Death Stranding has slipped and taken a tumble down the physical UK chart. Having already fallen from second to eighth last week, the unique PlayStation 4 adventure from Hideo Kojima now finds itself at number 13. New release Shenmue III doesn't exactly get in its way, either, debuting in 17th place.
The top 10 is instead dominated by the games you'd expect. Call of Duty: Modern Warfare returns to number one, while Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order keeps a steady pace, maintaining its hold on second position. The rest of the top 10 is dominated by Nintendo exclusives, but the likes of FIFA 20 and Fortnite make appearances among them.
Next week's chart should be pretty interesting as Black Friday deals get underway. We imagine we'll see the resurgence of many PS4 titles that have dropped from the physical chart. Here's the latest top 10 for your perusal:
UK Sales Charts: Week Ending 23rd November 2019
- Call of Duty: Modern Warfare
- Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order
- Pokémon Sword
- FIFA 20
- Pokémon Shield
- Luigi's Mansion 3
- Mario Kart 8 Deluxe
- Minecraft
- Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games Tokyo 2020
- Fortnite: Darkfire Bundle
[source ukie.org.uk, via gamesindustry.biz]
Comments 47
Not even 3 weeks. Rather disappointing for the UK market. Could you guys also cover other markets charts. Like France, Italy or generally the EMEAA?
That's excellent news for Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order. Hopefully it stays strong and sends a clear message to EA and their "people don't want single player games" misconception. It even beat Pokémon, something I'm genuinely shocked to see.
Bad news for Death Stranding, but I think this is the inevitable damage from its "wait and see" marketing campaign. Early adopters snapped it up, then their word of mouth got fence-sitters buying it in its second and third weeks, but now what? I doubt your average punter in GAME is gonna risk it on a whim (not until a sale slashes its price).
The unfortunate curse of being something new in an age where the unknown is feared, I guess.
GTA is gone for good it seems!!!
Reentry for Minecraft
@RogerRoger Sad state of affairs, though it would have done a lot better had it not released in November. I still believe the game will be a success though.
Could you guys also cover other markets charts?
@AdamNovice Oh, I'm sure it will. There are loads of folks (myself included) who are certain to play it one day, just not today. You're right, uncertainty at any point carries risk, but uncertainty in November? Charting for a fortnight is impressive enough.
@TheBuzz We do.
https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2019/11/october_2019_npd_the_outer_worlds_stuns_as_modern_warfare_expectedly_explodes
Oh well if the masses want to play the same old shooty nonsense and yet another version of the exact same football game they've already bought many times over, that's their loss.
As for me I'm about 30 hours into one of the most fascinating and unique games I've ever played, whilst also dipping my toes into what is a very good Star Wars game
Minecraft at number 8? Who is still buying this? It's been out on every electronic device for years and still it's selling enough to go into the top ten?
Very few people will buy death stranding as a gift but the others in the top 10 all fit with Christmas pressies. Does this list include games with console bundles too?
Best Star Wars game since KotOR and Trilla Suduri is one of the better characters I've seen in the Star Wars universe for a long while.
After finishing the story in Death Stranding last night all i can do is shake my head, people are missing out on a masterpiece, one hell of an experience and just an all round great game!
@MightyDemon82
We must have played different games. Story-wise it's the dumbest game I have ever played. Kojima relies on "Sam I have to tell you something" mechanics through the entire story.
You are thrown into a world that is never explained, and expected to be surprised at twists that means nothing to you, because relationships are never explained (until the last five minutes of the story). Why am I casually chatting with the president? Play 40 hours to find out.
At one stage the game explicitly says you're now playing the final boss fight. But the game carries on for another few hours after that, with no end in sight. It literally shows end credits on two occasions, hours apart.
An absolute visual masterpiece but story-wise it beyond amateur.
Nice to see Minectaft up there. That game deserves some recognition 😉
@LiamCroft i was more thinking of you guys give us sales charts from scandinavia, finland, franch, germany, poland, italy, spain etc
@RogerRoger I am playing Fallen Order and Need for Speed Heat. Enjoying both games but.......no micro transactions in either game ( yet ) . What's happening??? 🤔🤔😉
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@mantralux - Did you ignore all the emails and interviews? The whole what and why of the world is emailed to you across the entire game, as well as explained in interviews and cut scenes.
As for having to play for 40 hours to find out why you're talking to the president is utter nonsense, your relationship with both the president and Amelie is literally the first thing you find out right at the start of the game.
@Shigurui
I read a normal amount I would say. Not everything, but maybe a third of what was lazily sent over as rewards for delivering 32kg of photography equipment to a hologram in the mountains.
I'm not playing a game to read emails. If the story can't be adequately conveyed by character interactions then something must have gone wrong in the script.
I finished the game so I obviously don't think the game was bad overall. But anyone claiming that the storyline was brilliant must suffer from serious delusions.
@RogerRoger it's not just that but when you read or see reviews that give it a high score but they still throw words around like "Monotonous game play" or say things like "The games story doesn't get interesting until 10-15 hours in" then that's going to put a lot of people off even with a high score, a lot of people don't have the time now a days to sink 10 hours into a game before it get's good not when there are so many other great games on the market too
i said it before but Kojima is a genius but he needs someone to reign him in in order to keep his vision focused and he didn't have that here and as much as i love Kojimas games even I couldn't get into this one because it was just plain boring even with it's all star cast
@JoeBlogs
Please don't make the mistake of believing that the quality of storytelling is 100% subjective.
@JoeBlogs It would be like me saying the graphics in Death Stranding are awful. It's objectively not correct.
I have predicted 15th spot, doing better than expected. It seems the game came and went by in a blink of an eye. There was potential tho, bad execution.
Shenmue in at 17, well I guess its expected. Ill be getting the dlc to throw more money their way, hoping not 18 years till the next one!
@RogerRoger The only "new" thing was the online social features, other than that it is just a fancy triple AAA walking simulator simulator with a good story. Hideo really did not invent new genre or anything close to it. The gameplay mechanics were jerky as well, most of them felt unfinished or unpolished. Still the best walking simulator if you enjoy walking simulators. Sadly, walking simulators are cliche in the market, so Hideo shot himself in a foot with this one.
@ApostateMage Isn't she just? Her storyline was a very pleasant surprise. I totally get why EA were so cagey about spoilers, despite some of the revelations being advertised so blatantly by certain characters. On ten-foot billboards. In neon.
@Dobbos One new EA game without microtransactions is a curiosity, but two...? Surely a sign of the End Times!
@FullbringIchigo There is that element as well, yeah. Let me be totally clear, though; to see Death Stranding chart so high for a fortnight, and for it to still be thirteenth, is what I'd call a huge success, particularly during the annual Gaming Silly Season. I'm not here to criticise, or label anything a failure.
But there was an inherent danger in giving out so many vague answers to pre-release questions for so long. It worked when Mr. Kojima did it for Metal Gear because there was an established coherence to that franchise, a pre-existing knowledge of what to expect; the fun came from the unique weirdness weaved throughout each game. Death Stranding, meanwhile, is totally new and that confuses people when you're deliberately non-committal and evasive.
"What's your new game about?" "Making connections." "Okay, so it's a LEGO game, then?" "No, it's about delivering packages." "Oh, so it's thirty hours of fetch quests?" "No. Here, watch this esoteric twelve-minute trailer that I've been told to release, it'll explain everything." "Sure... right, that explained nothing. What else you got?" "That's it. You'll have to spend £60 during a crowded launch window to find out for yourself."
Fans of entertainment media don't really like living in the information age; we all know too much too quickly, and are nearly incapable of being surprised as a result. I'm not advocating that every game (or film, or television show, or book) should spill all of its secrets on the cover, but when you're specifically trying to introduce something brand new, something that defies classification (so many reviews have noted that Death Stranding "has no genre" or that it "creates its own genre") then you have to describe it in a clear, engaging way for all potential customers. That's just Marketing #101.
Slapping a well-respected name on the box whilst laser-scanning a bunch of celebrity faces will only get you so far in the charts, it seems. I really hope it features in a lot of Black Friday sales, or post-holiday ones, so that more of us can try it and discuss it for what it actually is.
@mantralux Saying the storytelling is dumb or bad is also incorrect. Objectively speaking.
As far as the narrative goes the game's story doesn't suffer from very many, if any, plot holes.
Everything is explained, with most things appearing in cutscenes, and other lore and worldbuilding questions explained in emails and interviews.
Lore and worldbuilding is not part of a narrative. It isn't really storytelling either, it's part of the setting, and had this been a movie or book the lore wouldn't be explored much at all. It's interesting, but that interest is subjective.
What isn't is that any questions are answered.
Any game that has lore and worldbuilding has reading that must be done.
Thematically the game is brilliant. It's a story about connections you have to meet the story half way to bridge the connection. That's the first step on the journey, and after that first step you decide what you want to take away from it.
Is it a commentary on our isolated post-modern society desperately clinging to an old world washed away by time and sterilized by technology?
Yeah.
Is it a moral that teaches you the value of a journey VS the sometimes disappointing result?
Absolutely. After all if all you care about is the result you will never reach the truth.
Is it an optimistic look at how human beings working together can conquer impossible odds?
Yes absolutely.
This game picks up where Metal Gear left off... Over 4 times... We've all heard that the future is what we make it, the genes don't define the man, and your life is what you make of it.
Except in Metal Gear we never really experience that. We are always fighting someone else's war, but in Death Stranding we are trying to make things better for everyone, by making bridges, connecting people to the network, and making connections with the real people that play the game.
I'm sorry you didn't get anything out of it, but your assessment that the story is objectively bad, is objectively wrong.
@Bamila You're brave! Best of luck with the game's many fans and defenders, even if it sounds like you kinda enjoyed it regardless...?
@Constable_What
Talk about reading 100x more into the story than what Kojima actually wrote. This is all a nice interpretation of yours, but it's not what was presented to most people over the course of 40-100+ hours.
Lines like "Because I'm Fragile. But I'm not that fragile." could have been excused if it wasn't for the fact that she says it at least three times in the main storyline as far as I counted. And lines like "Mario and Princess Beach" are ridiculous, at best.
And hey, Mr Die-Hardman's real name was John McClane. Brilliant writing. He was also called Die-Hardman when he was a soldier because...and let me get this right...Unger saved him many times so he was hard to kill...so he's Die-Hardman. Ok. He then goes undercover with the president but using the same nickname he had before that. Ok...
And hey, Heartman has something wrong with his heart. His heart is also actually heart-shaped. And he lives by a lake that is shaped like a heart. Brilliant writing! looks into camera and gives you 20 likes
And Fragile's plotline the entire story was to find out why Higgs betrayed her. That is handled offscreen for some reason, and when Sam asks her at the end why he betrayed her she gives a complete non-answer. Brilliant writing.
"But you didn't pay attention to every single details for 40+ hours, including the emails" is not an excuse for bad writing. Most people are confused as to major plot mechanics. Is that their fault or the fault of the person writing it?
@mantralux some people just want to play a game and i get that, but if you pay attention to every detail and read all the emails /data logs this games story couldn't have been anymore fleshed out.
@MightyDemon82
So you're saying there are no plot holes in Death Stranding?
@mantralux let's not argue, i liked the game i rate it up there with titles like RDR2, the last of Us, Nier Automata as one of MY personal favourites. i'm a huge lover of all things Japanese so alot of the things you found cringy in DS wouldn't be out of place in an Anime/Manga and they made me chuckle.
@mantralux The game is literally about connections, and if you didn't make that connection is not an excuse to claim that writing is bad. What Kojima intended is irrelevant. See Death of the Author for more clarification on interpreting literature.
Way to deflect from your original grievance. So the story is bad because of two lines of dialogue (That's a Fallacy of Composition, by the way), and something that is explained in a cutscene as well.
The Die-Hard Man arc is a contrivance at best, seeing as how Deadman, the President, and Heartman DO NOT trust him (They make efforts to subvert him every step of the way). Every single character has some part of their past that they cling onto to their detriment. Die-Hard Man kept his moniker, and it made the connections he made fragile.
Heartman is a little on the nose, but it works. The man has a broken heart. Get it? Good.
He's also the most generous, and the most compassionate of all the characters. The story did a good job of showing that he's trustworthy, kind, and that he cares. There is a reason you meet him in person at the final stretch.
To show that there's overwhelming optimism in the world. It works really well.
Higgs does most of his actions off screen. That character arc is not meant for Sam. It's meant for Fragile. She doesn't answer you, sure. That's frustrating, but there is a reason for it, and it makes sense for her not to tell Sam.
She's Fragile. She smiles to hide her pain, she regrets sacrificing her body, she's a broken person, and she the one things that isn't broken is her connection with Sam. Whatever she did to Higgs is for her.
I don't know if you've played any of Kojima's other games, but the dialogue is always silly in moments. It's to be expected when one of your inspirations is David Lynch... It's a stylistic choice that's been very consistent in all of Kojima's works. They're weird, boomerific, slightly cringy.
There isn't any shame in asking for a different perspective on what the story means. It means different things for different people, but just because you don't like something doesn't mean there is something objectively wrong with it. The game is about making connections, and part of it is asking other players for help, so if you neglect that as a player then yeah that is your fault.
So in that respect. Glad I could help you understand Death Stranding a bit more. Have a like!
@Constable_What
Listen. I've never seen someone so desperately try to defend bad writing in my life as you are doing here. From the use of recently-Googled technical terms to recommending further reading. You're like a Lost fan, trying to shoehorn explanations into a subpar storyline that was clearly made up on a whim.
"So the story is bad because of two lines of dialogue"
No, because of 40+ hours of poorly written dialogue. Not just two lines.
"Heartman is a little on the nose, but it works. The man has a broken heart. Get it?"
Everything in Death Stranding is on the nose, which is my point. You're not sitting on some unique insight into the game - we all got what Kojima attempted to do. Everything from connections to naming convention of characters. The analogies and messaging wasn't as complex as you make it out to be.
The problem is that the storyline is bad. The lines are amateurish. Kojima introduced visuals that he never explains (why is there a baby in Sam's stomach when he dies? or do I have to sludge through hours of "emails" and "interviews" [supplemental storyline] to find out?)
"I don't know if you've played any of Kojima's other games, but the dialogue is always silly in moments."
Yes, because he's an awful writer. Brilliant game designer and visionary, but awful writer. As evidenced by Death Stranding.
So in that respect, glad I could help you understand why Death Stranding is objectively a poorly written story packaged in an exceptional visual package.
@LN78 True, sorry about that.
@mantralux Wow. I mean I don't know what else to say to help you understand.
You've done absolutely nothing to show how it's objectively bad writing other than saying it's bad. Which does not make it so.
I also never said the story was complex either. I see you're putting words in my mouth because you lack a cohesive argument. As a matter of fact I think you're the only one that's said the story is hard to understand. You should stop projecting your ineptitudes on me.
I clearly do not share them.
Why is he an awful writer? Describe why he's awful in your own words. You can cherry pick examples all day, but unless you can put your thoughts into words your argument falls really flat. When you're wanting to convince someone of something it helps when you're consistent in what you're arguing.
40+ hours of poorly written dialogue is completely untrue. Even by corniness standards.
Just look at the Cliff flashbacks! Those were very well written and acted!
So far you've jumped from storytelling, but you conflated it with worldbuilding and lore (you haven't told me what that's bad), to the dialogue (it's bad because it's corny right? That's not logical or objective. That's a matter of taste. A lack of logic would be for them to say something that doesn't make sense within the context of the world that the story is set in).
Why is the baby in Sam's stomach? Is it? I interpreted that as an abstraction on Sam's part, like when he sees Deadman's head on BB. It's like he's waking up from a dream. Kojima isn't the only one to utilize visualizations like that... Or do you have a problem with Stanley Kubrick, Neil Druckmann, David Lynch, or Danny Boyle? That isn't anything new in storytelling. Why are you confused by that?
"So in that respect, glad I could help you understand why Death Stranding is objectively a poorly written story packaged in an exceptional visual package."
This is very telling. You probably think you're very clever rehashing what I've wrote to suit your own narrative.
You'd be mistaken, because this shows your lack of creativity, and the fact that you seem to have to latch on to something else in order to even attempt to make an objective argument.
Which you haven't. There's nothing objective about what you wrote because you've answered none of your own questions, and yet you're demanding that everyone agree on your perspective. That's not objective. Come on now.
You say that the writing is objectively bad because you don't like it, and that is not how objectivism works.
To be objective you need to follow logic, and your argument relies on fallacies, and the dismissal of fundemental standards in the critique of the written word.
Do you need to understand that to be a critique?
Absolutely not.
Do you need that understanding to say you're being objective.
Yes. You absolutely need all of the available information to make an objective assessment.
You can't solve a logical math problem (you're finding an objective answer after all in logical mathematics) without having all of the numbers.
It's perfectly fine if you don't like something, but that doesn't mean it's objective criticism.
If you want a lesson in objective criticism at its best take a look at a YouTuber named Mauler. He does an excellent job.
Also, looking up the definition of "objective" on Google might also help. Say what you will about my supposed "recently-Googled- technical terms" (lol) , but if I did do that I would have at least done due diligence before looking foolish using a word I don't really understand.
And that's where I'll end this. Have a nice day.
@LN78
I've done it. I would have done it before, but I hadn't Googled how to do it yet! >:3
Is too pricey still! In a few weeks it might be a bit cheaper.
@Constable_What
"You've done absolutely nothing to show how it's objectively bad writing"
I've literally given you multiple examples.
"I also never said the story was complex either. I see you're putting words in my mouth because you lack a cohesive argument."
You tried explaining the underlying themes to me as if you were sitting on some unique insight into the complexity of a story that is simply not that complicated.
"Why is he an awful writer?"
Because he writes objectively awful lines like "I'm Fragile but I'm not that fragile" and evidently thinks this line is so brilliant and key to the story that he has included it at least three times in the script. That is one example of many.
"Just look at the Cliff flashbacks! Those were very well written and acted!"
Acting is not my criticism. Writing is. Nothing wrong with the acting.
"Is it? I interpreted that as an abstraction on Sam's part"
...so why does he have scars on his stomach that hints at something being taken out of him?
"You probably think you're very clever rehashing what I've wrote to suit your own narrative."
No I am just showing you how silly that position is to take, by using the same mechanics against you. I am glad we both agree that this was a silly attempt at some internet win for you.
Here's the problem: you're a Kojima fanboy that has clearly invested too much time into this game. In order for you to feel like that time was well spent you need to defend the game even if you know it was poorly written (or "corny" as you put it). You will stop at nothing, overreaching into erroneously comparing Kojima to Kubrick. It's clear you have a weak grasp of cinema in general, and an awful grasp of cinematic storytelling specifically.
At no point in this discussion have you actually provided a coherent argument as to why Death Stranding's story was "brilliant". All you have done is provide faux interpretations, pretending that Death Stranding offers something more than it does.
The fact remains: the story is objectively poorly written. I know you don't like my examples since they prove my point, but I didn't write "Mario and Princess Beach" - your idol did.
You can excuse this tar pit of a story all you want, but we both know the story and the script are mediocre at best. It's the dumbest storyline I have ever played in a game by a mile, and most people found it both corny and unclear.
There are dozens of plot holes, and you have chosen to ignore them all in order to defend wasting 100+ hours into a game written by someone with the storytelling skills of a three year old.
@mantralux I have to agree with you about Kojima's writing. I'll still most likely pick up death stranding at some point, but I'm not looking forward to all the self indulgent BS he's laced it with. I think a lot of people feel that way and that's why it's struggling - when you take away the Metal Gear gameplay, what's left is a whole lot less appealing and the narative shortcomings are that much harder to overlook.
I think all the ass kissing Kojima has received just adds to the problem as he's started to believe his own hype.
@mantralux
You've yet to point out a single plot hole! There's no facts at all in your argument. You've only cherry picked a handful of examples of "bad" dialogue while simultaneously trying to insult me and label me as delusional and a fanboy.
Where are the other examples of bad dialogue then? You've had plenty of opportunities to give more examples, but you've repeated the same ones, and only those.
That's the Fallacy of Composition. It's the attempt at trying to refute the whole by way of a couple examples.
Know you know. You're welcome.
Alright let's go over his scars... Also use the damn spoiler tag you've been asked already!
...so why does he have scars on his stomach that hints at something being taken out of him?
Answer:
That's a side effect from repatriation. It's a scar from when a BT tries to connect to Sam's "umbilical cord", you get more scars and handprints if you die a lot to BTs. Which is how Sam makes Voidouts.
Now on to your obvious deflection about the flashbacks.
You've yet to say why those segments are poorly written. 40+ hours of gameplay. That's part of it.
Where is it?
I have provided a reason why the thematic (I can spell the word out for you if you like) storytelling is brilliant yes. I even clarified that in my first post.
Thematically yes. I have provided reasons why.
While you're Googling what being objective is, maybe you should also Google how to read as well. It couldn't hurt.
Where are the plot holes? You've typed so much, and you've only given me three you thought were plot holes. Dozens you say? You've counted?
Well you say you're so objective, right?
You've been flat out misrepresenting what I'm saying. You're even cherry picking my points and taking things out of context.
Like this: "You've done absolutely nothing to show how it's objectively bad writing"
And what did I say:
"You've done absolutely nothing to show how it's objectively bad writing other than saying it's bad. Which does not make it so."
Repeating the script verbatim is not an argument. You're just presenting information and saying "Yeah, this right here. It's bad."
What about this?
"You probably think you're very clever rehashing what I've wrote to suit your own narrative."
Ahhh. I see you conveniently left out where I explain myself.
Here it is:
"This is very telling. You probably think you're very clever rehashing what I've wrote to suit your own narrative.
You'd be mistaken, because this shows your lack of creativity, and the fact that you seem to have to latch on to something else in order to even attempt to make an objective argument."
My point was that you don't provide any arguments. You just rely information and say, "Yeah, this right here. It's bad." It's not creative. It lacks critical thinking.
Now here's where you stop being objective:
"Because he writes objectively awful lines like "I'm Fragile but I'm not that fragile" and evidently thinks this line is so brilliant and key to the story that he has included it at least three times in the script. That is one example of many."
In response to me:
"Why is he an awful writer?"
How do you know that he thought it was brilliant? Assumptions are not logical, and therefore, not objective...
Also... How is that line objectively bad?
Is it cliché?
How can it be when a line like that really hasn't been uttered at any time?
Does it not make sense?
You and I both know it makes sense.
Her name is Fragile, but she isn't that Fragile.
If she says it more than twice, then I think I'm safe in saying it's a mantra... She's been through a lot after all.
Look up what objective means. I'd post it for you, but you seem to dislike me, you're very emotional, and you're better off hearing from a source rather than me.
No hard feelings. My girlfriend and I very much enjoy the game. That might be a reason, but I've never claimed to be objective about the game. I just claimed to know that you aren't, and I have proved that sufficiently by your own words within context.
I also urge you to find someone to share your life with so you're not so angry. I wish you all the best.
(Assumptions aren't very nice. They're certainly not objective).
I really will be ending my part in the discussion here (I promise this time). This positive feedback loop has become unenjoyable. (I actually did not have to Google that. lol. That's what studying and conversing about psychology gets you. :3)
Death Stranding has a brilliant story and the cutscenes have me glued to the TV. Such an amazing game and the best open world I've experienced this generation by some distance, it's just so much more interactive than the usual hold forward until you're at the yellow dot we normally get. Then you have everyone making a clear impact on the world with all the natural paths forming throughout the terrain as everyone is exploring and of course each others structures and roads. Me, I'm on chapter 5 so I'm setting up some quicker than usual routes to zip around hard to reach places
@Constable_What - That is NOT how Sam got his scars, not even remotely close. From @mantralux missing the reveal of the relationship between Sam and the president at the start of the game and your reason for the scarring, which is shown quite clearly at the end of the game I'm wondering if either of you paid much attention to the story.
Damn this thread is a longer read than the game.
That being said, no matter how good you may think the game actually is, a trailer of gameplay and description makes it sound boring AF. That's why it's dropping so fast.
@Gumbopudding the constant hate it receives and people falsely and repeatedly calling it a walking simulator doesn't help either.
If ever a game needed a demo then this is the one. It should definitely offer a try before you buy for anyone that has doubts about it. I think a lot of people would buy it if they got to play a decent sized demo.
@Shigurui
I haven't gotten all the way to the end of the game yet, but I killed myself a bunch of times to see what happens and I noticed it.
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