Topic: Official Push Square Xbox Thread

@BAMozzy it's possible that a service like Game Pass would affect the sales but i'm sure MS would have taken that into account before putting it on there

i would also think that game pass would be making enough money to compensate for the loss of sales too at least it should or how else would the service even be viable?

Game pass is certainly a reason why the sales are seemingly soft I would guess. Honestly doubt Microsoft really cares at this point as they seem to be heading full force towards the "services" route. Having played the game all weekend its no where near worth a full $60. I'm sure they accounted for this though as anecdotally they apparently didn't give out a lot of physical copies to stores. I was in gamestop I think Saturday night and the clerk told me no store in the region got more than 20 copies (for context there are about 20 stores within 15 miles of me in a very well populated area)

@BAMozzy do you regularly watch Jim Sterling content? I watched a portion of his CD3 review and foundhim so mind numbingly negative I don't know how people can stand him for more than a few minutes.

@FullbringIchigo You would think that Game Pass offsets some of the cost of Game Development but that is a massive drop in sales. Forza Horizon 4 still sold and actually was the 'best' launch for the series of Forza - and that includes the Motorsport series too. A quick search had this to say

"Forza Horizon 4 achieved the highest launch month dollar sales in Forza franchise history,” Mat Piscatella told VentureBeat, “and is the biggest launch for a racing game on any Xbox platform in history.” Those numbers are backed up worldwide, and Microsoft said earlier this month that Forza Horizon 4 is “the fastest-selling game in the series,” according to the UK’s physical charts.

It would appear that Game Pass had little impact on sales of Forza Horizon 4 as it became the fastest and best selling racing game ever on an Xbox platform - at least in the first month but whether it goes on to be the best selling in total numbers I don't know but it still appears that Game Pass didn't have a big effect on sales. Its difficult to know for sure as we don't know how the game would have sold without Game Pass of course.

I am sure that Sales of Crackdown 3 may have been impacted a bit but whether or not it had a big effect we will never know because we can't see how well it would have sold without Game Pass and digital sales. I am sure it would of sold a bit better as a certain proportion of those with Game Pass may have bought the game and this is only the UK charts too. It maybe that us Brits weren't overly excited for more Crackdown but the US could be.

As for Game Pass, I don't know if the costs outweigh the loss of profits from sales - I don't know how much it costs MS to offer all the games alongside the new ones that they are losing sales for. Its possible that over a year, the money they get in from subscribers offsets the loss. If you look at Sales of games compared to the number of consoles sold, its rare that a game sells to more than 1 in 10 and if that ratio also includes Game Pass subscribers, 9 out of 10 wouldn't have bought Crackdown and so not losing a sale' to them but gaining the subscription fee. I am sure MS have calculated it anyway.

It is still a big drop in sales and not great for a brand new release to enter at 13th position below a lot of 'old' games. It maybe just a bad week to launch too with Metro and Far Cry launching on the same day - couple that with some poor reviews and that may have had a bigger impact than Game Pass. We can speculate all day as to whether or not Game Pass was a major reason for such a drop in sales, whether or not the other games launching had an impact, whether all of these affected sales or whether than game was just too mediocre for people to spend full asking price for it...

@BAMozzy well Game Pass must be making them money otherwise they wouldn't be so actively pushing the service

unless they are pushing it because it ISN'T making money?

@redd214 I do regularly watch Jim Sterling. I don't always agree with everything he says, but I do agree a lot with his comments on EA, Activision, loot boxes and the state of the gaming industry in general. If he found Crackdown 3 mindnumbingly boring then he is likely to be mindnumbingly negative about the game. Everything he said though has been said by numerous other reviewers too when talking about this game. There are a few that were more positive in that it was back to the 'crackdown' from 2007 which they were OK with where as others were hoping that after 12yrs, they may have evolved the game as other developers and gamers have evolved.

The game is sat at 60 on Metacritic with as many negative reviews as positive. Most are within the mixed range but after 63 reviews, its only on 60 with a user score of 4.2. A lot of the reviews from even MS/Xbox based sites were quite scathing in their reviews - many expressing the same things Jim Sterling said - perhaps more eloquently but still the same basic points though.

Most say that if you like Crackdown (2007) and still like it after 12yrs of innovation and progression, then you will probably like the mindless 'fun' and uninspired missions. Each to their own I say but I saw enough to know that I won't be spending money on this. I may play it if it's offered in GwG or its very cheap and I don't have too much of a backlog of games to play...

@BAMozzy oh I'm not defending the game if that's what you think. I think a 6 of 10 is an appropriate score. There's a huge difference between criticism and just flat out whining, he comes across as the latter to me. I don't disagree with what he is saying just his delivery and demeanor is just nagging imo. Don't think everyone has to be sunshine and roses all the time but man I just find complaining repulsive. Ah well glad you enjoy his content was just curious.

@FullbringIchigo At some point, Game Pass has to be profitable. If you consider each person is paying ~$10 a month and they have say 2m subscribers, that's $20m a month or $240m a year. Obviously, a fair proportion of that 2m wouldn't have bought EVERY exclusive and so MS are still getting $10 a month from those gamers as well as the sales from those who did buy.

At some point though, the numbers Subscribing will cover the loss of 'profit' from any sales, the cost of supplying all the games in Game Pass and any other costs/losses incurred. I don't know what MS's operating costs incurred for Game Pass and potential losses of sales, but they are almost guaranteeing to get a certain amount of money in - like I said, if 2m have subscribed, that's $240m incoming for the year, if its 3m, that's $360m - let alone all the money they get from Gold subscriptions and any game sales - both physical and digital...

Just found this in regards to some game pass numbers, interesting stuff!

Game Pass isn't really making MicroSoft a lot of money right now. It's rather an investment for them into the next generation than anything else.

If that is something to be enthusiastic about I don't know. The focus on subscription makes me personally less hyped, but that's probably the other way around for most.

@redd214 Yeah l too watch a lot of Jim Stirling. I echo what @BAMozzy said about him. Reviewing games is only a small part of his content though and he does bang the drum against some of the less desirable tactics the video games industry gets up to. He called out YouTube over this copyright thing ages ago for example (along with some other youtubers I follow)
He is not to everyone's tastes and admittedly I've turned a few of his vids off cos he has got on my nerves. That is just the way he is and you have to be a bit different to stand out in the world of YouTube.
In regards to GamePass, I think that will be the future but still exist along side physical media. You can make comparisons with Netflix, Amazon Prime etc however latency, input lag and download sizes will be a big issue to get round. Especially as some parts of the world you still can't get decent internet speeds, even in some parts of Amierca.

So i had a choice, either get a new pair of shoes as i need a new pair or buy a copy of Halo 5: Guardians so i made the informed, adult, responsible decision

Halo 5 should be here next week

@FullbringIchigo Wise choice sir, wise choice 😄

@MaccaMUFC i thought so

March's 2019 Games with Gold lineup for Xbox One includes: Adventure Time: Pirates of the Enchiridion and Plants vs. Zombies Garden Warfare 2. For Xbox 360 owners (and through Xbox One backward compatibility), March kicks off with Star Wars Republic Commando, followed by Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance.

I can't say I am enthusiastic or excited by ANY of these 4 games. I will add all, except Adventure Time as I can't see myself having any more kids that may get some 'joy' from this. The other 3 may come in useful if I ever get 'desperate' for something to play after clearing my ever increasing backlog and numerous other free games (both from Gold & PS+) that are infinitely better than these...

@BAMozzy yeah the XB1 games are not very interesting and as for Republic Commando and Revengence i already have those so i guess nothing for me this month

EDIT: actually they are quite bad when you think PS+ got Modern Warfare Remastered in March

@FullbringIchigo CoD4:MWr isn't exactly a 'big' AAA title from this generation - not even as 'expensive' as PvZ:GW2 was. It was initially a 'bonus' for buying a certain edition of a CoD game built for this generation of consoles and then eventually offered as a 'cheap' purchase for everyone months later. I have it because I got it effectively free with CoD and the Season Pass that came with the version I bought.

The Witness is not a game I want either, better than Adventure Time to me but neither are wanted regardless. Compared to For Honor and Hitman, and no more PS3/Vita offerings, this is a weak/poor month for me with PS+ - at least 3 of the Xbox games will be added to my library compared to none from PS+ - although that's partly because I already have CoD4 and its been ruined by micro-transactions and additional weapons etc. Campaign was worth replaying of course...

Each to their own but I think MS has a better month than PS+ - if not for the value, or the diversity then certainly on quantity.

@BAMozzy i meant to me it's a better month because out of the XB games i already have 2 and have no interest in the others where as PS+ actually has something i would like to play

@Frigate It does surprise me too to a degree. CoD4:MW was a game of the year winner back in 2007 when it released but the remaster certainly caused controversy as it was originally only available with a specific bundle for Infinite Warfare. It still was awarded the best Remastered game of 2016 so I can understand why some may think its a 'great' month for PS+. That being said, some reviews also highlighted the fact that this is a 2007 game with 2007 quality AI with 2007 pacing issues and 2007 MP balance.

It also received a LOT of controversy when Activision/Raven Software (as they did the remaster), introduced Micro-transactions that weren't 'just' cosmetics either. To top it off, the original DLC was then added for gamers to buy - at a higher cost than the original 4 map DLC cost. Those that didn't get the game as part of the Infinite War bundle were getting charged more, not just a bit more but 'double' the price for buying it separately and, if they wanted the 4 extra maps, would be expected to pay almost the price of the 'full' (Minus DLC) CoD4:MW which would take the game up to the price of a new AAA game.

Maybe people have forgotten all of that controversy and money grabbing tactics employed by Activision/Raven Soft, forgotten about all the micro-transaction content added in, forgotten about the price of the extra 4maps in the DLC, forgotten about how unbalanced the game was back in 2007 that because it was new/fresh, we didn't know any different, how a 'balanced' game should be. Forgotten about the fact that Infinity Ward and Treyarch spent the next few years working on things like Perks, Weapons etc to balance and refine the Multi-player - and now its 'worse' because Raven have added more micro-transaction content that also affects the way it played back in 2007...

All people seem to be seeing is that 2007 game with the nostalgic, rose tinted goggles on and the great memories of playing with friends rather than the 2016 Remaster and all the controversy that surrounded it from the day it was announced as part of the Infinite Warfare bundle only, then the addition of Micro transactions that altered its MP, the cost of the 'expansion' pack and eventual release of the stand alone version. The only people I can realistically see being 'happy' with the inclusion of this as part of PS+ is those that were either in a bubble in 2017 or were only interested in the campaign. I would imagine most who 'loved' the MP in 2007/8, would have either bought the more expensive Infinite Warfare bundle (like I did) or bought it 6months later when it released as a stand alone. The inclusion may well bring a few more players online (although most 'CoD' gamers would be playing BO4 I expect) and inject some life back into its MP for a short while. As such, I really can't see why many think this is a 'good' offering..

@FullbringIchigo I am sorry, it seemed to me that you were saying that CoD4:MW was reason enough to beat any/all of the offerings from MS this month. If you already have 'all' or most of the Xbox titles, then I can understand why PS+ may be personally better to give you a game you didn't already own.

I would still add the two older games at least to your 'owned/ready to download' list- even if you don't actually download and/or replay. Those games are 'permanently' yours and if you did want to replay, its easier than sticking in a disc for license verification. I do that with ALL the 360/OG games whether I own them or not. I have well over a hundred games in my 'ready to download' list that I own outright - regardless of my Gold status and its easier than swapping out the current disc in my drive to put in the older disc. You have to download them anyway and can't play directly and if you already have done that, adding them from GwG doesn't 're-download' the game, just adds the license to play to your account so you no longer need to put in the disc.

The two XB1 titles don't excite me I must admit. PvZ may be some fun in Solo or Co-op - MP is a bit 'CoD' and I would rather play a more adult M-Pea shooter. This was a AAA full price game at launch - unlike any of the PS4 offerings this month - that's partly why I mentioned 'value' of the games (inc the 2 AAA full priced older game offerings).

Anyway, I can see why you may be a bit more enthusiastic for PS+ games this month if you have the XB1 offerings you would want.

@FullbringIchigo MWR isn't exactly a great game now. Keep in mind it's lifecycle was up two years ago now so really all you will find playing now are hackers and modders which in my opinion just ruin the game. Now say if it was maybe CoD: WWII I might say PS+ is better but for me at least neither of them are good this month.