Much of Horizon Forbidden West Development, Playtesting Done on PS4

And a 60fps performance mode for PS5?

Probably best (and surely the standard) way to do it, develop the base stuff on ps4 and then add all the pretty extras, extra tech and 60fps on to the next gen version.

And not forgetting proper fast travel on the PS5 as well hopefully. Sounds great though, especially the climbing as that was something that needed improving from ZD.

Oh wooooow you can feel the pull of the bow. Never heard that one!

Sweet, my fancy new console gets fancier water. Totally worth it...

@Futureshark You'd hope they would announce that and that this would become an actual standard. I can't play games like Horizon in 30, it just plays terrible to me. I did really, really enjoy it on PC though, after I had put it down after a few hours on base PS4.

For me they can release all games cross generation forever if it finally means that 60 is a standard on console again.

Just hoping it will have a 60fps mode.
EDIT: Just read that it has been confirmed to feature such a mode. Yay!

@get2sammyb I was hoping for a turn based RPG...

@Deljo ps4 to ps5 isn't as big a jump graphically over ps3 to ps4. So yeah we get fancy water, 60fps and 4k resolution with greater graphical detail. I'm sure HFD will play well on PS4 but I am very happy with my PS5 investment already. Specifically the lack of a jet engine.

@get2sammyb It doesn't bother me that much I do feel like the effect might be a bit too strong. Won't hinder in anyway my enjoyment of the game when it comes out !

@Reyren they couldn't cut off the 100million player base on PS4, it just wouldn't make sense. It will just be a better experience on PS5. I am very happy to accept that.

@Reyren You would think that and yet there are plenty on here that would beg to differ.

😒

It sounds like they are addressing pretty much all of my issues with the original. I only hope they add something like the wind mechanic from Ghost. I'm afraid that mechanic might have spoiled other open worlds for me I never want to look at a mini-map again!

I once saw a video from the developer, praising the PS5 SSD. And how they originally wanted flying mountable creatures in the first game. But it wasn't possible because of the load speeds on the PS4 PRO. And how they finally were able to (hypothetically) do stuff like that on PS5 because of the SSD. Wondering if this will still be in the game

Really hope the PS5 version is 60fps. The melee combat in the gameplay video looked rough at 30fps.

Sounds like they have made getting around the much world easier, allowing you to climb anything then get down easily with the glider.

They do like that Hero Light.

@get2sammyb It's the usual complaints about how Sony should only be showcasing 4K, 60fps, ray-traced and haptic feedback games. This is complimented by the 'uhhh, the PS4 is so old and is holding us back!" whine.

Every generation takes a year or two to get going; happened on the PS3 and the PS4.
Unfortunately old Sony did such a good job with the PS4, it's still very relevant today - both in games and visuals it can put out and the sheer financial considerations - much to the chagrin of the entitled few.

So all of you bought a $500 dollar PS5 just to play PS4 games at 4K and 60 FPS? I was hoping PS5 would let us see an do things the PS4 can't.

@CKFilms
The huge benefits of ps5 hardware over PS4 is very little to do with anything as relatively minor as prettier graphics. The possibilities being lost by having this limited by PS4 hard drive, throughput, CPU etc is very sad.

But, early adopters should know by now that large markets aren’t just thrown away and so new tech won’t be used for several years after release in most cases.

I read a take on this whole generation thing last night that i thought made me look at it differently.

Jim Ryan said he believes in generations and experiences only the new machines can offer. We are getting them experiences in games such as dark souls (albeit a remake), deathloop, R&C and such.

What he didnt say is that they would never make any new games for the PS4. People just assumed that everything was PS5 only which is just that, an assumption. At no point did Sony or Jim say they would take their biggest franchises away from their biggest install base.

I get the whole misleading side. It could have been clearer. Hell, i agreed with the belief they out and out lied until i read that perspective.

Sony are producing next gen only games. They just arent the ones everybody else assumed the would be.

@LivewireCLS Where did you see that? Did I miss it in the GI interview?

I prefer horizon 2 to be the showcase for ps5 console, with flying mount and all..

And I'm sure as heck the sales will be way way better on ps5 compared to ps4, just like hitman 3 and miles morales. Most day one buyers is on the new console, not the old one.

@RBMango Apparently French journalist Julien Chièze confirmed it with the devs and reported on it in this YT video - unfortunately I don't understand French so I can't say what he said exactly.

PS4 is dead. Long live PS4.

I find it funny how the Sony inference, and then entire fan community railed on XSX as having no true next gen experience, it's just a box for playing old games like a PC with some upgrades. No need for it, it's just like upgrading your video card on PC. PS5 is all about whole new experiences that couldn't be accomplished on old last gen hardware.

Now now we start finding out the entire PS5 showcase sizzle reel was bunch of PS4 games with graphics enhancements if you upgrade to a PS5 video card. I'm not surprised in the slightest, but the life of its own that whole mindset gained, encouraged by Sony statements, rings so hilarious now. It's more the rabid fans than Sony itself that creates that comedy, but they certainly added assistance.

@Weebleman They went out of their way to position information so that it would appear the tentpole titles, HFW, GoW2, etc were games that would be designed around what the PS5 could offer. They never stated the games were PS5-only, but they did everything they could to let the viewer perceive they were, while never confirming or denying it when asked (even though they already knew). That sort of thing is never an accident. Similarly they positioned games like Dark Souls to convey they were only possible on PS5, and it's worked on you. There's nothing about that game that does. The game and level design is intentionally a direct copy of a PS3-limited game (and for good reason), and the graphics use no new hardware features. It would run just fine on PS4, at 30fps (like the original.) Business reasoning, not tech, limited that. R&C, and maybe at a stretch Returnal, though I'm skeptical, are the only "real" PS5 examples. R&C is built around the hardware gimmick itself as the inevitable hardware tech demo game, and Returnal would probably run perfectly fine on a PS4, but downgraded particles may not be ideal for it.

Don't get me wrong, this way is the way I expected them to do it and wanted them to do it. I was very disappointed when the whole "we believe in generations" thing went up. I didn't want them to believe in generations, so I like this result, personally, even as a PS5 owner. It makes me feel better about what PS5 to PS6 may look like and feel more confident in owning a 5. But they most definitely lied, and that doesn't sit well.

@get2sammyb They should totally make the PS4 version a 2D side scroller! Then I'd buy both

Interested in the free form climbing system. Is it somewhat similar to Breath of the Wild's?

@Futureshark
They confirmed performance mode 60fps in an interview to a French channel.

https://youtu.be/OTkdPL74z8c

Btw, I can't think of a single native PS5 game that doesn't have a 60 fps mode - Watchdogs Legion used to be the sole example but it got one recently.
Am I forgetting something?

@NEStalgia opinions man, we all have them. Like i said, it was clearly mis leading but never an out and out lie.

Disagree with the likes of demon souls and returnal being possible on last gen as, while technically any game could be dialled back to work on the previous gen, these were sold on features like ray tracing, loading speeds and dual sense integration that arent possible on PS4. Hence the only possible on line.

A sizzle reel just shows upcoming games for the machine. Again, the structure of the way everything was delivered coukd be seen as mis leading, but not a lie. As you said, they didnt say they were coming to PS5 only but i completely agree that they didnt go out of their way to stop it either.

@Weebleman
Loading time and 60fps are definitely a big deal for DS. Development was based on them to feel the remake was worth it.
A lot of people find issues that JR said 'games' as they understood 'all games' in their own imagination.

Is this a bad thing? Do we want another Cyberpunk on our hands?

Free-form climbing is kinda a big deal. I remember how simple obstacles seemed like invisible walls in the first game. Hopefully that gets sorted. It doesn't have to be Spider-Man Link like BOTW, but some freedom would be neat.

@ThaBEN I don't think Guerilla Games had access to the Kraken compression technology. You look at the last two games of the PS4 generation, The Last of Us Pt II and Ghost of Tsushima, apart from a long loading time at the starts, the loading time everywhere else are incredibly fast considering they were working on HDDs. Naughty Dog also updated TLOU pt I to load significantly faster, they might have access to new techniques that will allow them to do what they thought impossible when they started developping HZD at the start of the PS4.

@get2sammyb to be honest I did expect more from my ps5, yes. I knew that coming from the pro the upgrade wasnt going to be massive but fancier water and a shimmer effect is disappointing. Apart from faster loading times (which is nice) and an impressive controller I definitely think anyone struggling to buy the system shouldn't be too upset. Glad your impressed but not everyone is

@Weebleman Where it really became a lie is them refusing to state whether these games would be PS5-only or PS4. If the sizzle looked one way but then reps confirmed games are in development for both platforms (which was MS's stated plan at the time, until they backtracked in response to Sony doing "generations" and giving "true next gen experiences" like HFW and GoW:R, lol) we'd all be cool. But they refused to confirm, deny, or comment when questioned. Even though we now know this game was in development and testing on PS4 primarily, and I'm sure the same is true of GoW as well as they'd have been in development for years prior. That's where it becomes a lie. They hadn't decided. If PS5 stock shortages hadn't happened they'd be taking these PS4 games, locking them to PS5 only for purely business reasons, and the fans would be boasting how the games just aren't possible on PS4. They wanted to hedge their bets and play it both ways, follow where the winds blew and still be able to spin the "right" optics whichever way it landed.

Demon's Souls doesn't use RT, Bluepoint confirmed that early on. It's literally a 1440p/60 standard game, and level design, AI, etc is based on PS3 limitations (not criticizing, it is what it is because it should be.) There's absolutely zero about that game that uses anything special about PS5 other than faster loads, and I would be shocked if a PS4 running prototype didn't exist at Bluepoint that was held back for business reasons. There's a lot of business reasons that make sense for them to only release that game on PS5. But there's no technical reasons it couldn't have released on both. 60fps is a nice enhancement but it's not necessary for the game, and the original was of course not 60fps. I'm not knocking the game, mind, I just get tired of people saying it needs PS5 (or adequately shows off what PS5 can do) when it really, really doesn't. Other than the gimmick demos like Astrobot, or at a stretch, Returnal just because without all the particle effects it would be diminished (but that's a "small" game despite the high priced billing), R&C will really be the first and only "true" PS5 game, possibly through the entire first year of the console.

Again, I don't dislike the reality of what they're actually doing, but I really dislike they way they set it up, presented it, deceived, and hedged their bets to be able to do it the scummy way if the market permitted. They shouldn't get a free pass because they held back to decide if they should spin lies and force people into upgrading but decided not to in the end because they had supply issues.

I'm perfectly happy with the actual result, and got what I wanted PS5 to be out of PS5 - a video card upgrade, if you will. But standing on that fake pedistal at launch and pretending they were doing something other than selling a PS4 Pro Plus with a few next-gen tech demos for at least a year, where every known tentpole short of R&C is actually an upgrade patch on a PS4 game is pure sleeze. No way around that. They knew they were making PS4 games at the time, but refused to say so (even while the competition openly said so before reversing course due to Sony's posturing.) If they simply went with open honesty rather than trying to misdirect to hit the competition nobody would be disappointed. They deserve the focused criticism on that one, they 100% earned it.

@Futureshark Yes

https://www.psu.com/news/horizon-forbidden-west-60-fps-ps5/

I guess Push Square have yet to copy the article across from Reset Era or other gaming sites yet. 😉

Yup, it’s a PS4 title that will be enhanced on the PS5. There are going to be many games that are labeled PS5 that are actually PS4 games.

@Snick27 In the last decade the conversation has really begun to focus on higher resolution and frames of which I’m NOT a fan. The new thing that they are trying to get us to focus on is ray tracing.

I’m always hoping for improvements to animation and the AI of NPCs that aren’t always necessarily combatants.

Mmm... Sounds like how PC games are developed. And how videogames have been developed since the dawn of time. Do we need to be so freaking precious?!

Keep stirring that pot of discontent. This has been in development forever and PS5 dev kits were not a thing when it began. So can we please get over the notion that these tentpole games should only be on PS5 or should only be built on that system?

This stat needs to be attached to every cross-gen article:
PS4 units sold: 115 million
PS5 units sold: 7.8 million

Why on earth would Sony limit its sales of these huge first-party titles to a minuscule user base on PS5? That makes absolutely no sense. But people are too dumb to see that because "All games should only be PS5 exclusives now!"

@OmegaStriver for those with 1080p tvs is it worth getting a PS5? If so then guess 60 FPS would be fine right since I cant get the resolution of 4K.

@NEStalgia i think games that are simply just tech demoes are par for the course for any new gen release. The bonus this time is they have been good games as well.

Look, i agree with most points you raise. A couple i feel are your opinion which, while differing from mine, is perfectly fine. Should have been clearer but we are getting what they said.

Lets be honest, its a business at the end of the day and they all do what they can to get away with being crystal on anything.

@Snick27 you will get a 1080 image which is downscaled from a higher res so it will look better than a straight 1080 render. How much to the naked eye is debatable i suppose.

@Bluetrain7 if that's the case why ever bring out the PS5 then? Just call the PS5 the PS4 Pro 2. You have to give people a reason to fork down $500 for a new system and if it just makes games prettier then us with 1080p tvs will just stay with the PS4. Its only the games made only for the PS5 that will ever get me an others to purchase one. Sony needs to convince us for the need to ever upgrade and right now there is no reason.

Wait, HFW is going to have free climbing? Like, I can jump on stuff that should be climbable by default and don't have to hunt around for the very specific yellow-bordered jumping points? That's huge! That was probably my biggest issue with the original game.

I guess I should have known, considering she jumps on stuff in the gameplay footage, but I never really know how much I can expect the gameplay trailers to mirror actual gameplay.

@get2sammyb Honestly, Aloy looked out of place in the PS5 footage, like she was interacting with green-screened environments. It was bizarre. If the lighting for her character model in the PS5 version is the reason for this, I'll definitely be sure to play this on a PS4.

@Snick27 Honestly, I’ve bought 2, one for me one for my kids and I’ve bought every PlayStation day 1 since the PS2 but the PS5 is the only system that kinda feels like a waste. If I knew a year ago how I feel now I would have PROBABLY waited. Maybe not though as money isn’t that big of an issue for me.

People get mad when I say things like this and say, SELL IT THEN! That would not fix my issues. I’m just getting at, unless you really care 60fps, I’d advise waiting on a purchase. Hell, mines mostly a Rocket League machine. I’ve played all the big games and will buy RnC day one as well as long as it isn’t reported to be bad.

If money is something you are concerned about, and you don’t feel I have to have this. I’d wait, the games will be there when you get there and there is only a very few at that;

This is the way to do cross gen games, make for the lowest console then upscale. Otherwise you end up with cyberpunk.

That being said, it’s disappointing that they aren’t switching to PS5 exclusives yet. PS4 has run its course and there’s plenty of good games available, it’s time to focus on next gen.

@JapaneseSonic And that's why those games you mentioned sold less in it's early years. HFW and GoW have higher budgets than those PS4 launch titles. Color me surprise if Sony wanted their return of investment right away, after it took their studios years of development with AAA budgets. Besides, they started developing these games on the PS4. The 2021 and 2022 release date wouldn't have been possible for HFW and GoW Ragnarok if they waited for the PS5 devkits.

@get2sammyb Thanks, now I want this 2D-"Horizon" and will probably never get it.

‘For the PlayStation 5, we can go much further of course.’

Go on then. Do it. Hero lighting and better water effects don’t really cut it.

@JapaneseSonic Because that seem to be what is being posted on this site from a small number of PS5 owners who think that they should have everything PS5 only from now on!

Criticising devs like Guerrilla who will work wonders on BOTH platforms seems off to me. Plus most of the PS Studios games started development before the PS5 specs had leaked out from Mark Cerny's laboratory.

As I said further into my post, some people need a little patience as every gen takes a couple of years to get going - happened with the PS3 and PS4. As to why the PS4 exclusives started earlier? Probably because the PS4 was easier to code given its less complex x64 specs & Sony spent some time and money on a decent SDK.

PS5 owners are going to get a shinier version of the games, with haptic feedback, faster loading and 4K 60fps visuals so I don't get why the grumble that the game in a 'lesser' form is coming to the colossal PS4 community?

If this game was developed on a PS4, it should have been showcased on the PS4. Obviously, it will be to an acceptable standard as PS4 is the lead platform, so it should be fine, right? Why focus on PS5 footage if most of your customers will be playing on PS4? More confused messages from Sony.

@PossibLeigh Because the PS5 will be chucking 4K frames around at 60fps. Pro might be able to get close to 4K @ 30fps and base PS4 will be 1080p @ 30fps so it'll look nicer and possibly play smoother on the PS5.

If you're old enough to remember retail games from the 80s & 90s, the amount of Spectrum games that had Amiga screenshots on the back was real false advertising!

@Snick27 this article from April might well be out of date (PS5 owners please clarify?) but could help your decision:
https://www.psu.com/news/latest-ps5-system-update-still-lacks-supersampling-support-which-isnt-great-for-1080p-users/

@sanderson72 Rhetorical question, mate, as the answer is fairly obvious. As you say yourself, the practice was false advertising back then (I grew up in a speccy family) so why should it be okay now?

Obviously, I'm being slightly histrionic as there's a long way to go before release and there will be PS4 gameplay videos, but they should at least have shown some PS4 gameplay alongside the PS5 footage.

At the moment they are purely showing it as a PS5 product (of course, they want to sell PS5s, though demand does not seem to be a problem), whilst also saying it's a PS4 game first. The choice not to show any PS4 gameplay is telling. I wonder if they've had to dial down the environmental detail and clutter back to HZD levels, thus making it a much less immediately impressive product. I'm very curious as to how it will look on PS4.

Yeah, I do remember those days. Pleased to meet another old fogey! If I recall, a few speccy games made it to back covers; R-Type and Dan Dare did have speccy pics on their boxes, I think. Though Dan Dare may have been Speccy only? My memories shoddy. I do remember being stupidly excited, like ridiculously so, for R-Type though.

this does not bother me glad the PS4 is getting more support. I know it won't carry on forever & Unreal Engine 5 is not fully out yet! so games will be getting more & more advanced on PS5 in a few more years.

I love my PS5 even to play PS4 games with no boost.

the OTT nature of some gamers is getting silly this makes logical sense for now.

I think some of the latter comments here have hit the nail on the head. It's quite common for people these days to throw insults and accusations around when they're frustrated and that can come across as vitriolic, self-entitled, whining, etc. It's everywhere, it's really wearing and some very valid points are getting lost in it.

I don't think I've heard any lies. Exaggeration, yes, 'marketing speak', yes. So, absolutely nothing out of the ordinary then.

HFW is not for me but it does look good. I don't think anyone, hand on heart, really ever thought it was a PS5 exclusive. I'm sure it'll play well on PS4 but even better on PS5. No different really to playing the same PC game on a mid-level PC and a high-end one. You generally don't upgrade a PC in the expectation of getting exclusive games, just better ones in some areas.

@NEStalgia @Weebleman I understand the sentiment, but as far as Horizon Forbidden West goes, it's been confirmed as a cross-gen title since the day it was officially announced.

@BoldAndBrash Have you not watched the cartoons or movies?! Floaty physics are the norm for the Spider-Man series.

@Reyren The PS3 versions of most of those games were kinda garbage. They may or may have held back a bit, but they mostly just trashed the last gen versions of the games. They looked terrible for the most part.
And yes, there’s a good chance of games being held back.
Persona 5 was never a game that couldn’t work on previous generations. The vision of that game just isn’t very power based. Not the nature of the series.