“Why would anyone play this?” It’s a quote that will cling to Jim Ryan for his entire career – and now he’s actually addressed it. For those in desperate need of context, the PlayStation boss famously told Time about the occasion he attended a Gran Turismo event: “The PS1 and the PS2 games, they looked ancient,” he said of the older racing games, compared to the more modern Gran Turismo Sport. “Like, why would anybody play this?”
Ever since, the statement has been passed around as evidence of the executive’s disdain for older games, which came to a head recently when the company announced plans to close the PS3 and PS Vita storefronts. It’s since reversed that decision, but the stigma remains.
Until now, perhaps. “The point I was trying to make – obviously not very well – was just how great the PS4 version looked and how far the series had evolved,” he told Axios Gaming, as reported by VGC. “I certainly wasn’t trying to be disrespectful to our heritage. I guess my big learning from all of this is that when Kazunori Yamauchi unveils the next Gran Turismo side-by-side with its history, that I will keep my mouth shut.”
Ryan pointed to Astro’s Playroom as an example of Sony celebrating its legacy. Of course, the references in ASOBI Team’s platformer are wonderful, but some fans want to be able to play their PS1, PS2, and PS3 games on the PS5. “What is important to recognise when considering this question about designing a new platform, is that time, engineering resource, and money are all finite, and that important trade-offs have to be made in terms of what’s included, and what’s not,” he said.
In other words, the company made a calculated decision to focus on PS4 backwards compatibility and not for its previous platforms. Obviously, while we appreciate the requests here, it’s hardly surprising really. Despite how it may feel on the Internet sometimes, there probably isn’t a huge audience of PS5 owners desperate to dig out their copies of Disruptor.
[source axios.com, via videogameschronicle.com]
Comments 86
I think it’s funny that Xbox bangs on about their backwards compatibility yet only half of my 360 games were backwards compatible even on the xbone
Removed - unconstructive
I stand by my idea that Sony doesn't have PS3, PS2 and PS1 games on the brand new PS5 because...they are lazy as all hell. It's just that, not that it's hard yada yada yada. You can literally emulate those games with crappy PCs.
Between this and the generations quote, I dont think Jim is that fit for PR talk. I'm pretty certain in the future, a specific quote of his will be incendiary for some time I feel
I mean, there are PS2 games on PS4 through emulation. So it’s not impossible, they just haven’t done enough.
Yeah, Jim put his foot in his mouth with that one. I think we all lose perspective of old games because we are used to shiny new ones. But as someone in PR, he should know better.
Talking of old games, I have a friend who bought his kids their first console for Christmas this year… a Mega Drive!
It might sound like child abuse to some, but those boys love that console and have have a blast with if. They don’t have much exposure to other games (they live in a very remote place) but they are true gamers and happy. Long live retro gamers!
@kingbreww Fair point actually.
I mean it's far better than what PlayStation offers, but I nabbed a Series X a few months back and was surprised to find that not all of my old favourite 360 and OG xbox games were compatible.
The way it's talked about I had assumed almost everything would work on it, but it doesn't cast as wide a net as MS make out.
I should have read more about it.
But Ryan, well, I assume the PlayStation PR department gave him a bollocking for that statement. I know a few community managers who would be crippled with anxiety just reading this article.
Here's hoping he's learned to just let Hulst or someone else do the talking.
@AFCC no, you cannot emulate ps2/ps3 games on crappy pc's. most ps3 games run like trash (on powerful machines) and likely always will due to the architecture being emulated. ps2 fares a bit better but is still problematic and far from accurate in many cases. ps1, yes. not too many issues there. sony will re-release all of its legacy games on ps now one day with monetary incentives so i would guess THAT is the reason they didn't bother to go the extra mile with b/c.
I honestly gone past the point of believing anything this man says. He will say anything he thinks his audience wants to hear, and 180 as soon as he feels it either goes against finances or what players actually wanted to hear.
@Oval_Griffin Was it really, though? I liked the PS3 a lot, but it's arguably the weakest of Sony's main consoles.
@get2sammyb I don't agree with you all the time, Sammy. But when I do, it's because you're right 😌
PS3 was great, and some of the games on it were incredible, but it has the smallest number of titles in my favourites library.
(Not counting third party games - God of War, Uncharted, The Last of Us, Ratchet and Clank)
@get2sammyb Isn’t that mostly because almost every PS3 game worth having has been sold to us again in the last generation?
@nessisonett I Still To This Day Wonder Why They Stopped Adding PS2 Games To The PS4 Had They Kept Doing It At The Rate That They Were They Would Probably Have At Least Half The Library On The PS4 By Now
Actually sammy barker doesn't have a crush on taylor Swift anymore🤔.yeah right.i wonder what old games superfly jimmy ryan snuka plays.word up son
I appreciate Jim addressing that comment. As the article points out that quote really has haunted him to this day in terms of PR. I still hold out hope that older Playstation content comes back in some sort of capacity one day.
@get2sammyb the later years we’re extremely good, though. The first 3 Uncharted games, TLOU, Infamous, the good Killzone games, God of War 3, Demon Souls, Metal Gear Solid 4, Resistance, Ni No Kuni, Persona 4, (not just talking first party here)…
The PS3 took too long to find its place, but you could argue it was that soul searching that landed it in the path of third person narrative focused games, that is considered today it’s strength.
Sad it seems to have lost the 1st person potential during the PS4 gen, entirely abandoning Killzone, Resistance and failing with The Order 1886.
@Porco my point is if you can get it to work on bad pcs, even if it works badly, why wouldn't Sony be able to do it on a PS5?
Also, I don't expect that backwards compatibility on PSNOW at all, but I would be pleased to see it.
Eh, I've more or less stopped believing anything Jim Ryan has to say, but it's nice of him to acknowledge how wrong he was....for what it's worth, anyway.
Which probably isn't much.
@Shepherd_Tallon same here. I mean PlayStation never did it but first time they do they backwards support all the Ps4 games. As it should be done
They need someone else handling their PR just saying
Pretty much everything he's said has been contradicted by fan reception or other moves they've made in terms of software
@Tharsman Well abandoning The Order imo was a good choice considering that game in particular is like the prime example I think of when it comes to the critique of PlayStation exclusives being "walking simulators"
It really is just a nice looking movie with QTEs
Resistance I think was concluded at Insomniac's behest considering I think they said 3 was always meant to be the last one
@TheFrenchiestFry there is a good documentary on Resistance on YouTube
https://youtu.be/QmdcrQfvKr0
But my point is, Sony had some good FPS dev going on there for a while, and it all suddenly stopped in the PS4 gen after the PS4 Killzone and 1886 failures. Sometimes it’s ok to fail a few times, should not mean they had to give up, but that seems to be a pattern lately. Give up on FPS. Give up on cool Japanese titles like Gravity Rush. Stick to the few things that work (for now.)
Never had a ps3. I wish they’d just remaster all the ps1, 2, and 3 exclusives the possibly can (a la uncharted and TLoU) and let me buy them piecemeal on ps4/ps5. Pump these things out and get this issue (somewhat) behind us.
I'll give him the benefit of a doubt. He made a comment that he probably should have kept to himself and it made it's rounds on the internet. Live and learn.
Well Disruptor will always play best on a native ps1. I dont mind digging it out every now and then, the green fog games are cool
Sony hates old games? When they love to remaster and remake their IPs for the newer generations.
Finally Jimmy said something I can fully get behind: he should keep his mouth shut. He ends up walking back most of what he says, or just gets shown up by other parts of the company. Who picked this clown as the brand spokesman? Oh, that's right..... He did.....
He'd be a lot more likable of he'd be self deprecating more often. Though it isn't genuine. You can't really escape the context and tone of his original statement.
Now announce a summer showcase Jim!
@kingbreww It’s still better than 0 PS3 titles.
@AFCC sony likely could have gotten a curated list of ps3 games to run via emulation on ps5 (with a lot of effort and a custom emulator that is tweaked on a game by game basis) in the same way they got a curated list of ps2 games to run on ps3 and ps4... but from a business standpoint, why offer b/c for free to all users with physcal copies if they can just re-sell us those games again and make money? it sucks, it really does, but that is how these companies approach it. ps4 sold amazingly well with zero backwards compatibility — instead, we got a ton of remasters and remakes last generation and the publishers made a ton of cash in return. had sony offered us backwards compatibility, perhaps many of those remasters never would have happened and potential revenue would be lost. with a will there is a way, but in this case there is no will.
@kingbreww Remember it was a small team Internally. And that each game had to be tested, and permission received from the license holder. So far with 360, and OG Xbox they have about 616 as I counted. Program ran from 2015 to 2019.
That’s almost 13 games a month, 154 a year.
It’s actually really impressive. They paused in order to focus on ensure Xbox One games worked with Xbox X/S, but plan on returning after. Really it’s actually quite impressive.
I am with Jim on this one. PS1 and PS2 games aged terribly. They should remaster or remake the good ones. And I have owned every Sony console and handheld.
@11001100110zero Yeah, there are rumors that more are may start to be added at E3. Still a bunch I want but most I think have rights issues like music, unfortunately.
@11001100110zero I mean it’s good but hardly impressive. Every game would be impressive
Another U-turn from Jim
I think BC is a feature that is more asked for than is actually used. Of course BC is being used on PS5 for PS4 games and the same as XB from one to X. But going even further back is not something most people do.
@AFCC I don't think it's due to laziness, but greed. The more gamers play old games, the less they spend on new ones.
Skipping E3, eh Ryan? Ryan is a short-sighted PR nightmare, and this writeup is just another apologist piece from PS staff telling you "Sony can do no wrong!". Yuck.
"Next time I'll keep my mouth shut" should be Jim Ryan's motto.
Jim is probably not fit to do this PR stuff, but I agree with him (and have been saying that all along since current gen started).
I don't care about compatibility with pre-PS4, because I won't really play those games.
At best, I might boot them up for 5 mins to refresh my memory (as I did on my Xbox), but I won't play through them. I do however, want to play through Ratchet and Clank: Rift apart..
I think it's just sad that Sony has PS1 and PS2 emulators, but won't bring them forward to newer systems. The almighty Quest for Cash has tainted Sony's mostly stellar reputation. I guess I just have to hope my phat 60GB holds out or just switch to PC emulators.
Making PS1 and PS2 games payable on PS5, either with media or digital, is probably not that hard. PS3 maybe more difficult, IDK. I certainly wouldn't mind as I have games for them all. But does the average gamer really care about 20-25 year old games at this point? Maybe if they didn't screw up the PS1 classic? Maybe?
@kingbreww Agree. Also not sure why they made it so you can play a good portion of the OG Xbox library on X360 but not on anything newer.
I’m and old school gamer and have had every home console day one since time began.
I am used to not really having bc and I don’t care for bc. It’s ok but not a thing for me.
I have played the old games I wanted to play on the old console and don’t need it on my new console.
When a new console releases I like new games and new experiences that’s what I purchased the new console for, so bc can go take running jump off a very high cliff.
New console generation, new games that is the pure adrenaline and excitement of a new console and new games.
I'd like to give Jim Ryan the benefit of the doubt too,though when he talks about finite resources & (in the past),discussed Sony "dabbling in backwards compatibility" but then reckoning it wasn't popular it comes across somewhat as damage control when TLOU ps5 remake rumours sprouted.
I bought a number of the ps2 classics on ps4 range even if the emulation was perfunctory. Sadly a number are among the "it runs with major issues on ps5",if I upgrade.😕
As I said then,you can't really say something isn't popular if you also admit your efforts were half hearted.
If you don't want the albatross overhanging your reign Mr Ryan,invest the time & resources properly as a gesture of goodwill towards long time PS owners & open up the legacy library to those who haven't,throw in some features eg crt filters,or fps boost or a rewind feature for ps1/ps2 stuff!
Shawn Layden though never CEO like Jim, showed his legacy fondness through things like Crash Bandicoot,Medievil etc.
I'd like to know the correlation between age and the desire for BC?
I may be wrong, but it feels anyone in their late 30's, 40's like myself find it to be a valuable feature for a new console.
Anyone younger may not be as interested.
A generalisation perhaps but I'd be interested to know.
Personally I never cared for it until I hit 37. You start to reflect and my desire to play the games of my youth became incredible strong 😊
@Tavis
I agree he is not a great PR talker. I see that as a quality haha
I like straightforward people. (Not car sellers or populist politicians)
The press however has been appalling in butchering what he said.
There's clearly a market to play these old games, you only have to look at eBay and the plethora of new "old" controllers, HDMI mods, upscalers, clone consoles and ODE's to see that. Sony have made a business decision to just focus on PS4 and new games and thats fine, I'll just use the other means I have to play these.
At least he'll keep his mouth shut regarding older games and even as someone who's not his biggest fan I suspect its more an issue of soundbites been blown out of proportion then necessarily his true opinions.
Of course today's games have better graphics but I'm coming to appreciate the look of those early 3d games even more than I did then. I still find them visually appealing and enjoy playing them too. Perhaps the biggest issue for Sony regarding backwards compatibility, is that for the first couple of generations they were built largely on third party games rather than their own and as such chasing licensing would be the biggest hassle
I think it would be great if they could do a collection of 20 of the best games from each generation similar to the ps+ collection we have now on PS5. That would add incredible value to + and be a nice introduction to the history of playstation for newcomers.
I have quite a big collection of physical games from PS1, 2, 3 & 4. It would be handy if I could play all those discs on one machine, but in all honesty, I quite like that I have to dig out an old machine and plug it in to play them. It's nice to make a weekend out if it once in a blue moon.
I guess this means then that backwards compatibility isn't happening then for PS5? I mean for PS1 - PS3 games?
To be honest he should just own it (that quote about GT). No need to be apologetic. Old GT games look awful now (especially on a 4k screen I imagine) If you have an issue with reality or can't see through clickbaits it's too bad.
Now it's the time to bring all of psn psone and ps2 classic games from ps3 to ps4/5 😃
@wiiware I agree
@get2sammyb I thought the big issue was the shared RAM if it was so weak the US Army would have not used it.
@JJ2 I agree old games look horrible but as a big wig you need to look out how and what you say. And it sounds a bit disrespectfull towards the older fans.
@Old-Red I would to see a PS1 with a HD output i know its never gonna happen. I would rather have seen that then the mini with some extra ram maybe some storage and a way to connect to the store. 😁
@Flaming_Kaiser
Ummm. Nah
I prefer if they say what they think.
If I was in the same position playing those games, I d have been honest and said the same thing (about the old GT games )
EDIT.
Like man, why does it have to be always as if its fkin politicians in campaign?
It's video games we are talking about.
Jim Ryan is very sarcastic and very dry — a true Brit in many ways. I think his quotes get pulled out of context a lot.
Things sound different transcribed compared to when you’re just goofing in a conversation.
Having said all of that, as a CEO, he’s going to have to pick his words much more carefully moving forwards.
Tbh I don't see what's the rush for backwards compatibility as long as they keep making new gen games I'm all for it who knows with the way Sonys been working with new games they might soon aquire bluepoint and literally start remaking all the classics with new gen features will I can hope
@Tharsman @TheFrenchiestFry Resistance remains one of my most favourite franchises, and easily my favourite PS franchise.
As an FPS game, with the weapon designs, R2's Co-op MP, and how well the Chimera lent themselves to action and horror Americana, it has really been a standout series. Same reason I enjoy the older Halo games, when everything else is "modern shooter", nothing looks or plays quite like them.
It's also a shame considering that Insomniac are making like the 10th or so Ratchet and Clank game, it would be nice to at least get a reboot, soft reboot, or spiritual sequel.
Edit: I'd actually gladly accept a Resistance collection on the PS4/5 that had all 3 (5 if including portable) games.
@JJ2 I dont agree i would not like a loose canon in my company like that. You can say things if you know how you need to say them. There is a easy way to say what he wanted without pissig people off.
Politics are a great way to show how tonedeaf people can be.
I understand what he’s saying. I started on the Atari... played countless hours of Pac Man... not even the fancy color one with the fruits... I’m talking the old black and white. Decades later, the PS2 had a Namco disc with all the old classics. I played it for a day, remembered what it was like... then never opened that box again. Fast forward to now, my mom came to visit for Mother’s Day, I popped in Miles Morales and she was blown away. So yeah, I see where the dude is coming from when he looks back and wonders why... having said that, after shelving Avengers, I dove deep into ME1-3 and found Arkham for $12. Here I am playing old games, albeit slightly upgraded, and enjoying them all once again. Although this was my first glimpse at the original Mass Effect, and it was amazing.
@get2sammyb
Hi man.
What do you think about the way his 'I believe in generation' quote was reported ?
I think all of it has been out of context and very misleading. He was obviously talking about the hardware features like SSD and Dualsense and very consistent with Sony messaging since the wired reveal and Duallsense reveal.
@Tharsman agreed. Both him and Phil Spencer just need to walk away from the spotlight. They are both snakes.
I think part of the issue, and I don't mean this in a massively negative way, is that Sony clearly loves a remaster or a remake and want to charge again for it.
@Flaming_Kaiser
Sure. We are talking about 2 different things though. You are talking about the perception for the company. I'm only talking about facts and real talk.
Edit.
I mean, if saying what he think looks bad for Sony, I get it. But why would I care? I simply prefer honest talk.
More like he was told to reinstate himself on what his ment because shareholders and others weren't happy with his one liner
@Toypop
Nah I want to play the Barbarian game I was playing on CPC on my PS5 and huge 4k screen and I want an update that allows to load from a cassette player.
I'm only joking haha
When I was at our headquarters this monday, I've played Final Fight and my boss couldn't understand that. Even my opinion "It's great, simple, enjoying beat'em game" doesn't made him understand. Sometimes that simplicity of Final Fight, Double Dragon, Galaga, Contra, also Diablo, Mech Warrior, Warcraft, Legend of Kyrandia, Lemmings... etc etc etc., overweight complexity of modern games and delivers more fun...
@naruball I think that's even more disgusting to think about lol
I was the one who banged on about BC a lot in the past & yeah it would be AMAZING if a PlayStation console could play all my past PS discs but I have given up thinking about it now Most of the games I wanted from the past have been done again(like Crash/Spyro) so it's not all bad really. I would love TimeSplitters 2 & Burnout Takedown & MGS1 tho the most to be remade then I will be 100% happy (well happy'ish)
He loves old games as much as I love vegetables hah.
@MidnightDragonDX He also explained the context, which actually makes a big difference on what he was alluring too.
If it was the presentation where they showed all the previous games until the newest one, the idea is for people to feel like the new one is so much better than what came before.
So, in that context, his comment was perfectly normal.
With that said, this whole thing might end up with Sony being more pro-active into keeping up with it's back library. So, silver linings. xD
I personally would prefer to see sequels or remakes to long dormant IP's, than care about backwards comp. As long as the old consoles work, it's all good for me.
But, a remake/sequal to legend of dragoon/ape escape/syphon filter/wild arms/jak and daxter/wipeout/rollcage, etc would be really nice ways to delight your fanbase and respect your legacy.
I'm sure there are second parties out there eager to take the challenge. They don't even need to put the PS studios directly at work on these, and they can be much cheaper to develop than the usual huge AAA open worlds they make.
I bet they would find a way for full support reaching back to the PS1, if they could charge money for each game. I am not concerned about PS1 bc, because I don't have any PS1 games anymore. But I do have a decent library of PS2 and PS3 games that I would like to play on the PS4.
Disruptor was a rather good game if memory serves correctly.
There are some schools of gamers who sell their last generation consoles as soon as a new one is released and then there are the collectors. Those are the people who happily dig out and enjoy older games. I would definitely play previous generation games on PS5 if it was possible.
@Shepherd_Tallon @kingbreww
Last time I checked a few months ago around 38 of the 997 original Xbox games were backwards compatible and 477 of the 2154 Xbox 360 games.
Obviously this includes many of the most popular titles, but a lot of those have also been remastered too.
It’s a great feature I enjoy but far from a complete service.
EDIT: While you have to pay for it, PS Now has similar numbers
Yes it would be a cool feature but people seem to have a short term memory.
PS3 launched with the PS2’s CPU & GPU ‘Emotion Engine’ built in for backwards compatibility but this contributed to it’s unpopular price point that almost ruined Sony.
Yes it could be done through software emulation too BUT this takes even more of work. Microsoft said over 1 million man hours had been used in bringing backwards compatibility to Series X|S (and that was a while ago) it is not a cheap endeavour.
Personally as much as I’d like to see it, given the choice I’d prefer that money was spent on NEW games not backwards compatibility.
Equally I hope from PS4 forward this will always be a given for PS6, 7 etc.
@themightyant That's interesting. I had no idea of these numbers. 🤔
There is no reason PS classics aren't on the PS5. There should be no difficulty putting PS1 and PSP games on the PS5 whatsoever.
PS2 games are a bit more problematic. Some games, most notably the Ratchet and Clanks, used a bunch of weird cheats to make it run on the PS2, like having certain assets loaded from the the center of the disk, so those games are extremely difficult to emulate. But I do wish they expanded the PS2-on-PS4 offerings.
PS3 architecture is so weird, so we'll get good PS3 emulation around the same time we get good Sega Saturn emulation.
And with PS Vita emulation... let's be fair. 99% of people would be satisfied if Persona 4 Golden just got ported to PS5.
He really was just talking about old Gran Turismo games, not old games in general. He is right in that department, why the hell would anyone want to replay old GT games is beyond me.
@patronmacabre “There should be no difficulty putting PS1 and PSP games on the PS5 whatsoever.” Technically I don’t think there is a problem, the trouble is that every game has to be checked individually and maybe emulation settings adjusted. This takes a LOT of time and money. As I quoted above Microsoft have said it took over 1 million man hours to get backwards compatibility done and tested for Series X|S. That’s a HUGE and expensive undertaking.
Perhaps Sony could use community help e.g. create and release an emulator with adjustable settings and the community can help find the best settings for each game that are then applied across everyone’s systems. Could be a really positive way to engage with the community.
Still don't trust Ryan - dunno why but he doesn't seem to understand or care about the PS brand until someone reminds him that he should. Layden and House I had time for.
Regarding the backwards compatibility, the PS4 emulation - given the similar x64 architecture - was a no brainer. Walk away from circa 80 million PS4 users and see your market evaporate!
PS3 is the obvious problem child and emulation would be complex and probably buggy. PS2 and PS1 should have been there for the PS4, never mind the extra grunt of the PS5. There must have been a Linux based emulator that they could have purchased for a few quid and modified with their own internal expertise?
@themightyant That's a good point. That said, from PSOne classics, they should know ahead of time which games tend to cause problems. I think they could also just do what Sega did with Sonic Mania and contract people who work on ePSXe.
We want full PlayStation backwards compatibility. Patch that sh*t in.
Remake Legend of Dragoon and i wont be mad anymore. 🤪
@patronmacabre Sure but that was one game, that would have taken dozens or hundreds of man hours to test properly. Multiply this by the size of the PS1-PS3 library of over 10, 000 games...
All I'm saying is that it would be a wonderful feature to have but I understand why they don't do it. As Jim said "time, engineering resource, and money are all finite, and that important trade-offs have to be made in terms of what’s included, and what’s not".
Would you rather they spend their money and time on this or new games and services?
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