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Topic: Shadow of the Tomb Raider

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Th3solution

@andreoni79 I’m not very far into Shadow but there are difficulty sliders, and you can even select which part of the game to make more difficult or more easy - between puzzles, platforming, and combat. Evidently ramping up the difficulty to the hardest on all three options makes the game extremely tough. It severely limits the clues of where to go and how to find objects and buffs enemy health while taking away all the survival instinct perks. As for Rise, I don’t remember having much trouble with it, and it seemed slightly harder than the first (the first of this recent series) game. But I think most of my deaths involved insta-deaths due to traps or a missed jump. Pretty sure my first few tussles with a bear didn’t go well either.

“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”

Th3solution

@beemo Yeah, Lara seems shorter than I remember. And I noticed her look is different from her look in the TR 2013 game, but pretty similar to her look in Rise. But I think she shrunk.

“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”

Olivemady

I just got shadow of the tomb raider yesterday and ive made it to the plane wreckage but for some reason I can't get her to climb any walls or trees no matter what I try. I was thinking it was the controller so I got a brand new one and still have the same issue. I didn't have a problem in the first part of the game but in this section she won't do anything. No climbing or jumping.....

Olivemady

Th3solution

@Olivemady That’s really strange. Did you already get the makeshift knife? Until you get that, you can’t progress, but I didn’t remember having any issues with jumping. Man, it’s too bad because you’re about to get to some really awesome parts!

“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”

RogerRoger

@andreoni79 To add my personal experiences to what @Th3solution already helpfully stated, yeah, the difficulty increases a little in Rise across the board, but then is totally adaptable for every element of gameplay in Shadow. I haven't found anything to be particularly challenging in Shadow thusfar, but I'm playing on Normal across the board; playing Rise on the same difficulty setting gave me a few tough combat sections. From what I've seen, therefore, Rise is the toughest no matter what, whereas you can make Shadow the toughest if you're looking for a challenge.

@Olivemady That is strange (providing you got the makeshift knife from the propeller). The game is less than a week old, though, so it may be something that's random and soon to be patched out. Until then, I suggest you un-install and re-install the game, to clear up any potential glitches in your game data. Hope you can progress soon!

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

RogerRoger

Personally, I'm still very much enjoying my time with Shadow, but I'm willing to admit that there have been a few knocks to my confidence in thinking this would be a near-perfect experience.

I've reached a common problem with many open-world or "linear-plus" games, namely that the narrative has come to a sudden, shuddering halt because I'm in a large area filled with stuff to do, people to chat to, side quests to complete and optional places to explore. Because I do all of that kinda content as soon as it appears, I feel like the plot's momentum has dropped way off (and yeah, this is pretty much exactly what some have been saying about Spider-Man recently, so welcome to modern game design, I guess). The story objectives I have been doing have been great, but are missing that extra 10% of magic to make them outstanding and impactful, meaning some have blended together with the side quests in my brainspace. And it's not an uncommon thing (same happened to me in Horizon, too) but I'm disappointed because the first third of the game was so brilliantly-paced and narratively engaging. It's almost as if a different writer took over as soon as Lara reached Paititi and went "Nah, I wanna take the story in this direction instead!"

That's not to criticise any of the Paititi stuff I've played thusfar; it's a beautiful setting, with lots of small tweaks and details to make it a lovely place to help out and wander around in. But it's quite telling that there's a forced costume change whilst you're in the city and, as soon as the story moves you back out of it, you're suddenly Default Lara again. There's a little part of me that feels like I've been playing a different game for the past couple days, and now I'm returning to the Tomb Raider game I started last Thursday.

Will reserve full judgement until I've finished, of course, and I'm eager to see what happens next (because, once again, Lara's in a tight spot with no obvious escape in sight) but I don't remember this feeling being quite as jarring in the previous two games. Perhaps it's the curse that comes with the larger, richer, more 'alive' environment?

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

JohnnyShoulder

@RogerRoger I find games often suffer with pacing, especially ones that are open worldish in design, and your are left to own thang as to when to continue the story beats.

Hopefully this does a Spider-Man and the game is back to the best like it was in the first third!

Edited on by JohnnyShoulder

Life is more fun when you help people succeed, instead of wishing them to fail.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.

PSN: JohnnyShoulder

Kidfried

@JohnnyShoulder @RogerRoger I have this problem a lot. Take for instance Yakuza Kiwami, in which I played until chapter 4, then did all the minigames et cetera, and then finished the game. Sure i have some responsibility here, but I also think open world games should think of a smarter way to handle this.

Kidfried

RogerRoger

@Kidfried Agreed; I think picking the right moment to make side quests available is a fine art, and some do it far better than others. Saying "you can go over here and do this if you'd like" means that, inevitably, a lot of players will. There must be an awareness of what that'd do to the main story's momentum. In this case, it wasn't crippling, but it could've been timed a little better.

@JohnnyShoulder As soon as I got back to it last night, it picked up the pace. The next couple hours were really enjoyable, offering some story beats that I found really welcome, and I think it was in large part thanks to leaving Paititi behind and going somewhere else for a bit, somewhere much smaller but just as packed with details and discoveries. Despite the massive Paititi map being an incredibly vibrant place to be, I think there'll be an element of "bigger isn't necessarily better" in my final opinion.

I've also now raided all nine of the Challenge Tombs offered in the base game, and cannot wait to see what the forthcoming DLC ones are gonna be like. I inadvertantly saved my favourite 'til last, it was incredible and everything I'd hoped for, and they've undoubtedly been the highlight thusfar.

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

RogerRoger

...aaaaaand done.

Well, done with the story, at least. I'll wander around to collect a few bits I missed, and there's got to be some post-credits side quests out there somewhere, as I did all the ones I was told to and still didn't get the "Complete 8 Side Quests" trophy. I'll then start New Game Plus, probably on Deadly Obsession (the hardest difficulty mode) whilst I remember what all the buttons do.

Was this the greatest Tomb Raider game of all time? Probably not, but it was a very solid adventure from start to finish. The early promise of certain story beats never quite pays off in the way you hope, but they're addressed enough to see Lara's origin story through to a satisfying conclusion. There were a couple of surprisingly-sweet moments that left me with an involuntary smile, and some others which threatened to get me all misty-eyed, but the biggest emotions I experienced were probably those of panic and determination whilst doing battle with a relentless and chaotic final boss. It was all very spectacular, end-of-the-world stuff, which was what the marketing promised me.

Overall, therefore, the actual tomb raiding in this Tomb Raider game is the highlight, and that's a great thing to see and experience after the combat-heavy balance of the previous two games. The graphics, sound design, world-building and set pieces were all excellent.

The story is good. There are moments of genius, but also moments of mediocrity (which you probably wouldn't notice so much if the peaks in quality weren't so high).

It feels weird to say that Paititi, in all its glory and splendour, has a negative impact on the game. I think it's because of its placement in the ongoing story. The pace is being kept steady, like a well-flowing motorway, and then suddenly a massive articulated truck jack-knifes and forces everybody screeching to a halt. You're then presented with a bunch of open-world clichés, such as the first few side quests which never evolve beyond "go talk to these five people in sequence" (they get better later, but by then the damage is done) whilst you wait for the road to clear. It's a shame, because one of the things I'm most keen to do post-story is explore Paititi, chat to its inhabitants and find the bits that I missed.

And I can't wait for the DLC to deliver new Challenge Tombs, either. If they're half as good as the ones featured in the core game, they're gonna be brilliant.

Edited on by RogerRoger

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

NecuVise

@RogerRoger not a single trailer or news article hyped me for this game like your posts do I can't wait to get it (it's already ordered) and that all because of your writing.

Would it be wise to play Rise of the Tomb Raider again while waiting for this game?

Edited on by NecuVise

NecuVise

RogerRoger

@NecuVise Wow, that's real kind of you to say! Thank you!

I replayed Rise a couple months ago, deliberately to give myself space between it and Shadow when I saw a gameplay snippet showing some of the same traversal animations were still being used. I didn't want the games to feel too similar and blend together. Whilst there's plenty of new gameplay in Shadow, and it does feel fresh and distinctly different in many places, I wouldn't personally play them back-to-back, no. That'd be a heck of a lot of Tomb Raider and the last thing you'd want is to feel bored by the new game, because you'd just blasted through the old.

If you're looking for a refresher on the story, there's a video back on the first page which gives a recap (although it misses out the post-credits scene from Rise, which is key and mentioned several times throughout Shadow). In terms of gameplay, though, it'll be like slipping on an old pair of boots.

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

Th3solution

@NecuVise Although I’m far from done with the game, I would echo the sentiment to not play Rise immediately prior to this one, especially since you already played it. I have been reading comments from people saying they want to try Shadow since it is the refinement of the trilogy but they haven’t played Rise and I worry about people trying to play them both back to back. The game is similar enough that I agree it would likely spoil the experience imo. Yet for those who never played Rise, they would be a little lost on story if they tried to skip Rise. (Although like most good games, one could just watch the video recap and be okay enough to have some fun with Shadow, but it would not be ideal) Fortunately that’s not your situation and I am really enjoying the game despite my having played Rise way back at launch and being pretty rusty on the details. The gameplay tutorials are well done enough (I love the jazzy 3D text that pops up in the early hours instructing you on the mechanics. Very Nice) and the story is straight forward enough that I picked up quickly from my memory of Rise.

@RogerRoger Thanks for your impressions and honest take. I too have enjoyed reading them.
I have been busy enough the last few days that I haven’t been able to make progress. Unfortunately, this week involves some travel and I might not be able to get back to it much until next week. 😔
How long do you think your gametime was to get to the credits?
Any spoiler-free advice for me going forward? Should I try to power through the story or spend my time doing all the side stuff and take it slow? I know that’s probably personal preference, but in your opinion does the side quests and tombs detract enough from the main story to be better suited to just leave for post-game?
Is it too much of a spoiler to say, when you finish the game and want to go mop up things you missed post-game, does it take you back magically to the last check point before the final boss or does it flow organically into a situation where you are still running around in the world after defeating it?
And finally, how are the trophies? How close are you to 100% after completing your playthrough?
Whew, ...sorry. Didn’t realize I had so many questions.

Edited on by Th3solution

“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”

NecuVise

Thanks for your answers, I'll skip playing Rise again, especially as I'll be going for platinum in Shadow, so that could really be too much for me.

NecuVise

RogerRoger

@Th3solution I don't mind answering any questions, ask away!

I stopped keeping track of the time, but I think it took me around twenty, maybe twenty-two hours (going on a retrospective guesstimate) which is in keeping with what a lot of the reviews have said. I did all of the Challenge Tombs, all of the Side Quests and have about 70% of the rest (environmental challenges, artefacts, documents and the Optional Crypts which, unlike Rise, aren't just identical caves; they're sometimes as unique and impressive as the Challenge Tombs were before, and Lara reacts to each of them differently). My save slot, which tracks overall progress, says 86% all told.

My trophy count was 72% when I finished the story, and now reads 75% after I popped back in to find that last Side Quest and accidentally snag a combat trophy in the process (that answers whether you can return to the world post-credits, by the way). There are four trophies for clearing the game on the four different difficulty settings, but they do stack; I got two for completing the game on Normal, leaving me two (Hard and Deadly Obsession). There are a lot more story progression trophies this time around; the previous two games barely had any, but you regularly get bronze trophies for completing chunks of the story. There's also a silver for completing your first Side Quest, but a bronze for completing all of them (?!). Overall, it's a good list. There are some I'll struggle to get if I do decide to go for the platinum (because they involve being nasty to the animals in-game; I only kill things that are trying to kill me, I don't hunt for skins or anything like that) but aside from that Deadly Obsession difficulty, I think it'd be a breeze to complete the list.

For me personally, Paititi pulled the handbrake on an otherwise well-paced story, but that's because I stopped to do everything the city had to offer (and boy, it offers a lot). The first few Side Quests are quite straightforward and dull, but there are some really great ones in there as well, including a couple from a surprise location in the third act, which I loved. To say anything further might give away too much but, when I replay it for enjoyment, I'll probably focus on the story first and then spend a perfect couple hours after the credits doing all the Challenge Tombs. That's with the knowledge of what's in the game, though. I'd encourage you to just discover it for yourself and do what feels right. If you're wandering around finding stuff a little slow, go do a chunk of story and it'll pick right back up again. Nothing would appear to be blocked off, and everything can be revisited, it would seem.

Hope that helps!

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

RogerRoger

@NecuVise Sorry, no idea on that one; I haven't clicked it yet. All I do know is that New Game Plus offers "Paths" when you play, allowing you to focus on one of the three particular elements of the skill tree and gain additional abilities, but I'm not 100% on that. Might be skill point redistribution or something, letting you play a different way or double down on your favourite tactics.

If I do start it later, I'll come back and let you know.

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

Th3solution

@RogerRoger Yes, that helps a lot.
But as in life, more answers creates more questions ... 😅
In most games I tend to prefer to do all the side stuff I can get my hands on before advancing a story typically. I’ll probably do it that way and then push forward with story as you suggest if I feel stagnant. I like getting the perks that the tombs and crypts offer.
So the question - how many different clothing options are available to unlock? And did you feel like you didn’t have sufficient supplies to manufacture the clothing when you unlocked it? Did you focus more on using resources for upgrading weapons and equipment?
I ask because I got carried away using all my skins and cloth to upgrade my bow and then discovered I had to wait and grind a little to have sufficient to make the cool boots and top that was available early game. And given the lack of combat early on, I haven’t saved for Molotov and explosives because I haven’t needed them, but was wondering if I need to keep a back up supply for that as well. Particularly certain animal skins and cloth seem to be at a slight premium early on and was just wondering how I wanted to plan it out. I realize this is largely player preference dependent and we all approach these open games differently (that’s the appeal!) but just if you have basic thoughts on resource management, please sir.

Edited on by Th3solution

“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”

RogerRoger

@Th3solution That's okay; more questions lead to more answers.

The only resources I fell short on were those necessary to craft clothing items, probably because they require a high number of animal skins or materials (my best friend admitted to hunting an eagle because she wanted an outfit covered in feathers, for example). That said, you can buy almost every single resource type in the game from the various traders and merchants scattered about in the various towns and cities; I just never got around to it, as I was buying and selling weapons and equipment as a priority, as they helped me explore. It's always worth hunting around for gold and jade, as these sell for megabucks and are only good for trading; whenever you can, find a merchant and convert them into coin. You can also sell things that you find yourself filling up on, like wood or plants, and if you're not keen on hunting like me then you can also find animal skins drying around Paititi, which you can take.

There are tons of clothing options, many with unique ability boosts. If you've got save files from the previous two games, you immediately unlock about seven or eight of their highlights, but I reckon there's at least an equal number of new ones to discover. Some are presets, whereas others you can mix and match the top and bottom parts. Some locations force you to wear certain outfits, too, which is awesome in regards to the story and immersion but a nightmare for OCD folk like me, who just want Lara to look like Lara all the time (probably why I'm the worst person to ask about this, but hey). Those particular outfits are given to you at the appropriate story moments, so don't worry about having to craft things to gain access to anywhere.

What I did find common after arriving in Paititi was that resources, particularly those for arrow crafting and the perception abilities, were more plentiful, providing you're willing to stop and pick them up as you're running around (which makes narrative sense; people don't live in barren locations). I was sometimes short on what I needed to craft special arrows, but that's because they require special resources which I simply hadn't been keeping an eye out for; the beauty of the diverse combat is that there are always half a dozen ways to achieve your goal, so if you can't poison that guard or detonate that barrel, that's okay, just stealth around in the trees or whip out your machine gun instead.

As long as you've got plenty of those time-slowing, resilience-boosting, healing herbs for the final boss fight, you'll be fine (and since combat is much less frequent, I'm sure you won't have a problem keeping a solid supply). That's the only solid piece of advice I can really think to give.

"We want different things, Crosshair. That doesn't mean that we have to be enemies."

PSN: GDS_2421
Making It So Since 1987

Th3solution

@RogerRoger Thanks! That helps me a lot. I can’t think of more questions just yet, but I might later on. Well... I want to ask whether we get to have Lara don the classic teal top with the brown shorts and wield dual pistols, but don’t tell me. I’ll wait to be surprised.

“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”

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