Topic: Official Push Square Xbox Thread

I very much doubt MS are interested in leaving the console space. Yes the XB1 may not of sold like the PS4 has but its still sold more than the XB360 managed at the same point and still sold more than WiiU. It seems they are more interested in merging their Windows 10 PC gaming Market and its Xbox console market to make a MUCH bigger user base. Instead of looking at it that the 'exclusives' are no longer 'console' locked. the games are now MS windows 10 locked (not available to ALL PC owners, just Windows 10 PC's) and the potential user base its MUCH bigger than Sony has with its PS4. As a gamer, that also opens up the possibility of playing online games with full lobbies, better ping and experience,. The games are playable across both platforms and its not like you have to buy the PC version (unless you choose to buy physical) and can be more flexible where you play. MS are essentially merging PC gaming and Console gaming into 1, much bigger user base. Some of the 'benefits' of Consoles are being added to Win10 and some of the benefits of PC's are being added to the Console. MS won't care too much if you don't buy the next Xbox but game on a Win10 PC, play with your Xbox friends, earn Xbox style achievements and more importantly buy their software - its better than losing that sale to Sony or Nintendo. They are offering you the chance to play a game on your PC and then carry on where you left off on your console or vice versa. Your Xbox Profile is also your Win10 PC gaming profile.

Its possible that the Xbox could become more a gaming PC than a 'console' but lets be honest, Consoles these days seem to be more multi-media hubs anyway. The PS4 can play Blurays, has an internet browser and streaming apps. I doubt MS will make a full blown PC as I expect it to be optimised more for gaming than general use like a PC but I still expect it to have multi-media functionality.

I am not saying that what MS are doing is the right (or wrong) way to go about the future for gaming. Its just a different way to what we have seen before but they are able to go this route because of their domination in PC Operating Systems. Sony and Nintendo can't exactly offer the same. Like I said its not 'every' PC that will have access to these 'exclusives' - just those that are Win10. Microsoft's exclusives have the potential to reach far more gamers than Sony's can and why shouldn't MS sell their games to other MS users and only limit it to those specifically on Xbox? Maybe it will mean that Nintendo and Sony owners won't buy an Xbox in the future to play exclusives as they own a win10 PC and can game on that, but for MS its still an extra game sale - an extra person on their network, using their products, increasing their overall user base etc...

I can see MS offering a new, updated Xbox every 3-4years that is more like upgrading your PC's hardware. It will continue to play the games in your library - some at increased visual quality and performance (you won't get a game capped at 1080/30 suddenly running at 4k/60 without some developer patch) but you could see performance/resolution increases in games that are unlocked - maybe even access to settings like PC gamers have - like resolution, visual quality etc. That is the vision and future that MS appear to be moving towards with its console. It will still probably be 'underpowered' compared to a high-end PC but optimised for gaming and have the usual multi-media functionality but completely compatible with Win10 PC's inc game chat, cross-play etc

Sony are unlikely to change their formula and will no doubt release a 'new generation' Playstation every 5yrs+ (depending on the market and technology). Every new generation will be an evolution and compatibility with previous software may or may not work - I don't see it as a priority for Sony and leaves them free to look forward rather than consider old software and its (hardware) needs. If it works out then 'bonus' if not, they have a new, more powerful console to offer us. Whether we see another 'Pro' type mid-term upgrade will vwry much depend on the technology around it. If the PSVR2 requires more power to get the best out of it, 8k screens are available and selling better than 4k, or even a 'new' or better HDR implementation requiring more power, then its possible. I know the PS4 can play PSVR, can offer HDR and 1080p screens are still the most common, but the Pro enhances these and is more about the next 2years+ than the previous 3. I can only see 4k HDR becoming more popular in peoples houses ad as game development continues to grow, I can see fewer and fewer games hitting even 1080p so those who do upgrade their TV will certainly notice the visual decline after its upscaled more than 400%.

MS may well be late to the VR and UHD (over 1080p) gaming, may well be merging the best of PC with Consoles (and vice versa), may well not have had the 'sales' they hoped for with the XB1 but its still in a good way for the future and certainly don't appear to be looking to make their 'final' console - at least not to me.

@KratosMD: It's not about hiccups or anything like that. Microsoft aren't having a Wii U or Vita moment with the Xbox One. It's their most successful console. It's one of the fastest selling consoles of all time.

The reason I wouldn't be surprised for Xbox to get out of gaming hardware isn't anything to do with the perceived failures of the Xbox One. It's down to the business that Microsoft is, and their long term goals within the industry.

Look at Nintendo. You mention them having a failure with the Wii U. Yup. But for them to get out of hardware (which, incidentally, I think would be awesome for me) is a huge decision because they make all of their money from video games - hardware, software, merch. That's their whole business.

Sony have their fingers in lots of pies, many of which are struggling. They make premium hardware that people aren't necessarily buying as much of in the current economical climate, and their phone business has been annihilated by Samsung and Apple. Their movies aren't making as much money as they were. Their insurance is doing pretty well. Music is whatever. PS4 is one of the only aspects of their business that is a legitimate success, and PlayStation, generally, has been a really strong brand since it began in the mid-90s.

Conversely, Microsoft is a company that makes a hell of a lot of money from software - Windows and Office mainly - and very little (or it actually loses money according to many reports) from Xbox. If they dropped Xbox right this second it would make very little difference to their business whereas it would be catastrophic for Sony or Nintendo to do the same.

I'm not saying that Microsoft will get out of hardware. All I'm saying is that out of the three console manufacturers we have today, they have the least to gain by staying in the business. Some see them sending their console exclusives to PC as evidence that their long-term strategy has changed from taking over the living room to amalgamating their PC and console brands under one Xbox umbrella that will continue to exist as a service or an app or something. I don't think that sounds crazy.

It wouldn't surprise me to see Microsoft walk away from consoles. But then it also wouldn't surprise me to see them simply move away from the generational battle with Sony and do their own thing, similar to how Nintendo have. Or for them to just continue as is. They've got so much money in the bank and they make so much from other things that their future is a lot less certain, I think.

If anyone knows the history of MS the only reason they created the Xbox was so they could sell games. Back when they created the original Xbox console gaming was making a whole lot more money then PC gaming at the time. Microsoft just came out with their DirectX which made it easier to make games across a variety of PCs. Bill Gates saw that with the PS2 game systems could do much more then just game systems, fun fact the driving power behind earlier PS2 sales was the fact that t could play DVDS. It increased DVD sales in Japan (which earned more money fo Sony via their movie portfolio) ten fold and was alot of people's first DVD player. Bill Gates thought the Xbox could do the same for Microsoft. Introduce a console that was basically an introductory PC with games using Direct X which would create more money via MS software portfolio. Thus the Direct X Box or Xbox was created.

With that short history lesoon I don't think MS will leave the console business and quite frankly anyone who does just doesn't know business or a Sony, Nintendo fanboy and that explains it. MS has said it themselves that they want to put in end to console generations and that's what I think their plan is with the Scorpio, a console that is more PC then game console. Where you can upgrade parts like a PC yearly or however often and all Xbox games can run on a single system something like PC games.

Much like how Nintendo seems to be focusing on the Mobile gaming market with the Switch, MS is focusing more on the PC side.

@Tasuki: but if every xbox game is coming to PC, then whats the point in owning an xbox?

@FullbringIchigo: Yep pretty much what @KratosMD said, and that was the driving force behind MS creating the Xbox. As I said back when the original Xbox was conceived, PC gaming wasn't big like it is now more of a niche thing.

One of the reasons was the cost of a video game console vs a gaming PC. Another reason was how complex PCs seem to be at that time. In MS eyes what good is selling software if no one owns the hardware.

@FullbringIchigo: not EVERY game will be available on ALL PC's. For a start you need to have a Windows 10 PC and create an Xbox style profile to play the games that are 'exclusive' to both. Assuming you want to just buy an Xbox for exclusives as you get gaming met by other consoles, its cheaper to buy an XB1s than go out and buy a win10 gaming PC to play these exclusives. Not everyone wants to game on PC's so the console also caters to them. With both a Win10 gaming PC and Xbox, You can buy the game once for both platform which may suit certain people and set-ups. All MS are doing is basically extending and uniting their Win10 PC and Xbox market and user base - amalgamating them into one platform essentially. It doesn't matter if you game on one or the other or both. They are trying to do away with the PC vs Xbox and uniting them as one united platform. If, for example, you buy Forza Horizon 3 or Gears 4, you are not separated from each other but can play online together, chat together etc as if they were all on one console. What MS are doing is making the 'hardware' almost unimportant. It won't matter if you own a PC or Xbox, all MS games will be available on both, all games play across MS servers together as one united MS user community. You won't know if the person you are playing with is on console or PC, their profile is the same style, they both have the same achievements, same chat options etc. Your profile is the same for both Win10 and for Xbox - without this, you can't play their Win10/Xbox exclusives - its not the same as Tomb Raider for example which had a PC release - These games are only available in the MS store (the same as the store for Xbox), only available on Win10 and require an Xbox profile. Its NOT every PC. Your cloud saves work on both systems - meaning that if you start playing on one system, you can load up the game on another and carry on from the last point. In essence its more like win10 allows you to carry your Xbox onto a Win10 PC but if you don't have an Xbox but do own a Win10 PC, you can still set up an 'Xbox' account and play Xbox exclusives - like Forza, Gears, etc. Owning a PC isn't necessarily going to give you access to these games! If that makes sense...

I don't think that Microsoft are thinking about leaving consoles behind but I think they are trying to change the notion of what a console is. Sony, with the Pro is doing something similar.

I agree that Microsoft are going to tie their OS's together as they have and that Xbox will become a windows gaming machine and move to iterative updates. Regular gamers expect to update their hardware every 4-5 years, less regular gamers not so much depending on trends and popularity. So why release a brand new console and hope it catches when you can release iterative and better tie people into your app and game ecosystem. Less regular gamers still have working machines but they can always upgrade. New games will have modes and will eventually not work on older machines but old games will still be compatible in newer machines. It is a big incentive to stay with Microsoft if your games library will continue to work. I think the message of Scorpio will be, wow this new system is the dogs doodahs but fear not, your XB1 will last for a lot longer but when you are ready, upgrade. XB1 will be cheaper as well so sales will be steady and people get locked into Microsoft. I think they would be happy to keep the current install base for the XB1 and then add to it over time. It is a lot less risky then releasing a new console and it failing to connect to a user base.

The question is, will this prove to confusing to those consumers who like the simplicity of knowing I have console A, Console B is now available - I will upgrade as it is the new version for the next gen experience.

Interesting times to be a gamer!

@BAMozzy: I agree on some points but I do think that the PS4 Pro marks a change in the direction of the console. We have had slim versions and model changes but those have really just been cosmetic. The PS4 Pro is an iterative update to its console - maybe not as mind blowing as a generational leap but I can't think of other iterative console updates in the past. I think that is why there has been a difficult marketing balancing act. Ultimately the majority of users will not upgrade to the Pro but at the same time I can see why Sony needed something a bit more powerful in the market to keep users engaged. It is still a change to the way consoles are normally released.

I also think that the majority of consumers are easily confused by versions etc. I mean, people on the site here are fans and there are millions of fans but a vast majority are either not regular gamers or not regular purchasers of games. I've received presents from relatives and friends for the wrong console (heck, this year I got xbox vouchers instead of PSN vouchers from my Dad because he remembered, at some point, I owned an xbox). Manufacturers obviously need to be relevant to gamer hobbyists (I hate the hardcore, casual gamer terms so trying to think of something not patronizing) but a console needs to move outside this group to sell gangbusters like the Xbox1 and PS4 have done. I have several friends and relatives that have a PS4 (or XB1) who have bought maybe 1-4 titles a year and typically the big name games. Those people bought when the prices went down and game maybe once a week or so. We are at that stage in the lifecycle when those people are the ones really buying consoles. Iterative consoles are a harder marketing sell - it is a mindset change. Once people get used to it then great, but you need to sell the concept and that is tough. It is why Sony has been cautious with the Pro. I am intrigued to see how MS market the Scorpio to the mass market.

So now that I have decided to wait on Switch, next on my list is Scorpio and see what that brings to the table. Hopefully they will have some info on it here shortly, or at the very least E3.

Scorpio is a pre order for me, I got the One day one and Scorpio will be no different.

I'm jelly.

@Splat: What's there to be jealous about its just a Diablo clone, don't you have Diablo III on PS4? Besides it's on PC right now.

I wonder if Force Unleashed comes with the DLC. I played and finished it years ago on the Wii, which I loved. The Wii motion controls were really fun to use especially when playing Vader. I will admit the motion controls and the Wii version already having the DLC included was why I went with that version. Still for free I wouldn't mind playing it again.

I have zero interest in that Lovers game, it looked like a game from the '80s but the other 3 look decent. I have Star Wars on disc so I can get rid of another one now. I'm trying to retire my 360 and just have the One and it is going quite well with the BC games.

Not too shabby - I will probably download Project Cars - just because I can but I do get bored of racing games. I already own Star Wars on the 360 but will probably add it to my download queue for the XB1. Not interested at all in the other 2...

@KratosMD EVOLVE! i doubt even giving that away will help it

Kinda odd making Borderlands 2 backwards compatible since they have The Handsome Collection on Xbox one.

@Tasuki Not really as that is also 'free' to all Xbox360 owners too. Maybe some won't have the Handsome collection and maybe it might tempt them to buy. I doubt I will download it because I own the collection. Its still a great game and for all those undecided on Borderlands, its a great opportunity to try it. Its not like the game is linear or only 1 character so if they enjoy playing it one way on the free version, they may decide to buy the collection and play through the game as a different character and all the DLC and the other game too...

@FullbringIchigo Maybe, maybe not but its the 'Ultimate Edition'. Visually the game looked great but it was all the BS DLC - especially all the day 1 extras that ultimately ruined it, not the game-play and this comes with a lot of that. It may actually resurrect it on XB1 at least. Its still not bad value for 'Free'. I will actually download it but whether I get to play it much with Horizon and Mass Effect out this month...

Layers of Fear looks interesting for free too - not something I would normally buy but will download. Not interested in