Topic: Corona Virus Panic/Discussion Thread

Yes, clearly the numbers are all unreliable, the U.S. and China. Whether by nefarious means or no, reporting and testing is certainly sporadic. Nevertheless, the fact that the numbers in the U.S. are skyrocketing means that more than just a few elite are actually being tested. Certainly it’s true that many don’t have access to care and are not being tested, no doubt about it, but clearly more than the 1% of mega-rich and wealthy are being tested. Across the nation many, many cities are doing public drive thru testing. One simply must go to one of these large areas, usually utilizing a public venue with a large parking lot and supposedly thousands of tests per week are conducted at these drive thru sites. People are screened for symptoms as they drive from station to station and the window is rolled down only when someone with PPE is ready to swab. I have no idea how many people are turned away, if any, when they qualify for testing based on symptoms. And I have no idea what percent of states and cities are doing mass testing like this at public centers, but I feel like it’s probably getting more and more common.

I assume these type of mass testing set ups are present in the UK and Europe. I’m too lazy to google it — Is the set up the same over in the Old World, or is testing only done in a hospital or clinic setting?

Well, yes, it is rolling out to more people now that it has become such a national emergency. Slowly. We're seeing the extent of the invisible damage that has been happening to us for weeks and months without a competent response from the national government.

The problem right now is that we're still being reactive instead of proactive. We're still telling ordinary people not to get tested if they don't have the worst symptoms. Which means we'll never get ahead of it, and instead of using mass testing as an informational tool to track the spread of the disease and try to limit its spread, we're just employing them to see how much damage the coronavirus is doing to us.

The Italian Government has promised economic aid to families after the first attacks on supermarkets. Just to tell you what might happen in the rest of the world in the next few days...

@Ralizah I agree insofar as the response has been too little too late and primarily reactionary. There was a time when things could have been curtailed better, but now it’s mostly too late.
Nevertheless, I don’t see that any highly international community has the hopes of containing this particular virus. The U.S. is at a bit of a disadvantage due to the melting pot that we are, having borders on both oceans, and being a center of commerce and travel. But yes, the democratic society with emphasis of personal liberties and rights makes it so much more difficult as well. I can only imagine the outrage if in the hypothetical situation that several months ago when we all saw the initial signs in China and Italy that the federal government closed the borders, banned travel, left Americans isolated in Asia and Europe not allowing them reentry, shut down non-essential business and services, poured billions into ramping up research and testing, quarantined any suspected individuals under martial law, etc, etc — all the things that would seem to have made sense in retrospect — there would have been outrage at the administration for the violation of rights and certainly the rest of the world would have been highly critical of such actions. Now that we have 80,000+ cases, or whatever it is, such actions are justifiable, but when there was little to no American cases, it would be hard to impose those things on the public in the proactive sense.

As I sit here playing Monday morning quarterback, I am pretty disappointed in most aspects of the U.S. response, but I also realize that the public sector is not nearly as tolerant of taking aggressive action on individual rights to protect the good of society.

It did bring a smile to my face though as I read:

and immediately saw the plot of Star Wars Episode 2: Attack of the Clones in that statement and heard Anakin debating with Padme about the failings of democracy as they picnic in the fields of Naboo 😄

But I completely agree — if society could have a monarch or ruler who was altruistic, wise, selfless, and had only the good of the people at heart then that would be the ideal scenario. In a democratic society, we get something akin to the collective faults of the populace to rule.
Anyways, ... a bit off topic, but it’s an interesting discussions and thought experiment.

@andreoni79 it's to be expected unfortunately.

If you have no source of income or savings, which approximately 4% of the adult uk population wont now, some will take the matter into their own hands. I'm talking the cash in hand workers, labourers etc. They can't target homes as people are all at home so supermarkets will be hit.

Appalling but expected as they will need to survive too. Sounds crazy but as gamers we have experienced this in post apocalyptic games, resource management, saving health potions etc. Except in this game you really can't level up and are always on dwindling resources.

@Th3solution @Ralizah The reason Britain and the USA are angry is China lied about the numbers of dead in their country. No way was it 3000 odd. So the strategy was to do little to nothing since the advice in January - the whole idea was to let it wash over once it arrived, with a manageable number of ongoing sick. Once Iran (lied about numbers but you could see the problem) and then Italy (real numbers) became over encumbered with sick it was too late. We had missed the window to protect ourselves.

Coronavirus is too contagious and the illness procrastinated In the sick. If it was over in a week, we wouldn't have too much of an issue. But it sticks around, 3-4-5 weeks in some people.

Take China's current total of 2500 ongoing ill. A ton of them have been in ICU for an age. The new cases have dried up but 2k of people are still really ill. That's the real issue.

Hopefully once we start fighting back and the world doesn't descend into war a new politik will take hold - more truth, more power to the people. The rich and powerful have messed around too much in a condensed time frame. The credit crunch (which affected my business att) and now an out of control virus.

Both were avoidable and the people in charge as @Ralizah mentions are both incapable and unintelligent. Power in truth is always more potent than power in lies.

The rhetoric from the USA, the trust we had in China, the misinformation coming from Russia, the fabrication of numbers in Iran etc etc.

@Th3solution This administration is no stranger to courting outrage. If he had tried to impose strict immigration controls early on and plead his cases to the American people, even if he hadn't succeeded, it would have demonstrated the sort of pro-active attitude I'd want in my leader.

But you do have a point insofar as the commander-in-chief isn't able to unilaterally dictate such drastic shifts in foreign policy.

Still, if nothing else, it would have been nice, at least, to have heard a competent voice in the government as this was going on. To have someone who could help to lead us through this.

@Ralizah @themcnoisy I agree with both your sentiments. Hopefully the nations of the world learn from this. I’m an eternal optimist by nature, but the next pandemic or global crisis is likely to be worse. Widespread corruption of many world governments is wearing my faith in humanity thin. Nevertheless, wherever there are intelligent and conscientious people gathered together, we have a chance.

I dunno, seeing the greedy, selfish nature of the public first hand in this crisis makes me lose the little faith I had left in democracy. Is it any wonder our elected officials are this ineffectual when we’re the ones voting them in?

Even though Japan has yet to issue isolation orders - I have to say I'd have little problem with it. I'm an introvert anyway. I am more than happy to stay home, play games, read, watch anime and sleep. My only issue is that I rarely, if ever, really have two weeks worth of food in my kitchen. My fridge and freezer just aren't built for that and honestly Japan doesn't do canned food like the US. They have some but the selection is far smaller. Most dry goods are meant to be cooked with things that need to be kept cold or frozen so... That's all that worries me personally.

I get that people want to go out because it's what they do for fun. But I have a real hard time empathizing with the "I'm at home and bored and I hate it" mentality. I can understand it the way I understand 2+2=4, but the feeling? I just can't relate.

@Th3solution Problem is the world never learns and things seem destined to repeat in a cycle. After the financial crash of 2008 the world's richest became richer than ever before while ordinary people have suffered years of austerity. Our current system of capitalism is not just broken - it's rotten to its very core. And those with vested interests seem to have a grip on power the world over. Hopefully this crisis will mark a turning point and break 40 years of free market neo-liberal orthodoxy.

As a result of the financial crisis right-wing populism and nationalism reared their ugly heads once more, spearheaded by governments who are not terribly well equipped to dealing with the current pandemic. The situation in Brazil is interesting because Bolsonaro's response has caused his support to plummet. So perhaps it will kill off such politics, or perhaps it will make it worse as people regress even further and blame easily targeted groups.

The pandemic has been shocking to people because it's reminded us that humans are very fragile. Throughout history repeated waves of pandemics have hit, yet modern society, medicine and technology have coddled us and perhaps caused westerners to feel that we have managed to outrun nature. This stark reminder - if governments have any sense - should lead to a massive increase in healthcare spending. There are still some countries that need to adopt universal healthcare!

Oh boy, there's a confirmed case in my small rural county now. It spreads quickly.

@mookysam I'm convinced at this point that the right will continue seizing power and shifting the overton window by preying on the fears of old people until there's a marked generational change in the U.S.. There is a lot of support in America among millennials and (probably) zoomers for universal healthcare, but they don't go out and vote when the chips are down, so they (we) are not a relevant voting bloc atm.

Entrenched corporate interest in keeping healthcare insurance private and ridiculously expense is just too strong here, and it's going to take a unified and muscular response from a large portion of the country to change that. And even then, that'll take years of groundwork, because even if we somehow got universal healthcare legislation passed right now, I'm convinced the supreme court Donald Trump has shaped for a generation would consider it to be "unconstitutional."

@Ralizah I have to admit that for the average Brit the opposition to universal healthcare in America is baffling. It should be viewed as a basic human right, yet giant corporations have this chokehold and won't relinquish control. The way many Americans have been led to believe that any form of socialism is wrong - particularly at a time when it is needed most - is difficult to comprehend. The general message seems to be that socialism is okay when it comes in the form of massive corporate bailouts at the expense of ordinary citizens.

Although the UK's own healthcare system has been battered and stripped to the bone by a decade of very deliberate underinvestment, we are still extremely lucky to have healthcare that is universal and free at the point of delivery. I am in awe of the work doctors and nurses do and feel extremely grateful on a personal level. If we didn't have the NHS I would probably be dead right now, or at least in debt for the rest of my life.

Do you think that the millions of uninsured or underinsured Americans who simply can't afford treatment could lead to the COVID-19 crisis worsening? Then there are migrants - whether legal or undocumented - who are very distrustful of federal government and as a result may not seek help if they fall ill.

I've just listened to an altercation on the street outside my apartment, between a homeless drunk who was sitting with a beer, a passer-by vigilante telling him not to loiter and "spread contagion" in public, and a policeman trying to calm the drunk down whilst simultaneously telling the vigilante to get lost, or he'd arrest them for being outside without cause.

Welcome to the second week of the lockdown, everybody.

Shaved my head last night. A haircut was the only thing I didn't manage to squeeze in before non-essential shops and businesses closed down. It had become quite erratic, but I couldn't be bothered to ponce about trying to style it myself, so just took a razor to it. I reckon barbers and hairdressers are gonna make a killing when they re-open, fixing everybody's DIY 'dos.

@mookysam It being an election year in the U.S. it will be interesting to see. Healthcare reform is always one of the top 2 or 3 topics of debate. First Obamacare and now the proponents are calling it “Medicare For All” which is basically like a universal health care system. It has a lot of traction in the public and this pandemic is sure to influence voters.
It’s all complicated by the horrible related economic recession we are in, which will also be a factor.

@RogerRoger I literally read a tweet yesterday saying that thousands of guys are gonna shave their heads out of a mixture of necessity and boredom 😂😂😂

@nessisonett Boredom is a big factor. I was bored the other day, so I dyed my hair for the first time in a couple of years. Now it's a lovely dark reddish purple colour. It also helped that I'm now working from home and don't have to worry about what the office will say, though I doubt they particularly mind these things anyway.

@RogerRoger I'm a bit too squeamish to shave my own hair, so it's going to be rather long once this is all over. It's going to be interesting to see other people also having long hair due to the hairdressers being closed.

@nessisonett @crimsontadpoles Hey, if you're bored, learning to cut your own hair (like, properly making it look good and whatnot) could be fun for some. I had the opposite problem; I'm finding myself with tons to be getting on with, and so hated the idea of spending longer than ten minutes on something I personally find somewhat unimportant. I just wanted it gone!

And I must just say, deep crimson bordering on purple is one of my favourite colours!

I shave my own head, so it’s a nice break not having to do that for a while, actually. I actually had to wash my hair in the shower for once today, shampoo and everything.

Cutting your own hair at home is a great way to save money as well, and you get to avoid that awkward chit chat. There's just so many wins, I'd never go back to a hairdresser.

I always ask my sister to shave my hair very short. Saves so much money. That's nothing new, though.

@mookysam This is what comes of generations of brainwashing via corporate-owned media. Should we ever get universal healthcare that's properly funded, it'll likely be wildly popular like Medicare and Social Security are now. But, in this country, we have to fight like dogs to get even basic reforms that are considered basic rights of citizenship in other countries.

Although, honestly, the problems with America's political system go so deep. There's so much gross, blatant influence of corporate money in politics. Partisan gerrymandering. Voter suppression tactics. An electoral college system for presidential elections, and state electoral vote allocation rules, that disenfranchises wide swaths of the country

@Th3solution I understand a relief package was needed for the significant disruption this virus has caused, but I'll confess, it has been more than a little annoying to see a lot of the same people gaslighting Americans about a universal healthcare system "bankrupting" America by costing us trillions over a decade or so (despite Sanders' Medicare-for-All system actually saving everyone money in the process, a finding supported even by right-leaning institutions who have studied it) gleefully voting for a bill that literally consists of trillions of dollars of handouts to businesses and individuals. Most of these elected "conservative" people have no ideology. They believe nothing.