Topic: PlayStation 5 --OT--

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gamespot.com/amp-videos/ps5-... 120 Hertz support confirmed.

https://twitter.com/Andrew_Reiner/status/1137833936682274816?... hmm...

@WebHead
I'm curious to see what Digital Foundry makes of all this and of the chip they showed . Funny that both Sony and Ms say they co engineered (with AMD) very customized chip but they both sound similar anyway so far.

So from AMD Next Horizon Gaming. Lisa mentioned both new gen.
For PlayStation they worked collaboratively on the custom chip for the last few years.
For Scarlet a custom processor co engineered with xbox team.
Its funny she put it that way.

I wonder whether I’ll be able to transfer my PS4 save data onto the PS5.

@Ryall Yeah I think that will be possible, I thought Sony sort of confirmed this the other week?

EDIT: Think I'm getting confused with the cross-gen play stuff that was announced.

@Ryall While it’s hardly confirmed, it’d be surprised if it couldn’t with the cloud for save data and all that.

We can hope.

With Final Fantasy sevens first episode arriving on PS4 first and later episodes arriving after PS5 comes out. I want to be able to transfer my saved data onto PS5 rather than retain my PS4. @Jaz007

So, going back to what Lisa said and trying to make sense of what s in the PS5. She used the same term as Spencer describing how they co engineered the processor while saying they collaborated with Sony for the last few years on the chip.
To me it sounds like they both have the exact same GPU with Ray tracing that somehow made it's way to Navi consoles while its planned next year for PC. Or am I mistaken? Haha

@JJ2 We won’t really know till the teardowns are in but at this stage it does seem rather like AMD sold the same chips to both Microsoft and Sony.

@Ryall It seems that both MS and Sony are going to be using the same Zen 2 CPU and Navi GPU BUT they will be different too and I am not talking about clock speed differences either. Both Sony and MS will have their own specs for the GPU. Its not like they will be taking the same Zen 2 CPU and Navi GPU off a shelf and putting them in their Consoles. The design of the APU can even look similar too but each will have their own specific design and features built in to.

For example, Sony may want their GPU to support FP16, Object tracking etc built in - like they did with the PS4 where as MS may decide that FP16 isn't worth it nor Object Tracking but may decide that the audio be handled by a dedicated part of the APU to free up more CPU processing and dedicated DX12 area too built in so whilst the two may have the same 'base' design, both are still custom and unique to each.

When Sony worked with AMD on their 'butterfly' design for the Pro (its basically 2 PS4 GPU's bolted together so that games that aren't Pro enhanced will only use 1 half like a regular Pro to enable perfect compatibility with the PS4), they also added things from Vega that were not on the Retail Polaris GPU. Its like building your own custom PC by adding things (like a Disk Drive, a second HDD etc) and not adding bits you don't want to build you own custom PC that has features you wanted and not adding things you don't need to build it at a cost you find acceptable.

Certain aspects may well be similar - at least on Paper. Both could have 16GB of RAM, but 1 could be using high bandwidth GDDR5 and the other GDDR6 with higher bandwidth. Both could offer 12Tflops of GPU processing power - 1 with fewer cores but higher clockspeed and the other with more cores but lower clockspeed to keep cooling requirements lower. Both may be using the same AMD core elements but still be very different because of what custom design elements each wanted.

I think we can safely expect both PS5 and Scarlett to go for $500 USD when they launch. We getting beefy bois.

@WebHead At the very least. Anyone expecting anything less than that is in la la land lol.

@WebHead @JohnnyShoulder It’s worth remembering the console are usually subsidised at launch. If you bought a day one PS4 Sony only broke even after you’d also bought a full price game and PlayStation plus. I would expect the PS5 to cost more to manufacture than the initial launch price.

@Ryall yeah sony is probably gonna sell at a loss but still. Its pretty evident they arent skimping. Things like hardware raytracing are not cheap.

@Ryall Good point, I would still be surprised if it came under 499 quid though.

@BAMozzy I guess if we looked at the original PlayStation 4 and Xbox One at the same level of detail as is currently available for the next generation consoles. I would probably conclude that they were pretty much identical to. But the finish product looked very different when they arrived.

@Ryall If you look at this Gen, then BOTH had a Jaguar CPU, both had 8GB RAM and Both had the same AMD GPU architecture too - obviously there was a BIG difference with Xbox adding ESRAM and having a higher clock speed CPU but the PS had a lot more Cores for its GPU and faster RAM too. At release, the PS4 GPU, as we know, was 1.84Tflops compared to the XB1's 1.32Tflops - a difference of 0.52Tflops or to put it another way, 520Gflops. That's more than double the Xbox 360's 240Gflops which had 9.6 more Gflops than the PS3

Its also more than the Switch offers too with the Tegra X1 in Switch running at 196/393 Gflops in portable/docked - of course, if you calculate the power using FP16 as opposed to FP32 like ALL the other consoles, you can double the Switch values which is where some sites will make the Switch seem even more powerful than it actually is. That being said, like the WiiU's 176 Glops which is often said to have 352 Gflops (FP16), it seems that Nintendo products are often given in FP16 (maybe because it makes them appear more on a par with Sony/MS?? the PS4 Pro can use FP16 and if you want to keep to the same system as Nintendo, that should be quoted as 8.4Tflops instead of the 4.2Tflops.

Anyway, the point is that because this generation is now using GPU's that are over 1000Gflops (1Tflop), A 'small' number like 0.52Tflops doesn't sound like its too much of a difference. Its nearly third of 1.84Tflops though but 520Gflops is more than 2 XB360's (the best GPU of last Gen), more than a Switch running Docked (in FP32 to keep it the same) and that's why its a BIG difference when it comes to games. 900p doesn't sound like much of a 'drop' from 1080p, its only 180p right? WRONG! its 2/3rds of the size of 1080p - like 540p isn't half of 1080p but 1/4 of 1080p, 6Tflops doesn't sound all that much more than 4.2Tflops - but that's a whole PS4 more or 1800Gflops or 7.5 XB360's more.

Tflops are not the be all and end all when it comes to Graphical performance of course. Even if you could break down 7.5 XB360's, combine the GPUs and plug that into a PS4 Pro to get to the 6Tflops, the old 360 GPU's would lack the efficiency and improved latency of the much newer Polaris GPU and still wouldn't measure up well against the 6Tflops of the X. No doubt if PS5 released with a brand new Navi 8tflop GPU for example, it may sound like its only 2Tflops more but the better efficiency and lower latency would get much better results than the X if they boosted the clock speed up to get 8Tflops. Both would appear to be on a par numerically, but the PS5 being newer (not counting the CPU and possible faster and more RAM too) would be superior. 12Tflops wouldn't be twice as good as an X despite having twice the compute power.

MS claiming there Scarlett is 4x the X doesn't mean that the GPU must be 24Tflops (4 x 6..). They could incorporate FP16 support and a 12Tflop (FP32) is also a 24Tflop (FP16) LOL but not every 'instruction' can be given in FP16. Of course Sony too could say their PS5 is 24Tflops and be quoting FP16 figures but even if neither uses FP16, both have the same numeric values or everything (RAM, Clock Speeds etc) and Architecture (both Zen2 and Navi), Different design features can make a difference too - like having a dedicated part of the APU handling Audio where as that is handled by CPU by the other thus using more CPU resources or one having dedicated Ray Tracing cores built in which may reduce the available die space for GPU or if the GPU's are the 'same', give that Console an advantage. Even OS can affect what is available for games too.

Anyway, it will be very interesting to see how things develop over the next 12-18months. There is no way that I want to be without either next gen consoles - even if there is a clear winner in terms of hardware specs. For all we know, one console could be quite 'light' on specs by comparison, deliver great 1080p performance offline but when connected, can use the power of the cloud to 'boost' performance beyond what the other does. Let the cloud handle some of the most intensive calculations. I will still want both because both will have unique software that I want regardless.

@BAMozzy yeah wehn they said 4x boost over one x for scarlett they pribably meant as a whole rather than just GPU.

Also I can see Sony calling PS5 just PlayStation or "The New PlayStation". Same with Scarlett just being called Xbox.

@BAMozzy next gen i don't think i'll be getting both (for the first time) as i don't feel i need both anymore and as long as i get to play FINAL FANTASY then i'm happy so i'll go where it goes which will probably be PS5 because of the FFVII Remake (which is confirmed for PS4 and PS5 and nothing else just yet)

still i think the next gen systems will be pretty even in terms of the tech they use (both using SSD's for example), it's going to be HOW they use that tech that's the difference