Topic: Final fantasy discussion thread

@Tasuki to expand on where I am coming from a little more, there is a difference between genuinely preferring say FF6 to FF7 and outright saying characters in FF7 have no personality, and the stories were flat and dull, and then comparing it to a series of mediocre film sequels.

FF7 was lauded on release by critics and gamers, it’s regularly featured on best games of all time lists and has had and continues to have countless spin-offs.

That simply wouldn’t happen if it was a poor game.. unless you’re really suggesting all these people are completely wrong? Which would be pretty arrogant wouldn’t it?

So you can say people are being “fan boys” and not “true FF fans” (perhaps those things contradict one another a little!) but it’s clear as day that some of those who prefer previous instalments have become bitter and jealous that 7 tends to steal the limelight.

And you know what, I get it, it must be annoying but just as I can accept that for many people the NES and SNES games are legitimately better even though I don’t personally rate them that highly and I do think there must be something I am missing for sure, I think you could look at the facts and choose to reassess parts of your long held negative view of FF7.

Facts, by blind mindless sheep. I have played FF VII and I can assess that it's shallow, soulless game. It has nothing to do with being bitter or anything it's all about being truthfully which people are afraid to do nowadays. If they go against the establishment they they are made fun of and won't fit in to society. You see it all over go against the grain and you get ridiculed because your wrong.

Sorry to burst your bubble but I don't need reassessing, I know what's good and what isn't and don't need to be told what is and isn't. If you feel you need to do to sleep better at night that's fine. But let's not pass off a bunch of b.s. as truth and facts just because you're afraid to go against the establishment.

@Tasuki so a recognised stone cold classic has absolutely zero redeeming features in your view, nor can you see why other people might reasonably enjoy it without being sheep? 😂 come on Tasuki, come join the rest of us in the establishment - not even a little shout out for the music?

@Tasuki What you say about people in general has some truth to it at the very least, but to call everybody who thinks one of the most highly regarded JRPGs in history is great sheep is more than a bit extreme. There's nothing wrong with not liking the game or having the opinion you do about it, but that doesn't mean you are right and everybody else is wrong. It'd be different if it was one of these games that literally everybody thought was crap. They exist unfortunately, but in this case it's an opinion, not a fact. Again, an opinion you are more than welcome to have, but that's all it is.

One could draw the conclusion from what you have said as you hating the game just to be against the "establishment". I suppose that's not the case. Again, you are welcome to have the opinion you have as not everybody will love something that is highly regarded. Breath of the Wild is considered one of the greatest games of all time, but I didn't make it passed the 5 or 6 hour mark with it.

@kyleforrester87 @KilloWertz Problem is when it comes to FF 7 people are blinded by nostalgia that's the problem. Nearly everyone who says Final Fantasy 7 is the best one will admit it was the first one they played which I understand. JRPGs weren't big during the NES and SNES FF 7 was the killer app for the PS so yeah I understand, and as they say you never forget your first. It would be like I said earlier if someone first Star Wars movie was Episode 7 so naturally they saw 8nand then 9 but then went back and watched 1, 2, 3 and said 7, 8 and 9 are the best Star Wars movies ever. It made millions at the box office compared to 1, 2, 3.

Now if those people would take off the rose tinted glasses they will and play the older ones and have a non biased view they will see the difference but they don't. Their first impression is not the story and characters it's OMG the sprite graphics are bad compared to FF 7 3D graphics, the music is not orchestrated, you have to grind etc etc etc. All stuff that can't be compared because of hardware differences. It be like me saying a Marvel Movie is better then Citizen Kane because Avengers had CGI battles while a Citizen Kane is black and white and dismiss the acting, story etc.

If if people would do that they would see. But again people are too afraid to learn the truth and just go by what they are told and what feels right. They are afraid to learn that their precious FF 7 isn't as good as they though and it scares them for some odd reason.

@Tasuki none of what you are saying is justification for your opinion that FF7 has no redeeming features though. It’s like saying A Link to the Past is the best Zelda (valid opinion) and in the next sentence that Ocarina of Time is absolute trash in every single respect (an opinion for sure, but factually wrong).

As to whether nostalgia plays a part in people’s love for FF7, of course it does, just as it does in your love for the NES and SNES games. There is nothing wrong with that at all, and rational people will not be blinded by that. What do you take us for…?

@kyleforrester87 It just, your just not listening to what I am saying, that's all. Obviously you don't want to hear what I am saying that's fine. But I gave you several examples, this is what I mean by calling people sheep, you have to logic to add here, your answer is because everyone likes it. Have you ever thought that maybe everyone is wrong.

As I said, take a look without the rose tinted goggles on and you will see the that the earlier games where far superior in story and characters, they didn't need graphics to impress people. Play the games and you will see the proof is there if you want to see for yourself rather then letting others make up your mind.

@Tasuki I do believe I am listening to what you are saying, but sure - everyone is wrong! I thought you might at least throw FF7 some points for the soundtrack, alas, you are as stubborn as ever. Still, fun chatting! 👍🏻

@kyleforrester87 Soundtrack is fine but what has that got to do with story or character development?? I play a video game for story and characters not the soundtrack, if I want that I would just by the soundtrack.

@Tasuki you know what, I’ll take it. They should put that one on the back of the box.

“0/10, Soundtrack is fine - Tasuki”

Welp, if I’ve learned anything, I think it goes something like this:
FFVI = Citizen Kane
FFVII = Star Wars Episode VII: The Force Awakens
FFVII Remake = Thor: Love & Thunder
FFX = Forrest Gump?
FFXII = Avatar?
FFXV = Dumb & Dumber?
😂

Do we need some aficionado perspectives? @ShogunRok , @johncalmc Can we get a consensus here?

Robert’s recent review scores for FF1-6 went like this, respectively:
7, 6, 7, 8, 7, 9

I do see VII Remake scored an 8, and remasters for FFX and FFXII got an 8 and a 9, for perspective. And XV got an 8 and XIII got a 7…
The worst mainline FF game is apparently FFII, according to the Push Square expert who’s reviewed them all.
So in the movie analogy, FFII = …Jingle All The Way? 😂

Got a little bit further in Final Fantasy IV Pixal Remaster. Just became a Paladin and now I am heading through the old water way to sneak into Baron.

I’ve actually only ever played FF6-8 (and 7R obviously).

I bought my sister the remakes of the early games on PS1 and briefly tried them but they were pretty rough and I never really got into them. And the later games I just never got round to.

I was so hyped for FF15 but got completely put off by the fact that actually story was going to be tied to DLC so never bought it and there are too many other games out there for me to both going back to it.

@Thrillho I have the originals on PS1 and stuff like the 3 remake on 3DS and 6 on Gameboy Advance. I find my mileage really varies with the older ones. Without more generous save points I struggle to keep going with them, not so much that I keep dying (although losing 30 minutes of progress is annoying when you do) but more as I tend to play them alongside something else in short bursts and like to be able to stop/start easily. 6 on the Mini Snes worked really well with save states. I think the additions to these pixel remasters resolve all of the issues I would have replaying the older games, the only problem I have is the pricing really, which I think is a little on the steep side.

@Th3solution So, FFVII is Force Awakens? a slickly made rehash far too hung up on appeasing the nostalgia vampire fanboys to do anything original? I might play this one last.

@AgentCooper Well, it’s @Tasuki ‘s analogy, not mine, but I think what he meant was more like it’s a “common entry point for fake fans who never saw the older, original, better movies and even when they do go back and watch the classic series if they still say they like The Force Awakens better they are objectively wrong because they just like TFA better because it was the first one they saw and they are blinded by nostalgia, hype, and fancy new age visuals.”

I’m one of these ‘fake fanboy sheep’ (despite having played a total of eight entries in the series) who really adores FF7. (It’s a close race between it, FF12, and FF10 as to which is my favorite.)

To be honest the movie comparison might be better that FF7 is like The Empire Strikes Back, the consensus best in the franchise but there is a minority who prefer A New Hope. I don’t know… like I say - I haven’t played the old 2D games and can only speculate, which is also part of what Tasuki is pointing out. (However many who have played them all still hold up VII in highest regard)

Given that video games are interactive technology based entertainment, a better analogy might be the old 2D games are like driving a classic ‘57 Chevy and FF7 with its ‘newfangled’ 3D tech is like driving a ‘97 C5 Corvette with its newer LS1 engine at 345 BHP and 0-60 MPH times of 4.72 seconds. Then FF16 might be like driving a Porsche Taycan Turbo which leverages technology to pair two electric motors with a 93.4 kWh battery for outputs of 750 hp and 774 lb-ft of torque to achieve 0-60 mph in a mind boggling 2.6 seconds.

Driving any of those cars would be a joy it just depends on your preference for performance, modern amenities, and style.

@Th3solution I think a suitable test might be to get, say, 100 people who have never played a JRPG before to play FF6 and 7 simultaneously (alternating between one and the other for an hour at a time, so neither is truly played "first") until completion, voting on their favourite of the 2 once they have finished them and then adding up the results to get the overall winner. I actually don't think I'd be comfortable voting on which way that result would go, but if I absolutely had to I'd go with 7 out of loyalty/fanboyism. Though I think Tasuki would expect 100% to go in favour of 6, since the only redeeming feature of 7 is obviously its soundtrack, which I personally think is unlikely!

@kyleforrester87 Excellent idea for an unbiased study. @AgentCooper , you’re test subject #1! 😄
Just 99 more people to find!

I'm very happy to go with whatever @AgentCooper concludes, providing it's FF7!!

I always admire FF7 for having one of the biggest shocks in gaming history but putting a screenshot of it on the box.