Looking at Guerrilla's eye-wateringly pretty dinosaur destroying role-playing game Horizon: Zero Dawn on the PlayStation 4 Pro initially reveals the game that you have in your imagination; it's only when the upgraded version is observed back-to-back with its standard PS4 release that the stark contrast comes into alarming focus.
First, it's imperative that we stress: Aloy's adventure looks incredible on the console that you have under your television right now. But here's the reality that you simply have to accept: it looks several times more amazing running on a top-of-the-line Sony television rendered using the PS4 Pro. Like, eye-wideningly so.
There's been much ado about the PS4 Pro's inability to render the biggest names at native 4K, but whatever voodoo science the Japanese giant's brewed – "chequerboard rendering", as it's so catchily named – it's instantly clear that the title's running at a much, much higher resolution than 1080p. Remember when you replaced the sub-native resolutions of the PlayStation 3 for the full high-definition output of the PS4? Well, the PS4 Pro appears to offer a similar eye-rub all over again.
And when you take into account that this is all running on a system that costs $100 more than its eighth generation brethren – more like $50 if you factor in hard-drive sizes – it's immediately clear what Sony's offering here: a significant jump in image quality for the price that you paid for your current PS4 at launch. It's a very strong value proposition.
It's only when the upgraded version is observed back-to-back with its standard PS4 release that the stark contrast comes into alarming focus
But it's always worth pointing out that you won't need a fancy-pants new screen as well to take advantage of what the imminent hardware has to offer. True, the HDR functionality adds a richness to colours that you simply can't get on a standard display, but tried-and-tested 1080p screens will benefit from supersampling – which will, in short, ensure stellar image quality – as well as better lighting, effects, and potentially more.
The key part of Sony's strategy, though, is this: whichever PS4 you play on, you're going to get the exact same gameplay experience – and that's paramount. To repeat: whether you enjoy Horizon: Zero Dawn on a standard system or on a supercharged machine in 4K, you're going to get the same seemingly very entertaining game.
You could argue that such a sentence renders the PS4 Pro moot, but with the very significant improvements there for those who want them, without detracting from the experience for those who don't, Sony's delivering the best of both worlds. What it now needs to figure out is how to effectively demonstrate to everyone the differences that we saw – and that may be a challenge beyond even Mark Cerny's ability to solve.
Are you interested in the PS4 Pro at all? Have our impressions changed your opinion of the console? Upres your thoughts in the comments section below.
Since it has been a topic of discussion, how far away from what size 4k TV were you when you noticed the difference, and was it resolution or the HDR?
I all ready have the Pro on pre-order and picked up a 4K TV this week. I'm all in and can't wait...
I'm giving my vanilla PS4 to my Dad who has been wanting one for awhile now.
Already preordered the pro, can't wait to see the difference with old ps4.
I bought a 4k TV and returned it cause the input lag is too much. I bought one of the best rated for input lag too. I'll wait till the TVs can catch up .
@Realist - oh wow...bummer, dude! I've read and compared input lag with my 63" 1080p samsung, across alot of new models. Samsungs 2016 tv's compare favorably to the one I have. Did you remember to switch to games mode?
If you can spend the money you can the LG OLED55E6V has HDR and dolby vision it's has an input lag on gaming mode of. 34 ms which was reviewed by a pro gamer as great, it's not the most expensive in the LG oled screen range, but at £3k it's the most my wife will allow me to spend when I move house next month. If your not bothered by an oled screen you can go much cheaper, but you're correct you have to research input lag because not all tvs make this a priority.
http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/input-lag. It is great at explaining the Leo bodnar lag test.
http://uk.rtings.com/tv/reviews/by-usage/video-gaming/best is the site page reviewing best gaming TV. They both make really interesting reads and will help you decide whatever you budget the right TV for the experience you want and can afford. Hope this helps people trying to decide which TV to get.
@Realist The Samsung KS series has the best Input Lag of any 4k HDR TV and beats many 1080p TV's too. In fact very few TV's can match it at all and only 1-2 that can beat it but they are 1080p and not HDR either. The input lag of the KS series is 21ms and rises to around 21.6ms when running a game in HDR. (Figures from http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/ue55ks8000-201609174362.htm and other reviews have found similar results - RTINGs measures 20.5 in game mode at 1080/60 and 20.6 at 4k/60+HDR for example). Most TV's, inc 1080p can't match that!
Of course you could just stick with the TV you have and still benefit from the 'Pro' as it will still improve the quality of the visual experience. The improved hardware should improve games with unlocked frame rates without needing a patch too. The 7% boost in the XB1s saw a 7% increase in frame rates over the XB1 in games that have unlocked frame rates so would expect to see more dramatic results from the Pro.
I will wait. My launch day PS4 works great still and I don't have a 4K TV.
@Mega-Gazz The TV was, at a guess, 60-inches. The difference was noticeable with your face pressed against it, and from the other side of the room.
@Neolit No, haven't seen that, sadly.
Looks amazing! But i won't get it tho, maybe next year. So far there are very little games support it.
@Realist This! The input lag is noticeable, even on the standard ps4 it is slightly noticeable with the likes of usf4, most platform games and Driveclub. With the extra 17-34 milliseconds of delay on top of the other latency with the bluetooth controller with gaming on a 4k (like my mate does) it really ruins the gameplay. Fine for ESO and strategy games but terrible for usf4 my moves really felt sluggish.
If FFXV has a performance boost on non 4K tv I am gonna grab it asap, if not I'll wait for a "cool" limited version or something.
@themcnoisy it is sure a good thing for fighting games...though, as a street fighter enthusiast, I must say that the ps4 version of usf4 had a terribad net code. So the pad is only 10% of the problem.
@Realist I heard hdr mode on tv can add input lag around 100ms plus the tv original input lag, That's crazy!
This is a really good video explaining about hdr and what to search when buying new 4k tv:
HDR Primer #1 What You Need To Know If You're Getting A PS4Pro, PS4, or Xbox One S
This sales pitch still seems stupid. Either confidently sell a higher-spec PS4 or don't bother. All this "it'll look even better, although it will already look great and play the same on your old ps4" talk is just stumbling round in circles.
I will wait until they release a white PS4 Pro.
Already got my on pre order cannot wait, it just goes to show how uninformed people really are towards tech. Obviously its going to make a difference with the PS4 Pro being over twice the power of the standard PS4, the PS4 Pro has 4.2 Teraflops over a standard PS4's 1.84 Teraflops that is a higher spec like it or not. It'll look a lot better wether your on a 1080p TV or amazing on a 4K HDR TV with better frame-rates, and your standard customer wouldn't be able to tell the difference from Sony's upscalling technique and native 4K fact.
Not sold. Doesn't really seem like a "good value proposition" unless you have the TV to support it, And I'm not running out to spend thousands on a TV to buy another 3/400 console, simply can't afford it. I envy those that can. All in all this pro move just seems like a way to get more money out of consumers for the smallest jump forward in tech. My current ps4 works great. Ive said it before, but all Nintendo have to do it price their console reasonably and I'm looking into that.
So we now have the PlayStation pro on display showing a game that has been delayed...........talking about delayed games for me the PlayStation pro is not the problem it is the fact many......many....many games have been delayed to sell the PlayStation pro...... it is not a coincidence top games have been delayed if PlayStation pro was out in a couple of years I would be playing F.F.15 right now along with zero dawn G.T.sport and a whole load of other eagerly anticipated games.
Talking Pro I have a setting on my H.D.T.V that gives me a "Dynamic" picture kinda looks like the video of zero dawn to me its a waste my "contrast" is turned waaaaay down to 15 maybe 20%.....
Sony has tweaked your nose..................I do not see anybody reviewing that
Did somebody mention 8K
If I am after better graphics then I would be gaming on the PC not getting a Pro. There is not a big enough jump and it does not offer any more games than I can get on the original PS4. If I am spending £350 it would be better getting a PSVR where I can experience something new and original.
Until Sony or Digital Foundry show me a full side-by-side comparison video, I'm not convinced PS4Pro is worthwhile.
Personally, it's too small of an upgrade in all the wrong areas and just comes across as this is what the PS4 originally should've launched as.
The lag can be negated by turning off all the post processing on the TV and connecting the new controller via cable.
I'm a console player so this is great news for me ,already got my Sony 4K TV with HDR pre-order the PS4 Pro. I also brought some HDMI wires from audioquest and popcorn machine, I'm ready to be entertained Sony!
@Feena Those who attended highly praised the high resolution, splendid texture, and smooth and stable framerate of Final Fantasy XV on PlayStation 4 Pro.
Read more at http://www.siliconera.com/2016/09/16/early-impressions-final-fantasy-xv-playstation-4-pro/#kYKXSFhRTdKk9ddU.99
@j1965 love audioquest robbie williams was a blast
That's a very good point. Higher resolutions just allow bigger screens so you cannot see the pixels when viewed from the same distance. The individual pixels on a 1080p screen cannot be seen by the human eye from a normal 6 feet viewing distance.
What you can see though is fine detail pixel shimmer because this involves several pixels animating, but this can be cured by high quality anti aliasing. Most PS4 Pro games seem to be upscaling 2K (1440p) to 4K via a clever supersampling checkerboard technique.
If you simply downsample 1440p to 1080p, you instantly get the best anti aliasing solution achievable at no extra cost and it will result in an incredibly smooth 1080p image. It would give games that Toy Story look in 1080p and that's incredible. Bear in mind that detail gets a boost when the 1080p image is generated by a higher resolution.
Try watching a 1080p video via Youtube on a 1080p computer screen, then watch it again in 4K on your 1080p computer screen. The resolution of your computer screen does not change but there is a huge boost in detail sharpness due to higher quality screen pixels.
Don't laugh. On it's own, a pixel is a pixel and cannot be improved, but it's relation to the surrounding pixels can. Downsampling from a higher resolution creates very high quality pixels that blend seamlessly with surrounding pixels, creating a very high quality image with increased sharpness.
PS4 Pro is a no brainer. It's cheap, it's powerful, it will generate a very higher quality 1080p image and generates a very high quality 4K image by upscaling from 2K to 4K using a smart supersampling checkerboard technique that looks really close to native 4K. It's not a bog standard upscale you get from an XB1 or inside your TV.
The quality of the PS4 Pro 4K output is very close to native, making the XB Scorpio look like a very expensive brute force native route to achieve the same result. MS are worried that it makes the XB Scorpio obsolete, hence their recent attack claiming PS4 Pro cannot do native 4K gaming. But the truth is it does not need to. The quality of the upscale means they only need to generate 2k with very cheap hardware and use a cutting edge upscale technique, so gamers win with huge value for money.
Then we have HDR which actually adds even more detail than 4K. HDR is only available on 4K TV's. 4K adds resolution detail, but HDR adds colour and shade detail which is vast. Think about it, an image with every pixel the same colour looks exactly the same on a 1080p and 4K screen. The resolution benefit disappears. HDR adds a huge amount of extra gradients, so you see detail in areas that were simply the same colour on a normal RGB screen.
In RGB, shadow areas and highlight areas are made up of just one or two different colour shade gradients, but in HDR you have much more shades so details and texture not seen in RGB suddenly form to add extra detail. The range of pixel colours and gradients is called the colour space, the colour gamut or the dynamic range, hence High Dynamic Range (HDR).
The classic example of dynamic range is when you take a picture of a blue sky with your camera and the picture ends up with a white sky. Nature has the full dynamic range but when you try to capture it on a camera with a narrow dynamic range, bright colours are trimmed to white, dark colours are trimmed to black and some mid shades simply disappear. HDR makes all those extra colour shades visible.
Without doubt, PS4 Pro will look awesome on a 4K HDR screen, but most people only have a 1080p screen and will do so for the next 5 years. The devs need to make their game look great at 1080p as well if they want sales. The image quality is sorted, so that just leaves frame rate. Gamers are expecting a frame rate improvement as well.
The quality you are getting for £345 is incredible value for money. No PC can match this quality in the same price range. Even high end PC gamers cannot see HDR detail because all computer monitors are RGB, unless you own an expensive industrial monitor used by the devs, but you won't have any HDR content to view on the computer.
We will get lots of silly PC fanboys comparing PC and PS4 Pro screenshots in limited RGB because that is all they can see on their computer, but if you look at the HDR TV image generated via a PS4 Pro, there will be a vast HDR detail range that is missing from the high end PC screen. The problem is how to you demonstrate that on peoples computer via an RBG monitor. The real answer is you can't. The internet cannot transmit that quality either because everything is an RGB colour space infrastructure.
The only way to view the quality on offer is to watch it with your real eyes on the real kit, hence Sony's smart move to take the gear on a roadshow around the country to invite gamers to see it with their own eyes.
Sorry I wrote far more than I intended there, but it's all valuable information that everyone can benefit from. Share the knowledge.
Still don't believe it's worth the investment! Maybe if you could trade your old console I would change my mind...but right now, it's just spending 400 euros again to see prettier images
Pre ordered and after reading @justerthought comment above who obviously know's his stuff I won't regret it one bit. Hater's gunna hate but I love FPS's and I couldnt play say BF1 (No BF4 but i'm getting it) on a regular PS4 knowing that PRO user's had a distinct advantage over me, draw distance and finer detail will make a big difference.
@justerthought we had all this with H.D.T.V. crisper sharper brighter .
We aint fools Sony.
In 2 years time i will have to fork out 500 quid for the Spartacus PlayStation 5 and another grand of bunce for an 8k Television.
When they said you need a bigger monitor to play championship manager .4 before the resolution was 800 by 600 but you needed a monitor that would display 1024 by 768 at that time it was the fastest-selling PC game ever on its first day of release.
They sold a lot of 1024 by 768 Monitors on the back of championship manager 4 ....because without 1 you could not play it
That is when the rot set in. we should have stuck to our 800 by 600 monitors that were more than adequate . at the time.....
If your sick of Sony taking the proverbial do not buy a 4 K T.V. as a protest if you have money to waste help someone else.
@Sanquine ah, black model it is then
@justerthought thanks for the detailed reply . There is some debate about not being able to see the difference between 1080p and 4k at reasonable distances, which is why I was asking. You should catch up on this thread: https://www.pushsquare.com/forums/ps4/4k_tv_recommendations - towards the end we get into alot of detail about it. the TL;DR version is that the stat you quoted is based on 20/20 vision, and lots of people have much better than 20/20 vision. Also for some things, like detecting parallel lines we have significantly better even at 20/20 vision. I've been quite skeptical about resolution making a difference, but the empirical reports seem to be saying it helps. Dunno how much that is confirmation bias, there seems to be a lot of people saying it helps.
@MadAussieBloke What? Both Xbox One and Wii U have had games that run at 1080p and 60 fps (Halo 5, Gears 4, Smash Bros) or 720p @ 60fps (Bayonetta 2, Mario Kart 8). Both machines are far from cutting edge, but they're more than capable of running nice-looking games. Stop drinking the Sony Kool-Aid.
Nope. Sorry Sony, but I think I'll just wait for the PS5 (if it ever actually happens).
They pressured us into getting HD TVs. Then it was 3D. And now 4K? Let me guess, 8K will be the big thing in five years time? Not to mention VR being so haphazardly thrown into the mix. It's yet another classic case of throwing stuff at a wall and seeing what sticks.
@get2sammyb I think in the future if you want any of these Pro articles to be of any use you need to be a little more journalistic and not write things like "top-of-the-line" and write "4k with HDR" instead, or whatever the screen is you are watching it on.
I haven't purchased a PS4 for 2 years b/c I really didn't notice enough difference in graphics for all those remasters on PS4, PS3 games looked "good enough" to me, and I'm a self admitted graphics wore who won't play 8 bit retro looking games. So I would need to know what Pro does on my 1080p non-HDR TV to see if it's worth the extra $130. $399 Pro - $299 Slim bundled w/ Uncharted 4 which seems like a $30 game at this point. Though we'll have to see how they bundle Pro in November, I still need FFXV but I'm not paying extra for it. It looks to me like every X1S is bundled, would seem really odd to launch Pro w/o a game. I might buy Pro for $399 bundled w/ RotTR Definitive Ed or whatever they are calling it. They should bundle it, seems to come up a lot in relation to Pro, plus it was already on X1, so some people gave already played it so it's not automatically a lost sale.
But please, in the future, when you are talking about how great a game looks, can you say HDR or not, 1080p or 4K. I won't have either of those for years, kids braces are crazy expensive.
What about the textures? Are there improved textures on the PS4 Pro version, or we're simply talking about a resolution increase with better colors?
I find it funny how many console gamers all of a sudden care about visuals and resolution. But then they dismiss pc gaming lol... hate to say it but you could have had all the ps4 pro offers and much, much more for a long time now. The way he says the jump from ps4 to ps4 pro is eye widening? Yeah the jump from consoles to 4k ultra settings pc gaming is like a generational jump from ps3 to ps4 pro, its that big. I game on both an ultra wide 3440x1440 100hz monitor and a 50 inch 4k hdr tv and ive been getting this wow factor for over a year now lol.
All that being said, the power the ps4 pro is offering for the price is absolutely amazing. I cant wait to snag one. Horizon zero dawn alone was enough reason for me to say yes please. Looks great. I just really REALLY hope its not 30 fps. Yuck
@Nickolaidas Digital Foundry implied that they may not have enough RAM for alot of 4k textures... but I guess that depends on how the developer is smart about memory and how many textures they need.
Pro > Xbox One S
I wish that I'm getting this but I will have to stick with the original for now...
@justerthought LOVED YOUR COMMENT CAN'T BELIEVE I READ THE WHOLE THING XD
PC Fanboys really need to chill Sony is being very smart about this console !
@AFCC You could sell your ps4 on your own. One of the reason I'll buy ps4 pro first and not ps vr is because I only need to add about $200 after I sold my old ps4 with 1 or 2 game.
@mitcHELLspawn Console gamer always care about graphics. Decades ago, the reason I want snes is because the graphics are amazing compared to my nes, same with ps1, ps2, etc. It's just that console gamer doesn't care enough to buy a high-end pc, why buy $1000 pc to play 4k games when $400 ps4 pro can play 4k too.
@wiiware sorry but if you believe the ps4 pro and a 1000 dollar pc is comparable you really really dont know what youre talking about. But whatever lol
The PC can outperform but you are usually closer to the monitor (requiring better resolution for the same effect), and the PC is "higher maintenance " if that matters to you.
@BAMozzy thanks for this. I had been waiting on 4K HDR with low input lag and it looks like it is as simple as a firmware update as previously HDR game mode was not available. Perhaps other manafactures will do the same now 4K gaming is on the verge of becoming mainstream and we will have a good choice of TVs to pick from.
So all those people that say the 'Pro' doesn't represent much of an upgrade, don't complain when your PS4 can't cope with a bit of 'fog' or can't run games at a 'locked' frame rate.
I have a 55" 4k HDR TV and sit around 7-8 feet away and I can see the difference between 1080p and 4k. granted it isn't the same step up that full HD is over standard definition but the extra level of detail is still noticeable.
I know the 'Pro' isn't native 4k - at least not with the majority of games, but it is at least twice the resolution of 1080p. It may use checkerboard rendering but what that means is that the GPU starts off with a 4k sized image and draws 'half' the pixels in the frame and then draws the other half in the next frame. The bits that aren't drawn are filled in by the information from the previous frame essentially. This method gives a 'better' result than drawing a 1440p (same pixel count) and stretching it out to twice its size to fit the 4k screen. This stretching method is the same method used by XB1s (and 4k TV's - so my TV upscales XB and PS games to 4k). The XB1s though will be stretching games like BF1, TF2 etc to 9 times its size to fit a 4k screen as these are 720p. On PS4 these are 900p.
People also seem to be forgetting the Pro isn't a 'next' gen console but it is a half way step between the old and new. Its still the first console to have native 4k games. Its still the first console to offer UHD HDR gaming (the XB1s may have beaten it to HDR but its still just HD gaming).
I know most here can't see what HDR offers and probably won't see much difference on their compressed youtube video's on a 1080p TV but I watched Horizon ZD at 4k and the difference is clear and that's before HDR is applied too.
It doesn't bother me whether you think the Pro is worth it. I think it is 0 especially for £350 (although can be found cheaper). I can't wait to play games in HDR and much higher resolutions.
@aric201812 Some TV's may well need an 'update' but most HDR TV's will work in game mode with HDR without updates - they have now been tested properly too. Most 1080p TV's though can't match the Samsung for input lag - even at 4k HDR. The Sony they used at TGS for example has an input lag of 42ms in game mode and higher when using HDR. RTINGS (http://uk.rtings.com/) is a good website to find out your TV's Input Lag). The difference HDR adds is less than 0.001 (one thousandth) of a second on the Samsung to put it into perspective!
@mitcHELLspawn It's not comparable, but it is enough. Sure pc will have better texture and framerate, but did you see the digital foundry comparison on ps4 pro vs 4k pc that can play rise of the tomb raider? DF has to pause the video and red circle the difference to compare ps4 pro and the pc. Most people won't buy a $1000 pc if the difference with $400 ps4 pro is only noticable by pausing the game.
@roe I disagree. The PS4 Pro is aimed at the hardcore crowd while more casual gamers need to be reassured that the Pro isn't entirely replacing the original PS4 or rendering it irrelevant, to avoid confusion. Of course, they could just not release the Pro at all and wait a few more years to incorporate higher specs and 4K support into the PS5, but that ship has sailed I'm afraid.
@wiiware yeah but they werent using the ultra preset either. They were showing how the rotr ps pro version has increased the graphics settings. What was closer to medium settings on ps4 is now closer to very high.. but ultra takes it up a whole other area especially with vxao. It looks incredible.
@wiiware the DF video comparing RotTR to PC showed really clear differences, especially in the textures. I also recall one section section where reflection caused stuff to be a little blown out where the PC got it much more correct - and that problem with shiny surfaces comes up repeatedly in PS4 games.
True they paused it to highlight the differences, but that just makes it a good, well presented informative video - it doesn't imply the difference isn't stark.
In particular look at this image which clearly shows the lighting issue... the ps4 pro 4k overdoes the impact of the lighting on the skin in a terrible way. (ps4 regular does this alot in other games too @ 1080p. I remember this alot in bloodborne, IIRC)
I also should say that I think alot of the PC screenshots suffer from over-sharpenning where edges are too clean to the point of looking fake and unrealistic, which is all I can see in this picture despite it also showcases ps4 pro's lower res textures:
one more comment - it is my understanding that HDR would really help with the lighting problem above, allowing light and reflections to be bright without losing details or getting washed out. 'Course, I haven't actually seen it.
@AFCC gamestop gave me 125 for mine
@Mega-Gazz Like I said, you have stop the game and analyze the graphics to see the difference, you can't see that in normal gameplay unless you're looking for the difference. I also want to see the spec of digital foundry pc that play rotr since I heard that game need a really good pc to play it on 4k resolutions with 60 fps.
My interest in the Pro is for improved performance. 1080p on a 1080p tv or upscaled on a 4K tv is a very good image. What i want from a turbocharged PS4 is smoother and higher frame rates, shorter loading times, elimination of motion blur, and overall faster operation of all functions. The PS5 can be for the next big graphics upgrade.
Higher definition prettier graphics does not overcome poor frame rates, loooong loading times, and blur from any in game movement of character and camera.
For me, the visuals are not important enough to upgrade. But I think it is good of Sony to address the concerns of gamers who are looking for the best visuals that console gaming can provide. Obviously Sony are pushing the Pro but I think after the launch hubbub has died down, the Pro will just be a small paragraph on most game reviews.
Oddly, the thing I would want most from the Pro would be quieter running and the better HDD. I also think the timing is confusing - Pro or VR will be a choice that some gamers have to make.
I am still interested how mid grade iteration updates will affect console gaming in general - this is new waters but I guess time will tell.
@NoCode23 TVs already have moved to the next generation. When the PS3/XB360 generation came out, they were built for the next generation of TV's in essence - which in this case was HD screens.This was before many had given up on their CRT TV's and moved over to the much larger flat-screens. If didn't stop the console manufacturers making their consoles 'future' proof for their life cycle.
The difference between 900p and 1080p may not look like much on youtube comparison video but on a 55" 4k screen, when those games are stretched 6 x (900p) and 4x (1080p) to fit, the difference is obvious.
The Pro is a 'half-way' step for the next generation of displays. Its still a PS4 though and locked to this generation. Its up to the developers how they want to utilise the power.
Most games have 'low' visual effects compared to what they could have. Rise of the Tomb Raider are offering several different options - all of which are 'better' than the PS4 will offer. There is a 1080/30 version with all the visual settings turned up as well as a 1080p unlocked frame rate version and a 4k/30 version. Higher definition does not always make a game 'prettier'. A game like 'CoD4' (for example) was 720p on last gen and a game like Star Wars: Battlefront is 720p (on XB1) yet the games are miles apart in terms of visuals. A lot of the 'Remasters' look worse than current generation games at the same (or in some cases lower) resolutions because of advancements in lighting, textures, shadows, particles etc. Its clear though that Horizon:ZD looks 'better' at the higher resolution over the E3 showing a few months back and that's without HDR
Games with unlocked frame rates should play much more consistently and most likely at the targeted frame rate. Loading times may not improve because the data transfer from disc is still likely to be similar. Motion blur is often built into the game as a 'cinematic' effect by developers.
@Rudy_Manchego The Visuals as well as the increase and hopefully more stability in frame rates are reason enough for me to upgrade. The BF1 Beta (for example) struggled to hit 60fps at 900p (I know DICE could fix this by launch) and it will be interesting to see how much difference the Pro makes - considering it will also be running at 1080p at least. Games like Fallout 4, Witcher 3 had issues with frame rates too - even without a patch, these 2 should run at the full 30fps.
Its possible that the Pro 'could' be a one-off in terms of iterative hardware. During the PS4's life-cycle we have seen the development and release of VR as well as 4k HDR TV's - both of which require a lot more power to get the 'best' out of. If the PS5 is built to run games perfectly well on both of these, there is no need for a mid-term iterative hardware. The main reason we are seeing a mid-term upgrade is because of the new visual hardware.
Unless we see the development and release of a some new 'technology' which requires substantial processing power during a consoles life, I think its unlikely we will see iterative hardware. Of course manufacturers could make 'consoles' at the lower end of the necessary power scale and so therefore struggle to keep up with the new technology in the hands of developers.
If you look back at the PS3/XB360 generation, these consoles were built to offer HD gaming before most people had HD TV's. If they had been built for CRT technology and visuals, I bet they too would have had an upgrade or even been replaced by a 'new' generation of console. The launch XB360 didn't even have a HDMI port!
I have seen comments about 8k TV's and whilst they do exist (and will also conform to the minimum standards for HDR), these are more than likely to be nothing more than a 'status' symbol. As the average size TV bought is 48", and at 4k, you can barely see the difference between that and 1080p at 'normal' viewing distances, 8k would offer no real benefit. The next major steps in TV technology are most likely going to come in the development of HDR and improving the specs. Current HDR TV's meet the 'minimum' specs but don't meet the 'optimum'. No commercial TV can meet the full rec2020 colour gamut or reach the 4000nits HDR is mastered at. The professional display for mastering that can operate at 4000nits is water-cooled and very power hungry too. Advancements are more likely to be made in this area which won't affect gaming as they would already offer HDR.
@hadlee73 I've read that 4K has no benefit on TVs/monitors under 40 inches anyway
@BAMozzy just a quick thank you really
for the information 10/10.
@hadlee73 @wbh1138 The smallest 4k HDR certified TV, I believe, is 49" and that is 'relatively' small compared to a lot of TV's. I have a 55" 4k TV and sit around 7-8 feet away and can see a difference between 1080p and 4k - in fact it's relatively easy to see. I admit that some scenes its not quite so apparent until you flick between 1080p and 4k. Its actually quite amazing how much detail your brain fills in and in some cases how much detail you miss. Most often you focus on the action or speaker and incidental details like the background go relatively un-noticed. A patch of 'green' is 'grass' a darker green with a brown line underneath is a tree - but in 4k, there is more 'detail' in these so they look more like a lawn or a tree. I watched 'Big Cats' - a documentary about the cat family and the difference 4k made was significant. Whiskers, for example stayed defined even into the mid range. Fur still retained the 'texture' of fur and their patten too instead of becoming more blurry and flat. 4k is able to do that and also retain a more accurate colour image too - even if you can't see the individual pixels.
As you know, a picture is made up of pixels of an individual colour. In a 10x10 square at 1080p, that image is made up of 100 possible colours. In 4k that block is made up of 400 possible colours. If the image, for example has a lot of different colours, in 4k, a 2x2 block could contain 4 very different colours a black, white, ginger and brown pixel (some cats fur for example) but in 1080p, this would be represented by just 1 pixel - an average of all 4! Its why 'textures' remain more detailed and more 3 dimensional as it doesn't 'flatten' the colours so much. Like I said in 1080p, our brain sees a flat green area and in context we know it represents 'grass' but in 4k, that grass has more 'texture' and looks more like grass.
I also watched 'Pixels' (movie with lots of gaming nostalgia) and things like the Denim Jacket, looked more like Denim - a mix of dark blue and white threads which at 1080p still looked like Denim but more flat and 'stonewashed' light blue (mix of the dark blue and white threads). The boys (I can't remember his name now but was the son f the 'love interest') had actual freckles - I never noticed these on the 1080p version.
If, as you and many others here, think that 'resolution' doesn't make that much of a difference, then why has there been so much made of the PS4's ability to offer higher resolution than the XB1? Its not as if these games play any differently.
I own both a XB1 and PS4 and I also own some games on both. Some of these games play identically BUT the PS4 has a full 1080p resolution. I can clearly see the difference and in theory, the resolution shouldn't make the game 'less or more' enjoyable. However, I can say I enjoyed the higher resolution more. I found myself enjoying the world more, the level of detail the developers put in. Take Arkham Knight, the first time we see the Batman with the rain on his cape etc. If resolution really doesn't matter, why bother with 'remasters' when most of them just offer 1080p resolution as opposed to 720p.
I am really looking forward to revisiting Uncharted 4 in higher resolution - of course HDR is more significant but I spent a long time just 'looking' at the world Naughty Dog created (as I did with the previous 3 on PS3). To me games are not just about 'game-play' alone, although certainly a major part, but also how they look too. I bet people wouldn't buy games like Uncharted, Last of Us, Arkham Series etc if they all had 'minecraft' style visuals - even if the story and game-play was the same. Games are designed for all our senses, including sight and the closer to 'reality' these games get, the more immersive they become. Games like Resident Evil, Dead Space etc wouldn't be very scary with minecraft zombies!
@Bhattiboy No probs - hope it helps you (and anyone else too...)
@wiiware Thats just it, you don't have to stop it to see the problem, they're very obvious. In this case I used stills to point it out to you, but the reflection wash out issue in particular has been noticeable in several games for a while, its something that really breaks the immersion. The lower res textures you can 'get used to' but certainly the difference is easy to spot without pausing.
Tempting but I don't have a 4k TV and don't intend to buy one particularly soon so probably not worth upgrading for me. I know it's meant to boost PlayStation VR games as well but I don't intend to buy a VR set any time soon either. Might change my mind at some point depending on how things move forward from here.
I stopped by my GameStop and asked a guy I know there about PSVR and PS4 Pro pre-orders.
To my surprise, there were only a handful of pre-orders for either device (like two or three).
I live in a town of 24K people and there's only one GameStop, so basically everyone goes there.
I wish Sony well, it's going to be a fascinating holiday season with all these new products.
I haven't been keeping up with the mid-gen upgrade stuff. Are we going to get games that are PS-Pro only, or have severely crippled games on the PS4 now? If not, I'll likely pass.
@SavoirFaire No, everything will run great on the regular ps4, Sony is enforcing that. pro is just for enthusiasts, basically to keep people from moving to PC as the difference gets bigger, like at the end of the ps3.
This author is obviously paid by sony to promote Ps4 pro. In Evry of his texts his traing yo sell us the Ps4 pro, but in all articles any of real reason are mising. Please dont try to take us for a fools. Push Square please take the advise to filter the texts you relising, couse this kind of paid journalistic can hurt badly your reputation.
@99miki who do you believe is paid to promote the ps4 pro? Push Square staff or one of us commenters?
All this prettier graphics stuff,and PSVR is a total non issue for me at least for now.. I want to see substantially more games running at 60fps.And Bloodborne and DS3 at the very least (in terms of older games getting an upgrade) patched up to run at 60.In olden days pretty much everything on consoles ran at 30fps,After getting a taste for higher frame rate,Its seems obvious to me its far and away the most important issue..It equates to BETTER GAMEPLAY.Why not just get an i3 pc running with all the graphics settings turned up if you want to play a shiny slideshow turd? 30 fps needs to be faded out quickly as possible.
@Mega-Gazz please read last three articles writen by Sammy Baker, and you will see what I'm tring to tell. Pure commercials for ps4 pro. I think that jurnalist should write reviews/reports with some analysis on product, but from this author we only recive "pamflet" on sony products. This is bad for Push square.
@99miki Good call....
Imma go watch Watership Down..there a part where they find a new Warren where food is plentiful and everything seems serene.
Hazel and his friends believe that this is the perfect place for them, since the tenants seemed so healthy and safe. They overlook some odd tendancies like refusing to answer questions, reciting poetry, and building mosaics on the warren walls and decide to settle in. After repeated warnings from Fiver that the warren is not safe, Bigwig gets caught in a snare.
The runaways from Sandleford Warren soon discover that what they thought was a new home is actually a death trap. The Cowslip rabbits refuse to help and get angry at Fiver for asking for them to release Bigwig. Once Bigwig is free, it becomes apparent that men snare the warren territory, but keep the rabbits happy with good food and only a few kills at a time. The Cowslip rabbits feel that this is a good enough trade for the safety and food they are offered and soon become odd and domesticated rabbits.
@BAMozzy, there are two types of motion blur. One is the blur to indicate fast movements or acceleration. The second form of motion blur is when any movement of the camera or character causes blurring of the entire image. The blurring ends and a nice sharp image returns when movement ends.
The latter of the 2 types of motion blur is what i find annoying and when heavy i find the game unplayable like MGS 5, Just Cause 3, and Dying Light.
Doing searches i have found i am far from alone on hate for that type of blur. A common reason given for this blur is that it is used by game makers to provide stable frame rates. Stable 30fps not 60fps.
The PS3 may have come before the big price drop that put hd tv in millions of living rooms, but the PS3 turned out to be underpowered for hd games. Compromises had to be made such as sub 720p, low frame rates, and blur. If entire screen and entire game motion blur is a compromise on the original PS4 then i hope the Pro eliminates the need for that compromise.
No matter how high def or interesting a game is all is lost with an image constantly blurring and making my eyes hurt and giving me a headache. For me i will trade lower def for smoother frames and no blurring of the entire image in any movement.
The game makers are big in all this as higher def and visuals is what they use to sell games. When was the last time frame rate quality was mentioned in a promoting a game? How well their games are or can be ported to consoles is more on them than on Sony. With Sony all of the systems and specs are the same unlike all of the different pc builds in use. Well now there are 2 systems with 2 sets of specs, but still not the vast number of different pc builds.
@wiiware Not enough...I don't even have a 4k tv...also, how are you supposed to transfer your data if you sell your ps4? xD
@AFCC You can use cloud save if you got psplus, or just copy your save to usb drive. I don't have 4k tv either, but in some game like tomb raider the pro is clearly better, you can have 1080p with better graphics than old ps4, or better framerate with the same graphics. If you still doubtful you can always wait for digital foundry comparison later after the ps4 pro launch.
@Mega-Gazz I actually like the ps4 pro picture in the first pic, the pc pic is too dark. The second pic is showing that pc texture is better.
@99miki Let's not go there shall we? Who is paid by whom, do sammy paid by sony, or you by microsoft, or me by nintendo, is ouya the mastermind behind all this?
@NoCode23 "The game makers are big in all this as higher def and visuals is what they use to sell games. When was the last time frame rate quality was mentioned in a promoting a game. How well their games are or can be ported to consoles is more on them than on Sony." Yeah,but both Sony and Devs don't seem to grasp that even though motion blur is a horrible thing,they would still generally make the best possible looking game so it has to be 30fps with excessive motion blur to boot.Maybe its just that i am currently playing on a quite nice 27 inch monitor..but for goodness sake,i would personally rather have games run at 720p/locked 60fps than a blurry 4k shakey 30fps.Is it just me? No,720p isn't the future of high end console performance - but neither is the PS4Pro remember? A half step.Hence the Probable majority of titles being a blurry 30fps for sake of only slighty better graphics anyway.. still..Sony could call the shots if they wanted.Havent bought a nintendo since the N64 but it used be they would have the final say on if a game is good enough to be allowed to take to market.Better framerate and cutting down motion blur (i.e better performance) is surely more of a selling point for any gamers who are at least past total casual level..the guys that splash the cash,too..(mee! a bit) Side issue,the Pro will still be very close to Scorpio performance wise i predict.The Microsoft newbie is going to run on windows 10..Oh Dear,its is going to need all the horsepower they can squeeze out of manufactures running on that horrible,bloated mess of an OS. One more thing,I think Pushsquare's Main problem seems to be an influx of trollish like comments from some guys around here recently (Obviously not you NOCode23) Sammy is an editor not a journalist,and a big Playstation fan.Thats okay.Everyone should be allowed freedom of speech,regardless if anyone agrees or not,but people shouldn't be a dick for their own sake,at the most basic level.Not pointing fingers,its an impartial statement.Sorry,goodnight.
@NoCode23 If the latter is caused by the lack of power to deliver that sharpness and maintain the frame rate, having more power can only improve that - especially in games not patched to increase the resolution or visual appearance.
If, as you say, its caused by the hardware's inability to process the image and maintain the frame-rate, then having more processing power will eliminate that problem. If however, its built in to the programme to create the illusion of more speed, then it makes no difference of course. I don't own or have played the games you mentioned and can't recall seeing that issue myself in a game I have played lately. I can imagine it would be annoying.
My biggest gripe with games at the moment is texture pop-in and frame rate drops in some games so I hope this is resolved by the new Hardware. I know the RAM hasn't been increased but they have given the RAM a 30% increase in bandwidth and given developers an extra 512MB to use. The CPU also has 30% more processing per core too which should help - especially in the games that are running at the same resolution and settings as the standard PS4.
Having also seen Horizon running on the 4K screen at EGX, I actually didn't like it. It looked extremely garish and actually turned me off being interested the PS4 Pro. I then saw Horizon running on the normal screens/PS4 and thought it look better.
@Mega-Gazz I would wait to see the 1080/30 , As that is the mode that has the highest settings. I am looking forward to the comparison between that and 1080 pc/original ps4.
@NoCode23 we get the same thing in Pro Evolution Soccer 2017 when gameplay is slow the lines are lines but if you do a long ball say a goal keeper kicking out then the lines become blurry its not noticeable if your watching gameplay but its there.
I have last years Samsung JS9000 TVs,and it's very good in game mode,but laggy without it.Does anybody know if you can use HDR in game mode? Hope so.
I want one but with another baby due a few weeks after release, and the fact I won't actually be missing out on any gameplay per se, I think i can hold out for the next 'proper' gen! But i DO want one......
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