Topic: Nintendo Switch --OT--

@nessisonett It's not next-gen. What generation a console is is largely determined by both the technology inside of it and industry circumstances surrounding the new device. In this case, it was clearly built as a PS4/Xbox One competitor/companion, and runs most games released for that generation of consoles.

If Switch had failed, and Nintendo went back to the drawing board again, would that make a Switch successor a tenth gen device if it released today? And if that failed, and Nintendo still amazingly tried again with something new and improved, would that make their next device an eleventh gen console that was released in the ninth console generation?

New main console doesn't automatically equal next-gen console. The Wii U failed and was terminated early, and Nintendo tried their hand again with a new device.

@nessisonett The switch is the only current generation handheld console. It is less powerful than either of its competitors home consoles. It is very much an indictment of the Wii U that it is comprehensively outperformed by a handheld of the same generation.

Ugh, all this talk about what generation the Switch belongs in reminds me of that NL poster (whom I won't name, and they would never go to Push Square anyways) who always talks about how the Switch is a step back from the Wii U in every respect, and doesn't consider it the successor to the Wii U.

Anyhow, I just finished off the final boss in Paper Mario: TOK, and my arms are still shaking (though that could be because of all the waggle in the second phase)! Pretty epic, though.

@RR529 I think you could definitely make a case that in certain respects, Nintendo’s approach with the Switch has been a bit of a step back. The lack of Virtual Console, for one. Plus the move towards GaaS elements hints that their mobile games are creeping into their console games. However, the third party support massively outweighs most downsides for your average player who only owns a Switch. The portability’s also a big draw considering I could barely even leave the room with the Gamepad. I just think the Switch created a great opportunity for Nintendo and they’re slowly turning me off with the lack of concrete news. If they really do make BotW2 and Metroid Prime 4 exclusive to the rumoured Pro, I’m done. The Switch would officially be the worst valued purchase I’d ever made if it was obsolete in the space of 3 years. Now these rumours haven’t been confirmed but many are acting like they are and that they’re a good thing, which does my head in. I don’t know why anybody would be pleased about having to drop £300-£350 on a mid-gen refresh.

@nessisonett Plenty of PS/Xbox fans happily purchased PS4 Pro/Xbox One X. If you primarily play on one console, it's easy to justify the expenditure. And, if price is a concern, you can even sell your older console to help with the cost of the new device.

Anyway, there's not a chance that BotW2 or Prime 4 would be exclusive to a Pro model.

Hell, the only notable exclusive the New 3DS got was a port of Xenoblade Chronicles, and that was mostly just to show off the capability of their new handheld.

Besides that, there was one game (Hyrule Warriors Legends) that might as well have been a New 3DS exclusive (performance on OG 3DS was awful), and a bunch of games that ran fine on the older hardware but enjoyed enhancements on the N3DS.

@nessisonett, oh yeah, Wii U was definitely better for back compat gaming (both because of the VC & built in Wii support), and Switch definitely has some build quality issues in regards to the stuck drift, so I'm not saying it's perfect.

It's just that the conversation reminded me of the Wii U diehards you get on NL (though there's not as many as there used to be) who try to write off all the Switch does well in additions to it's downsides (including the overall first party output. "It's best games are Wii U ports, including BotW. It's true exclusives are all rehashes, or a step back, from the Wii U/3DS entries that aren't worth getting excited about, or just don't count for some arbitrary reason, such as Astral Chain").

@Ralizah To be fair, I do own a PS4 Pro because I got it at a crazy trade-in discount and it was the same price as getting a controller and Modern Warfare which it came with. I just feel like every other Nintendo console had strict improvements over the first few years in its exclusives in terms of ambition and scope, which Switch doesn’t seem to have. BotW, Mario Odyssey and FE Three Houses were the most ambitious games on the console imo and two of them were in the first year. Nothing I’ve seen coming out recently or in the future seems to be utilising the tech better than what’s already been. If Nintendo need state of the art tech to compete, something’s gone wrong or they have a lack of imagination because they’ve competed with worse tech for 20 years now.
In 2005, 3 years after the GameCube launched in PAL territories, we got Resident Evil 4, Pokemon XD, Star Fox Assault and Fire Emblem Path of Radiance, all games that blew launch titles out of the water graphically and through complexity.
Even the Wii U got Splatoon, Xenoblade Chronicles X and Yoshi’s Wooly World in 2015, three years after release. Those games were a noticeable step up from launch titles. Switch has been a strange ride which makes me wonder if Nintendo actually handle success well.

@Ralizah To be fair, even though the Wii U was by technicality a "current-gen" console, it still felt like a minorly souped up last gen console

The Switch felt like more of a proper response to the PS4 and Xbox One considering it actually recieves a lot of the same current gen multiplats nowadays that the Wii U just missed out on. The power gap between the Switch and its competitors was a lot less pronounced even though it was still definitely noticeable, and it helped that it does still end up nabbing a lot of big name 3rd party titles from this generation like The Outer Worlds, DOOM, Wolf 2 and Witcher 3, which I could just never see happening on the Wii U, hence why I just think it's a glorified 7th gen console that happened to be released during the 8th gen

The Wii U was the last traditional console that ran most games directly from the disk rather than needing to install. Whilst there are merits to this approach modern multi platform games are created with the assumption that they will be installed and patched.

The Switch can't really be classed as being in the same league as the PS5 and XSeX, the ports of current gen games are always inferior in some way technically and that is going to be even worse if it gets ports of games designed specifically for PS5 and XSeX.

From Wikipedia:

I mean you could class Switch as a next gen console, but i think you be wrong to and would only be kidding yourself.

Bought A Short Hike & Gato Roboto last night. After a more lengthy game I decided it'd be nice to tackle a couple games on the shorter side.

A Short Hike seems to be the indie of the week over on NL at the moment, and while the hype may have played a part in me getting it now, I was already interested in it when revealed at the Indie World, as something about it reminded me of The Touryst, which I enjoyed.

Gato Roboto is a "Metroidvania" with a cat in a mech suit and a striking black & white aesthetic. It's been in my wish list for ages, and I think it had a good reception back when it launched.

I don't buy too many Indies, so hopefully I enjoy these.

@RR529 I played A Short Hike last year on PC and it’s fantastic. Honestly, a proper incredible experience. There’ll always be people annoyed that NLife give out 10s to games that aren’t Nintendo first party games but I can see why they did with A Short Hike.

Lol, something strange happened: I just finished Ori and the Blind Forest on Switch. Got to the final cut-scene, and the game just closed in the middle of it because of an "unexpected error".

I don't know whether to blame Microsoft or Nintendo, so I'm going to blame both. Now I have to reply the last boss...

@Kidfried Blame both of them and accept only Sony in your heart. They’ve crossed you for the last time 😉

@nessisonett, yeah, I just finished it tonight, and it was lovely. I think I'll hold off on writing an impressions piece until after I play Gato Roboto though (and do a sort of "indie corner" type thing where I'll write little reviews for this, that, and Waifu Uncovered, which I played awhile ago).

I will say that the ending had me inexplicably in tears, it just hit something deep inside. After I get home from work tomorrow I'll probably goof around in it a bit more to see if I can't collect anything more (I finished with 11 Golden Feathers & 2 Silver Feathers) before putting it down.

@RR529 Good to see you enjoyed it, it’s one of those games that really hit me too and I’ve played a lot of indies over the last couple of years. I’d recommend Owlboy as well, that’s another one that hit me almost as hard as this and Celeste.

There's a thread over on NL asking what your top 10 Switch games are, so I figured for fun I'll copy & paste what I wrote there.

It's too hard to make an actual top 10, so I'll make two alphabetical lists. The first a detailed list of my 10 top shelf games, then 10 honorable mentions that just miss out.

• Astral Chain - I was brought in by the great art aesthetic & sci-fi world, stayed for the varied gameplay on offer headlined by it's deep combat (including great bosses), but also enjoyed the stealth & detective sections.
• Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze - The best pure 2D platformer I've played in ages. Spent a lot of time as a kid playing the original DKC, and this is a worthy modern follow-up.
• Final Fantasy X HD - This was one of the three games that got me into JRPGs back in the day, and it's held up impeccably. I was as hooked now as I was back then, and it has one of gaming's greatest love stories as far as I'm concerned.
• One Piece Pirate Warriors 3 - I'm not a big One Piece fan (give me Dragon Ball, InuYasha, or Rurouni Kenshin any day), but I picked this up on a whim after enjoying the two Nintendo Warriors games, and fell in love. There's just something about it that makes it fun to play, and it's become my go to Warriors game, and one of my go to time killer games.
• Super Mario Odyssey - With large creative worlds to explore & the versatile capture mechanic, this game was pure magic to experience. I mean you get to smash things up as a T-Rex, scale a Japanese Castle, and fight a ferocious dragon, and I haven't even mentioned New Donk City.
• Super Smash Bros Ultimate - I love Smash, but I usually don't have anyone to play with, so the meaty single player modes on offer quickly made this one of my favorites in the series, and my favorite fighter on Switch. With every playable character returning, plus some new fan favorites, it truly feels like a celebration of all things Nintendo, and maybe even the Japanese gaming industry as a whole. I do miss trophies, though.
• Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (Torna) - A grand JRPG epic with a fantastic world, great characters, deep combat, and a great romance at it's center (and hey, I like the typical "waifu" character design, fite me!). While Torna, which is pretty much a full game in it's own right, is a sombre prequel with refined combat.
• Zelda: Breath of the Wild - Not much to say about this one that hasn't been said already. It's an absolutely gorgeous game that's just fun to get lost in and explore. Finding a new shrine or scaling the next tower are moments of joy, while this version of Hyrule is beautiful.
• Zelda: Link's Awakening - Say what you will about what is essentially a spruced up Game Boy game, but sometimes it's nice to go back to something simpler. It's one of those games that really reminded me of the reasons I am a gamer, and had a smile from start to finish. I had played the original on 3DS VC without it leaving much of an impact, but this remake is one of my favorite Zelda titles.
• Ys VIII - With an engaging "Metroidvania" structure, slick combat, and an ancient mystery, this quickly became one of my favorite JRPGs on the system, and it stands out even today as one of the best games on the system, IMO. I loved the little sense of community you built up with the other castaways too.

Honorable Mentions: Animal Crossing: New Horizons, Daemon X Machina, Devil May Cry HD, Fire Emblem Warriors, Hyrule Warriors: Definitive Edition, Luigi's Mansion 3, Okami HD, Onimusha Warlords HD, Paper Mario: the Origami King, Shining Resonance Refrain

Not sure I’ve even played 10 games on Switch, certainly not completed them, but I’ll try.

1. Smash Ultimate. I love Smash and this is more of the same, with a great cast. Only reason I don’t play much anymore is that my older brother moved out.

2. Super Mario Odyssey. Really enjoyed this game, just sheer fun although I did miss some more pointed, expanded levels like the older 3D games. Next game, I hope they mix up smaller objectives with larger set-pieces like what we saw with New Donk City’s parade.

3. Katamari Damacy Reroll. Brilliant game, perfectly suited to Switch. Yes it’s a port but it’s a good one at that.

4. Fire Emblem Three Houses. Another game I need to beat that I appreciate some of the changes while some frustrate me. Decent cast with some I love and some I loathe. I just absolutely hate stories that pull the whole ‘kill off characters you care about/make them hate you’. It’s why I dislike the Walking Dead and most things with that kinda deal.

5. Breath of the Wild. Only ever did about 10% of the game but enjoyed what I did play. Joy-Con drift ruined my momentum and I need to go back.

6. Hollow Knight. Incredible but I’m going to start fresh with Game Club for another perspective. Yes, this was a shameless plug.

7. Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, I guess? It’s Mario Kart. It’s good fun.

8. Animal Crossing New Horizons. Like it, can’t quite fall in love with it. Partly due to my absolute rotter of a brother making our island look bloody horrible. The revolution will not be televised.

9. Cadence of Hyrule. Great game, great source material, great soundtrack. Really opens up possibilities for Nintendo to do more of the same.

10. Tetris 99. Yes, I ran out of games. Couldn’t include Mario & Rabbids because it’s the most focus-grouped beige game I’ve played or TWEWY because the controls make me want to rip my arms off and eat them. Just play TWEWY on DS. Tetris 99 was pretty fun for 10 minutes though. It’s also free.

Top 10 Switch games

1. Smash Ultimate - Easily my most played title on the console. It's endlessly replayable and has a super gratifying feel to its fighting mechanics that I just didn't really get from the Wii U title whenever I did play it. Everything's a lot less floaty and attacks have significantly more weight to them. Definitely a major improvement. The newcomers are also practically all excellent picks. Nice to see the best Belmont, Richter getting in on the action as well as obviously Joker representing Persona to a tee despite the unorthodox Persona summoning mechanic.

2. Astral Chain - Platinum does it again. An excellent action game with a peak Platinum storyline filled with flashiness and style, yet retaining enough substance to keep me engaged all throughout. Also one of the best looking exclusives by far on the system.

3. Xenoblade Chronicles: Definitive Edition - My personal favorite RPG from the last decade got the graphical facelift it deserved and there is practically no logical reason behind choosing the Wii or New 3DS versions over this stunning remake that even packs in major QoL improvements from Xenoblade Chronicles 2.

4. Super Mario Odyssey - The best 3D Mario game in a long time. It deserves a blind playthrough just to fully grasp how fantastical and bound to imagination everything is, from the animations, to the abstract levels and incredible soundtrack. A must play for platformer enthusiasts.

5. Catherine Full Body - Easily Atlus' most underrated title of the 2010s and the Switch version is far superior to the PS4 version simply verging by the fact that it comes with all of the DLC like the extra multiplayer characters and the Persona 5 DLC on the cartridge & available to play from the start. It's a great puzzle platformer with a decievingly seductive exterior that masks a tense story about alcoholism, facing one's personal demons, the weight of commitment problems and a man trying to hold onto his sanity in the midst of it all.

6. Persona 5 Scramble/Strikers - It's technically not out in the west yet but I played this game almost non-stop when getting an imported Switch copy from Japan. Unlike traditional crossover Musou games, this title deemphasizes fighting large hordes of enemies in mindless hack n' slash antics in favor of more closely mimicing the turn based strategy and contained battling of mainline Persona with a real-time twist. It also has easily the best Persona spinoff story that truly feels like a natural narrative progression of Persona 5/Royal's plot, which is something I couldn't say for other spinoff titles like the Persona Dancing games or Persona Q series.

7. Splatoon 2 - A pretty addictive competitive shooter with a vibrant as hell visual style and great, catchy soundtrack.

8. Breath of the Wild - A proper modernization of the original Zelda game's open ended format of gameplay. Despite the story itself feeling like a tacked on afterthought, the gameplay was generally really enthralling, and the world of Hyrule was breathed to life in a way that made it feel like as much of a character as the people you meet during your escapades.

9. Final Fantasy X - An excellent starting point for new players to the franchise and an immensely satisfying JRPG with an extremely likable cast of characters and a dense, lively setting that has as much of an emotional center as the plot itself.

10. Bloodstained RotN - When Konami couldn't deliver on the promise of a new entry in the classic Castlevania series, Igarashi stepped in to provide an extremely well crafted Metroidvania that feels both fresh and aesthetically diverse, while recognizing its roots and feeling like a proper spiritual successor to the GBA/DS Castlevania entries.

@TheFrenchiestFry I’ll give you one reason the Switch version of Xenoblade’s worse - Reyn looks like the bloody Wolfman 😛