Topic: PS4 games have reached a new incredible level

@BAMozzy

Companies like EA and Activision are releasing fewer games a year

I don't see that as a problem really, if other players fill the void. And they do.

As for Souls games - they have been around since Demon Souls and just because Bloodborne was a success, its routes go back to 2009 PS3's Demon Souls. Dark Souls 1 and 2 were also last gen games.

Like I said, outside of their original series. I'm talking about stuff like Hollow Knight, Nioh, The Surge, etc.

There were a LOT of true Indie games on XB360 - not just the 'Arcade' like games but Indies costing less than £1 on XB360 with as much diversity, probably more so than today - which tends to be a lot of 16bit era games - not always 16bit era visuals but game-play.

We have way more diversity in indie games now. There's more indie games now, and I was arguing that in this gen these indies can be bigger, which is something we didn't see before. Games like Senua amd The Witness pretty much increased what indie games can be.

Card games were around - Magic the gathering for example.

We've seen a huge change in card game video games. Magic is a regular card game, which got ported to Xbox 360. That's different from what we've been seeing since the rise of Hearthstone. So, why it is a new genre:

• Card games like Hearthstone, Gwent standalone, Shadowverse, Spellweaver, etc. are new card games, that didn't exist as a real life card game before.
• They have features that wouldn't be realistically possible in real life card games. Take for instance the Create option in Gwent, it allows you to create a random card from a certain type, that you don't have in your deck. Or the option to clone cards, etc.

Xbox 360/PS3 had Magic, which... was one card game - that already existed in real life. We now have a whole genre.

Metroid games were around too - maybe you really didn't bother with the indie/arcade market but there was hundreds of games and they had their roots in games like Metroid

I have really trouble coming up with those actually. I can think of Shadow Complex, which was alright, and Guacemelee, but that was more of a cross-gen release - as it released on PS3 in 2013 and got immediately ported to PS4 once that released.

But then there's this generation: Apotheon, Axiom Verge, Dust, Ori and the Blind Forest 1 and 2, Forma.8, Guacemelee 1 and 2, Iconoclasts, Headlander, Hue, Salt and Sanctuary, Steamworld Dig 1 and 2, Song of the Deep, Teslagrad, Xeodrifter, Bloodstained, Owlboy and the list goes on...

The genre has definitely made a revival. And the fact that you could play Shadow Complex on your Xbox 360... well... We've had more than 4 times as much Skylanders games, a series that you will argue has disappeared, then we've had Metroidvania games on PS3/Xbox 360.

2D platforming, tower defence, Physics based, walking sims, narrative story games - basically if you wanted to play it, there is a game on last gen

A game.

Games like Guitar Hero, Skylanders, Dance/fitness/Party games and a lot of other games that utilised motion controls etc have disappeared too although some did release on this gen - while they maybe are not missed, they added to the diversity.

There was a Guitar Hero game, Rock Band game, a Skylanders game, a Just Dance game. Just not a new one in the series every year, which is a good thing. I mean, if you want to make an argument that last gen was a better gen because we had a Guitar Hero game every year... then I don't know why we're even having this discussion.

Also, there have been games in the party genre plenty. Keep Talking Nobody Explodes, Jackbox Pack, That's You, Sportfriends, etc. etc.

Activision released 3 games in 2018 - two of which are remasters (Spyro and Crash), the other being CoD - and an expansion to Destiny 2 of course. in 2012, they released more than 15 (although 15 were on XB360). All you have to do is look at the games EA or Activision released in the five years before this gen and the five years after and you will see LOTS of big name games that have disappeared - as well as numerous other one offs, licenced games (007, Harry Potter, X-Men etc).

I think you're contradicting yourself here. First you complained there were too many sequels this gen in comparison to last generation, and now you're stating the fact that EA is making less sequels as a reason this gen is less diverse?

Anyway, objectively more games are releasing every year this generation than last. PS4 gets more games than PS3, Steam gets more new games in 2018 then 2014, etc. So, whether a few companies are putting out less games than before, doesn't really matter in the grander scheme of things.

This gen may have taken some games to new levels but the core is still not new. The Witcher 3 is one of the best games this gen and better than last gen games but its still not entirely new to have an open world RPG with sword combat. Its set apart because of the writing and the quality of its side quests. I love the game and its definitely in my top games of all time but its more 'evolutionary' than revolutionary - after all we had Skyrim, Dragon Age etc last gen... Point is, you could play the equivalent on last gen and more - just maybe not as evolved as they are today. Just because the Witcher changed more than most, doesn't mean that the game was revolutionary in its game-play but proved that Side Quests didn't have to be yet another filler and could have more significance.

But it doesn't matter whether it was revolutionary, what matters more is if the game is excellent. And the game is excellent, and way better than it's predecessor. And that's why I brought it up!

@JohnnyShoulder Of course Anthem and No Way Out are 'original' games and I gave no issue with sequels in general but what I don't want is 'just' sequels and remasters. EA in general and Activision in particular though are releasing 'fewer' games and a lot of the games that are releasing from these are games that offer relatively easy ways to monetise additional content - even if it is 'cosmetic only' and that plays into their design.

Arguably Anthem is EA's Destiny - different enough maybe not to be too similar but you wouldn't be surprised if the Execs said they wanted a Destiny type game - a game that is predominantly online with options to add MTX as people will want to look different when playing with others. Something that can rake in billions on MTX's and expansions... Not complaining if its enjoyable and it is a game I want.

Sequels themselves can be good - the games generally get sequels because they sell and are popular. There is a reason that gamers get excited at the announcement of a game based on just a title because its a recognised franchise. I know that new IP's can be a hard sell because people don't know what to expect, whether they will like the game, the story, the characters etc. I know this generation has had quite a few new IP's too - Destiny being one - even if that also released on last gen too. It seems though that they are fewer are further between than we had last gen. Sony seem to be the ones that are more willing to push new IP's than any other - I know that a lot of Devs made 'sequels' at the start but, seem to be diversifying now - H:ZD instead of another Killzone, Ghost of Tsushima instead of another Infamous. I am sure that both GG and SP could have made another game in those franchises, may yet do in the future, but at least are adding to their diversity, their portfolio. If CoD collapses, Activsion would be in a bad way - most of their studios are involved with CoD, whether its that game or the next 2 in various development phases. Their share-price dropped when BO4 only made £500m because that was down on BO3. They don't have a plethora of other games in development that could become the 'next' big thing or even to keep bringing in money because they are relying on just a 1 or 2 games to do that This year, the only 'new' game they released was CoD:BO4 with two remasters (Crash & Spyro) - as well as the expansion to last years D2 which cost as much as a game but both Destiny and CoD are bringing in over £2bn in MTX a year so if they 'collapse', Activision could well be screwed.

My point though was about the fact that we have sequels and remasters with fewer and fewer new IP's and that leads to less diversity. That wasn't saying that sequels and remasters aren't good games but that we had more range of choice. Some of that may well be down to motion controls too which allowed for more diversity. As someone else said, this gen has been more 'iterative' improvements rather than a revolution but I also feel its more 'streamlined' because those genres that were perhaps not as popular as others have tended to disappear from the mainstream market. FPS games were popular last gen and to a degree are this too, but we had more competition in this sector.

I am not complaining about the games this gen - there is more than enough releases that I want to and can play in the time I have. I just think that the range of games available is not as broad as it was last gen. The point of my original post was more to say that if we were to consider what era had the most diverse range of games, last gen beats this gen at this point in time. As for popularity, with the Wii selling over 100m and both the 360 and PS3 selling 80m each - albeit over a longer time than this gen, then it seems that consoles were also very popular... Again not to say that this gen won't reach those figures - PS4 is certainly doing well and should surpass the PS3 but Xbox isn't and as U said, the Wii was incredibly popular.

There isn't anything fundamentally wrong with the games we have this gen, that wasn't the point - but when you look at the plethora of original titles, diversity of genres and range of games within those, at this point in time, the options were much more vast. In terms of FPS games, it seems the strong survived and the less popular vanished and its not as if all of these were 'clones' of CoD with each having its own unique mechanic or USP. We had games like Bulletstorm, Vanquish, Crysis, BioShock, Left 4 Dead, Resistance, Borderlands, Spec-Ops: the Line, MoH, Brothers in Arms, FEAR, Singularity, Mirrors Edge, Metro etc as well as games like CoD, BF, Halo and Killzone. There was more diversity within the genres too as everyone of these had their own identity and quirk - maybe less with games like MoH which almost became EA's CoD. BF as we know is 'different' to CoD in a lot of ways despite being a military FPS game. There was more choice in Arcade racers - whether you liked games like Burnout, wipeout, Motorstorm, blur or PGR. We also had more RTS, more RPGs, just more diverse games in general - Enslaved, Brutal Legend, Shadows of the Damned, Lost Odyssey... I could go on and I am sure you could think of games that are no longer with us or genres as fully represented as they were before. Maybe the card and walking sim games are more prolific now which may have been limited to magic the gathering or some poker/pontoon indie game but so many of todays big releases are evolved last gen games and by evolved, I mean in the way that they would have evolved whether this gen was here or not - the sequel that had to do a bit more than the last game type evolution rather than something that the hardware itself suddenly enabled that wasn't done before - which is where Battle Royale comes in because they couldn't give you 100 people on a server with maps that vast either. Battlefield's big leap was the fact that they could now give you the 64player battles that PC gamers had been able to enjoy.

The Witcher 3 maybe a big jump up from 2 in terms of scale and design, going open world like Elder Scrolls, but not falling into the trap of side quests for filler purposes but more thought and better writing - the same writing that main stories were afforded.The main difference between last gen and this though is the better streaming which allowed more data to load in ready for when you moved across the map - far less narrow pathways or door openings that hid the next sections loading - now they can be much more 'open' with much less dead areas and loading every time you enter a building. Whilst this is related to the hardware - its led to more quality of life improvements than 'new' revolutionary games - although Destiny could be classed as revolutionary - but that also was possible on last gen hardware as proven by its simultaneous 360/PS3 release - as that also put real players into your game on their own path way rather than being their because you invited them and opened up the 'games as a service' market where these games can be expanded and change over time rather than just add new maps to the MP pool.

Anyway, that's my thoughts and opinion - I appreciate that others may not agree and whilst there isn't as many games (yet) released on current gen, I feel there is a higher percentage of remasters and sequels than new games as well as more indie/arcade games that also help push the number of games released up - not that there is anything wrong with that but the last gen had more diversity and more new franchises born that gave us more variety within genres too as well as creating something we hadn't yet had or really adding something 'new' to the mix that separated it from anything else before it that transformed it from say an FPS into more of a horror survival (like Bioshock) or RPG MP (like CoD4).

This gen has been a watershed. My old games look like relics and most if not all genres of games have been improved and new genres have emerged. There are new issues I don't like at all - this is predominantly the always connected nature of our society and how capitalists want to make money from it.

That aside Rocket League is a better multiplayer game than SF2 or Super Bomberman. I never ever thought I would write that. Pro Evo 2019 is a better game than Pes 4 again I would never have thought that possible last gen. God of War beats up Ocarina of Time. Wipeout Omega collection is the best future racing game. I've been sat in a chair my hands stuck in a contraption in statik. I've been a wanted man by the Japanese mafia in Yakuza. I've had a sex change and hunted robot dinosaurs in HZD and Ive fultoned thousands of soldiers and gave them a slap in mgs5. They even thanked me for it.

Everything has come together. The acting, graphics, sound, artistry and immersion.