws)

Third party retailers usually offer lower pricing in the Netherlands on base games when bought physically. The same can be expected for digital content, thus the consumer always has to pay more when going digital, because they can only buy it at PS Store.

So the goal here is to make all content available at multiple retailers, not only Sony.

@Boxmonkey I'm always prefer physical over digital. But i don't think "digital gaming prices are disgraceful" since i've seen many times that digital games prices are cheaper than physical.

For starter, Suikoden 2 and Mega Man Legends 1 & 2 prices on PSN only cost like 6-10 bucks for each game. But can you buy a second hand CIB copy of MM Legends 2 or Suikoden 2 that cost 10 bucks? Last time i check, they cost around $150-200+ at ebay or amazon.

Or Lunar Remastered Collection cost like $50-55 on PSN and you got both Silver Star Story Complete & Eternal Blue Complete including a nice update of the graphics, translation, and VA. But i doubt you can get a PS1 copy of Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete with mint condition that cost 50 bucks. Last time i check amazon, the cheapest copy cost $250+.

I wish Sony release Rule of Rose on PSN because the second hand copy are fking ridiculous that cost more than $1200 🙄

They can argue that Sony is breaching the Digital Markets Act of the EU. Apple was fined 500 million and has made changes to its store, due to the DMA, to prevent another fine.

@DennisReynolds keep cheerleading anti consumer practices. The corporate suits appreciate your efforts

Maybe if the next ps console is digital only, but now as long as we have choice between digital and disc it's still okay I guess.

It's worrying that the digital games price is way more expensive than disc though, the price of games disc in amazon usually way lower than the price of digital games in psn, full price after years unless it's discounted.

I hope Sony responds by denying access to digital downloads from Dutch IP addresses. Force them to buy physical or get a VPN.

@LogicStrikesAgain
As I understand it, this can be used to force Sony to allow additional storefronts onto PS, providing the functionality is there (much harder to force them to change the console OS).
PS5 has partial functionality in the fact a web browser is present - Im shocked they haven't seen this coming and removed it tbh.

The bigger cause for concern is if/when (because its only a matter of time imo) the companies that run games like Fortnight and Roblox sue Sony to allow themselves to sell their own in game currency through their own web based stores, which then updates to users accounts for in game marketplaces, effectively cutting out Sony from that 30% of microtransactions they currently take.

If Xbox go down the 'PC in a box' route, they would be able to 'join in' with COD...

@Boxmonkey Nah i just tend to care more for things with actual importance.

It’s kinda crazy how PS does control their digital sales more/less, unlike Xbox who allows anyone to sell digital codes. On ps it’s either a sale from them directly or full price anywhere else.

Erm, just buy a disc drive then or the PS5 model with one included. Sure, Sony are clearly trying to encourage their players to be digital only but you can quite clearly buy every major release physically.

I'm still a mixture of both physical and digital but tens to buy more physical games on the Switch 1/2 as they're the only ones which still play directly from them but I wouldn't say Sony is forcing me to buy digitally

This article completely missed the actual point.

This is about digital storefronts exclusively. Yes you can add a disc drive but this is about competition within the digital ecosystem, which Nintendo, and Xbox, allow, by letting retailers sell codes to digital games at whatever prices they see fit. That's digital competition.

You know what Sony lets retailers sell? Store credit. They USED to do codes, but not anymore. So whatever price you are forced to pay is it. No other choices.

@Northern_munkey But there is hosting, infastructure, marketting, and platform development costs. These things also have costs which are never factored in when discussing online vs physical, just no disc = cheaper. Digital probably is a bit cheaper, but it still has its own costs.

All that aside however its pretty much irrelevant because digital stores usually operate at the msrp to protect physical trade. If digital games where all suddenly £20 cheaper it would decimate the already shrinking highstreet game shops.

This article completely misses the point. The same court action is happening in the UK aswell with that consumer rights guy leading it

In the summons sent to Sony by Stichting Massaschade & Consument, there are two core accusations: the exclusion of competition, and the exploitation of consumers and game developers. The organisation claims PlayStation players are entirely dependent on Sony and its prices due to its closed ecosystem, while developers have limited commercial freedom with Sony setting prices.

Could just report the news instead of butchering it to try and defend a corporation?

@Oz_Who_Dat_Dare Im basing it on general supply and demand from working in the wholesale enviroment. Companies very rarely want to undercut their own customers as it often has negative results.

If you could buy every game £20 cheaper on launch day then physical would be utterly crippled. Only hardcore collectors would buy it, and if not one buys it then no one will bother selling it. Suddenly your product is not sitting on the shelves and that lack of marketting is a huge loss.

Its the same problem Xbox are having with the Series consoles in Europe. They have no visibility and its hurting their brand awareness in a pretty big way, hence why 80% of dutch players are PS.

The biggest issue is Sony not allowing digital codes being sold in third party stores. That has to change.

Having said that, I always roll my eyes when I read these class action lawsuits demanding exorbitant damages on behalf of all players. But I guess that's just how the legal system works.

I think there is a certainly a case here in Europe with the store pricing of first party titles.
When sales are on you often find first party titles more expensive than their US version. I’m not referring to exchange rates but simply the numerical value of the item, for example GT7 in last sale $30, £35 in UK.

@Sakai Sony don't set prices though, so that quote is fundamentally untrue.

This case in the Netherlands is also fundamentally flawed by their own words. They go to the length to establish that Sony has a dominant market position and claim thay is being abused to set higher prices. However, in the Netherlands Xbox games all have the same RRP as their PlayStation equivalent, and as already established they are a minor player in the market. Therefore market position has absolutely no correlation to final prices in this case.

All these cases are fundamentally flawed and are just moon shots at hundreds of millions of dollars. Digital prices should be lower than physical but it's not going to be rectified this way. If the market can't sort it out then there probably needs direct legislation, the EU would be the most likely to initiate such legislation first but I doubt it's anywhere close to reality yet.

@Areus

They probably don't realise Xbox is even a thing.

@SeaDaVie Sony do set prices, especially sales prices. Lots of developers have complained about this the last few years

The UK equivalent lawsuit was given the go-ahead in 2023 and earlier this year was given the green light to proceed to trial. It's not as frivolous as you make out

@Ilyn well seeing as you put it that way...

@Sakai They do not set prices, that’s 100%. Expedition 33 costs £44.99 because Kepler Interactive chose that price. Monster Hunter Wilds cost £69.99 because Capcom chose that price. Elden Ring: Nightreign cost £34.99 because FromSoft chose that price. Etc. etc. etc.

Companies are also free to set all their own sales prices, the only thing they are restricted on is when items can go on sale, as it needs to be co-ordinated with store wide sales. You can’t just put a game on sale on a random Tuesday for 3 and half days.

There’s literally zero evidence that Sony have ever attempted to influence prices of games, as that would be pretty bad.

For as long as disk drives are available and games are released on disks, this is a moot point, don’t like digital prices? Well get it on disks second hand or on sale, most games are even cheaper at launch on Amazon on disk….
I wanted Star Wars Outlaws cheap, guess what it was cheap on disk on Amazon..
Or you can wait for the game to go on sale on one of Sony’s sales it has.

The one digital platform where I find games to be expensive is Nintendo as their first party titles VERY rarely go on sale, but again physical media..

Looks to me like the market there has seen Steam prices and wants the same on PlayStation.

@SeaDaVie i did mention especially sales in my previous comment, they even mention launch price in the article i have linked
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2021/06/30/dev-details-sonys-frustrating-rules-for-discounts-and-promotion-on-playstation/

you cannot even do a launch discount without their approval and it is "very limited." That's right.... You can't do the thing that ever other platform does meaning the Platform X owners will always get the worst deal!

Oh but don't worry. There is a way to guarantee you get featured! All you need to do is spend a VERY reasonable minimum of 25,000 USD to get featured. Oh and then 30% of your subsequent earnings....Bargain!

Now when your game is on the platform, likely without any support from Platform X, you may think, no problem, I can sync up discounts on Platform X with Steam and others...Wrong! Discounts are invite only and invites are also "very limited."

It's been literal years since we could put a title of ours in discount, and I spoke to some other VERY POPULAR devs today and they had the same experience. So even if your game does well at launch and thrives on other platforms, you may still never be invited? Y? who knows?

And from Paul Tassi

I didn’t realize that there would be this arduous process for a game developer to need permission or an invitation to lower the price of their own game.

doesn't the original model of the ps5 digital still have no disc drive compatibility, and will (probably) never get it?

Waste of everyone's time, a total non starter

@Sakai You can set the launch price to anything they want, yes, they have to wait to a sale period to set a specific reduction on that original price. That's not setting prices, just a little bit of inflexibility.

The other things mention in this quote like having to pay for a feature of giving over 30% commission are industry standards and normal across a wide range of industries.

I hope Sony stops using physical media so PSN remains as the only place to purchase games. People will be happy then because the prices of games will surely go down when you have only one place to buy them.

Apple defenders keep bringing up the Games Industry as examples of closed platforms people are content with, yet there is no gaming platform to my knowledge that has only one storefront. Even digital only consoles like the Series S with no disc drive add-on can purchase discounted codes from places like CDKeys.

A more pressing matter is platform lock-in via digital licences and a lack of consumer ownership. There needs to be a way to let you take your digital purchases from one platform to another (eg PlayStation to Xbox) without paying for everything again.

@LogicStrikesAgain If I recall correctly, devs have said Sony doesn’t allow them to put their games on sale and they have to be “invited” to do.

Having DS2 early access limited to digital deluxe only also is not a good look. That says to me they are pushing ppl to digital.

Not having third party offers for digital games on PS really does suck. This is a valid point they should be arguing.

These idiots do know Sony don't set the prices right?????

Woah sony are a shady business company I'm surprised lol

@Ernie I’m pretty sure they don’t actually allow that. There are no third party stores on the Xbox ecosystem(Yet).

You can buy digital codes because those are codes from retail cards I believe. So, those are cards sold to retailers by Microsoft themselves. The retailers have already paid MS their money and then you can buy the code from a third party site giving you the illusion of buying from a third party, but they were just a middle man. A proper third party seller would be a seller independent of MS that buys their codes directly from the publisher.

You can also buy PSN credit at third party retailers, normally for up12-14% discount for the best deals, meaning you can effectively get a 12% discount on every RRP you see on PSN.

These 2 situations are not fundamentally much different from a consumer perspective.

The issue is the dominant position, @Areus, and it would be difficult to argue that the Xbox is in a dominant position in any regard when compared to the PlayStation. Truthfully, this is just the start. The further Microsoft fall behind, the easier it is for Sony to do as they please...

For me personaly, as a Dutch moron, i like to play physical discs. They are WAY cheaper after a little while. And i think my biggest issue with the PS store is that every week there is a socalled ‘SALE’ and all the prices are the same as the sale from last week. The prizes seem to stay the same each sale.

Perfect time to put this:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/702074/

Make sure to sign it.

Edit: just made a forum which provides more info into this.

@Hypoman That sounds a lot like DFS (a sofa distributor) they also were taken to court over always having 80% sales when it turned there were no deals at all.

It's undeniable that Sony has been doing this especially given how the ps5 pro is digital only off the box. Don't think I have seen a single drive for sale on retailers.
The defense force is strong here, naturally. But in europe the consumers matters.

@Areus They have no reason to sue Microsoft because A. Xbox isn't popular at all in the Netherlands and B. Microsoft allows people to buy digital Xbox games from third-party storefronts.

Just like Steam games, you can buy Xbox games as gifts and sell the digital codes on other storefronts like eBay, Eneba, GreenManGaming, etc. Therefore, Microsoft doesn't have a monopoly on digital Xbox game distribution.

Sony used to allow people to buy game codes, but they got rid of the feature and now, if you want to get a digital PlayStation game, you have no choice but to buy it on the PS Storefront. Meaning the only discounts you have access to are the ones Sony allows.

Contrary to what everyone is saying here, this lawsuit makes perfect sense.

@CallMeDuraSouka It is not at all nonsense. Sony has a monopoly on digital PS games, unlike Xbox, Steam, and (maybe?) Nintendo

"Considering it is still perfectly possible to purchase physical games on the PS5, we’re not convinced the premise of this case has any real weight."

Not every game has a physical version though.

In Capcoms case there is no MegaMan Legacy Collection that is physical availabe here in Europe and Kunitsu-Gami is only available digitally on PS5.

Like a Dragon the Man who Erased his Name is digital only as well.

So the PS5 still allowing players to play games physically doesn't give them much of a defence when not all games can be played that way.

@SeaDaVie It doesn't at all matter whether Sony sets prices of games or not. That's not the point of the lawsuit.

The problem is that Sony does not allow people to buy digital PS games from anywhere else other than their own storefront. They used to allow people to buy codes for PS games, but they got rid of the feature.

And, by the way, yes, the two situations are fundamentally different because you can sometimes get digital Xbox games at a cheaper price from third-party sellers than you can on the official Xbox storefront. The fact that Sony prevents third-party sellers from reselling digital PS games means players only have access to the sales on the PS Storefront and that's it.

@Questionable_Duck Price setting is 100% important, because it means that PSN is not a store but a marketplace. It functions the same as eBay, anyone can sell their goods there, they set the price themselves, and then pay a commission to Sony. In a market place the primary driver of competition is other goods of the same type on the same market place. That’s what drives competition and price setting.

The codes are being provided directly from MS, therefore MS is controlling 100% of the digital sales on Xbox. From an economic perspective the 2 situations are effectively the same.

They’re wasting time and money with this, what a silly decision this is.

They’ve probably smoked far too much with this one.

Sony are no angels but they are the cheapest of the three consoles for games no? Both Nintendo and MS are raising prices while Sony has yet to (I’m sure they will “have to” in time). Out of the three, I’d wager Nintendo to be the downright worst at using their dominance to inflate digital prices. Switch (and now SW2) games are insanely high for years after release, and rarely drop in price.

Fun fact: you can still redeem games by keys because Sony still distributes keys to devs, devs could sell those keys if they wanted to.

@Sakai Honestly? I don't see the problem here, the same happens in a supermarket shelf. Ever picked a product from the top shelf? They paid to be featured there.

@SeaDaVie From a consumer point of view, it doesn't really matter if those third party stores are just resellers. They set their own prices and have their own discounts independently of the Xbox store, thus giving buyers choices. That doesn't exist on Playstation. Buying PSN credit at a discount is a good hack, but you don't nearly get the same level of discount as you typically get at third party resellers. I wouldn't consider those two options fundamentally equivalent.

@Ainu20 It does matter as it means 100% control of all digital products on Xbox is still controlled by MS. So if PSN was defined as a monopoly by a regulatory body then so would Xbox.

In a normal store, like game for example, the store would buy the products directly from the publisher, and they pay a license fee to the platform holder.

MS allowing third party stores to sell keys, with the possibility of a small retail discount, is not significantly different from Sony allowing third party stores to sell PSN credit at a discounted rate. Technically every single item on PSN is available at retail discount, via PSN credit, at all points in time.

The fight for greater consumer rights is much bigger than making the platform holder sell digital keys through third party sellers(in a supply that the platform holder has 100% control over. The starting point for understanding the market, and what greater oversight is required, is in understanding that both systems are fundamentally the same and confer the same level of power upon the platform holder.

Well, I guess if they sued MS for pushing all digital with their dominant platform they’d be laughed out of court.

Hopefully they’re still laughed out of court, since Sony sells more physical versions of games than MS does.

@Midnyte-Monkey you can buy ps cards from shopto £70 will cost you £58, theres no difference in my eyes to a code for store credit or a code for a specific game

@SeaDaVie Again, price setting isn't important because that's not at all relevant to the lawsuit. Like, read the Eurogamer article that's linked at the end of this Push Square post. Nowhere does it say that Stichting Massaschade & Consument is suing Sony because they're setting prices of third-party games.

Link: https://www.eurogamer.net/sony-sued-in-netherlands-over-sony-tax-and-its-perceived-monopoly-on-digital-sales

As the Eurogamer article points out, Stichting Massaschade & Consument said that "Sony is the sole provider of digital content on the world’s most popular gaming console." The problem that Stichting has with Sony is that "PlayStation players are entirely dependent on Sony and its prices due to its closed ecosystem."

This problem doesn't exist on a platform like Xbox. While all digital Xbox game sales do technically go through Microsoft, as you said, Xbox players are not entirely dependent on Microsoft and its prices due to its closed ecosystem. As I pointed out in my previous comment, Xbox players can get reduced prices on digital Xbox games through third-party retailers, without having to rely on sales on the Xbox storefront.

Take Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice GOTY Edition, for instance. In the UK, Sekiro currently costs £59.99 on Xbox. However, on CDKeys, you can get a digital Xbox code of the game right now for £12.99. This is not possible on PlayStation, because Sony doesn't allow third-party retailers to resell digital PlayStation games.

The money you save on PSN gift card discounts is negligible compared to the money you save by getting digital games from third-party retailers outright. You are never going to get a $50 PlayStation gift card for $25, for example.

@Questionable_Duck the price setting is specifically mentioned in the UK class action suit, the one that was quoted above by “Sakai” that my first response was directed towards.

The price setting is still important in the Netherlands case as it is a key economic instrument that underpins how the market actually works. Secondly, all Xbox game key are provided and sold by Microsoft, so it is exactly the same. Those game keys you can buy on third party sites are codes that were sold to retailers by Microsoft, they’re basically the equivalent of retail product that’s an empty box with a digital code inside, or say, a box with a useless disc and a code to download a game.

@VeldinX I definitely agree that Nintendo is, by far, the worst when it comes to digital game prices. At least Sony and Microsoft heavily reduce the prices of their AAA blockbusters after a few years. Nintendo, on the other hand, never does that. Not unless the game they release is garbage.

Surprised they've not been after Nintendo because they took do it you can't get there games anywhere else and it makes 2nd hand prices practically near full price which gamers thing might as well buy new or online which is what Nintendo want

@SeaDaVie You use a lot of text but you keep ignoring the fact that those third party stores do set their own prices and have their own discounts that are not controlled by MS. It literally gives the consumer more choices. And again, those discounts go far deeper than what you'd typically get for PSN credit.

You can claim it's the same all you want, but it's literally not.

@SeaDaVie You're right about the setting prices stuff mentioned in the lawsuit, my bad.

Even still, it is not exactly the same. I have pointed out pretty clearly in my previous comment that the impact it has on consumers is completely different. You refuse to acknowledge this, for some reason.

You want to get Sekiro on PlayStation right now? Tough luck, you're gonna have to pay $60 to play the game without waiting for a sale.

You want to get Sekiro on Xbox right now? Good news, you can get the game from CDKeys for a fraction of the price that it currently costs on the Xbox Storefront. Sekiro's digital Xbox version is £12.99 on CDKeys, but it's £59.99 on the official Xbox storefront.

And I have no idea why you're bringing up code-in-a-box releases? Why would a gamer who's looking to buy a digital code from a third-party retailer care about the fact that they're not getting the game physically?

I swear. This gen, most of the interaction I see on gaming forums has more to do with the business side of the gaming industry than then games themselves. Always with the arguments about 1st/3rd party, digital/physical, etc. Gamers have driven themselves to become miserable turds. Maybe it’s because we 80s gamers are in our 40s now and have become old curmudgeons? 🤷🏾‍♂️

If they won this, wouldn't Sony just make physical more expensive than digital like what Nintendo's done with Switch 2 1st party exclusives outside NA (e.g. physical DK Bananza is £66.99 while digital is £58.99)?

It’s a baseless claim, and I’m very much against forcing Sony to allow alternative stores on PlayStation, but I’d like someone to give them a bit of a bloody nose on this as digital is indeed scandalously expensive compared to physical. Some type of enforced timed reduction in prices would be the wish, or at least give us the right to refund within a certain period of time, or at the very least a right to trade digital keys (even if Sony take a cut)

I have not got how these companies get away with selling digital games on release day as or more expensive than the disc version.

Firstly less production costs, no disc or case.
Secondly, no percentage to a shop for the sale.

To me it’s the biggest piss take these companies have done over the years.

Then again if we buy them at that price digitally, they will sell them at that price.
But it’s still terrible corporate greed and customer piss taking.

@Grumblevolcano
I see Nintendo made a move there but most big AAA games are £70 so the £66.99 physical is not that bad and the £58.99 digital a little bonus.
Not saying it’s great but seems better.

Clueless politicians looking for any platform to stand on. Some things never change

Saying “well you can always buy physical” isn’t quite correct if the vast majority of games on the PS store aren’t available as a physical release. Of course I don’t have the stats but I’d be willing to bet that most games, by a large margin, don’t get physical releases.
Plus as others have pointed out, the lawsuit isn’t about pricing, Sony and Devs can charge what they want. The suit is about making digital games available on other online storefronts/retailers to enable competition and buyer choice.

@Haruki_NLI @Ricowtje I didn't even need to read the article, just the headline, and I know nothing about the case, but I immediately assumed it had something to do with the lack of Sony selling game codes in local stores. I think that has come up in the US. In Target there are plenty of games cards w/ codes for Switch games but not PS.

The problem isn't Sony going all digital, it's Sony going all digital and then not letting stores sell game codes. That's a forced monopoly that doesn't need to exist. Even if they don't want to do physical cards at retail they could easily do electronic email codes on Amazon or the Dutch equivalent of a games store.

It's not physical vs digital, it's monopoly vs open market. The future is all digital, so this does need to be addressed now.

Didn't get that from the article though. Thought I might have been wrong but your comments make me think I'm at least on the right track. 🤷‍♂️

@Questionable_Duck The reason that the existence of boxes without the game is relevant is that economically they are the same product. A game key is the same as a box with no game in the box, or on the disc. Physical games are still available everywhere, and with the same level of discount. Effectively what people are arguing is that if all PS physical editions were just codes in a box, and therefore sold regularly at deep discount, as is the norm for physical editions and all those editions could now be sold on third party websites as just codes, and therefore you can now buy digital games on PSN from third parties.

When you break it down like this it shows how the lines are blurred between what is actually a digital product and what is a physical. If the line is sufficiently blurred then the existence of the physical market for PS is achieving the same goal.

So in the scenario where Sony no longer sells physical games in a box and everything is just a code in a box, is that a better market overall or a worse one? Because in that market you can buy game codes for PS games anywhere and the game codes would cost the same as current physical games.

The disparity in price between digital and game codes is because codes operate like a physical market and the digital market is artificially operating on cycles of deep discounts and returns to RRP. This can be negated with legislation specifically targeting this behaviours that forces all digital games to be sold at the lowest discounted price it has been available for on that platform. That’s the kind of key legislation that I think the market needs.

Blame the people who keep buying digitally if they didnt we wouldn’t be seeing such high pricing all the time. Physical alll the way

It requires proper regulations instead of a lawsuit like this. The Consumer rights and complaints Commission of the EU would be the right place to start, because if Sony would loose the right to sell in the EU, it would make them rethink some of their anti consumer policies. Just see what they achieved with apple and the usb c Standard, or mandatory 6 year hard and software support (starting on e production has ended) including replacement part supply. Great stuff!

Also, those who come out all defensive for their brand tribe bs, anti regulation fools and all-digital enablers should just hide in the pit they're digging for themselves and others unfortunately. The always sunny guy just for example, who says he "only cares for important matters", but still finds the time to ridicule and belittle those that don't share his views.

So I’ve been on this hill for a while now, often bringing up Armored Core VI as an example, where Sony refuses to sell an almost 3-year old game for any less than $30, but physically, you can get it as low as like $12. I love digital but this is one thing I do not love, that’s for sure.

Also, I see the same counter arguments popping up, and in the interest of having safe discourse, I’m just curious. For the folks who keep saying “oh Sony doesn’t set the prices, the developer does” can you expound on that? Because I’m confused why Amazon or Best Buy can sell a game for $15 when the PSN store won’t go under $40 for digital. And no, in the case of Amazon, I am not including 3rd party sellers. Again, I’m just curious. It’s weird to think so many devs across the board are like “yes, charge more for our game digital, but give it out physically for less than the price of dinner to Best Buy customers.”

@rjejr You are correct. Its about monopoly vs open market. The article is a bit misleading in my opinion, as thats not what the lawsuit is about like others also already pointed out.

@Areus no, xbox allow you to buy cd keys for games from online retailers, Sony do not.

@DaveTheRave the games don't fit on disks anymore, they're only gonna get bigger, there is always the argument about plastic waste etc but it comes down to it costs Sony money to make and distribute games physically but they charge the same for digital, they deserve everything they get.

I feel like this happens almost every year, but nothing ever comes of it.

It does propose an interesting dilemma.

Physical media is often cheaper because the retailer purchases the stock from Sony, at that point they can follow the RRSP or make their own. If the market average for a game physically is $5 cheaper than the digital version, should the digital market be forced to follow the physical pricing?

When it comes to used games it's a different dilemma. Used are often cheaper because they're used. Someone else has had the media and so it's not brand new. With digital that isn't a possibility, so should digital always carry new game pricing? The move to physical discs being download keys muddies the water further as, when you insert a used game in to your console, you're downloading the same version as is sold on the digital store, but having paid less for it.

At the end of the day I don't see this going anywhere - Sony have the right to list games at whatever price they like, and the physical/used market exists for players to purchase from at a lower price if they want, making this case moot.

Doubt this will really go anywhere.

The PlayStation Store is where I buy discounted games all the time. Not sure if it’s different in other countries, but PS store sales are constantly going. Is there really a problem with inflated prices?

@Areus pc has been digital for over 20 years people seem to love steam 🤷

This will go nowhere yet, although I do agree Sony have plans to further an agenda just like the one discussed in this lawsuit.

However there really needs to be an independent investigation and likely lawsuit into the construction of their dual sense controllers. The drift I have experienced in 4 dual senses is unacceptable and feels by design. Almost an electronic drift rather than drift of old. 1 I can understand, 2 is iffy, but 4?! Gtfoh.

Oh and before any of the mindless Sony Allegiant come at me the last two I actually rotated so they were used even less because I rotated between two every play session and yet the Drift actually occurred sooner in each

A controller they are charging that much for of which the price has increased should not have a shelf life that can often be less than a year. I finally bought a third party pro controller with hall effect at the expense of haptics just to stop giving Sony money for an obviously Nintendo level of defective stick design.

If you check out Stichting Massaschade & Consument's website, you'll see that they have also launched class action lawsuits against Airbnb, TikTok and Google - so they clearly have some kind of strategy of going for some of the biggest, wealthiest companies. The Google and Tiktok cases are about privacy and the use of users' information, and they are similarly seeking compensation.

Also, while they themselves are a non-profit, litigation is financed by a company called Omni Bridgeway - who take 20-25% of any successful claim. So, while the company may be motivated by high-minded ideals of helping consumers, their backers are obviously hoping to use these cases to strike it rich.

Anyway, there's some basic journalistic research for you all.

@Nalim Seems like the people posting from your neck of the woods (never realized how stupid that saying is until just now) have a better handle on things than the rest. Which makes sense. 👍

It would be nice get back the possibility to buy digital codes elsewhere.

@8bit4Life I've not bought physical in about 5 years but I agree with you on the PS Store sales. I see them all the time, usually even as quickly as a month or 2 after release. I saw someone mention Dragon Age: The Veilguard being $30 on PSN but listed as $12 physically. I mean, they gave that game away for $0.00 a few months ago so I think paying $0.00 beats paying $12.00.

@OldGamer999 If you make physical games more expensive than digital, you're essentially trying to force people into the digital only future. Same thing about the existence of Key Cards/Discs instead of putting the game on the cart/disc.

How companies act if the digital only future arrives is a problem in itself but the focus should be on trying to prevent the digital only future from happening in the first place.

@Grumblevolcano
Taking out any politics.
I just go by the cost of the materials and the products.
So surely cost wise if you are not making a disc and a case for the disc then your product should be cheaper digitally.
Then you have the cut to the retailer which is not there.
So the digital product should be cheaper.

So going just on the above a digital game on release should be cheaper than physical.

That is simple production cost economics.

@Grumblevolcano
Also taking out politics and production cost.

It’s even more simplistic. They will charge us physical or digital as mush as corporate greed allows them to make the most money as long as we buy. Yes we are the great gaming customers that pay, because we are passionate and love our hobby.

Reminds me I need to sue McDonald's for their dominant position

@PuppetMaster Why not rerelease it physically im certain the crowd will go nuts for it

@Flaming_Kaiser Which games for physical re-release, Rule of Rose and Mega Man Legends 1 & 2?

MM Legends still have some chance. But the PS2 Rule of Rose got cancelled and attacked by European reviewers & politician for silly af reasons. So i'm not sure Sony or any publishers wants to touch the game again :/

this lawsuit won't go any where , but on a side note , i've been a big fan of the attachable hard disc drive. whenever i had an issue with a video game console , its always the disc drive, its much easier being able to replace that part yourself then having to send in the entire console and more then likely get a replacement console instead of getting it fixed.

Full disclosure- I rarely buy digital games, and hate the push toward digital. Where i live there is a store called “disc traders” where about 68% of my games are from ( used of course). Even with Digital being SOMETIMeS cheaper ( like black Friday in USA) i still prefer the game on disc. Feels more tangible and like i own it. Same for movies. All that said, there are better ways to handle this, government marketing and/or negotiation for starters. Even IF this non-profit is being altruistic, it still looks and feels like a mafia type shakedown. In the US we call this “lawfare”. The goal is not to affect any real change, or win the suit. The goal is to cost the company lots of money through the court process or “win” by getting a big settlement. If this was about protecting the consumer they would have sued to make changes to the business model, NOT for any monetary awards or damages. And , to clear up any potential confusion on where i stand, i am not pro playstation policies,i remember when you could buy a gift card for a game on PSN. I am anti lawfare as an end goal. More and more i have seen this trend towards suing “ big bad evil company ( that I still CHOOSE to participate in)” because I don't have control of the company. Especially when there are other options first.

Do they know PC has been digital only for decades?

I'm loving this, all power to the Dutch breaking down Sony a little!!!! ✊

@Ryu_Niiyama Read the article again, please. It's about abusing their market position and monopolising prices, not digital sales per se.

@Bez87 Of course you should sue them for it. Pressure from below. But find allies, class action is needed ✊
Unionize, folks!!!

@PerpetualBoredom I did read the article. Pricing on PC eventually dropped to current sales all the time prices, often much cheaper than their physical counterparts. Even if it didn’t the market has been able to bear PC being digital only for decades. So if consoles go the same eventually the market will correct and find equilibrium. So I don’t see where I need to revisit my original comment. Perhaps you tagged me by mistake?

@PuppetMaster What was the reason i really dont know and maybe another try would make fans even more happy. Especially if you kick against the establishment shins a win win.

@Flaming_Kaiser True. I'm sure a lot of PS fans would be happy with a physical re-release for old niche titles. I would love Legend of Legaia, Alundra, Shadow Hearts etc get a PS4/PS5 physical copy with affordable price.

But sadly it will be hard to do right now with more and more publishers pushing for digital only release :/