@Ravix Plain English? From me? You signed up to play a game hosted by the mighty Tjuz while not being fluent in Tjuz? Sounds like a skill issue on your part.
Here's the thing: In Fantasy Critic officially, when someone picks one of your games as a counter-pick, that game is locked in for the duration of the draft. It's not possible to switch out that game for another once it has been counter-picked. So, as per the official rules, I would now be unable to switch out There Are No Ghosts at the Grand despite having a switcheroo available, because you locked it in by picking it as your counter-pick.
Sol brought this up a few weeks ago as a hypothetical scenario, where I realised I hadn't explained any of that in my previous posts. At the time, I said that for the time being we can still switch out games in our drafts that have been counter-picked, as I felt that introducing you to the lock-in now after all was said and done was unfair. It could be that the lock-in would have affected your drafting/counter-picking, for example, and you'd now be unfairly informed of a rule that would've led you to make different decisions if you were aware of it beforehand.
So, going by the judgment call I made there, that means I would be allowed to switch it based on my previous judgment. Except... it now comes across as something I'm doing for me just by the sheer unluck of having this hypothetical scenario where I'd want to switch it out happen to me! A solution I thought at the time would be a nice thing to do for players who were not informed properly due to my own lack of explanation turning out to look like a selfish power grab!
So, to clear it up once and for all knowing both what the official rules are and what I said before, I ask Sol and Rog to make their judgment. If they're fine with having their counter-picked games locked in despite not having that information available to them beforehand, then so be it. If they feel it's unfair for this rule to have been introduced to them after they had done all their picks, then we can go by the solution I previously provided. I'd ask you for your opinion too, but I think you don't care at this point as long as you get to keep your counter-pick! Hence why I said you can keep yours nonetheless, because my fault of not explaining that beforehand shouldn't come at the cost of your pick.
Was that plain English enough for you, or should I try saying it gayer next time? 😛 Either way, you're not affecting my score at all with that counter-pick! Ha! (Remember: counter-picks just give you the inverse of whatever I would get... which in this case would be 0, and thus 0 for you. Still better than my -18...)
Anyway, despite all this moral talk of ''fairness'' and ''democracy'', please do note that I will be inventing further rules on December 31st to make sure I win no matter what. Try and stop me!
@Tjuz okay, maybe that is not where my confusion lay. I was maybe thinking... isn't the threshold for points scored 70/75 review score (whichever it was) and so any score below that counts as a minus when converted into fantasy points. And therefore a game that scored 60 or whatever would be net minus points. So then a score of 0 (no reviews because it totally failed to release) would generate some kind of total for you and me, both? That was what I was kind of thinking 😅 like is a 1/10 game not better than a game that doesn't release, for an extreme example, because at least people got to play that awful game? Is there really no punishment for missing a release window beyond not scoring any points?
I know i'm playing with fire as I have 2 games set to miss the release window, too. So i'm not just trying to go against you, honest 😄
Do the actual fantasy league rules have any penalty for games that don't come out, beyond scoring the player 0, which is the same total that a successful 7/10 game gets? That just seems peculiar.
I always went on the logic that a counter pick was locked in, because why wouldn't it be. Even if you never said it 😅
@Ravix@Tjuz@werehog
Ok guys, I’m digesting this all and will give my vote/ideas shortly.
I am in the middle of something but will have a post soon to weigh in.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Ravix Haha, fair enough. This time I'm not making things up, I promise! Yeah, the official Fantasy Critic rules say when a game gets delayed into the next year (or unexpectedly releases as Early Access...) it counts as a ''no score'' rather than a 0 score. No score means there's nothing to base any points on, so it gets a default 0 points. Only a straight-up cancelation of the game would result in minus points (10 if I remember correctly). I think it's that way because a default -70 points if your game gets delayed unexpectedly would basically just lose you the draft entirely if it doesn't happen to anyone else. The fact that you're missing out on scoring any points whatsoever should be punishment enough. I agree that it's a bit backwards for it to score the same as a perfect 70/100, but I guess that's equally not a score you anyway strive for when drafting. Besides, I desperately need an income of fantasy points! Even a zero ruins my whole year already, and you want to make it -70? Help! But yes, the threshold for when there is a score is 70, correct!
@Tjuz@Ravix@Werehog
Ok, so before I give my thoughts on ‘NoGhosts-gate’, I have something extremely selfish to take care of. And before you condemn me for taking advantage of this situation to perhaps screw someone over, know that I’ve been pondering this move for a while now, but I wanted to give a little more time and see what happened at Gamescom. I also wanted to wait and have our commissioner Tjuz present for the transaction, and now since TJ is out of hibernation, Gamescom didn’t bring me any news, and my other game without a release date actually got a release date, I want to hereby submit my one free exchange voucher.
In accordance with the Fantasy Critic charter and under the authority of the governing board, Pretendo Entertainment Corp would like to submit for approval the following action:
Exchange Kena: Scars of Kosmora for… Trails in the Sky 2nd Chapter (release date 17/9/26)
As this is a full remake, in my understanding, so I believe it should be eligible, but let me know if that’s is not the case.
I’m very unaware of these Trails games (I tried Trails of Cold Steel but fell off it and never went back) but they consistently score high and I feel like this is a no-brainer. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, as they say, and I would rather take this versus holding out on the hope that Kena comes out this year. The radio silence on Kena since the State of Play has me concerned and I can’t see a reality that it comes out before Dec and I don’t want to wait until last minute for the delay announcement and then I won’t have as many options. Trails itS (…I don’t want to abbreviate it shorter for fear of getting censured by the Push Square moderators 😅) is coming out in about 3 weeks and I’m very nervous someone else is about to grab it with all this talk of exchanging by TjuziMax and BoobiSoft (although the acronym for the game fits Rav’s company…)
Ok, so I needed to get on the record with that request first. It should be a safe exchange no matter what decision is made henceforth since Kena is not a counter-pick by anyone, so this should be a smooth transaction.
I’ll let you all chew on this breaking news for now, while I compose a separate post about my thoughts on our situation over There Are No Ghosts at the Grand. Just know now, TjuziMax CEO, if you were about to select Trails 2nd Chapter, I call dibs first! 😈
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Tjuz@Ravix@Werehog
Ok, now on to the issue of exchanging a game that has a counter-pick…
Yes, it is true that TJ said we could exchange those games and so I feel like we should allow TjuziMax to exchange No Ghosts. This would of course count as his one and only exchange.
However, in order to keep BoobiSoft from being unfairly penalized, I propose that Rav be given options. This is just an idea— we could allow Rav to choose another counter-pick, including whatever game TJ switches to. However, I believe Rav should not be penalized if his new counter-pick scores well, so he should receive at the worst a 0 for his counter-pick score, which is what he would be getting for No Ghosts, or if his new pick bombs then he will be awarded the appropriate points from that pick. So basically it’s a no lose scenario of him getting a second chance at another counter-pick — a free pass in case that new counter-pick is a critical hit, then his original No Ghost pick kicks in to just give him a default 0 points.
I also think that if he picks a game from Pretendo or iDoss then we shouldn’t be penalized if that pick does poorly. So we should get a pass also with no negative consequences in the event he scores big with an “extra” counter-pick against us.
So for example, if Rav chooses Control Resonant for his supplemental counter-pick and it scores a 60, then he is awarded the 10 points but I am not subtracted the 10 points I would have been if this was his original counter-pick. If Control scores an 80, then he is just awarded a 0 for his counterpart-pick, rather than getting a -10 as he would have otherwise.
This may be more generous than the committee would like, but I believe it’s fair to all. TJ gets to use his exchange, as he said could be done when the question was asked early in the draft, and yet Rav gets a second chance with no real risk.
In 2027 it could be part of the rules that counter-picks lock in, if that’s the usual approach in Fantasy Critic, but maybe this could be a good option for this scenario.
@Th3solution good, goooood. That is the spirit of evil corperate competition we like to see. Let's all make our swaps while @Tjuz fumbles with that precious made up rulebook! 👀
I thought i'd do a quick search engine research on my questionables, just in case, actually, and it put my mind at rest a little about one. I don't know enough about the behind the scenes timelines but it seems positive that Grave Seasons "has officially received an 'M for Mature' rating from the ESRB" "The Entertainment Software Rating Board officially flagged the game for blood, gore, strong language, and violence." And "The listing details that players will encounter bloody corpses at murder scenes, cutscenes of creatures attacking townspeople with prominent blood-splatter effects, and still images showcasing severed remains."
Yum! How could I ever consider not sticking with that pick. It just sounds so darn lovely 🙂
I do at least understand that having a rating locked in is a good sign that the game will indeed come out at some point, too 😅 so, fingers crossed. If anyone knows the general timeline between ratings and releases, that'd be good to know. Fall 2026 is still very loose.
As for Goldman. I really want to stick with it because is so meticulously crafted (that apparently takes a long time and is impossible to enforce crunch on, typical) but I am nervous that any changes they make need to be hand drawn and animated into the game from scratch 😬
Oh, that rule does seem very fair and considered, Sol. I definitely want it to still be enjoyable, and locking @Tjuz into no score when he was apparently trying to help you two earlier on by letting you swap in that scenario would indeed be mean (I do feel like you like me mean, though, Tjuz. Rawr *cat noise)
We shall see what the iron fisted @Werehog thinks, but it feels pretty balanced. Not that we should be balancing things for such a mistake as picking a game that I told you wouldn't release, Tjuz 😛
@Tjuz I'm glad to see you are okay, Amber said she'd like to talk to you for five-minutes this week when you have the chance. I'm not sure why but I can guess it's about me. She asked me to attach a small message too but I'm not doing that, I explained it's the Critic thread.
Alas, TjuziMax may get knocked down time and time again... but as the old saying goes, we get up again!
There's a song that says that too.
It's really good.
Edit: She told me you talked while I had dinner, I can't see chat so I'm assuming she wiped it afterwards. Thank you either way. She KZ and me spent some hours working on another post, then they fully tapped out and went gaming, or weed or both, it was a topic that I'm comfortable but she's definitely not. I think it took four-hours of 'yes you can say this' and 'no you can't say that' and 'I need a smoke, be right back'.
I was about to come here and give condolences to @Tjuz after seeing the 7/10 on Push Square for Resonance A Plague Tale Legacy but then I peeked over at Open Critic and saw it’s at 85 over there. Seems that Rav’s bribery of Liam was effective but not enough to pull down the overall score. The game looks to be very well received around the industry. So there will be no fire sale at TjuziMax just yet, I assume?
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
Walking back into this topic after a single day AFK, be like...
In all seriousness, I appreciate being included in the discussion surrounding CounterSwitchGate. Let the word go forth that iDoss Interactive is more than happy to go with the group on whatever works out best (a.k.a. Sol's rational, fair, and eloquently presented idea).
With no disrespect to our esteemed organiser-turned-overlord, who has done and continues to do a great job spinning this particular plate, we're in beta right now anyway, aren't we? This being the inaugural PushSquare Forum Fantasy Critic tournament, combined with the fact that it already started late, makes it the perfect testbed for these kinds of issues. The more of these anomalies we discover and play around with now, the more robust the rules will be for next year's twelve-month saga.
So, let's just try it and see what happens, gather the data, and continue to have fun. I mean, we all agreed that this whole thing only counts if I win, right?
Speaking of which, y'all seen the review scores for Star Wars: Zero Company...?
...but the hog is back with a bang today 😄 *blush, btw. I wish I had a better genuine response to that, but I deleted a wall of text because of the duality of my mind and my inability to take praise without some form of performative element to either big myself up or put myself down. Let's just say I just can't accept any kind of praise like a regular human for many, many reasons. But you insist on being a really nice person, it is quite sickening and I do not know how to respond to that 😛 Can I not just praise you instead? Headpats for warehogs, or are they too spiky? Here I go making it weird again. You're... welcome?
First of all, we can swap out the word "weird" again, this time for "funny while simultaneously being open, honest, and awesome" although I'm gonna apologise whilst doing so.
Because in describing yourself up there, you also described me. Yeah, I see you, buddy. But that's why I need to apologise, because I can't stop giving credit where it's due. There aren't enough good people in this world. It's my duty to shamelessly champion the few I'm lucky enough to meet.
That being threatened, if I'm causing you genuine grief, tell me and I'll shut the heck up.
Awh, you softie! I will take being ''besties'' by default as a win. Though that makes me wonder whether everyone enjoys the same scale and Ravix is equally under bestie, in which case I reject this notion. Come on, look at him! There's no way you love us both equally! He's a monster!
Getting to quote this immediately after all that mush I just wrote to Rav...?
Either way, I wish you bad luck when it comes to our face-off in review scores tomorrow. As much as my heart wants your game to be an incredible success, I will have to preserve my ''good lucks'' for the people performing worse than me. Which, currently, is no one. I am now in the minus points!!!
Well, at least your heart has scored some points today!
But don't be discouraged. I see A Plague Tale has still done quite well for itself, so it remains a credit to your line-up! Besides, we all know you're eventually gonna win. You're running this whole tournament, after all. It's like being the banker in Monopoly, or the dealer in a card game. If you're not gonna abuse your authority like a proper CEO would, what the heck are we all doing here?!
"If I let not knowing anything stop me from doing something, I'd never do everything!"
@Werehog Omg, Zero Company at an 88! Nice! If only I would have pulled the trigger and drafted that game like my gut was telling me to do!
(I love the gif, by the way 😂)
To further rain on @Tjuz ‘s parade, Plague Tale as dropped a couple points today to an 83. I looks like IGN are the haters who brought the score down with their 6/10 review. (Someone check the BoobiSoft transaction ledger and see if a large transfer of funds was sent to IGN recently… 👀) @Ravix
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Th3solution It's worth repeating after every release that the cut-off for scoring is 70, so A Plague Tale is still netting @Tjuz a healthy +13 with its current total. We're all looking for the big wins, but in my experience, the eventual victor will be somebody with a draft packed with modest results, rather than somebody who needs a couple of 90s to compensate for the rest of their underwhelming line-up.
Urgh. I think that was overly upbeat, even for me. Crash and burn, Plague Tale. Crash and burn.
"If I let not knowing anything stop me from doing something, I'd never do everything!"
We're all looking for the big wins, but in my experience, the eventual victor will be somebody with a draft packed with modest results, rather than somebody who needs a couple of 90s to compensate for the rest of their underwhelming line-up.
May I just be obnoxious for a second (of course I can) what happens when your most modest picks are in fact GotY contenders with scores of 89? Would that be considered a good tactic for this overall victory? At the moment it is looking like my weakest score will maybe be for the established mega franchise Final Fantasy, and even that may not dip below maybe 84 at this rate, because it's Final Fantasy and people are desperate for HD-2D classics! Could that be the winning formula, rather than settling for 7 or 8 middling scores 👀 i'm half expecting to be able to get away with a game not releasing and still winning, I might even risk it. Though I do have a really nice backup waiting, also, because i'm just that good at this 😛
Now, back to the real me... (or so he says 😛) every time I see a new release from our pool of Fantasy league title picks I keep thinking "are all these games going to be pushing 90? (Apart from Tjuz's games, eeeesh) Are we just that good at picking great games, or are games just in another purple patch of a year, like the last few years have been!?" So far it feels like a high 7/10 or a good 8/10 is kind of on the lower side of things, in terms of aggregation and acrual reviews, which is a pretty darn high standard.
And don't worry, Werehog I just wanted to dance around it a bit awkwardly (I think you can appreciate this 😄) and now I will just keep going on as usual by ignoring all shameless flattery, which may all be a sly tactic to have me let my guard down and... and... and... be... nice? (Neece? Noyce? Nisay) I'm unsure of the pronunciation of that word, to be honest... and I know you are too proud to admit to wanting those spiky head pats, but don't worry, I think Tjuz may need more of my attention anyway, as those picks are just so, so, so terrible. I mean, seriously!? We should all be here to provide comfort, honestly. So bad. Sorry, Tjuz (🙂)
Oh, Did you try the Star Wars game yet, by the way? I have a big Star Wars comment pending, but as it is a pick here it would be interesting if you or anyone played it. Seeing as we didn't all play Big Walk 🥺
@Ravix Hey, I never said "no" to those head pats, did I...? Didn't think so! But darn it, you're right. We should all rally around our supreme overlord in his time of need.
Funny you should ask, as my copy of Zero Company literally just got delivered. Alas, I won't be playing it right away. I wasn't expecting to pre-order it, but I panicked in the midst of the physical release furore, and since I have no experience with the genre, it's more of an eventual "get curious for something new" than a "clear my schedule and play at launch" (which is what Galactic Racer will be). What about you? Are you planning on picking it up right away? If so, I hope you enjoy!
"If I let not knowing anything stop me from doing something, I'd never do everything!"
@Werehog i'm tempted, but I also haven't even got around to watching more than the one trailer that got posted in the SW thread and even then I still didn't know how gameplay will intertwine with story. Maybe part one of some internet persons playthrough is the best way. I used to watch those as a quicker way to enjoy a game as they can be watched on the go a bit more and don't need dedicated gaming time. But I at least try to buy and play all the games I want these days, even if it means (figurative) piles of unfinished games.
So yeah, I keep remembering i'm very bad at sticking with games and playing anywhere near as much as i'd want to. And if I do go for this, then what happens to my Death Stranding 2 run that will already be hampered by Vampires in early September? I can't bare to think of another unfinshed game on the pile. And now we are in danger of The Witcher retaking my gaming time after i'm done with the spun-off Witcher-wolves' vampiric game (if it isn't broken on release 🤞) SW will probably have to be a skip, but i'll grab a copy if gameplay/story looks worthwhile. It might be a shorter game than my usual picks so can be fit in somehwere, sometime. Boy am I thankful for playing James Bond and Mafia 4 this year, as they were much shorter and didn't take over more than a month of on and off playtime, though Bond did get quite dragged out.
Wow, that was a longer answer than was required 😅 I had assumed that game was already out a few days ago, so that is good timing, at least. I'll try and make an effort to see if it is a game for me, and if it is then at least order it.
What is your current game. Head pats will be earned on the strength of your answer 😛 and i'm fully aware this thread will get massively out of hand if Tjuz doesn't come to reign us in, or at least join in. We're maybe keeping it mildly on topic, but still.
@Ravix I totally understand your dilemma. I'm somebody who'll force himself to stick with a game no matter what, and sometimes that's the wrong choice, but this coming autumn / winter period in particular, my head is being turned left, right, and centre by a combination of new releases and tantilising backlog options. In cases where there's any uncertainty, I'll at least glance at somebody else's gameplay to get a sense of what I might be about to boot up. When it comes to things like Star Wars, it's more a question of "when" than "if" so I knew I was always gonna play Zero Company, but it's still a factor.
Being aware of your general tastes, I did wonder whether that recent news about The Witcher 3 would impact your own plans. Hopefully you'll have fun, whatever you end up playing!
I'm currently between games. I have just finished Resident Evil 3 Remake and will be starting Final Fantasy XV Royal Edition next week, once my schedule has calmed down a little. I'm guessing that'll keep me busy until early October, and then I'll be free to sample my own wares!
"If I let not knowing anything stop me from doing something, I'd never do everything!"
…every time I see a new release from our pool of Fantasy league title picks I keep thinking "are all these games going to be pushing 90? (Apart from Tjuz's games, eeeesh) Are we just that good at picking great games, or are games just in another purple patch of a year, like the last few years have been!?" So far it feels like a high 7/10 or a good 8/10 is kind of on the lower side of things, in terms of aggregation and actual reviews, which is a pretty darn high standard.
I’m going to give full credit to us being exceptional connoisseurs of gaming quality who can recognize a hit when we see it. Nevertheless it could be a “purple patch”… whatever that is…? Is that anything like a “bumper crop”?
But yeah, I’ve found myself having similar thoughts where a 7 seems like a disappointing outcome and previously I would consider a 7/10 a good game and worthwhile to consider for a purchase. The bar is definitely set high!
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Th3solution Is there a list of who chose what? I'll be honest I can't keep up. Off the top of my head there was: Grand Theft Auto, Witches Bakery, Goldman, The Big Walk, possibly StarWars, Dawnwalker, and that's about it. Also when is the end date if there is one? I've been playing Two Point Museum all week, it's too good not to.
These violent delights have violent ends & in their triumph die, like fire & powder Which, as they kiss, consume.
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