Microsoft Wants to 'Surprise Sony' with Xbox Scarlett, Devkits are Reportedly Rare and 'Nowhere Near Final'

If this is the case, sony have an advantage regardless of the reason. It means devs are more likely to use PS5 as their base platform and port to xbox, as they will have had more time to get used to the hardware. Sony did this with ps3, and it gave 360 that huge advantage in the early years with 3rd party developers

another useless article

@Amppari Well, looking at your comments history you're obviously not a huge fan of the site. Maybe it's time to move on?

I doubt microsoft isn't providing devkits to devs because they want to surprise sony, it's more likely microsoft is a bit late providing devkits for devs, like last gen.

Sony make more cheaper and more powerful box at the start of this gen, and at the middle of this gen microsoft need 1 year and additional $100 to make more powerful pro console, I have no worry about ps5 power especially since mark cerny is helping sony again for ps5 design

Since devs have the devkit for the PS5 for a few months now, I feel that'll help devs get used to working with the PS5.

I hate to be that guy, but is the Sony vs Microsoft "war" even relevant anymore? This generation had a clear winner, and looking at Sony's recent developer acquisitions, the inevitable sequels to big games from these past few years, and the psvr2 on its way, can Microsoft really "compete"?

Personally i think ps5 will have the edge. Microsoft have confirmed than Scarlett will have Gddr6 Ram, but Sony haven't mentiond ram as far as I'm aware. But i heard rumors of ps5 using HBM2/ddr4 Ram. HBM2 is more energy efficient than Gddr6, so would that allow ps5 to clock the Gpu higher? Also people claiming scarlett dev kits are not final, but that could also be the case for ps5 too.

Oh come on. No devkit is near final. Thingy wants to surprise is pub talk
And nobody is saying 'them not being powerful etc.' So you know its bs

@TurboTom
That's just wild speculation trying to be rumours

@JJ2 yeah that's true, i just find it interesting that Sony haven't mentiond what kind of Ram yet, and the reports of ps5 clocked high. But yeah just speculation for now

Cool, still buying a ps5, I don't have any attention focused on scarlett until after I make that purchase... shoulder shrug.

They want to surprise Sony this time around by actually publishing some decent exclusives maybe? I very much doubt it.

@ShogunRok
Dont know about his history but hes got a point about this one though. Ms wants to surprise, devkits are nowhere near final.... you got to admit that's no scoop. That said respectfully.

Following this argument, according to insider Daniel Ahmad both PS5 and Scarlett Dev kits are not final, so this means both companies want to surprise each other?

Yeah, seems strange that the Scarlett devkit would be in so few hands. Every part of that seems like a bad idea. If they're still finalizing the specs, that leaves less time to find hardware issues (red ring, anyone?). If they're just holding it to be secretive, then devs won't be able to optimize their games as well as they can on the PS5, which sounds like it's been in most third party hands since earlier this year. Being secretive also means no press. I think Sony gets kind of excited when pictures like the one from earlier leak. It doesn't reveal anything that they're adamant about us not knowing, and it creates press. The only time I hear about Scarlett is when Phil Spencer says something stupid. On the other side of that coin, the internet won't shut up about the PS5. Through the drip feed of info we get directly from Sony, to leaks like this, it is constantly in our minds. In my opinion, Sony is already winning this console war, and it hasn't even started.

@JJ2 With respect, if we built this site on nothing but "scoops" it simply wouldn't exist.

@ShogunRok
Yea I know. It's just a way to say this one is no much news tbh. Ms trying to 'surprise' okay?
Devkit not final hey? Are they ? Of course not

To me this says we dont have much in development games wise. Dev's need the kits to develop games.

@thefirst yeah phil Spencer even said in a recent interview that they had a discussion about if to even launch a new console. Being behind in development this close to launch is not good in my opinion, and ps5 will probably have a update or two for the dev kit before it comes out next year too.

Power of the console shouldn’t even matter at this point. We know the hardware is going to make games look great on both consoles, but it boils down to games. If Microsoft wants to surprise Sony, they better have a great catalog of exclusive games that matches Sony’s lineup. Gears, Halo, and Forza can only take you so far.

At this point if Microsoft don’t step up their first party games quality next gen they should just leave the console business.

The only way MS could surprise anybody next gen is by releasing some decent games that aren't called Gears, Forza or Halo.

Absolutely irrelevant. Power has never mattered in the grand scheme of things as consumers, or rather gamers, tend to buy the console with the unique library. That's the only reason to buy a console in the first place, not the controller, not the online service, not your friends list, the exclusive games... Something MS hasn't had since 2015. The Switch, an amazing console with an amazing library, is overtaking the "world's most powerful console". Let that sink in.

I keep hearing people talk about their recent acquisitions (and now their confirmation they won't be buying anymore) and how they'll bolster their 1st party lineup.... No, they won't. When they announced Play Anywhere, they unofficially went 3rd party. Their biggest launch title, Halo Infinite, is on 3 different platforms, the studios they've purchased that have released games on other platforms are selling better on those platforms than on MS'. Microsoft is building a 3rd party service network, they're going to be the biggest 3rd party publisher in a few years, that's what they want and honestly it's the only area where they can be at the top. The only reason Scarlett is coming is because Phil got a late start with having to jump in and fix the mistakes made earlier. Scarlett is a 'good faith' box to appease the diehard fans who are still there but worried. We've seen this transition towards 3rd party for the last 4 years, it's obvious to anyone who's been paying attention. They'll keep taking these small steps until the following generation and by then, they'll be completely setup with their fans locked in.

@Nintyfan

Interesting take and great observation. Perhaps that IS the MS plan for the future. Spot on take about power and the Switch as well - what gamers really want is - well, good games!

@NYJetsfan123 it just means Sony has the lead. PS4 won the console war this gen, but let’s be reminded that Sony wasn’t strong in the PS3 era. It’s too early to say if PS5 will dominate.

As a PlayStation fan, I’m hoping that Xbox can compete. Competition ensures that companies do not get complacent and get fat off of their greed. I hope there’s a healthy competition in the coming console gen. Its better for gamers.

It sounds like they’re holding back final specs so they can up them if they’re behind again. It all sounds a little last minute and desperate honestly. Whether it works or not is another story though.

@throwmeaname

I completely agree with you. Competition is good and very welcomed. It forces developers to really dig deep and push out great products.

I guess I wasn't clear in my original comment. My bad. The point I was trying to get across is that the whole "war" thing just seems irrelevant these days. It seems like both companies have a clear vision of what they're doing and who they are trying to please.

I personally could care less who sells the most consoles, games, etc. As long as Sony keeps pumping out these damn good games I'm happy!

@NYJetsfan123 I agree!

@Rob_230 or most likely no one cares about the next xbox not even devs because microsoft forces their gamers to gamepass and people don't see the real value of games anymore.

Go back to PC Microsoft u lost the war the new xbox dev kits r so rare cuz they dont exist yet just like there 1st party games better specs on the x box will not sell more u need games people will actually play

So they're gonna surprise Sony by basically having no games ready for its launch window? Good plan Microsoft, take your biggest weakness this gen and apply it to next gen. This probably explains why Super Luckys Tale was the only game they had to celebrate the launch of "The Worlds Most Powerful Console"

@throwmeaname pretty certain that by the end of that gen PS3 had caught up or even surpassed the 360. The reality is that the Xbox has only ever briefly been competitive with Playstation and that was at a time when Sony were screwing themselves

MS lost the console war the second it decided to have all its first-party games on PC as well. From the second the X-Box doesn't have exclusives, it means there's little reason to buy one.

Want Halo? Buy an X-Box or use a decent PC you might already have.

Want Bloodborne? Buy a PS4.

But I can see X-Box in the future becoming a streaming/subscription service that even goes into the PS eco-system. Pay 15$ a month to have Halo/Gears/Forza/MS First-Party games available on your PS6 as well. Or buy them on a PC/X-Box. Or subscribe on X-Box/PC for 8$ a month.

Phil Spencer is right when he says that MS is all about options. I respect that. Sony has awesome exclusives, but they're more narrow-minded where options are concerned.

@ShogunRok
hes an Xbox fanboi checking up on us, i to keep on eye on xbox from time to time

Games are going to look great on both platforms. Currently, though, PS5 seems like it has a coherent direction behind it, whereas I feel like, whenever I hear about Scarlett, the news is purely reactionary in nature. Which is a problem. If Microsoft wants to be competitive again, they need to be bold and ambitious with their new console. Sony's first-party output is practically rivaling Nintendo's stuff in terms of commercial success and critical acclaim now, and Microsoft simply has nothing comparable to draw gamers to their console.

I couldn't care less about specs to be honest, if PS5 was a tattie i'd still be getting it. I mean guaranteed sequels to GoW, HZD, Spider-man and those are ones we know will definitely be happening that i'm invested in. Can't wait to hear about new IP's for PS5.

@Rob_230 The Xbox 360 had an early advantage last generation, because the PS3's proprietary Cell architecture was a nightmare to code for, and poorly annotated. This is also why 360 versions of multiplats ran better for years, despite Cell theoretically being more powerful.

As devs got more comfortable with Cell, that gap closed. Had nothing to do with the availability of dev kits.

@Nickolaidas People seem to forget that the console was (and to some extent still is) the low/no margin device the platform holders HAD to sell you, in order to get you into their walled garden, where they would make their real money on accessories, services, and game sales/licencing.

If you don't buy a Scarlett, but still get Game Pass, and Halo, and an Xbox Controller for your PC, all you've done is cut out the low margin middle-man, in favour of buying the high margin stuff from Microsoft. There's a reason Google was happy to jump in and try to sell you everything BUT the console.

This is also why "attach rate" was always bandied about as an equally important data point for the health of a platform. The size of your customer base obviously matters (which is "the console wars"), but your attach rate represented how much money you were making from each of those customers.

The "Console Wars" are only going to become less and less relevant as the battlefield becomes more and more asynchronous. Next gen you're gonna have Sony with a traditional console, Microsoft with Console + PC + Streaming, and Google with pure streaming (assuming it's still around a year from now, haha).

@NorrinRadd As someone who is older than six, I can vividly remember the first couple of years of this generation, when the Team Blue fanboys relentlessly mocked the Xbox for only being able to run most games at 900p. It seems power mattered very much back then, when the "exclusives gap" was narrower

While the games are ultimately the biggest pieces of the puzzle regarding the success of a platform, and Microsoft definitely fell down badly on that front this generation compared to Sony, I do enjoy the revisionist history from blueshirts pretending like they don't really care about power, and "games are what matters".

Sort-of like how backward compatibility definitely doesn't matter, but being able to sell used games definitely did. Weird how it always works out that whatever Team Green does is either bad or irrelevant. Almost like motivated reasoning or something.

As someone who always buys all of the consoles, I have no rooting interest here, but boy do fanboys give me a laugh.

If this is true, surely a lack of Xbox dev kits means a lack of games in the pipeline for Scarlett? Surely this can’t be the case, this would be suicide for Xbox.

@MadAussieBloke they've skipped 20, they're onto Infinite now 😂

@MadAussieBloke As opposed to Gran Turismo 7, God of War 5, and KillZone 4.

Microsoft's problem this generation was a lack of new IP that really hit big, not a massive oversaturation of their three "pillar" franchises. That, and those sequels didn't really strike a major note with critics or players (except Forza Horizon and Gears 5).

There's been one mainline Halo game this entire console generation, and it came out four years ago - much less than last gen. There's been two Gears titles - less than last gen.

And to be clear, my first sentence isn't a criticism of those games - it's pointing out the glaring hypocrisy behind your snark. God of War was a terrific game, and GT Sport has slowly become a terrific game, and I enjoyed both (KillZone Shadowfall was "meh").

@Scottoest i dont disagree with you. The cell was notoriously difficult to develop for, but its also fact that the 360 getting to market first meant that developers were not keen/couldnt afford to put the same time and resource into learning completely different architecture.

If Sony had released first it could have been a very different story as developers would have had to learn the ins and outs of the Cell.

Its true that Sony emphasised dev friendly architecture this gen because they learnt lessons from cell. But i do still think getting to market late remains a fundamental issue.

Mystic did an interesting documentary on youtube last week i think which touches on this

Btw 'Microsoft wants to surprise Sony this time."

About everyone has been saying that for years...just like the assumption that new xbox will be the most powerful. It s possible but it's only based on wishful thinking and no news. I think they will be very close.

Also the guy is going on about Lockart possibly releasing after Scarlet now, which is whatever...🙄

As always does it have games the Xbox X does not make a difference. Playing on a original PS4 i bought a PS4 for the game not the consolepower. 😩

@Scottoest I think my problem with Xbox was the lack of games. Yes i would love 4K 60FPS but it was the games that kept on PS from the PS1 era.

@MightyDemon82 Ghosts of Tsushima is high on my list for PS5

Since both consoles will be launching at the same time and using AMD tech they should be performing at about the same level. Microsoft couldn't possibly have benefit much holding back with the dev kit. A likely reason could be the high speed SSD which Microsoft did not see coming. If Microsoft really wants to surprise Sony, they could just ordered a larger APU, more RAM and subsidies extra cost. But that should not cause a delay in the Dev Kit.

if MS are purposely holding back the Scarlet dev kits then i'm sorry but that's a dumb move

if they leave it too long in order to get a jump on Sony probably waiting to hear what the PS5 is capable of in order to adjust the Scarlet accordingly, they are just limiting the amount of time developers have with it before the console launches

at least with the PS5 kits already out there the developers have plenty of time to get to grips with the new system well before launch

They'll need some actual decent games before they can even consider an equal footing.

First-party games? Also on PC. Game Pass? Also on PC. Online play? Also on PC, and without the need for a Live subscription. Fact is, while there's no denying the convenience of all this, Microsoft has taken significant steps during this generation towards making their own hardware fairly irrelevant to anyone with a half-decent PC.

@Boucho11 i may get it on PS4 but will see!

MS absolutely hated being less powerful than PS4 at launch and I reckon they’ll be aiming to reverse that trend with their next console.

Having said that it’s the games that matter and Sony have got that locked down. MS have new studios yet to prove themselves...

Don’t think there’s anything MS can do to win me back tbh...

@MightyDemon82 I thought it was going to be a launch title? If it comes to PS4 i don’t know know if I could wait for PS5

@Boucho11 i believe it's been moved to october since LoU2 got moved to may!

@carlos82 You're correct. PS3 edged out the 360 by about 1.5mn units at EOL.

The hubris is stroooong at MS. At this point it doesnt matter. The clear winner this gen has their tech in devs hands for next gen. MS gon be port city. Hopefully internal devs are getting a headstart lol

@JohnGrey and how many had already bought a 2nd 360 before MS reimbursement came out. Ps3 won by a wider margin than those numbers tell

Without compelling games, power is irrelevant for me. The fact that I can now play the big Xbox exclusives on my phone/tablet/pc make it a moot point. As others have said Horizon, GOW, Gran Turismo, Spiderman etc etc will all have sequels coming to the ps5 and MS can't match that regardless of how much power their next box has.

Multiplat games have always existed, but as each generation in game consoles came out, more and more started to take over a game console's library for better or worse. From about 5th generation of games and up it steadily increased because well games got more expensive.

9th generation will really show who has the games to shine in such tight competition. Everything will be mostly multiplat unless said game console companies has their own studios. Microsoft isn't looking so hot right now for this department.

Betting all guns on PS5 to dominate 9th gen.

How does seeing a odd picture of a Dev kit online give anyone a advantage? If anything if Microsoft is not supplying Dev Kits and they are rare it limits the game being worked on for Xbox.

Its Microsoft's that letting XBox fall behind. The Xbox One X was a year late. They didn't acquire exclusive studios when they had a much larger market share. Yes Microsoft have been reactive, but it Sony that has been innovative!

Standard PR stuff. Word is already circulating that the PS5 is going to be more powerful than the next Xbox. Microsoft is trying to get in front of that. Will it help? Probably not.

I find this news somewhat worrying for Microsoft. They are supposed to be hitting back with lots of games, but very few people have dev kits and we only have a year to go until the next generation hits, whereas sony has lots of studios working on games. What they would be wise to remember is it isn't always about brute force - if you look at the PS2, still the best selling console of all time, it was less powerful than the Gamecube and Xbox, but it dominated by having the best support and games. Granted, Microsoft completely screwed just about everything there was to screw up coming into this generation, but assuming they want to remain relevant they are going to need to pull out all the stops. If it ends up being more powerful than the competition then good for them, but the Xbox One X did nothing to dent the PS4 lead - surely that should tell them something? Microsoft really need to get their act together and fast. Maybe they will end up with some really cool extra bit of tech or power, but they are fighting the momentum of Sony with now well over 100 million PS4's sold and a huge host of extremely capable first party studios and IP. Microsoft need to come fighting out of the gate this time, and with a year left, dev kits really should be in as many hands as possible, whether final or not. We know final specs of consoles can change as late as possible, but the reality is all that will happens is specs will increase if anything, so it would benefit Microsoft to get those kits out and if things get better for devs then they will have a higher ceiling to work with when it comes to optimisation at the end.

Doesn't really matter if he is keeping his cards close to his chest, since the CPU and GPU are definitely locked at this point and we're way past the point of no return on those, so they can't be changed. The only thing that will differ from devkit to retail is ram and hard disk space.

Also, Sony is better at hardware when they try, so no, they will not be on equal footing, since there is a huge chance the PS5 will end up the most powerful one. The only time Xbox could claim it was more powerful is when they released a year later. Also Sony didn't really try with the PS4 Pro because they didn't need to, it was a quick cash grab for them. Meanwhile Microsoft went all out and it didn't even matter, since the PS4 not only still beat the crap out of Xbox One, but I am willing to bet the PS4 Pro also outsold the Xbox One X by a huge margin as well.

So not worried about this. Microsoft continues to promise big and underdeliver.

@Rob_230 But wasn't the 360 a PowerPC unit...like the Gamecube? PPC was already a very well known quantity.

Whether or not PS3 released first, by using known and accessible, at the time, architecture, would have given the 360 the advantage regardless.

It's where the Wii U flopped. It stayed PPC despite the at the time standard being X86.

And I mean, given we know both PS5 and Scarlett will be borderline identical, like last time, I cant imagine developers are anxious about lacking Scarlett devkits.

They can just make a spec for PC, because it's AMD PC tech being used again, or make a spec for PS5, and since games are now designed to be available, because of how many configs there are now of x86 alone, they'll pretty much have made a Scarlett version of a game by simply...making the game at all.

@BorderlineJon
Tbh I think it's just much ado about nothing. The reality is often in between. Ms is a few months behind schedule vs Sony and ultimately it wont make much difference. Ps5 devkit are more widespread because they are market leaders simple as that.

Jason Schreier came out and said it was fake news lol

@NYJetsfan123 yes! Pick a side! 😂

@oldschool1987

Can't tell if this is sarcasm or not...

@NYJetsfan123 of course it's sarcasm lol. Being a blind fanboy is silly. I like that Xbox and Sony compete with each other, we're the ones who benefit in the end

@Nintyfan ^this, 100%!

Considering these systems launch next year, I bet devs have had both systems or performance equivalent packages since late 2017.

There is no way devs are just now getting their hands on these systems mid 2019 and are expected to release launch titles.

Power will not matter they will both be able to hit the targets it is games that will keep people with Sony MS could be heading for a car crash if that is true.

@Rob_230 This is highly inaccurate. Microsoft's advantage is using the same basic API which is shared with Windows I might add, which has been superior to Sony's for some time (in terms of ease of use). The Jaguar cores aren't well suited to it (as they aren't for windows either), but the Ryzen ones are. Practically no work will need to be done. The CPU architecture is known and in use, this is why they have started putting Xbox games into the Game Pass for Windows. Sony's API does not run off windows. There will be more work needed. This is similar to when Nintendo used an easier API for switch, and switched their system and API, and developers had their games running in some scenarios in one day, since NVIDIA had a very easy API they developed for them. Microsoft are probably simply having developers developing on a PC kit that has the same basic specs, which would transfer perfectly considering their API. It is not a problem at all. If anything, Xbox can use this to hide how powerful their console is rather well. They also announced theirs first, I highly doubt they are behind. My guess would be they are far ahead in terms of Sony, at least in knowing their full final specs. Sony is probably still working on it.