Topic: The TV Show Thread

@RogerRoger More. There was another series too by Virgin books I think.
Also, as far as I know, none of the books or audio dramas are strictly canon. Think of it like how Disney treats the Star Wars EU.

@crimsontadpoles Well, many of the current writers are soap veterans, so there is that.

I'm actually OK with the companions this time around. Graham specifically. Bradley Walsh is great in his role. Ryan and Yaz largely just seem 'there' sometimes, I don't mind them on the whole, and no one has turned out to be cosmically important so far, which is refreshing for new Who.
I'd rather Yaz and Ryan were the ones leaving though. Or just ditch all three and pick up a companion from the future or an 'alien' or something.
Big companion rosters can work, but having them all from the same place and time and largely there for exposition in the guise of 'good guy' ignorance - it is a bit boring.
When 5 was travelling with Turlough, Nyssa and Tegan, they managed some great interplay; Turlough a potential traitor but scientifically adept, Tegen the ignorant-then contemporary human and Nyssa an alien from a technologically advanced planet.

I agree. JW feels hard to gauge. She has moments where it seems to click, but it does feel like it needs to click.
There are no real introspective moments or solo adventures for her either which doesn't help. While I've commented before about the saccharine sentimentality of new Who, the times when 9, 10, 11 and 12 were alone served up some great characterisation.

So far, I think it is almost fair to say that 13 is being treated nearly as badly as 6 (OK, that's a bit of a stretch).

My mom (bless her) loathes Bradley Walsh as a companion @KALofKRYPTON... She says his acting is stiff as a board and he doesn't seem to act any differently then if he was presenting The Chase 😂

I don't mind him myself (Or any of the companions really)... Probably would've been better if it was just one of them as a companion though.

Yaz in particular seemed to have nothing to do in most the episodes I saw of that first season with 13th doc. Ryan wasn't that great either but he had something usually besides twiddling his thumbs.

I was so hoping Jodie'd be good in the role too. Tbh I didn't think she was that great in Broadchurch (which is the only thing I'd seen her in prior but it has been a while since I watched it and I don't think she had much to do there?) but I was looking forward to her as I do with every new actor who takes up the mantle.

She felt pretty flat to me though as The Doctor. The awful dialogue and scripts not really helping her case especially with those messages as @crimsontadpoles mentions being about as subtle as a sledgehammer...

But I dunno... I think better writing would be a bit wasted on her too if I'm honest as I think her acting's a bit wooden. Maybe she's better in this newest series but... Yeah I'm not watching that

This Capaldi talk and @RogerRoger's talk in particular is making me want to try his second season... I didn't like the plots that much of his first season either (and urrrrgh don't get me started on Clara) but I thought he was alright as the doctor at least...

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy Verisimilitude!
He does well at coming across as a bloke in a situation rather than a narrative device.

You could be right; JW could just be out of her depth - but I do think she has the potential to be good in the role. There isn't much of a change in the second run for 13, other than some episodes being marginally better (and some, significantly worse).

Go for it for 12. Variable quality throughout his run and I get the feeling that the shooting order clashed with the trajectory of Capaldi's characterisation and direction, but it does get steadily better for the most part. I've always seen Clara as a bit of a millstone for 12 - but on a re-watch, she's better for 12 than she was 11. I was glad when BIll turned up though.

Mmm I might start from the begininng of Smith's run @KALofKRYPTON in fact as I kinda stopped halfway through his second season when it first aired. Can't remember why as I quite liked his first season and thought he was pretty decent!

I admittedly didn't like Tenant much when he took over from Ecclestone (Shame he's a plonker about it as I quite liked him in the role).

It was only on a rewatch a couple years back when I got a really good deal on series 1-4 of the new run that I'd completely changed my tune and really liked Tenant so hopefully the same can happen with Capaldi and Smith!

I, personally, was kinda hoping for someone like Eva Green for a female doctor... I thought she was fantastic in the series Penny Dreadful as Vanessa and I very much doubt we'd be questioning her acting chops unlike poor Jodie!

I mean the scripts'd still be pants... but at least we'd be blaming them only! 😂

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy
I took me a while to appreciate some of Tenant's stuff - again, soppy sentimentality ruins quite a lot of it. As well as the 'sonic screwdriver' fixes everything!

Ecclestone was given a bit of a bum-deal. The BBC essentially lied when he left/was forced out, and said that he was only intended for the first season and that it was totally his decision etc etc. It's only very recently that he's started talking about it.

I loved Penny Dreadful! And Eva Green is great in it too! What a terrible shame the last half of the final season was! She would be very good.

I'd have liked to have seen someone with a bit more presence than JW has so far. Katie McGrath, Lara Pulver - along those lines - or even an older, more commanding woman leading on from Capaldi. Someone along the lines of Charlotte Rampling.

@KALofKRYPTON Frustratingly, I think the show robbed itself of the perfect female Doctor when they cast Michelle Gomez in such a major, recurring role. She'd have been fantastic.

And thanks for the heads-up on the books. I've got the Thrawn trilogy to read first, but I can see myself dipping in and out somewhere down the line. I've fallen into quite a deep Doctor Who pit at the moment, but may have hit bottom last night when, in a sudden flash of self-awareness, I realised I was watching a Venusian Aikido supercut on my phone at 3am. As one does.

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy I hope my effusive praise hasn't misled you, and that you enjoy Capaldi's second and third seasons! I could never claim to adore Clara, but her arc was well-considered. I think you'll get along much better with Bill, and by that time you'll hopefully be invested in the Doctor enough regardless.

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy well he is leaving in the special this year so your mum should be happy, so is Tosin with only Mandip staying so Yaz might actually get development next series

@RogerRoger
The Thrawn trilogy has the potential to make you scream at how inadequate the Disney trilogy is in comparison! The two afterwards aren't as good, but I never did read the most recent canon one.

Also, I'm very much enjoying The Eight Doctors so far. Nicely handled trip down memory lane - Venusian Aikido included! 😁

@KALofKRYPTON Yeah, now that we've seen how Disney deigned to conclude the Skywalker Saga, it'll be interesting to compare and contrast an alternate trilogy. I've heard good things about the new book, although be warned it's a prequel to TV shows The Clone Wars and Rebels, focused on Thrawn's rise to power in amongst established characters and events. Might change the dynamic a bit.

Anything with Venusian Aikido included gets my vote. Good to hear it's positive!

... Huh... I always assumed that he didn't wanna talk about it was down to him being embarassed with the role or something @KALofKRYPTON. That's really quite interesting from looking up about that.

I take back my extremely mild insult of plonker as he was beyond reasonable in this new light 😂

I've only seen Katie McGrath as Morgana in the BBC Merlin series (Well and that short role in Jurassic World) She'd certainly be interesting. I'm not familar with Lara Pulver but I know Charlotte Rampling for sure.

I'd not complain about any of them and I agree they'd no doubt have a stronger presence on camera

Ahh don't worry @RogerRoger! I'll either like it now or I won't. When I decide to do my annual "pay for Netlix for a month and catch up on what I want before ditching it til next year" I'll give Capaldi and Smith their chance to shine

Good to know @FullbringIchigo!

Michelle Gomez was HILARIOUS as Missy. I really miss that iteration of the The Master.

Has the current run with Jodie Whittaker improved at all? I watched the new run of the show religiously for years from Eccleston up through halfway into her first season. I barely managed to survive the terrible last season or two of Capaldi's run (such a shame, because I loved the concept of his doctor), but as of last season, the show became practically unrecognizable to me, like all of the fun was sucked out of it.

Not a fan of JW's performance, but if the writing were decent, I could look past it. I miss Doctor Who being good.

@Ralizah I'd say that Jodie Whittaker's second season in Doctor Who is about the same as her first, maybe just very slightly more tolerable. If you weren't keen on the first season then you're unlikely to feel any different about the latest season.

I've watched all of her episodes, but overall haven't been too fond of them.

In a hypothetical world where COVID19 dictates that I be locked up for 2 weeks unable to leave home and I actually finish all my gaming and other Netflix, Amazon Prime, and movie backlog.... wait what I am saying? This will never happen. Anyways, in such a fantasy world, which if any of the DC/Arrowverse shows should I watch? I’m a complete noob on that world. Watched a couple seasons of Arrow and got bored of it a couple years ago. Or would it be better to watch all the Marvel shows. Similarly I watched the first half of season one of Daredevil and it just didn’t hold my attention. Are there even any good superhero TV series out there that don’t become complete garbage after the first few episodes?

@Th3solution
If Arrow bored you, then the majority of the Arrowverse leans the same way. The Flash is pretty good for the first few seasons, as is Supergirl - but the formulaic nature bogs them down a touch. Conversely, Legends of Tomorrow is hot garbage, but becomes increasingly entertaining hot garbage once Arthur Darvill leaves from season 3 onward and the production really leans in to absurdity.
Swamp Thing was great.
Titans is trash, but looks nice and remains oddly compelling somehow (car crash effect possibly).
Black Lightning starts OK but gets quite good, haven't got to see any of season 3 yet.
Doom Patrol is great by all accounts.
Batwoman is awful.

As for Marvel, the second season of Luke Cage is absolute dynamite! The first is OK too, but that second!!
Daredevil varies wildly - lots (and lots) of meandering.
Iron Fist starts terribly. Second season was pretty great though.
Jessica Jones started well, but diminishing returns.
Defenders was OK - but don't bother if you haven't watched the rest of the Netflix stuff.
Punisher is quite good, but I can't stand Bernthall's grunting!
Agent Carter was apparently great, but I never watched any of it
Agents of SHIELD is like Torchwood, but worse.

Obviously, your mileage for all of this may well depend on your familiarity with the characters.

@KALofKRYPTON Yeah, my exposure to DC is limited to the major cinema outings, knowledge over the years of the basic major characters of The Justice League, and whatever I got from playing Injustice and Injustice 2.

I guess I have FOMO about the CW shows, but it seems like I’m not missing all that much. It seems like a large time investment that I just don’t feel inclined to put out.

@KALofKRYPTON @RogerRoger yeah none of the "expanded" stuff is canon in Doctor Who although some elements of it may be used in episodes (such as meeting Mary Shelley which had already happened in the Big Finish Audio Dramas)

but basically like with Star Trek and yes like it always was with Star Wars too (before Disney took over and wanted to make a multimedia franchise out of it) only the stuff on screen, ala the show and the film is "true canon"

@FullbringIchigo Apart from the Shadows of the Empire run for Star Wars I think. That was canon, but I'm not sure if it is anymore. Probably not.

@KALofKRYPTON i'm still unsure on that one actually but if it was or wasn't is a mute point because it isn't canon now, although the ship, the Outrider is because you can see it in A New Hope leaving Mos Eisley

https://uk.ign.com/articles/2015/04/30/shadows-of-the-empires...

@Th3solution The Netflix Marvel series has some really great and memorable villains.

@Th3solution If you're looking for something comic-connected yet standalone and simpler to digest, then I would recommend Gotham. It starts out as a straightforward police procedural crime drama, but just becomes more and more bizarre with each passing season, until it crescendos with a blistering self-destructive orgy of chaos. It's a unique take on the Batman mythos without necessarily feeling like a Batman show and, since it's totally separate from all other DC shows, you can enjoy it without having to do any homework or pause to watch crossover episodes every other week.

@KALofKRYPTON @Fullbringlchigo I'm pretty sure Shadows of the Empire was supposed to be as canon as the films (same as The Force Unleashed, an "everything but the movie" multimedia project) but under the rule of Disney, it's unfortunately been kicked down the ladder with the rest.