Media Molecule's E3 2018 Dreams Live Musical Performance Sure Is Something

Dreams never stops to impress me. I hope Media Molecule releases the beta this year.

Controversial opinion but...

I think it would be best not to release Dreams as a commercial video game at this point, instead release it as something else.

Now hear me out on this.

In addition to being a tough sell to consumers it will require a certain creative mindset.

To this end, I think attaching a higher price, and assuming its user friendly which it should be if its going to be a game, a licensing it out not as a game but as middleware will not only yield higher returns from licensing to developers, but add another game engine into the world for people to use.

A game engine for the artistic visions people cant realise in Unreal, Unity, GMS etc. Without extensive reworking or making their own engines outright, is very much welcome in my eyes.

Plus the money coming in would be excellent if they could get it to catch on.

Then as a result, we the consumers get more games professionally made using Dreams.

Thats just my opinion anyway

@Knuckles-Fajita you haven't even played it.

@CK97 Evidently not. Have you?

Did you even read my comment?

The idea of this game, is to create. It is more engine than tangible game as we consumers know it.

Its a very creative piece of software to develop and create things with. Sure that can be a consumer product but...Imagine letting people from Remedy or the developers of Katamari loose with this?

I am not saying Dreams is a bad idea, but I do wonder if it would be better served, have greater impact and better reception not as a game, but an engine for developers.

What that needed...was more cowbell.

Okay this is cool, can't wait to see all the good users generated levels/music/vr

@Knuckles-Fajita I think at this point it would gain too much negative PR to take away the commercial side. Think Rayman Legends on the Wii U when it was complete but held off so it could release with all platforms a few months later. Except, surprise! This game we’ve been talking about for years is just going to be for developers only. It would feel like they were flipping off their community.

@ztpayne7 Perhaps doing both is best then.

That way, the game can live on as an engine, which is what it seemingly is leaning towards with flexibility, but it comes out as a game for those interested.

I just think it's in the best interests of the product to make it a developer tool. Longer lasting and full potential reached that way.

@Knuckles-Fajita

I'm nto exactly sure w'ere on the same page but I've been thinking for about a month now they can't simply release this as a $60 retail game. There needs to be something different. I mean let's face it they are NEVER going to recoup the cost of a 6 year development cycle anyway, so might as well try something different. Not sure if they should make it free-to-start, sell the single player for $20 like the Octolings and give the creation tools away for free, or the other way around. OR charge for web portal access, or make if part of PS+, maybe sell it for $60 on PS4 but give it away w/ PS+ on PS5 like Driveclub was supposed to be. But this fails as a $60 retail release. And it's taken so long might as well wait 3 months until it's $30 like The Last Guardian. Maybe bundle it w/ PSVR 2.

But if they just stick it on a shelf next to RDR2 or Ghosts or anything else for $60 I don't see it doing well. Needs something.

Or maybe Media Molecule should just become an orchestra at this point rather than a game developer b/c it's been at least 5 years they've been working on this 1 game and they couldn't even get the beta out in 2016 like they wanted to.

https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2015/07/media_molecule_dreaming_up_dreams_beta_trial_for_ps4

https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2017/06/e3_2017_where_the_hell_is_media_molecules_dreams

I'm not sure how they even show their faces in public when the beta is delayed for 2 years.

@get2sammyb So is Google Docs, Unity, Unreal Engine 4, GitHub, your point?

Notice how I am NOT saying DONT release it as a game.

I am saying dont release it ONLY as a game.

@get2sammyb No, and no.

Firstly in many game engines, platform specific publishing, and various features, are paid for things. So no, not saying it should be free.

Nor am I saying it should cost more as a game.

I am saying to NOT release it ONLY as a game. That means release it as a game, for whatever price they will release it for, but then unleash it's full potential as middleware for the usual higher fee that middleware commands for.

See what I'm saying?

Let me break it down real simple.

Current Plan - Release game. $60. Let community create.

My Idea - Release game. $60. Let community create. AND release as engine, whatever price, let developers create games in it, more exposure for Dreams, more games made in Dreams, more people experience dreams.

@get2sammyb Well, I'm saying have the retail game be a kind of LittleBigPlanet experience, but the back end tools be expanded upon for licensed use.

Think of it like Unreal Engine. That started as a custom engine for a single game, kind of like this. Then the engine expanded in scope and became widely adopted.

So let's say Dreams starts as a game where you can create what you want, and MM sends it out to other SIE developers to make games in and release, and it grows from there.

That'd be a lot more desirable, and interesting from my end, than a simple retail release.

But that may just be my desire to not see an idea go to waste. After all, products like this happen all the time. Look at Super Mario Maker, or the aforementioned Unreal. Sure Mario Maker was the reverse of the situation, but it works both ways.

@Neolit I was trying to work it out as I watched it. Seemed like most of it was pre-recorded (drums, main melodies etc) and most of the ds4 twiddling was probably altering effects in real-time. Then the rest of it was improvised ds4 button presses mapped to the right scale for the track (you could see that on the screens) so it didn’t sound out of tune.

@get2sammyb There's going to be an inevitable limit to that however. At what point would that become too overwhelming and more so, at what point does it become less interesting to gamers and more to engineers?

I really really hope some talented individual recreates the Mos Eisley Cantina scene in this.

@get2sammyb @Knuckles-Fajita I think the only thing that would “possibly satisfy” both sides is if there was a commercial version of the game and then a “locked” version of the same game for businesses that would certify none of the assets used in the game was created by someone else. It could be more expensive but the plus side is that it would also come with an Interface that would make it possible to publish and charge for the game on the PlayStation store (with approval from Sony). They would have the same tools as the community, plus the tools for publication.

@rjejr I have seen their work i applaud these brilliant developers. So please go away with this bull. Yeah i have never seen something like this on this scale. It looks brilliant day one sale i never did this building games stuff but this looks to good to pass on.

I just want this game already! 😩 More recently I've been really wanting to create music. I installed the FL Studio demo but you can't even save anything and it really doesn't let you do much for a demo so I've been hoping this would release soon!

@Mergatro1d haha yes!

Continued to be impressed by what media molecule is doing. Hopefully we get a release date before the year is out.
Wishful thinking: early next year
Most likely: Fall of next year
Hopefully not: 2020

We sure are getting a lot of these little demos of the game in action. You’ve gotta think it’s close to being ready.

@ArkhamKnerd to create music there are many applications available for a PC which even allow midi input etc. Some of those apps are even free.

Back in the day there were quite a few Games Creators for the 8Bit computers. Utilities such as GAC (Graphic Adventure Creator), PAW (professional adventure writer) and The Quill allowed you to make fully functioning text adventures which, in turn, were allowed to be sold as retail games as long as the utility used was referenced. It'd be great if MM would pick some of the games that are to be created with Dreams and allow them to sold as retail games. If users of Dreams knew there was a possibility to make some money from their hours of painstaking games design then it'd be a great incentive for people to really start creating something special.

I for one am really looking forward to Dreams. I thought LittleBigPlanet was great, but, this just looks like a huge leap forward.

@stupidget Mark Healey of MM did say the inspiration for this and LBP did come from C64 game making software such as Shoot'em Up Construction Kit etc and I'm sure he's been around long enough to have dabbled with the utilities you mentioned.

this game blows me away the more I hear & see cannot wait to get my hands on it.

@hi_drnick Yep, SEUCK was great on C64, I remember Zzap! put a couple of games created using the software on their cover tapes in the UK, and you could actually save your creations to load without the utility and bring it over to your friends house as an actual 'game'. Dreams is looking really interesting.