A mysterious PlayStation 4 version of Demon’s Souls has been discovered on Sony’s servers by a Twitter account which is renowned for digging up file size data. PlayStation Game Sizes regularly posts about patches, release dates, and download sizes based on information that it scrapes from the PS Store. It’s rarely ever inaccurate.
However, this doesn’t appear to be a final product. “Demon's Souls has [a] PS4 version in the database,” the account explains. “But this version [could] be cancelled […] or only [a] small test version for developers.” The game obviously released as a PS5 exclusive late last year, but Sony reinforced its approach to cross-gen by announcing Gran Turismo 7 and God of War Ragnarok for the last-gen console earlier in the month.
So, what’s going on here? Frankly, we’d be surprised if a PS4 port is in production; obviously it’s not impossible – Godfall is getting a last-gen version – but we don’t expect Sony to go backwards with a title that’s already released. More likely is that development of the cult classic started on the PS4 before it eventually became a PS5 exclusive later in its lifecycle.
[source twitter.com]
Comments 71
If there's more money to be made by going backwards then I'm not sure why they wouldn't. But I've already said, I bet this eventually releases on PS4.
More and more reasons of it being pointless in buying a PS5 console right now.
Press X to doubt
I suppose rift apart is the only game than can't be played on the ps4 since it needs that ssd. For demon's souls and returnal, downgrade the visuals and it should work on the ps4
If it actually ends up happening I still think PS5 is the way this game is meant to be played. It's clear this PS4 version will probably be significantly cut down and scaled back to fit the hardware. It'll especially be paired back on how seamless the load times between entering different parts of each Archstone through the mist portals or entering a new Archstone from the Nexus
I'd buy it on PS4, pending being able to buy a PS5. Plus Bluepoint would probabaly be able to avoid the frame pacing issues which characterise From Software's own 30fps games.
Let's be honest, a few downgrades and it will run no bother. A ps3 remake for ps5, ported to ps4 has a bit of symmetry about it
Amazon has demon's souls ps5 for $50
The playstation 4 is the 1080p & 30 fps version maybe. But man if this is true, sony really didn't have true next-gen exclusive beside returnal and ratchet ps5 for this 1-2 years.
Or maybe sony can port the ps3 remaster 60 fps for ps4, upgrade $10 (from $60 to $70) to get the ps5 version.
@TheFrenchiestFry - It's a PS3 game with a shiny coat on. Beside the resolution bump and SSD load times there's nothing there that won't be just fine at 1080p on PS4.
This game was one of the big reasons I got a PS5 at launch but it coming to PS4 wouldn’t bother me at all. For one thing I wrapped it up months ago and I don’t think you’d get 60FPS on the PS4. I’ve played mostly PS4 games on my PS5 but the great thing is some have great updates for the new platform. Even those that don’t benefit from faster loads etc. In short, I don’t think Sony going cross gen for supposed PS5 exclusives is a problem at all.
Hey people are gagging for a remaster ever since the ps3 servers were closed. They could have started development on the ps4 (weren't bluepoint working on it for 3/4 years?), and then the higher ups decided this would be a good launch game for the ps5. Horizon 2 started development on the ps4....
My question is why was this only discovered now and not upon release?
I mean, next year Ratchet and Returnal come to PS4 too and finally we will have no effing reason to have a PS5.
Sony sure are going out of their way to convince me not to get a PS5 with all the moves they're pulling: cross-gen tent-pole titles, PC ports, MLB launching day one on Game Pass, and now PS5 exclusives potentially getting ported back a gen. This has to be the least committed I've ever seen Sony be to their latest hardware since the Vita. The PS5 is looking more and more like PS4 Pro 2 these days with the addition of a premium game price tag.
So a demake of a remake. Makes sense.
I hope not. Not because i care about the game launching on PS4 - heck, it would be good business. But the drama surrounding it would be deafening, and the anti Sony narrative is already so tiresome
@Rob_230 If im gonna play it its gonna be on PS5 it looks fantastic lightningfast loading is the reason i want it.
Would be an interesting situation. I wonder if it would still be £70 😂
I actually like loading screens you know. Reasonable ones. I like being able to check my phone or have a quick swig of my drink. I can’t imagine not being able to do that when I get a PS5. It’s one of the reasons I’m still on the fence 😂
@Flaming_Kaiser yeah thats a massive advantage. I die so often on it, the ability to respawn instantaneously is a huge boon lol!
What they are doing is being stubborn. They've got no interest in lowering the price, so they will release on ps4 and use that extra income to subsidise the ps5 versions low sales. Then they can keep the price at £70 on ps5 with minimal loss to them.
I'm sure that was the plan all along as the development process is built on what came before.
I'm not bothered eitherway anymore. Let them get on with it.
All the more reason for no need for a PS5 until late 2022.
Ratchet and Clank looks great but I can wait.
Returnal isn't my type of game.
Horizon and God of War would have made me upgrade but I can get them on PS4 so no need along with Gran Turismo now.
This gen has been a con from Sony so far hasn't it.
@Shigurui The asserts, even in 1080P, are not PS4, I’d still the best looking game I’ve ever played in 1080 and 4K. So much graphical fidelity would be lost.
So we will have only one true next gen game (Rift Apart) in the first three years of PS5. NOICE!
@Rob_230 As much as i loved Bloodborne its just to hard for me but indeed if you get reduced loadtimes i might look at if in another way. 😁
@Netret0120 Well there tons of games where i would love to see my loading be reduced and it still looks and runs better. That a upgrade for me and then we get the haptic feedback if implemented good its the cherry on top.
@Ah-Void Don’t forget Returnal!
I don't understand the people mad at a lack of next-gen exclusives. I mean any game available for both will still be better on the newest gen. Does it really amount to sacrilege if there's also a pleb version floating around?
Plus timed exclusivity, as is maybe maybe the case here, means they still seemingly prioritized the PS5. Isn't that what we want? And it's a remake so it's not like they dumbed down gameplay features knowing it'd eventually need to run on the PS4.
I mean we're like 6-7 months in. The games will come.
@fR_eeBritney Im old i can use time in better ways. 🤪
This is still the only next gen game that I consider a must play. Ratchet and Clank and Returnal look awesome and I'm sure I'll play them at some point but they're not high up on the list. Plus the fact that I don't have a PS5 yet kinda limits what I can play
@fR_eeBritney You can just stop an take a drink whenever you want though.... I understand Demon’s Souls load screens actually had lore and art and were interesting enough, but enjoying load times is very peculiar.
These downgrades are an obvious attempt to cope with ongoing, no-end-in-sight console scarcity. I can’t imagine being so impatient that I’d pay to play inferior versions of what should be next-gen exclusive games.
It’s hard not to see this generation transition as an unmitigated failure. PS5 won’t be easily attainable until some time in 2022 at the soonest, at which point the hardware will already be increasingly outdated. Many game releases will have been diminished by the limiting demands of straddling generations. It’s a rather bleak outlook if you care at all about innovation and advancement.
@AFCC
You obviously don’t have a PS5 if you think that there is no reason to upgrade from a PS4. It is lightning quick to get into games, games look and run amazing and you don’t have a jet engine in the background like my ps4 pro used to sound like.
@zupertramp
Yes.
@Nepp67
The PS5 versions do raytracing, higher framerates, faster loading, smaller file sizes, and haptic feedback (amongst other exclusive hardware enabled features), none of which the PS4 can/will do...
So why again is it pointless?
As it is, my PS4 struggles and screams from time to time with these games. The exact reason I haven't bought Miles Morales yet, and the exact reason I plan to play FF7RI & Nioh 2 over again from scratch. I've also bought the PS4 versions of Dirt 5 & WRC 9 & haven't really dived into them yet because I want to experience them with full bells & whistles + haptic/adaptive feedback on my 4KTV.
@sanderson72 @Ristar24 @BAMozzy So a PS4 version of Demon's Souls Remake does exist .
@Rob_230 "Sony narrative is already so tiresome" because Sony deserves it lmao. They been pulling some whacky sh*t in the last few years that deserve to be called out. Calling it out companies are good and don't forget that
@Jaz007 - So some fidelity would be lost, hardly a deal breaker. At 1080p it would still look fine on PS4 and the Pro could do 1440p. As I said already, it's just a shiny PS3 game.
@Shigurui
The SSD makes a huge difference.
Its even more important than 60pfs imo
Edit
Especially appreciated if you need farming a bit.
@JJ2 - I know the SSD is a factor but that's a QoL thing and nothing more in this case. We were all playing every game including Souls and Bloodborne without SSD's a few months ago and the PS5's existence doesn't suddenly turn the PS4/Pro into a potato that can't possibly run this glorified PS3 game.
@Shigurui
Well it does make them seem like potatoes haha
I wouldn't go back.
they totally failed with the launch of ps5 due to shop online only politics and now they need to port everything to ps4..yeah ps4 still makes the money..ps5 made scalpers rich.
@zupertramp Never underestimate the desire some people have to feel superior over others by either owning something they don’t or accomplishing something they haven’t (like pushing back against an Easy Mode in Demon’s Souls / Dark Souls).
Either that or they already had niggling buyers remorse and such events only cause those niggles to grow.
@KidBoruto Ha, ha! Still won't be buying it as I hated the original!
Wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 did get a version though quite who'd buy it, I'm not sure? With the huge breadth of titles still pouring out for the PS4 I can see it getting lost in the noise.
At least with the PS5, they have a captive audience hungry for new gen only titles (even if it's a 12 year old PS3 title originally)
@JJ2 @Shigurui As I've been saying recently, stick a decent SSD in the Pro's internal SATA3 HDD slot and be amazed how much quicker it is.
Of course it's not going to be as quick as a PS5 as it's just being used as storage and not some strange swap space device - I wonder if that's why there's only about 600Gb available for the PS5 storage as the other 200Gb is like a swap file?
Either way, my Pro is running quietly and doing everything asked of it only with much quicker load times.
The PS5 games WILL come but publishers & Sony need to make money from their games and a conservative 10:1 ratio of PS4 to 5 owners means that the old girl is still going to get a lot of support. Until the PS5 appears more readily in the wild, this situation will continue.
For anyone who predominantly buys a next-gen console just for new exclusive games, yes it probably doesn't make huge sense to have a PS5 yet.
For everybody else who's loving the incremental upgrades to their backlog/library and the best version of all the new cross-gen titles the PS5 is absolutely fantastic.
Day 1 buyer, zero regrets.
@themightyant Exactly this.
We've had this conversation every 5 - 7 years for the last few decades, and we'll have it again in another 6 or so years.
There are early adopters who love new hardware, and there are people who'd rather wait.
I bought a Series X and there is not a single next gen game on it for me to play right now. Nothing. But I wanted the hardware because I love new consoles.
Whatever you like. It doesn't matter. It's all about the value you place on things as an individual.
As for Demon's Souls, I'd be surprised to see it turn up on PS4. Its not impossible, but I'd be very surprised.
@KidBoruto Completely not surprised at all!! There is NO way the game couldn't run on PS4 with some visual tweaks of course. Its just whether Sony want to use the Game to entice people to buy a PS5 or willing to maximise its sales and release on PS4 too at some point. It would of probably started out as a Project for PS4 too...
If this is true, Sony are still adding to the reasons why I shouldn't get a PS5 (at least for a few years). Not like I needed more reasons at this point but whatever. I have never tried Demon's Souls, so I would probably pick it up if it did come to PS4 (depending on price).
@Shepherd_Tallon Yes it is cyclical and it does happen every generation, but it is a bit more extreme this time.
I think this is because
1) the new-gen consoles have the same fundamental x86 architecture as the old-gen. This is one reason why you didn't see it as many cross-platform games on PS3 -> PS4 with wildly different architectures and all the quirks of Cell
2) Development pipelines and tools are now used to making games scale more easily e.g. from mobile to PC or perhaps a smaller segment of that same scale. Hence it's not a huge new thing to make cross-platform games. They are already scaling games efficiently.
3) AAA Budgets have gone up significantly - making a game as a loss leader to push people to next gen sooner is not as feasible, as often.
4) Game development takes longer. Most games being released for next-gen were initially developed on last gen.
.. and many other reasons!
Digital foundry's podcast counted 10/11 exclusive next gen games across PS5 and XSX and some of those (The Medium, Demon's Souls and another, forget which) have been rumoured to be coming to PS4/XBone. Bringing that list down significantly (several of them were pretty trashy, cash grab "next gen" games.) That is smaller than usual.
Personally I don't care much right now, I have more games than I can ever play in my backlog with new titles I want to play arriving every month. A good game is a good game whether on PS4 or PS5. The PS5 plays basically all these better than PS4, even if it's just load times. The true next gen games will come.
My only minor concern is if this, or the chip-shortage, or the pandemic, will extend the natural life cycle of this generation beyond the expected 6-8 years as I like and value the new hardware and the benefits it brings.
Nowadays an Xbox/PS console is basically an optimised PC in a small box with a few special bells and whistles. It no longer makes sense to create anything radically different, look at the reception PS3 got. Hammered because it was too hard to develop for, not mainstream enough.
So each gen will now be a better and better PC, because that's what everyone wants. On the upside, you are likely to be able to play previous gen games on it with better graphics, content and frame rate.
I'm very happy with my PS5 .
@themightyant Solid points all. I don't disagree on any of that.
I hadn't considered the chip shortage extending the lifecycle, but it's definitely a possibility. I love the two new consoles, but it does feel like we haven't quite got the ball rolling yet.
@zupertramp the voice of reason? Now that's refreshing.
@zebric21 couldn't be further from the truth
@themightyant
Wait .
How many 'next gen' games were released at this point on ps4? I don't think there were more.
Not really different so far.
I remember people complaining for a long time to leave past gen behind for multiplat mostly. Watchdogs was touted in the press as the next gen haha
Edit
So there is 5 PS5 PS Studio exclusives new gen so far. More than there were for ps4 I think.
I can see this happening.
If Horizon FW slips to 2022, what exclusives has PS4 got for the rest of the year? Deathloop and Ghostwire Tokyo are only on PS5. There's nothing else major really.
They could certainly scale this game back to 900/1080p at 30FPS. There's no gameplay mechanic like Ratchet & Clank that prevents a port.
More gamers get to play the game and Sony makes more sales. Win win.
@JJ2 To be clear that 10/11 games from Digital Foundry was across both PS5 and XSX. The 8 next-gen exclusives on PS5 they listed were
1) Demons soul's (rumoured to be coming to PS4 here)
2) Ratchet
3) Returnal
4) Sackboy
5) Destruction all stars
6) Godfall (rumoured to be coming to PS4)
7) Enlisted
8) Aliens - not the game you are thinking of! and there's a reason you haven't heard of it
It's not a definitive list but a quick google showed this for PS4 by the same period. There's likely more.
1) Killzone : Shadow Fall
2) Infamous: Second son
3) Warframe
4) Knack
5) Outlast
6) Don't Starve
7) Trine 2
8) Blacklight: Retribution
9) Daylight
10) Blue Estate
My point wasn't that it was massively different, more that it was cyclical, it's happened before and will happen again, just this time is a little more extreme (especially on XSX)
For anyone wondering how the first year of PS4 went, here is an article on Eurogamer about the PS4's first year... sound familiar
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-11-15-who-needs-games-playstation-4s-first-year
@naruball it happens on occasion.
@FX102A I'd like to think it's the buyers remorse thing.
I just know I'd be happy to have one if it didn't take so much work to get one. Unless some sudden disgust for video gaming washes over me, I'm thinking it'd be a sound investment. Whether there are exclusives for it at the moment or not doesn't really concern me.
@themightyant
First party was similar and you missed Astrobot. I of course only mean PlayStation.
Edit.
First party is actually much better this time but its difficult to say it against the narrative.
@figboot If given the opportunity, I'm not going to wait until late 2022 (maybe even 2023) to play a game I've been waiting to play since 2020, downgraded inferior version or not. Patience is a virtue, but I'm not getting any younger either.
@JJ2 I agree they are similar, the whole point is that this is cyclical and in the first year of just about every new generation people moan about "no next-gen games" or "cross-gen". (If it isn't the first year, it's the second e.g. Switch) We've heard it all before, and we'll hear it again in 7-8 years.
Also agree the first party Sony next-gen line up is better this time round, they've done well imho! But there's also plenty of cross-gen to play, a good game is a good game.
ps. Astrobot - Knew I missed one! Brilliant little game.
@naruball so you tell me that ps5 software sales are thriving and the system isn't sold at a loss..
@Rols To me a new console means new games. The rest is obviously upgraded but I won't buy a console just because it's faster.
Edit: And yes I have a PS5.
@zebric21
That's right but only the ps5 disc edition is no longer sold at a loss.
@JJ2 To be clear about the "no longer sold at a loss".
This was presented as part of Sony's investor briefing. This is relevant because they would want it to be shown in as positive a light as possible to investors, therefore the favourable metrics they used in the documents were "Cost of goods (sold) COGS" v "Ave. Wholesale Price".
In other words it includes the costs of labour and materials DIRECTLY involved in making the product. It won't include indirect costs and expenses such as R&D, marketing, shipping etc. etc.
They will still be making a loss per box when you factor in ALL costs and expenses.
For an interesting comparison when Xbox said in the Epic v Apple case that they had "never turned a profit on Xbox console sales alone" they were almost certainly factoring in ALL costs as it was in their best interest to show that THEIR 30% charge on Xbox store was justified while Apple's, who do make a profit on hardware, wasn't.
This Ladies and Gentlemen is how you 'lie' with statistics
@themightyant
Yea I'm just taking the official version correctly reported as base for information. 🤷♂️
It's when what they said is incorrectly reported that I see an issue.
@themightyant
Hi man. Sorry. Just to be clear, I'm usually here on my phone walking about and such and not too much time for long conversation.
I believe what they said is likely true in the way they presented it, unless proven wrong or mistaken later. Now it's certainly possible to see a different angle and speculate or argue or frame it as untrue in a way or another and is not my worry at all. 👍
@JJ2 https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2021/06/ps5_games_are_still_selling_poorly_at_retail_in_japan
another article that proves problematic software sales..scalping is still the biggest issue sony has..this alone will force them to change everything promised.
@JJ2 What Sony specifically said is "PS5 standard edition is expected to break even next month (June 2021)" that is apparently true.
However it is also a slippery statement and doesn't tell the whole story. Yes it is true the cost of materials and labour now are less than or equal to the cost they sell the box to retailers.
But the complete cost of a console is more than just the parts and the labour. That statement being true doesn't mean they are making a profit on each box sold either. (Which I've seen a lot of people say)
This isn't a criticism of Sony, it's brilliant that they have got to that stage so soon after launch, i'm just trying to make people aware of slippery use of statistics, and not jumping to incorrect conclusions.
@themightyant
Fair enough.
There is obviously many moving parts in their business.🤷♂️
I'm not really THAT interested in how much money they make anyway 😃
Sooo whatever they announce about the cost is fine with me.
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